Mini 508- Trouble in New Catania-Game Over

[Rishi]

Huh? That was weird Lowell its almost like you want to have a vote on a particular person all the time. Just because no one else was voting for Rishi's suspect doesnt always mean you have to jump on just to please them.

FOS:Lowell

Yeah. That was so obviously scummy. I'm starting to think... Jester?

I don't think it's unheard of in a Mini Normal.

Never mind. He can't be a Jester or he would have hammered himself earlier.

But, yeah, I don't like how he just switched his vote looking for a lynch.

Unvote, Vote: Lowell

[kuribo]

That's the point I've been making about Lowell, he's done alot of votehopping.

[Rishi]

I don't think vote-hopping is suspicious, in and of itself. It's just the way that this was done.

[Lowell]

Huh? That was weird Lowell its almost like you want to have a vote on a particular person all the time. Just because no one else was voting for Rishi's suspect doesnt always mean you have to jump on just to please them.

FOS:Lowell

I'm not trying to please anyone, I'm trying to get this game going. Unless we get another viable wagon that people can talk about at least, I'll be lynched by sheer inertia and laziness.

Here's your problem. If I end up dead, there will be NO good information to go on for tomorrow, since no one else will have ever been in danger. And as satisfying as it may be to write "oh well, he deserved it for acting scummy" it'll still not help force some of the lurkier players to do anything that could potentially help later on.

[Happiest Sadist]

I'm not trying to please anyone, I'm trying to get this game going. Unless we get another viable wagon that people can talk about at least, I'll be lynched by sheer inertia and laziness.

Here's your problem. If I end up dead, there will be NO good information to go on for tomorrow, since no one else will have ever been in danger. And as satisfying as it may be to write "oh well, he deserved it for acting scummy" it'll still not help force some of the lurkier players to do anything that could potentially help later on.

Here's my problem. Even if you are alive there will be NO good information. This is because you continue to do stupid things to draw attention to yourself. What can we discuss to find other scum while Lowell is votehopping for no good reason, voting for anyone who he hopes he can ge lynched to save his own skin? Nothing.

[someone2]

I'm trying to get this game going. Unless we get another viable wagon that people can talk about at least, I'll be lynched by sheer inertia and laziness.

Seems to be a last breath tentative...: Don't lynch me please, make a wagon on another that will be lynched instead of me. Because you know if another bandwagon is created, everything I have done have a chance to be forgotten

Here's your problem. If I end up dead, there will be NO good information to go on for tomorrow,

Another tentative...

since no one else will have ever been in danger

False.Me.

Here's my problem. Even if you are alive there will be NO good information. This is because you continue to do stupid things to draw attention to yourself. What can we discuss to find other scum while Lowell is votehopping for no good reason, voting for anyone who he hopes he can ge lynched to save his own skin? Nothing.

I agree. (talking toLowell) We've been doing what you want us to do now for like two pages(while I was the victim). Two pages is not a lot, but we couldn't get more information about other players because YOU have done some scummy actions again, so you returned under the spotlight, taking the place of other players, stoping our information collect at the same time.That's nice for a scum,because without information, the town can't determine which is your scumbuddy. So I'm going to let you choose: or you stop doing scummy actions and let us do our information collect(townie choice) or continue to stop our job by doing what you have been doing since the beginning of the game(scummy choice that will result in your lynch). Am I not nice?

[The Fonz]

Ibaesha replaces BrianMcQueso.

[Rishi]

Hi Ibby.

[Lowell]

I like this someone2 guy. He's tenacious.

But really, another wagon would be useful. Does no one see this, really?

[Rishi]

I actually agree, Lowell.

Unvote

I still find you the most scummy, but more discussion would be useful.

[ibaesha]

I skimmed the thread some already, but need to do a thorough read-through which may take me a day or two. Based on primarily gut reactions from my skim, I'd be voting someone2, but I'd like to see a votecount. Language barrier or not, the 'slip' shouldn't be dismissed offhand.

