The Werewolves of Millers Hollow (Game Over)

[DizzyIzzyB13]

It's unfamiliarity with a game mechanic more than anything else. You may have noticed I made a random lynch vote in this game already. With my earliest experience of playing Mafia, I didn't do any random voting until I was confident enough to do it, but that wasn't on this site and I don't believe there are transcripts of those games anywhere.

[Battle Mage]

It's unfamiliarity with a game mechanic more than anything else. You may have noticed I made a random lynch vote in this game already. With my earliest experience of playing Mafia, I didn't do any random voting until I was confident enough to do it, but that wasn't on this site and I don't believe there are transcripts of those games anywhere.

voting for mayor is just like voting for scum, except u vote for the most town person. But random voting can help you put some feelers out, and assess who likes who. Mayor voting can be a useful scumhunting tool aswell, you see?

BM

[Jahudo]

[No, why did you vote him for Mayor? 0.o'

Ugh, im such a dumbass. Whats a vampire?

1. If we want to lynch X today or test the theory that it just won't work (I don't think Unlynchables necessarily have to force a no-lynch if he is telling the truth as town or scum unlynchable), we need to have a mayor. If he doesn't die and is still mayor then he'll be a prime night kill target anyway (I'm guessing there are multiple killing factions because most large games have them).

2. MS wiki article on Vampire : It's basically the Judas role but with a werewolf theme it seems even more likely to be present. It doesn't change my opinion of X's claim, actually, because now that he's claimed unlynchable there might be a killing faction that would get him at night anyway.

Our issue is whether we get rid of X now or wait until tomorrow and if he's still alive we have to wonder why.

Also I'm probably not the best mayor candidate. I like to think I'm pro-town when I'm town but I've been wrong about who's scum alot of times. In fact, that's my meta as town.

[Battle Mage]

[No, why did you vote him for Mayor? 0.o'

Ugh, im such a dumbass. Whats a vampire?

1. If we want to lynch X today or test the theory that it just won't work (I don't think Unlynchables necessarily have to force a no-lynch if he is telling the truth as town or scum unlynchable), we need to have a mayor. If he doesn't die and is still mayor then he'll be a prime night kill target anyway (I'm guessing there are multiple killing factions because most large games have them).

true, but itll make it harder for us to lynch him tomorrow. Something i think is looking more likely atm.

Also I'm probably not the best mayor candidate. I like to think I'm pro-town when I'm town but I've been wrong about who's scum alot of times. In fact, that's my meta as town.

lol

BM

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote Count for Mayor:

(3)Battle Mage: Shadow Knight, Gorrad, Battle Mage
(2)The Fonz: Yosarian2, knox
(2)Xtoxm: Xtoxm,Jahudo
(1)Jahudo: MikeSC6,
(1)Juls: zwetschenwasser
(1)Dr Pepper: The Fonz
(1)DizzyIzzyB13: DizzyIzzyB13
(1)Percy: dingoatemybaby
()MikeSC6:
()Barrylocke:
()dingoatemybaby:
()Firestarter:
()Gorrad:
()knox:
()Mufasa:
()Shadow Knight:
()Shinnen_no_Me:
()Yosarian2:
()ZONEACE:
()Ztife:
()zwetschenwasser:

Not voting: Barrylocke Dr Pepper Firestarter Juls Mufasa Shinnen_no_Me ZONEACE Ztife Juls Percy

Vote Count for Lynch

(6)Xtoxm:Percy, Battle Mage, Gorrad, DizzyIzzyB13, MikeSC6, Jahudo
(1)Jahudo: Shadow Knight
(1)Gorrad: Xtoxm
(1)DizzyIzzyB13: dingoatemybaby
()Battle Mage:
()The Fonz:
()Juls:
()Dr Pepper:
()Percy:
()MikeSC6:
()Barrylocke:
()dingoatemybaby:
()Firestarter:
()knox:
()Mufasa:
()Shadow Knight:
()Shinnen_no_Me:
()Yosarian2:
()ZONEACE:
()Ztife:
()zwetschenwasser:

Not voting: Barrylocke Dr Pepper Firestarter Juls Mufasa Shinnen_no_Me ZONEACE Ztife Juls The Fonz zwetschenwasser Yosarian2 knox

Simultaneous Vote Counts are tricky, so if I messed up, please let me know.

