Gistou Eternal

[Luna Fox]

Huh, thinking about it remember SS faction slipping in the pre-game and i even brought it up in the PT... dunno why i did let that day drag on.

[Cerberus v666]

Yeah day was over when we didn't get up to 9 not us votes on LLD before the first VC. :p everything else was just noise and posturing.

[beeboy]

I claimed 2 different locations this game because I accidentally claimed one of my partners fake claims LOL

[beeboy]

Later upon you guys saying you had a location cop on me I changed the location I originally claimed and no one noticed.

[Cerberus v666]

Lol, I didn't even notice that.

Once you did that, you shoulda told us and we woulda just hard bussed you then. :p saved us all so much time lol.

[beeboy]

I'm not lying about anything.
What are the chances of a redirection happening that coincides also with the same Nation/Location as someone in the hood?

Northern Tribes.
Great Lake.
Vampire.

I haven't claimed my other info yet.

Subject: Gistou (Night Two)

We are from the West Empire

-sc

I told Cakez to claim West Empire so 100% on me.

[Luna Fox]

Actually i changed my mind

spoilers pls

[mastin2]

To be fair, I almost made the mistake of misidentifying where Cephrir was from.

TWICE.

[SirCakez]

I mean, I was so confident that you had that whole cool system in place specifically so your game wouldn't possibly be ruled by simple cop checks, that I didn't even consider any possible anti-cop play.

The super-cool system was mostly a red-herring. Mostly, but not entirely.

Race checkers always had the potential to be cop-lites if players interpreted them that way, but I had specifically intended for scum to

not

be considered scum for claiming non-human, ergo, they were meant to be only marginally useful, in identifying liars.
Location and Nation checkers are virtually worthless: they can catch liars, but other than that, they hold only marginal value, because I specifically designed distribution to have SOME vague patterns, but to be so weak as to be almost invisible.

In short, I thought that the system I had designed--while cool--was flashy theatrics which would do nothing but confuse and mislead people. I thought it would

weaken

the town, rather than strengthen them. With the exception of the non-human race cops: because of their factional conversions, THEY had use for those race cops.

Or, in other words: the whole check system? All of it? Location, Nation, Free, Full Free, Race, Full? I thought the entire thing was a pro-scum mechanic that would end up boosting

their

strength while not giving the town anything which was actually tangible. In short, I thought the town had no actual investigatives. (The watcher, as noted, is not purely town.) I thought that they had absolutely no way, short of pure scumhunting, of actually finding scum. So that's why I gave them the cops. Both of them were even nerfed: Luna got factions, but without knowing what that faction was (ergo, without seeing the faction flip), Luna would have no way of knowing whether the result was an innocent or a guilty. (Aside from URS results.)

The other cop is a unique nonhuman, akin to Hans Pohl, and the wording on their cop results is deliberately unhelpful: they know threats to them, but not what they actually *are* in the grander scheme of things. They also got ambiguous (i.e., pseudoguilty) results on the Undead Risen Slaves, and they don't even know about their cult result. In short, built into both cops was an inherent weakness that I anticipated being put into play more than it was.

I think I've only seen that many deaths in one night once before wow

Spoiler:

Ironic that the last member of our team is the one who nearly got lynched day 1

[SirCakez]

ya Luna and Stormblade played pretty well

[Voidedmafia]

On D1, sure, it was reasonable, but after town had *4* flips to look at, PLUS their own, it should have been easy to identify whether or not you were town...

Yeah, that was annoying.

Anyways, so yeah, two factions are down to a single member now, and both have a recruit left? (unless you undead used your recruit already?)

Watch as town summarily completely implodes and it comes down to either 2-1-1 or 1-1-1 kingmakers scenarios.

[beeboy]

did you kill him or just visit him?

oh ok I can see now, I was redirected, my results don't match storm's flip.

Let's see if Nosferatu did what we failed bum bum bummmm

[Stormblade]

ya Luna and Stormblade played pretty well

Thanks. I only wish scum didn't have a strongman, this is the second time I get strongman killed in a row.

[Cerberus v666]

did you kill him or just visit him?

oh ok I can see now, I was redirected, my results don't match storm's flip.

Let's see if Nosferatu did what we failed bum bum bummmm

Wouldn't make sense for it to work, since they have evidence already of what redirection took place.

[Cerberus v666]

Holy shit I wish I were alive. The extreme level of incomprehension about what's going on is hurting me to read.

[Luna Fox]

That's why we died obviously (jk i obv died coz of that + faction cop + globally townread + guilty on your teammate)

[Nahdia]

the people parsing all the flood of information we got all died last night lmao.

[Cerberus v666]

the people parsing all the flood of information we got all died last night lmao.

Word. Now everyone is mainly having trouble solidly putting things together to understand what actually occurred.

I mean, I'm not being too harsh on them, right? I do have insider information etc, but I THINK from the information they have they should be able to put all the pieces together.'

Bacde watched Luna
Toogeloo BG'd luna.
Bacde saw Nosferatu and himself visit Luna, and did not see Toogeloo.
Luna died.
Nosferatu claims he visited Stormblade with his role.
Stormblade died.

Luna dying through protection means: Toogeloo is lying scum, was redirected, or was roleblocked. The first two are unlikely because luna was a high priority watcher target, and toogeloo was a low priority redirect target.
Bacde not seeing Toogeloo means: Toogeloo is lying scum, was redirected, was roleblocked, or Bacde himself was redirected. We already established the first two as unlikely, so Toogeloo was roleblocked, or Bacde was redirected.

No reason to assume two redirectors. Most likely that one of Bacde or Nosferatu was redirected.

If Bacde was redirected, and Nosferatu was not, he saw Nosferatu alone visit a town corpse. Nosferatu guilty.
If Nosferatu was redirected, and Bacde was not, he saw Nosferatu alone visit a town corpse. Nosferatu guilty.

These hold true regardless of whether Toogeloo was roleblocked or not, but not seeing toogeloo makes it more likely that Bacde was redirected than Nosferatu.

That's where they should be at, right? I'm not using any information they're not privy to. They're just not seeing it.

[Cerberus v666]

I mean, I KNOW that I redirected Bacde to me, so what he actually saw was Nosferatu visiting my corpse, which Nosferatu could easily use to claim to have vigged me, but THEY don't know that.

[Nahdia]

Or Luna was strongkilled.

[Cerberus v666]

Man, I was sure I had that in that write up, but apparently I didn't. Yes, or Luna was strongman killed, but that's not relevant to determining whether or not Bacde's results are a guilty on Nosferatu.

[mastin2]

Fuck.

I told you in the hunter topic that you would count as visiting the player you redirected to.

I'm pretty sure that means you should have shown in Bacde's scan.

[Luna Fox]

Well it's never late to correct a mod error.

[mastin2]

Yeah, I informed him privately through PM that he should have seen RAM visit his target. I'm going to leave it at that, just private.

[Cerberus v666]

Well. That should basically clear everything up. Once he claims that, he'll know that either I redirected Luna, OR he was redirected himself.

If I redirected Luna, Nosferatu is lying about who he targeted.
If I redirected Bacde, Nosferatu was seen visiting a 2x BP corpse.