I'm otherwise suspicious of Rishi (mostly because I disagree with his take on LML). I disliked the 3 'unvote because we're out of the random stage' unvotes. It serves no purpose whatsoever to randomly vote and then remove the vote without placing it onto a genuine suspicion, but since -three- people did it, I have my doubts that they're all scum. I also am not sure that I agree with the Lowell wagon because I see a lot of 'you did scummy things!' but (and granted this was just a skim) I think his play is mostly attributed to his playstyle (like it or not) and has little to do with his alignment. I will, however, look at him closely when I re-read. My gut feeling is that his wagon is scumdriven, so along with looking at him, I'll be looking closely at the people who have jumped on (and off) that wagon.

[ibaesha]

I'm up to page 6 in reading more thoroughly. No detailed analysis yet (that'll probably come tomorrow), but I'm going to steal one of Pooky's schticks here and say:

Fearless Forecast: Rishi, someone2, and kiribu are teh scumbags.

Mod: Can we have a votecount please?

As an aside: There's a ton of info in this thread, including a lot of voting and interactions. I disagree with those that say that there isn't enough info yet. I don't necessarily find saying so suspicious, but I think it's wrong.

[The Fonz]

Votecount seven is brought to you by New Catania Community College- now enrolling for criminology courses!

Lowell 5 (rite, Happiest Sadist, kuribo, Ibaesha, LoudMouthLee)
someone2 2 (CTD, Beastly)
LoudMouthLee 1 (Lowell)

Not voting: death_omen, Streeflo,someone2

Prodding Streeflo

[CrashTextDummie]

Hi Ibby! <3 Ibby! ^_^

I quite like your approach re: Rishi. I find him reasonably scummy as well as of late.

No one likes my LML vote. Sad.

I was about to say that not only did I not like your LML vote, I actively disliked it. But upon rereading, I realized that you weren't voting LML at all at that point.

Nevertheless, I still dislike the sentiment. The feeling I'm getting from this, and from you in general, is that you're sitting at the sideline. You did a bit of defending Lowell and a bit of attacking someone2 (more on that later), but overall, you don't seem to be too interested in the most interesting topics of the game. The fact that you're lamenting a lack of LML votes when you haven't made any effort to get any pressure whatsoever on him (I don't even see a proper case) indicates to me that you're just treading water.

Okay. At first, I was going to jump to someone2's defense, saying that he's new and it could have been an honest mistake. Looking back over his games played, he has played in a game with Three Mafia before. I still think the slip might have been honest, but he is defending himself badly.

Vote: someone2

Well, I think I will have to explain it in English because it looks like you do not understand English. I made a simple mistake of meaning in the word left, that in my inexperience of English, I had forgotten that he had two meanings, or left in the direction remains, and left in the direction party. I used that word in the sense party, and you understood in the sense remains. So I apologize for the confusion.

Mod note: It translates francais as ENGLISH? How shit a piece of software is that?

This is what someone2 said. I doubt it's the perfect translation, but I think I get the gist.

Unvote

= the sum total of what Rishi had to say about someone2.

First of all, I find it astonishing how easily Rishi was willing to abandon his someone2 vote, and how he completely ignores the fact that the alleged "slip" was not the only thing someone2 was accused of.

If this (quite obvious) explanation was all it took to convince Rishi that the slip was none at all, one has to question why he found it suspicious in the first place. I could see this being a panic reaction by a scum-buddy.

Yeah. That was so obviously scummy. I'm starting to think... Jester?

I don't think it's unheard of in a Mini Normal.

Scummy sentiment. The possibility of a Jester is usually

not

something a townie has on his mind. In the vast majority of cases where Jesters where brought up in games lately, it was done by scum. It serves them because it adds another layer of confusion for the town to think about and because it's a convenient way of commenting on a player without taking a proper stance. Really don't like this.

I actually agree, Lowell.

Unvote

I still find you the most scummy, but more discussion would be useful.

You want more discussion... and so you unvote? Your discussion-generating methods are foreign to me.