[Mufasa]

Vote Mufasa for Lynch

Vote The Fonz for Mayor

[Barrylocke]

Mayor Vote: Mufasa

Because Mufasa was cool

Lynch Vote: The Fonz

Because he was not

Note that I havent played mafia on this particular site in ages, so I know noone.

[zwetschenwasser]

Unvote Mayor; Vote Mayor: BattleMage

*bows at insane post count*

[Shinnen_no_Me]

I don't buy X's claim. I've heard of Unlynchable as both a town and scum role anyway.

I bet he's actually a UNK SK. This is the perfect fake claim for that.

I'm actually liking this idea. If X was really unlynchable, why would he claim? That would be like the worst idea in a long history of bad ideas. He's basically calling for a N0, if he's a town. So, that leaves us with: a) he's really a bad player; b) he's lying; c) he's truly lynchable but is anti-town; d) he's a jester playing some inverse psycology trick. Either way, he's up to no good. However, I believe that trying to lynch him in D1 is a bad idea. We can learn more about him in D2, if he survives.

And for mayor, I really don't know... I don't recognize most of the players, so I wouldn't know their playstyles. I'll have to wait a bit longer to lay that vote.

Mod: About your rule 11, I believe it is wrong (though, I might be wrong). If n is the number of votes in play, that would mean that a lynch would occur as soon as someone lays a vote. Why? Because you have n/2 + 1 = 1/2 + 1 = 0.5 + 1 = 1.5, rounded down = 1. That means that as soon as a vote is cast, the condition for a lynch is met. I believe that n must be the number of players, and only the numbers of votes in play at deadline. Am I being clear? (sometimes I can't get my point across with numbers, so I want to be sure I'm explaining myself right.)

[Shadow Knight]

The sad part is that if Xtoxm is town and survives night 1, he's painted an even bigger target on his back for the vig.

[Percy]

For the record, here are the breakups by gender and by age:

Male players

dingoatemybaby (Male, 38)
MikeSC6 (Male, 19)
Xtoxm (Male, 18)
zwetschenwasser (Male, 1)
Yosarian2 (Male, 28)
Jahudo (Male, 73)
Barrylocke (Male, 19)
Dr Pepper (Male, 17)
Shadow Knight (Male, 29)
Percy (Male, 27)
Firestarter (Male, 32)
Mufasa (Male, 16)
ZONEACE (Male, 21)

Female players

The Fonz (Female, 11)
DizzyIzzyB13 (Female, 17)
Shinnen_no_Me (Female, 19)
knox (Female, 18)
Gorrad (Female, 42)
Juls (Female, 29)
Ztife (Female, 24)
Battle Mage (Female, 19)

Age in ascending order

zwetschenwasser (Male, 1)
The Fonz (Female, 11)
Mufasa (Male, 16)
DizzyIzzyB13 (Female, 17)
Dr Pepper (Male, 17)
Xtoxm (Male, 18)
knox (Female, 18)
Barrylocke (Male, 19)
Battle Mage (Female, 19)
MikeSC6 (Male, 19)
Shinnen_no_Me (Female, 19)
ZONEACE (Male, 21)
Ztife (Female, 24)
Percy (Male, 27)
Yosarian2 (Male, 28)
Shadow Knight (Male, 29)
Juls (Female, 29)
Firestarter (Male, 32)
dingoatemybaby (Male, 38)
Gorrad (Female, 42)
Jahudo (Male, 73)


No idea if this will prove useful, but good for reference later maybe?

As far as i see it, those who want to be mayor arent necessarily arrogant or scum. They are just being selfish, and finding the simplest route to fulfill their win condition. If we all vote for ourselves, nobody will get anywhere.

...and yet you want to be mayor?

I think those who want to be mayor should be motivated by a

lack

of selfishness - understanding that they are submitting themselves to greater scrutiny for the benefit of the town. Yeah, your vote counts more, but if you're wrong about a vote, it will be a

lot

harder to talk yourself out of getting lynched in retribution. Anyone who is wanting the power to throw in another vote for selfish reasons is dangerous

at best

.

