bandwagon ftw
Mini #534 - Vegetable Mafia (Game Over!)
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Hmm, I didn't actually unvote before I voted for ryan, so he never made it to L-2...Aimee wrote:Veggietastic Vote Count!
ryan -- 5 (thinktank, kravhen, Oman, Crub, destructor)
Crub -- 2 (Northjayhawk, Y)
Y -- 1 (Phate)
Korran -- 1 (WhoMe?)
destructor -- 1 (soupfly)
Not Voting -- Korran, ryan
Now searching for a replacement for Korran.
He's got 3 votes on him right now.
My vote's still on Northjayhawk.
soupfly, I still wonder why you vote for me..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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wtf is wrong with you people? And the wagon on ryan was meant to be bad.
@ ryan, hmm, because I have no reason to believe a mod wouldn't follow their own rules, maybe?
@ WhoMe?, no
@ Phate, wtf. Your question was already answered in Post 99. Are you read thread?
@ Northjayhawk, see above.
@ kravhen, feel free to speculate, but there is no need for this, given that I already explained it in response toyourquestion..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Phate, you're being a tool.Phate wrote:And if he was really playing some cute little bullshit game to the tune of "Oh, but I didn't put the comma in the right place so it wasn't REALLLLY a vote so why are you mad?" I find that scummy. It looks like a fallback position for scum hoping for a quick lynch to me.
I'm following the rules. According to the voting mechanic as outlined in rules 3 and 4, you have to Unvote or the next vote you cast doesn't count. What the hell are you going on about saying that Ididmake a vote? No, according to the rules, I didn't. And yes, I was completely aware of this..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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That's not exactly true. If someone's at L-1 and they're on their own wagon, Unvoting would take them back to L-2. There's no guarantee that there'd be another player willing to make up for that vote even if someone was willing to hammer back at L-1.Oman wrote:Self wagons are like pointing a gun at your headand then having 6 other guys grab the trigger too
Wagons on others are like pointing a gun at their headand then having 6 other guys grab the trigger too
No one person on a wagon controls whether or not it hammers (i.e. the guns shoots), as anyone who comes off can be replaced and anyone can hammer. Your analogy fits MAD mafia or Bad Idea more than regular Mafia.
But in a random stage, I'm all up for self-voting..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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There are many things I don't like about the above post. One is that you seem to be usinganti-townandscummyas interchangeable terms. Another is that you say that you think Oman and I 'have both done enough to be lynched'.
And short of a confession, 6 pages is a pretty short time to see a lynch. You seem quite eager, ryan.
While I'm at it:
Care to elaborate?ryan wrote:Vote: destructor
I think this last exchange shows us scum. Time to hang scum man.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Not contributing to discussion in any way is anti-town but not necessarily scummy.thinktank wrote:However there was a comment earlier on Anti-town and scum and their lack of interchangeability which i disagree with. Anti-town is imo the same thing as scum and i fail to comprehend why anyone would think otherwise. If you are not helping town, you are taking away from town. Aka, if you were a townie taking away from town, you're play would make absolutely zero sense. However if you consider the position from a scum perspective, this position becomes entirely justified.
After not contributing to discussion, to jump onto the most popular bandwagon could be better described as scummy.
Does that do much to illustrate the difference for you?
You don't buy my answer? Why not? Is there some other answer you're expecting?thinktank wrote:Destructor: Why did you fake vote? I don't buy your claim that you wanted to see people's reactions..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I don't like this idea that it's somehow an argument against me that I 'ran the risk of causing a mod error'. How is it scummy for me to expect the mod not to run the game according to the rules? And if that is what you think I did, then you're not accusing me of being scum - you're accusing me of being a cheater..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I just did a reread. Heh, one of the first things I realised was that I didn't unvote before I voted for Northjayhawk. So my vote's actually still on Oman. I can't escape criticism for his. I admit thatthatwas a mistake, but the ryan "vote" wasn't. It's my word against, well, nothing, really.
If anyone wonders about the brevity of my responses earlier - I felt no need to clutter the thread when I felt I'd already answered the questions being asked. Nothings really changed. I've noted those that seemed to pursue the questioning without reference to my prior explanation.
Also, that vote count Aimee posted was apparently completely screwed up. Besides the technically of my vote, kravhen and Phate's votes were both misplaced. According to my count, this is more like what it was at post 86:
Korran (1) - WhoMe?
ryan (4) - thinktank, Phate, Oman, Crub
Crub (2) - NJH, Y
Oman (1) - des
des (1) - soupfly
soupfly (1) - kravhen
Not voting (1) - Korran, ryan
Mod: Can you clarify the vote count at post 86, taking into account anyone that didn't unvote before placing a new vote?
ryan, I think you need to read your signature, but maybe even replace 'vote' with 'post'.
@ kravhen - I don't think you ever explained why you voted soupfly in Post 42.
