Mafia 75: Return of the Mafia! TOWN WINS (really late)

[curiouskarmadog]

jesus christ...can we please quit talking about who we think are town?!? It paints a target and really helps no one but scum!

[Nemesis]

jesus christ...can we please quit talking about who we think are town?!? It paints a target and really helps no one but scum!

I disagree with this completely.

[Nemesis]

Oh and Skitzler, while I appreciate the 2 town - 2 scum... It doesn't give you a reason to not post anything else. Besides, including yourself in the 2 town is pretty much pointless as everyone would include themselves in the 2 town thus making it 1 town, which doesn't quite work.

[thenextepisode]

Oh and Skitzler, while I appreciate the 2 town - 2 scum... It doesn't give you a reason to not post anything else. Besides, including yourself in the 2 town is pretty much pointless as everyone would include themselves in the 2 town thus making it 1 town, which doesn't quite work.

that's exactly what i said in my post 270, and he suggested i was scum for not including myself.
this impeccable logic has earned

skitzer

and

FOS

[Nemesis]

I noticed, I didn't include it in my original post because it had already been said, then added it because I realized that you were the one disagreeing with him and thus it might be seen as a defence rather than honest opinion.

However, I'm a little curious why you waited to FoS Skitzer over it. (Presumably I didn't tell you anything you didn't know.)


Also I blame Fritlzer for the typo in my last post.

[thenextepisode]

i dunno. i forgot to do it last time.

[Battle Mage]

I'm going to reread again, vote stands for now, but I'm fine with people realizing BM has to die eventually and can't be auto-cleared because of this. Thats probably better than a D1 lynch on someone scummy who won't really contribute that much.

lol is anyone else getting exceptionally scummy vibes from this?

[curiouskarmadog]

jesus christ...can we please quit talking about who we think are town?!? It paints a target and really helps no one but scum!

I disagree with this completely.

other than getting a stance Day one where people are to use later in a reread...how does the telling who we think are most likely town helping anyone but mafia? A concenus of a town player, lets the mafia know who to eliminate, keeping the scummiest players around to confuse the town.

[JordanA24]

Updated Vote Count

Prodding Fattierob, Charity, Tlp, GSGold. Still on the lookout for a replacement for SilverConqueror.

[Antithesis]

A concenus of a town player, lets the mafia know who to eliminate, keeping the scummiest players around to confuse the town.

Not that I disagree with you, but...

So what happens if, say, the Mafia doesn't eliminate that player... does he or she become a suspect by default, and thus loses their 'townie' status?

This isn't so much about this game, but a game I played here not that long ago, everyone's concensus townie player turned out to be scum, and I was the only person in the game to call them on it, only to have other townies argue with me and defend the fake townie over my accusations.

Sure, it was a newbie game, but still. It isn't like Mafia aren't playing blindly themselves. They'll try to kill perceived townie leaders regardless of what we say in the thread. IMO, the best townie players (especially those with power roles) act a little scummy and possibly ignorant early on, to avoid being targeted at night. The balance is not to overdo it and get lynched for it.

[curiouskarmadog]

A concenus of a town player, lets the mafia know who to eliminate, keeping the scummiest players around to confuse the town.

Not that I disagree with you, but...

So what happens if, say, the Mafia doesn't eliminate that player... does he or she become a suspect by default, and thus loses their 'townie' status?

I assume that when you say "townie status" you mean in the eyes of the town as a whole. now that we have addressed it, hopefully that will be the case.

I have been in games where everyone posted a top two (or three) scum list and top two townie list. The very next kill (N1) was one of from that list.

again, how does posting town list help anyone but the mafia?

[Antithesis]

again, how does posting town list help anyone but the mafia?

I think it could be quite telling, in those cases when the poster is a member of the Mafia.

I guess my point was that it need not be inherently bad, per se... depends more on context and circumstance really. Though I do agree making such lists day 1 or 2 is perhaps so meaningless as to be silly, as enough time hasn't passed to make the list anything more than arbitrary at best.



BM, you asked

lol is anyone else getting exceptionally scummy vibes from this?

I think its a valid point, for what it is worth. Hypothetically, say its.. I dunno, day six or seven and only a handful of players remain, you being one of them. If we just go by the Miller claim, then yes, you might appear scummy enough to be mislynched.. possibly costing the town the game.

This however discounts how you play between now and then, and what contributions you might make for the town. Between your Miller claim and that hypothetical day six or seven, you might lead the charge on lynching quite a copious amount of scum, help redirect the town when it gets off course, possibly intuit some major information about the game's set up, thus helping townies make better informed decisions.

All that is possible, and it is why I don't feel it's necessarily a good idea to lynch someone who claims Miller early, or even late for that matter.

That said though, if its around day 3 or 4, and you havent voted for any scum lynchings, and you don't really contribute much in the way of helping the town win, that combined with the Miller claim should make you very suspect.

Just my opinion.

[Tlp]

Well mafia probably know who their friends or there must be more then 1 family?

I don't think outing as a townie is that bad, not like everyone will believe you.

[curiouskarmadog]

"outing a townie"..interesting phrasing

[Rosso Carne]

A concenus of a town player, lets the mafia know who to eliminate, keeping the scummiest players around to confuse the town.

Not that I disagree with you, but...

So what happens if, say, the Mafia doesn't eliminate that player... does he or she become a suspect by default, and thus loses their 'townie' status?