I think a lot of people are voting Battlemage simply because he posts a lot, and that's pretty dumb. A large post count is not indicative of anything I've outlined.


Still no posts from Firestarter, Ztife or ZONEACE. Post, please!

[Shinnen_no_Me]

The Fonz - Female, 11 years old... Hmmm... Reminds me of Lilith, in Supernatural.

Any roads, I agree with Percy in the Mayor issue. Being a Mayor carries a great responsability, which I don't know if I can fulfil, hence why I don't want it. Though I'm getting better with every game I play, I still get a bit emotional with very good players that are even scum. Also, do we have to have a Mayor? Just wondering if there's a deadline for that, or if it's mandatory to have one.

Shadow Knight is also right regarding the X issue and his supposedly unlynchable ability. But, one way or another, I don't think it was wise to claim so soon, hence why I'm distrusting of him right now.

[Percy]

We have to have a mayor.

I've been thinking about Xtomx's claim, and I think it's like a miller role, which should be claimed on Day 1. I think lynching him

just to test his truthfulness

is a bad idea. It's great we have this information, and if he looking like a good lynch candidate, then we lynch him; if he's not, we don't. There is nothing inherently scummy about the ability, and sacrificing a lynch shouldn't be an option.

Where Xtomx is very wrong is that it makes him a good mayor candidate. He shouldn't be mayor, as if he is unlynchable and scum, there will be a minimum of two days where he can wreak havoc with his doublevote.

I'll

Unvote Xtomx for Lynch

(for now) and throw my vote on a lurker!

Vote Ztife for Lynch

.

[Jahudo]

Actually I think if X is scum and has partners, him being mayor is a bad idea even if he does die since he can select the next mayor.

unvote Xtoxm for Mayor
Vote: Battle Mage for Mayor

he seems townish so far

[Gorrad]

I have great faith in BM's scumhunting from past games.

[Juls]

[No, why did you vote him for Mayor? 0.o'

Ugh, im such a dumbass. Whats a vampire?

1. If we want to lynch X today or test the theory that it just won't work (I don't think Unlynchables necessarily have to force a no-lynch if he is telling the truth as town or scum unlynchable), we need to have a mayor. If he doesn't die and is still mayor then he'll be a prime night kill target anyway (I'm guessing there are multiple killing factions because most large games have them).

2. MS wiki article on Vampire : It's basically the Judas role but with a werewolf theme it seems even more likely to be present. It doesn't change my opinion of X's claim, actually, because now that he's claimed unlynchable there might be a killing faction that would get him at night anyway.

Our issue is whether we get rid of X now or wait until tomorrow and if he's still alive we have to wonder why.

Also I'm probably not the best mayor candidate. I like to think I'm pro-town when I'm town but I've been wrong about who's scum alot of times. In fact, that's my meta as town.

You think Xtoxm may be a vampire but still want to lynch him? And you wanted him to be mayor (as of this post)? I don't follow your logic. Plus, I don't like you saying that you have a "meta" of not finding scum. I have seen you play very well as town...granted its been in marathons but that is even a harder scenario for town. I have also seen you play very well as scum. Can you link some games where you sucked as town? It seems to me you are setting yourself to take part in mislynches.

Vote: BM for Mayor

Unvote, Vote Jahudo for Lynch

[Jahudo]

You think Xtoxm may be a vampire but still want to lynch him? And you wanted him to be mayor (as of this post)? I don't follow your logic.

My top two guesses are 1) UNK SK and 2) Scum Unlynchable. It's still early in the day so maybe that will change but I'm just going to start from the vantage point of suspecting X based on his oddly timed claim.

Do you think a vampire could make themselves a target this early in the game? One that wants to be scum more than town I would think, but they have the unique opportunity to switch sides when one begins to gain leverage and day 1 is not the day you can tell that sort of thing. That's why I'm thinking it's possibly SK, because he did not handle being SK well last time (Mini 695).

Plus, I don't like you saying that you have a "meta" of not finding scum. I have seen you play very well as town...granted its been in marathons but that is even a harder scenario for town. I have also seen you play very well as scum. Can you link some games where you sucked as town? It seems to me you are setting yourself to take part in mislynches.

