Mini #516: Canyon City - Abandoned

[Spambot]

While I can see some benefit, I agree that lynching an npc today is wrong. Depending on what sort of information is revealed tomorrow, it might become worth it, but right now I think we just don't know enough about how they work to make a good decision, given that we can't analyze their behavior or anything. I really doubt that we can tell which ones are scum based on the role name alone.

[Phate]

So, now that we're all agreed on that, let's turn to the lighter business of choosing one among us to brutally murder.

=]

Bump.

[Spambot]

So, now that we're all agreed on that, let's turn to the lighter business of choosing one among us to brutally murder.

=]

Bump.

Ok, you go first.

[Shanba]

A vague dislike of Phate's last post prompts a

Vote: Phate

. Is everyone aware we're deadlined?

[somestrangeflea]

Apologies for recent inactivity. It's been a frantic weekend, and I'm going on an away for a few days. No idea how active I can be when I'm gone, but I'll be back on Friday.

If I need to be replaced, so be it...

[tyhess]

A vague dislike of Phate's last post prompts a

Vote: Phate

. Is everyone aware we're deadlined?

yes

[MCHammer]

I didn't think the deadline was in force yet actually, but have seen it now (only ever tend to read the rules once or twice)

mod: can we get the deadline date on the nxt votecount?

- even though my random vote was on phate, I think I'm happy with it for the while (he does seem awfully eager after all).

Seeing as how we've now come to an agreement as over how to treat the NPCs, there's a few players who have kinda disappeared though....I hope phate hasn't killed them somehow

[YagamiLight]

Well, seeing as we have come to our decision, I should probably

Unvote

that NPC. And after my reread of our amazing three pages , the only thing I really see is two things by phate. His joke about all scum claiming now just seems kind of odd, the same goes for his most recent post. Both seem like jokes, but both seem kind of odd to me all the same. Both are really minor, but it's all I see right now, and he only has 2 votes, so let's bump it up to 3.

Vote Phate

[Phate]

*grins, unconcerned*

So the evidence so far is that I don't like inactivity and I make lame jokes. If those are scumtells, I'm going to be lynched every game.

Yagami, IGMEOY. I'm in another game with Shanba (where she's definitely town, IMO) and I'm harping at everyone to post there, too. So I can see her getting fed up. And groinhammer's vote was a random one that he chose to let stand. Those I can accept, even if I don't agree with them.

But my joke "So... yeah. I vote all the scum claim right now" and my other one "So, now that we're all agreed on that, let's turn to the lighter business of choosing one among us to brutally murder." (I believe both are complete with a smiley, too) are admittedly lame, but implying that they're scummy?

If I was scum, what possible benefit would I have by making a joke about the scum claiming or by humourously (to me, anyway) trying to spur activity? It seems to me that you're just looking for a wagon to jump onto.

[YagamiLight]

I'll admit I'm just looking for somewhere to place my vote, I don't care if the person had votes or not. It's not so much they were bad jokes as it's the only thing that really stands out right now. If you would prefer I could have been just like everyone else and just stayed as I was, not posting anything. Like I said, that's all that stands out, and until something better shows up (which would be anything really) then I'm keeping my vote on you. Also, if you were to get any higher, I would remove my vote, because it's definitely not enough to lynch.

[Shanba]

viewtopic.php?t=1798viewtopic.php?t=4861
Both of these are examples of scum making jokes - in the first, I jokeclaimed scum d1. In the second, EmpTyger jokeclaims scum halfway through day 1 - he ended getting lynched for it (and also got his title). Now, it's not an exactly comparable situation, as he didn't fakeclaim scum. However, it's enough of a scumtell for me to base my d1 vote on. Also, I dislike the way he asks us to move forward without actually doing anything about it in the post I said I disliked.

[Phate]

Those are scum jokeclaiming, not making jokes. Large difference there. I think I'll go look at the first three pages of three random games and tally the joking scum to joking town ratio.

[YagamiLight]

You know Phate, something else that stands out is that you criticized me for my comments/vote for those two posts, but not Shanba or Groinhammer, who both pointed at one a well.

[Phate]

...

Did you actually read the post (58)? Go back up and read the second paragraph, where I explain why I'm not (as) suspicious of them and explain why. Then read the third paragraph, where I explain that I AM suspicious of you, because of the (given) REASON for your voting.

Also, Shanba, I'm'a give you some links.