I'm still suspicious of someone2 and will leave my vote there pending a response from Rishi.

[Streeflo]

Sorry, forgot about this game. Will reread tomorrow ::points at sig::

[Rishi]

I usually find it tough to take sides and give interesting opinions on the first day of a game. But I will attempt a re-read in the next couple days and post my thoughts.

[kuribo]

Rishi, when you post, will you be answering CTD's sentiments about you?

By themselves, the Jester comment and the unvote don't look bad, but together, it gives one something to think about. You also accused LML of vote-hopping, even though his vote had rested on Lowell for quite some time. After his comment to that effect, you only posted a one-liner criticizing my logic regarding Lowell's lynching. From there, you hopped on the someone2 bandwagon and then expressed disappointment that "no one liked" your vote against LML. This is all wrapped up by the Jester comment, which strikes me as odd since I don't think that it would occur to anyone here that Lowell was TRYING to get lynched. Say what you will about him, but if he had WANTED to be lynched, he could have just let the bandwagon roll on instead of protesting.

So, in the process of your re-read, Rishi, I'd like to see you explain some of your behavior.

[Rishi]

The only way to explain my behavior is with the truth, which may not help. My play isn't scummy - it is lazy. I tend to check the site several times a day and it's really easy to just read the last few posts and post a 1-2 sentence response to what I have read. A lot of times when I shouldn't say anything at all, I write something impulsive. You can see that from the Jester comment, which I retracted a few minutes later. (Of course, the retraction doesn't look like one, because the Jester post was the last post on page 8 and the retraction was the first post on page 9.)

CTD is right - I am treading water, but this game is treading water. I don't like how several players are statically keeping their votes on Lowell without any attempt to build a further case against him.

A few interesting things from my re-read -

1. I've noticed that kuribo tends to follow other people. He almost never originates suspicion on anyone, but takes someone else's suspicion, hides it behind a lot of words, and makes it look like his own. He has been freely accusing people while keeping his vote on Lowell for quite a while. Also, notice how kuribo has not made any accusatory comments about me all game and then, suddenly after Ibby and CTD say they are suspicious, he suddenly wants me to explain my behavior.

2. People are criticizing me for thinking (even for a moment) that Lowell wanted to be lynched. Well, Happiest Sadist made this observation on Page 4 (and didn't take it back), but he got off scott free.

3. The defense of LML is mostly coming from people who I assume have played with him before. I haven't (other than in Ibby's game, where he was killed Night 0). You can't expect me to realize that it's his "playstyle" if I have never played with him. I don't have the time nor inclination to do a metagame reading on everyone in the game. Sure, he hasn't vote-hopped lately, but the Lowell bandwagon is still the most likely to lead to a lynch. I don't like the "playstyle" defense because, at best, it is a null-tell. It does not mean that he is pro-town. Until you know his alignment, I don't see why I am getting so much flak for simply being suspicious of him.

4. Did you all know that Beastly and rite are still active players in this game? News to me!

[ibaesha]

unvote, vote someone2

I have not liked the reasoning behind a single vote or FoS (and the FoS's are really suspicious, (hate when people won't put their vote where their mouth is) from this guy. I think half of it is conjured and the rest is merely following other people onto whoever they're suspecting at the moment. Then there's the slip, regardless of language barrier.

I have notes, but not time to post a lengthy analysis of everything that's happened. If anyone has questions they'd like to ask me about what I've thought of various things or people, I'd be happy to answer them. Overall, I am still most suspicious of the three I already mentioned. I just can't believe that someone2 hasn't received more pressure than he has.

Let it be known that I don't necessarily agree with my predeccessor's thoughts on all things including his vote on Claus or his FoS on Lowell.

[kuribo]

1. I've noticed that kuribo tends to follow other people. He almost never originates suspicion on anyone, but takes someone else's suspicion, hides it behind a lot of words, and makes it look like his own. He has been freely accusing people while keeping his vote on Lowell for quite a while. Also, notice how kuribo has not made any accusatory comments about me all game and then, suddenly after Ibby and CTD say they are suspicious, he suddenly wants me to explain my behavior.