It was mostly a joke because I put that as my "meta" on my wiki page for all to see and obey

I don't mean to say I suck as town (ok, I did suck in Mini 695 oddly enough). I guess let my involvement on wagons speak for themselves and if you think a second vote is safe in my hands then so be it.

[knox]

Vote Mufasa for Lynch

Vote The Fonz for Mayor

Wow this game got going quick. Mufasa, why have you voted yourself for the lynch? Is it just me or does this seem like an odd move?

Vote BM for Mayor

Seems to be working to help the town and would be a good choice.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Mod: About your rule 11, I believe it is wrong (though, I might be wrong). If n is the number of votes in play, that would mean that a lynch would occur as soon as someone lays a vote. Why? Because you have n/2 + 1 = 1/2 + 1 = 0.5 + 1 = 1.5, rounded down = 1. That means that as soon as a vote is cast, the condition for a lynch is met. I believe that n must be the number of players, and only the numbers of votes in play at deadline. Am I being clear? (sometimes I can't get my point across with numbers, so I want to be sure I'm explaining myself right.)

Sorry, what I mean by a vote "in play" is a vote that has the potential to be cast. For example, if somebody were to lose their vote, then the lynch threshold would be based on the number of people who WERE able to vote, not the total number of players.

[Battle Mage]

We have to have a mayor.

I've been thinking about Xtomx's claim, and I think it's like a miller role, which should be claimed on Day 1. I think lynching him

just to test his truthfulness

is a bad idea. It's great we have this information, and if he looking like a good lynch candidate, then we lynch him; if he's not, we don't. There is nothing inherently scummy about the ability, and sacrificing a lynch shouldn't be an option.

There may not be anything inherently scummy about the ability, but there is something inherently scummy about the manner in which he claimed it. If he was town, i see no motive for him to claim such a powerful ability in the early stages of the game, because it just makes him a target. On the other hand, if he is scum, there is no downside to him claiming early, because presumably he cannot be NKed, or is less likely to be. And this is all assuming his claim is true. He could just be a generic goon, who wants to avoid being lynched.

BM

BM

[Battle Mage]

Actually I think if X is scum and has partners, him being mayor is a bad idea even if he does die since he can select the next mayor.

unvote Xtoxm for Mayor
Vote: Battle Mage for Mayor

he seems townish so far

this is a good point. Although it would be interesting to see if he'd implicate a scumbuddy or not.

BM

[Battle Mage]

For the record, here are the breakups by gender and by age:

Male players

dingoatemybaby (Male, 38)
MikeSC6 (Male, 19)
Xtoxm (Male, 18)
zwetschenwasser (Male, 1)
Yosarian2 (Male, 28)
Jahudo (Male, 73)
Barrylocke (Male, 19)
Dr Pepper (Male, 17)
Shadow Knight (Male, 29)
Percy (Male, 27)
Firestarter (Male, 32)
Mufasa (Male, 16)
ZONEACE (Male, 21)

Female players

The Fonz (Female, 11)
DizzyIzzyB13 (Female, 17)
Shinnen_no_Me (Female, 19)
knox (Female, 18)
Gorrad (Female, 42)
Juls (Female, 29)
Ztife (Female, 24)
Battle Mage (Female, 19)

Age in ascending order

zwetschenwasser (Male, 1)
The Fonz (Female, 11)
Mufasa (Male, 16)
DizzyIzzyB13 (Female, 17)
Dr Pepper (Male, 17)
Xtoxm (Male, 18)
knox (Female, 18)
Barrylocke (Male, 19)
Battle Mage (Female, 19)
MikeSC6 (Male, 19)
Shinnen_no_Me (Female, 19)
ZONEACE (Male, 21)
Ztife (Female, 24)
Percy (Male, 27)
Yosarian2 (Male, 28)
Shadow Knight (Male, 29)
Juls (Female, 29)
Firestarter (Male, 32)
dingoatemybaby (Male, 38)
Gorrad (Female, 42)
Jahudo (Male, 73)


No idea if this will prove useful, but good for reference later maybe?

Yeh, thats a very good idea actually. Must be some sort of reason for them...

As far as i see it, those who want to be mayor arent necessarily arrogant or scum. They are just being selfish, and finding the simplest route to fulfill their win condition. If we all vote for ourselves, nobody will get anywhere.