@ Northjayhawk - In Post 48 you flesh out, in some detail, your issues with Oman. You say that you had a 'barely-random' vote on him, which doesn't ring true in light of this post. This becomes stranger when you take into account the fact that you returned a random vote to Crub. How randomwasyour vote on Oman, really?
@ ryan - What do you think about thinktank, kravhen and Crub?
@ soupfly - Are you telling us that your 'original' vote, back in Post 41 was a pressure vote? Why pressuremethen?
@ thinktank - In both Post 90 and Post 139 you suggest that the ryan wagon was questionable because of Oman's involvement in it. What I don't understand is why you think this, and exactly what it is about it that makes it 'scummy(?)'. Can you clarify this for us?
@ WhoMe?
Why didn't you just start it?WhoMe? wrote:I could be interested in a NorthJayHawk wagon.
@ Y - Are you scum?
Based on how much I had noted, these players need more post:
Crub, Korran (LOLOL), Oman, soupfly, WhoMe?.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Mod: I'm pretty sure my vote's still on Oman.
Well, Northjayhawk's leaving, so my questions for him won't do much anymore. I would point out though, that me calling his vote 'barely random' was a typo. I meant to write 'non-random'. My point stands. He explained it too much for it to be, as he described, "barely non-random'.
soupfly, got anything to say about what's happened in this game so far?
I'm quite happy to go either way with the veggie claim, but worry of the chance of outing power-roles. From the exchange between Phate and thedragonprincess, if we're to believe them, it seems that therearen'tany duplicate roles, so claiming vanilla townie isn't so easy. But this seems game-breaking, which makes me wonder. If scum have safe claims, this achieves next to nothing for the town, while giving scum some info..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I don't know if it's obvious that you're not scum at all, but yes, it's not a reason to lynch you, as much as you saying ryan is your scum-buddy isn't a reason to lynch ryan. But Phate and TDS bothagree(?) with you and say they want him lynched.
Maybe my sense of humour isn't so sharp today, but while I find it all amusing it's also confusing the hell out of me..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I think that's too generous. Is it his early vote on ryan alone that makes you think he's town? Because, that vote included, I don't recall much else that could even make me remotely sure about him.Oman wrote:I have a reason. See how he is at the top? Its at the start somewhere.
Can you comment on this quote with your suggestion of a popcorn claim in mind?Oman wrote:No, my personal thought is that a) one of them is lying (I shan't tell you which one and why, and if you push it I'm calling it rolefishing). b) there are two or three townie names spread out over the townies..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Ok, but I see a discrepancy between that statement I quoted and your suggestion of a mass nameclaim now, so much so that I have to wonder what could have changed your opinion.
You said that you thought there were one or two townie names and now you're actually suggesting that there are no duplicate role-names. What made you think otherwise before?.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I'm not sure I buy that. But it'll do for now.
Next -> WhoMe?
Regardless of this, I have a feeling scum have safe-claims, mostly for the reason that I think it'd break the game if they didn't, so I still think this isn't really going to help the town a whole lot.
In the mean time...
Vote: Crub.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Maybe I got a guilty investigation on you?Crub wrote:
Care to outline why exactly?destructor wrote:In the mean time...
Vote: Crub
I'm feeling like we're seeing a lot of opportunism around Oman's 'beans' thing. That said, it could be dodgy. I'll try to reread and maybe do a player-by-player-thing..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I think Bookitty makes a notable case on Oman. I really didn't like his 'scum-buddy' comments from Day 1 and the whole vanilla thing still doesn't sit well with me.
I don't understand the Mason claim thing. Why are we even assuming there are masons in this game? And how could there only be 1 mason left anyway? Wouldn't we have seen a mason role revealed with one of the dead?
I've definitely got an eye on WhoMe? now.
How is this different from outright asking me if I'm a cop?gorckat wrote:destructor:Didyou get a guilty on Crub?.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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QFTCrub wrote:
*raised eyebrows*thedragonsprincess wrote:unless destructor is mafia simply claiming cop. that being said... anyone care to counterclaim?
I'm not the cop. I didn't have a good read on Crub but was feeling uneasy about him, so I said that to see his and others' reactions. Not sure what to make of it all, but I figured I'd better nip this at the bud..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Your whole argument is based on things that didn't happen and, given any Town made of sensible players, probably wouldn't have happened anyway. Regardless, this is all negated by the fact that I admitted that I wasn't the cop. If I hadn't I might not be so sceptical of your vote.WhoMe? wrote:
by intimating you have a power role, and also hinting you have information on another player. If we had all took you at your word and speed lynched, what would you have said then? If a real cop had counter claimed, then your I didn't mean it wouldn't have counted for crap, we would have lynched you. It was an anti-town move.destructor wrote:The fact that something slightly unordinary happened. It's like you're using that as an excuse to vote for me.