This isn't so much about this game, but a game I played here not that long ago, everyone's concensus townie player turned out to be scum, and I was the only person in the game to call them on it, only to have other townies argue with me and defend the fake townie over my accusations.

Sure, it was a newbie game, but still. It isn't like Mafia aren't playing blindly themselves. They'll try to kill perceived townie leaders regardless of what we say in the thread. IMO, the best townie players (especially those with power roles) act a little scummy and possibly ignorant early on, to avoid being targeted at night. The balance is not to overdo it and get lynched for it.

ABSOLUTE

FUCKING

WIFOM!!!!!!!

You can't possibly attack omeone just because the scum didnt kill them one night. mayhap if its a cop claim, but just because someone is talked about as being obvious town doenst make the scum auto wantt to kill them. it might be a gambit, they might be hunting for other crumbed roles, and they might just want the town to wifom themselves to death.

actually agree with nemesis somewhat.

[Battle Mage]

"outing a townie"..interesting phrasing

Thats actually... not what he said. 0.o lol

[Battle Mage]

Quite right, was gonna edit it out, but forgot, and another post would look rather pathetic...But still, evidence does seem to point towards Lloyd is some degree, though I'm still not done looking through posts...

Why would you be concerned about discussing a Jester?
I get the impression you are just bowing to OEJO's pressure.

Unvote, Vote: Imat

BM

[curiouskarmadog]

Well mafia probably know who their friends or there must be more then 1 family?

I don't think outing as a townie is that bad, not like everyone will believe you.

damn, bm, you are right.."outing as a townie" and "outing a townie"

I guess I am not understanding what he is saying here.

[Battle Mage]

Armlx-except i AM the Miller, hence you couldnt cop confirm me anyway-claim or not.

so if Battlemage is the Miller, then what armix?

If BM does turn up dead and he was indeed the Miller, then I think we should go after Armix.

Setting up multiple lynches? UBERSCUMMY

HoS: Nanosauromo

oh btw, i know im jumping around alot atm. its deliberate-when i reread in 10 pages time, ill be able to see who i found scummy, and be able to focus on their subsequent play.

BM

[Battle Mage]

so basically either

BM is lying scum and is claiming miller to avoid investigations

or

BM is telling the truth, he's basically vanilla, but there's always going to be that uncertainty about him, and scum will try to play on that to get him lynched at a crucial moment


Am I missing something or is this the situation? If this is the case I may switch my vote to BM, because I don't see much of a down side.

Thats actually about 66% correct. There's an option C that he had some kind of role on top of miller thats exactly the same as option B otherwise.

This is a surprisingly perceptive post. It isnt especially a town-tell, but it shows me that you are thinking objectively at least. Of course, it also raises the question of, Why the hell are you voting for me, if you think this is a possibility?
Im seeing hypocrisy here....

BM

[GSGold]

jesus christ...can we please quit talking about who we think are town?!? It paints a target and really helps no one but scum!

I disagree with this completely.

Could you explain your reasoning as to why it's a good idea?

[Battle Mage]

jesus christ...can we please quit talking about who we think are town?!? It paints a target and really helps no one but scum!

I disagree with this completely.

Could you explain your reasoning as to why it's a good idea?

I'd rather see you explain your reasoning as to why it ISN'T a bad idea. That goes for you too CKD.

BM

[Battle Mage]

*bad should say good there. lol

Fattierob has requested replacement, which I will hopefully find soon.

[armlx]

so basically either

BM is lying scum and is claiming miller to avoid investigations

or

BM is telling the truth, he's basically vanilla, but there's always going to be that uncertainty about him, and scum will try to play on that to get him lynched at a crucial moment


Am I missing something or is this the situation? If this is the case I may switch my vote to BM, because I don't see much of a down side.

Thats actually about 66% correct. There's an option C that he had some kind of role on top of miller thats exactly the same as option B otherwise.

This is a surprisingly perceptive post. It isnt especially a town-tell, but it shows me that you are thinking objectively at least. Of course, it also raises the question of, Why the hell are you voting for me, if you think this is a possibility?
Im seeing hypocrisy here....

BM

I am voting you because I believe you fall under option A, rather than B or C. The 66% wasn't referring to your case, but instead the fact WhoMe? had found 2/3 of the realistic possibilities.

There is the possibility you are town, and I've considered it. However, there are two things I also considered.

First, I believe that the estimated gain from lynching you is higher than the estimated loss. The gain from lynching you as lying scum is far greater than the loss from lynching you as town miller and visa versa, less gain for you living as town miller compared to loss of you living as mafia with claim.

Second, given your behavior I'm leaning that you are more likely scum safe claiming based on a metagame. I've never been more than about 75% certain throughout the game, but its enough given the first point.

The auto-clear thing is in regards to miller being unclearable by cop. B/c you claimed miller should not mean we accept you as town, as there's no realistic way to assure you are.

If someone who legitimately is a lot scummier than you are shows up, I'm willing to lynch them over you. However, at this point in time you are definitely the best lynch, and thus my vote stands until it is needed elsewhere.

[curiouskarmadog]

jesus christ...can we please quit talking about who we think are town?!? It paints a target and really helps no one but scum!

I disagree with this completely.

Could you explain your reasoning as to why it's a good idea?

I'd rather see you explain your reasoning as to why it ISN'T a bad idea. That goes for you too CKD.

BM

already done that