...and yet you want to be mayor?

I think those who want to be mayor should be motivated by a

lack

of selfishness - understanding that they are submitting themselves to greater scrutiny for the benefit of the town. Yeah, your vote counts more, but if you're wrong about a vote, it will be a

lot

harder to talk yourself out of getting lynched in retribution. Anyone who is wanting the power to throw in another vote for selfish reasons is dangerous

at best

.

Lol, calm down! xD
When i say people voting themselves for mayor are being selfish, i mean they are looking no further than the tip of their nose for a candidate. It's a logical approach:- I know im town, therefore if i am mayor, at the very least, ill be TRYING to find scum.
My point was, this policy doesnt work for everyone-because if nobody looks to another candidate, scum will inevitably win (because they can trust each other).
I think you'll find i'm quite aware of the fact that the mayor will be under the spotlight, but i think you may be overstating what the role of Mayor actually is. At the moment, the mayor is weak. A double vote with 11 to lynch, is not a major difference maker. It's much later in the game that this becomes a pertinent issue. I've already stated that im well familiar with the Kingmaker game structure.

I think a lot of people are voting Battlemage simply because he posts a lot, and that's pretty dumb. A large post count is not indicative of anything I've outlined.

Why do you think i would be a bad mayor?

BM

[MikeSC6]

Unvote: Jahudo for Mayor

Who actually wants to be mayor? I think it would be helpful if we narrow it down to whoever wants the responsibility- having it thrust on someone who doesn't want it, because of a lack of confidence or a sensitive role for instance, would do more harm than good.

I can't get my head around Xtoxm's actions- what has gone on so far would surely be risky for town or scum, or in fact an SK. It looks like he's trying to get us to test his claim. Unless, like people have said, he wants us to think he's a Jester or a Vampire or a similar role, in order to protect himself from a lynch. For all we know he could be nightkkill immune, and using this to discourage us from using the only weapon that would work. Or a special kind of werewolf that needs to be silver-bulleted rather than lynched maybe? A Werewolf Godfather, that would come up innocent on investigation and can't be NKed?

Are we expecting further information from Xtoxm regarding his role? This speculation is leading down many different alleys. If he is pro-town, the information he's given so far would be most helpful for scum.

Unvote: Xtoxm for lynch

If he wants us to lynch him, then I don't think we should. It wouldn't make him a confirmed townie, even if he's telling the truth about being unlynchable. And if he's lying, he must want to be lynched.

[Ztife]

I believe Xtoxm has been lynched D1 in another game I saw as well.. for erractic posting. Can't rmb which game though.

Lynch Vote: Zwet

, for being a 1 year old kid... how can a kid be sensible in his votes?

Also,

FoS: Percy

Seems a little too early to scum hunt issin't it? Anyway, I didn't realise the game started, I was still refering to the queue thread...



Also, I volunteer myself for mayor's position. Im more of a conservative/argumentative player, I use words more than I use votes to pressure players and stuff, so I won't be needing it much in the 1st place, instead, here's what I'll propose if im mayor..

I will only cast my vote (worth 2 as mayor) only when there is at least 1/4 of town (excluding myself) urging me to vote. The exception is that if the vote is a hammer, I will not do it. Instead for me to do a hammer vote I will need all the current voters for the target to urge me to do the hammer. Meaning every voter for the target has to agree to a hammer.

There are several benefits to this, its essentially giving people 2 levels of suspicion. If you are really suspicious of a person, you can urge me to use my vote INCLUDING YOUR OWN VOTE. If you are suspicious, but not too, you can choose not to use my vote. This will make people think twice before they spend their votes, and it will be harder for maf to try and abuse.. since townie pushes for them will look extremely scummy.

In addition I will also state which targets I will want to vote for should I have a normal vote and such as well, just like a normal game. I will essentially play a normal game except for this mayor vote which will be "used" by town basically.

[Juls]

Do you think a vampire could make themselves a target this early in the game? One that wants to be scum more than town I would think, but they have the unique opportunity to switch sides when one begins to gain leverage and day 1 is not the day you can tell that sort of thing. That's why I'm thinking it's possibly SK, because he did not handle being SK well last time (Mini 695).

Yes I do. That is why I am baffled as to why you would want to have him as mayor.