You say I'm muddying the waters. How?
I also find it ridiculous that you'd entertain the idea that a speed lynch would have occurred, yet make no reference to what this would have implied, finding an action that was so unlikely to cause it scummy instead. Who is likely to vote for someone based on a 'half-Cop-claim' besides scum? I think that the reactions we saw to my post are a pro-town result, yet you've decided to vote me for it.
But, hey, here's something else worth bringing up: fruit.
[quote="Wikipedia on "Green bean", claimed by Oman"]Green beans (American English) or French beans (British English) or Mahune (South Slavic, Balkans) are the unripefruitsof any kind of bean, including the yardlong bean, the hyacinth bean, the winged bean, and especially the common bean (Phaseolus vulgaris), whose pods are also usually called string beans in the northeastern United States, but can also go by snap beans.[/quote]
[quote="Wikipedia on "Pea", claimed by Bookitty"]A pea, although treated as a vegetable in cooking, is botanically afruit; the term is most commonly used to describe the small spherical seeds or the pods of the legume Pisum sativum.[/quote]
[quote="Wikipedia on "Capsicum", cailmed by gorckat"]Thefruitof Capsicum plants have a variety of names depending on place and type. They are commonly called chili pepper, capsicum, red orgreen pepper, or sweet pepper in Britain.[/quote]
[quote="Wikipedia on "Cucumber", claimed by tdp"]The cucumber is a creeping vine that roots in the ground and grows up trellises or other supporting frames, wrapping around ribbing with thin, spiraling tendrils. The plant has large leaves that form a canopy over thefruit.[/quote]
So we've got four vegetable claims that are technically fruit claims.
Before we jump the gun, have a look at this.
[quote="Wikipedia on "Vegetable""]Since “vegetable” is not a botanical term, there is no contradiction in referring to a plant part as a fruit while also being considered a vegetable. Given this general rule of thumb, vegetables can also include leaves (lettuce), stems (asparagus), roots (carrots), flowers (broccoli), bulbs (garlic), seeds (peas and beans) and botanical fruits such ascucumbers, squash, pumpkins, andcapsicums(bell peppers). Botanically, fruits are reproductive organs (ripened ovaries containing one or many seeds), while vegetables are vegetative organs which sustain the plant.[/quote]I'm not sure why lettuce and broccoli are mentioned here, since theyare notbotanically fruit.
Yeah, so I think this name claim was more useful than I first though.
Things to consider:
• Did Aimee attempt to avoid this confusion? Perhaps. Regardless, I believe that most of the unambiguous claims we've seen are most reliable. These are, in order of claim - Lettuce, Broccoli, Spinach, Brussels Sprout and Cabbage.
•Applicable across all of our name claims- which part of the world is Aimee from? :lolstalk: Would she have used the common names for vegetables used in that region? If so, we should consider which names players claimed and whether it's likely that Aimee would have assigned these names.
I'm not sure, but I don't believe she's from the US because I'm sure I've spotted her using "ou" spelling =D. With this in mind, though, I become more sceptical of Oman's Green beans claim, since this name is listed as common in the US. It is also used in Australia, however. If Aimee is from the UK, my vote will likely go to Oman
I'm also suspicious of "Green pepper" for similar reasons, since my impression is that that name is more often used in the US than anywhere else. I usually refer to it as "Green capsicum" or just "Capsicum" andneveras "Green pepper".
I feel it's likely that there is at least one scum in the list of four fruits, but would be surprised if there were more than two..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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I usually call them beans too, but I've heard and seen "Green beans" enough to call it common here. I usually say Brussels Sprouts, not sprouts. According to my role PM, Aimee probably calls them Brussels Sprouts too.
About which of the four fruits I think are scum... I think it's most likely you or gorckat. I don't find the 's' thing suspicious but I'll be rereading both you and gorckat all the same. I'm less suspicious of the other two because unless Bookitty was willing to bus her Godfather, I doubt she's scum and I also find it unlikely that tdp would have counterclaimed Phate as scum..::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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Yeah, but like I said before, I think the unambiguous claims (non-fruit) are less likely to be scum. It gives us a place to start.WhoMe? wrote:I feel it's likely that there would be a scum within a list of any 4 randomly chosen people left
Which two townies are confirmed fruits?Crub wrote:Also this whole fruit argument is crazy, it's confirmed that at least 2 townspeople are fruit, how does that make it any more likely that both the scum are fruit?
I'm totally willing to join the soupfly wagon for reasons stated (except the one I quoted below) and others I may reveal later.
This is semantics and is almost as much a reach as the 's' argument. Points 1 and 2 you raise were good enough to base a vote on. Was 3 really worth bringing up?gorckat wrote:3) "the NK" (think tank)...not "one of the NKs"? That seems like you slipped letting on a personal involvement in think's death.::][:::::][:::::][:::::][::.-
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