I'm not "following other people---" you fail to remember that at one point, I was the only person questioning BMQ, much to the rest of the town's irritation.

I haven't been vote hopping like some of the other people here--- my vote rests on Lowell. I believe Lowell is scum and see no reason to change that vote for the time being. But, thank you for pointing out my lack of vote-hopping. It's hard to continue building a case against Lowell when any questions directed his way are met with sarcastic replies and vague comments regarding the others in the game. And he knows this, and he knows it isn't helpful.

Of course I question numerous people. I didn't "accuse" you, I simply wanted an explanation for your behavior. Were I accusing you, I would have flat out said "Rishi, you are scum and I am voting for you."

Lowell hit the nail on the head earlier-- I am a newbie--- the only other game I've played (aside the ones I'm active on) was a newbie game that lynched the scum in 8 pages. And I was NK'd on Night 1. So while I'm not an experienced scumhunter, the only thing I am guilty of is being a fairly aggressive or paranoid townie.

[Lowell]

rishi's post is right on the money. Too many folks are hiding behind their early votes.

unvote, vote rite

. Because why the hell not. Something needs to happen here.

[rite]

4. Did you all know that Beastly and rite are still active players in this game? News to me!

I've had nothing to say for pages and pages. In fact, I've made the equivalent of this post over and over again:

I wish I had something to say, but we've just been spinning our tires in the mud. In my opinion, Lowell has put on by far the scummiest performance, and I'm honestly flabbergasted that the day hasn't ended with a lynch on him yet. I can't believe that he has avoided lynch for so long when his primary counterargument is "seriously guys, unvote me."

This is Day One people. I hate day-start Day Ones. Hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate them. I want it to end. I've contemplated asking for a deadline for the last while, but I've been afraid that people will jump on me: "only a scum would want a deadline when there's still meaningful conversation going on."

Well there isn't. I'm formally

requesting a deadline

, hopefully this eternal day will end soon, and we'll wake up tomorrow with some concrete information on which we can pretend to base our baseless accusations.

[kuribo]

Are you kidding me, rite? While your analysis of Lowell is in synch with mine, I find it hard to believe that a deadline is good for the town, no matter the circumstances.

Mix that in with your self-admitted lurking, and I really don't like the looks of this.

You mean to tell me that with page after page of people suspecting me and others for being on the "Lowell bandwagon," you AGREED with me, and felt no need to step in and post?

While I'm still not completely convinced of Lowell's town-ness, there are others that are starting to stick out at me a bit more.

Unvote

Vote: rite

Asking for a deadline? Seriously?

[rite]

Has there been some sort of taboo on asking for deadlines since I've been gone from the site? Surely there must be someone else who thinks that this aimless, wandering, boring, lurky day has gone on far enough?

There are currently four people voting for Lowell, a number which not very long ago was six, with several people leaning towards condemning him. I didn't post to support you because I felt like every post I had made in the game thus far made it clear that I agreed with you. If you had been in anything close to danger, sure, I would have stepped in, but I felt like three posts that all said the exact same thing may have been too much.

The town is looking for clues where they can't find them. That's pretty much how all day start day one's go. The best strategy is just to find the scummiest looking person, lynch them, hope for the best, THEN start the fun on day two, when we have that person's alignment and night results.

Yes, I'm fully aware that somebody is going to take my "find the scummiest looking person, lynch them" quote, then respond with some pithy response about how that's me, then vote for me. No, I don't think it's clever, nor do I think it's true.

I don't understand why Lowell's bandwagon has squelched with no real explanations from him, I don't understand why there are currently two votes for me, and, most of all, I don't understand why this day is still going on. Maybe things have changed on this site since I left, but if this is how long games usually take-- pointless debate over nothing of substance on day one-- then I guess I'm just out of touch. I don't like it very much, either.

[Rishi]

I'll say it too. This day could use a deadline.