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6027 - Friends and Enemies
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6468 - Newbie 495
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6561 - Triumvirate Mafia

Friends and Enemies is an open game with 3 Masons, 3 Mafia, and 6 townies. I joke a lot there, but when I see something serious, I discuss it seriously (although I may throw a joke or two in parentheses)

Newbie 495 is, obviously, a newbie game. I behave similarly there, although after reading games where action is spurred by a particularly abrasive player, I have decided to try and conduct myself there in a much more profane manner, to test the results. And yet, aside from my self-imposed posting restriction, the formula is the same: a unique mix of lame jokes and analysis.

Triumvirate Mafia - Here, I

Oh, shit. Gots to go. Will finish this later.

[YagamiLight]

Yeah... that's probably why I didn't mention it in my post (59). But I still stand by what I said in 59, about your thing being small imo, but all there is right now.

[Shanba]

phate, linking ongoing games in normally considered bad form, as it gives clues to your alignment oustide of the thread. Specifically, I'm going to forbid you to say anything about my game - I'm sure the mods of the other games feel similarly.

However, the gist of your argument is that you like to joke aroun and therefore it's not scummy for you to. Perhaps that is true. I don't know you well enough yet to offer an opinion on that. Until I form a metagame read on you, there's little point in me pursuing this further. Consider the point dropped.

However, there's still the second point - I don't like the way you asked us to contribute without doing it yourself. It's not damning, but it' good enough for my 1st non random vote.

[Primate]

...

Did you actually read the post (58)? Go back up and read the second paragraph, where I explain why I'm not (as) suspicious of them and explain why. Then read the third paragraph, where I explain that I AM suspicious of you, because of the (given) REASON for your voting.

Also, Shanba, I'm'a give you some links.

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6027 - Friends and Enemies
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6468 - Newbie 495
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6561 - Triumvirate Mafia

Friends and Enemies is an open game with 3 Masons, 3 Mafia, and 6 townies. I joke a lot there, but when I see something serious, I discuss it seriously (although I may throw a joke or two in parentheses)

Newbie 495 is, obviously, a newbie game. I behave similarly there, although after reading games where action is spurred by a particularly abrasive player, I have decided to try and conduct myself there in a much more profane manner, to test the results. And yet, aside from my self-imposed posting restriction, the formula is the same: a unique mix of lame jokes and analysis.

Triumvirate Mafia - Here, I

Oh, shit. Gots to go. Will finish this later.

Make another post like this again and I will modkill you.

@Votecount: I'll do it when I'm not in class.

[Spambot]

If I was scum, what possible benefit would I have by making a joke about the scum claiming or by humourously (to me, anyway) trying to spur activity? It seems to me that you're just looking for a wagon to jump onto.

You would be trying too hard to fit in and make jokes, like you're acting relaxed. It does look like you are trying to appear townie right now.

The way you are being so dismissive and adamant about how your actions aren't scummy is enough for me to vote for you. I think it might be a slip that you are SO hard attacking the premise of the argument (that you joking is scummy) and aren't really addressing the conclusion (you are scum). Does everybody see what I mean there? I'm not sure if it's clear. I think he's doing the classic "well, you can't PROVE that I killed her"-guilty-conscience thing. It's not huge, but at this point in the game I haven't seen anything better to go on.

Also, that you were criticizing others for lack of content without going after scum first bothers me. You're showing now that you'll post a lot to defend yourself, but you haven't done anything to look for scum. I think being so self-centered and unhelpful is a decent scum tell.

Vote: Phate

[Shanba]

If I was scum, what possible benefit would I have by making a joke about the scum claiming or by humourously (to me, anyway) trying to spur activity? It seems to me that you're just looking for a wagon to jump onto.

You would be trying too hard to fit in and make jokes, like you're acting relaxed. It does look like you are trying to appear townie right now.

The way you are being so dismissive and adamant about how your actions aren't scummy is enough for me to vote for you. I think it might be a slip that you are SO hard attacking the premise of the argument (that you joking is scummy) and aren't really addressing the conclusion (you are scum). Does everybody see what I mean there? I'm not sure if it's clear. I think he's doing the classic "well, you can't PROVE that I killed her"-guilty-conscience thing. It's not huge, but at this point in the game I haven't seen anything better to go on.

I actually disagree up to here. The first seems to be condemning him because he's defensive, which is not a scumtell (neither scum nor town should let themselves be lynched). The second paragraph I don't agree with either - I would be more worried if someone only attacked the conclusion (No! I'm not scum! Honest!") than the argument. The guilty conscience thing is interesting, but not really applicable to mafia - scum in mafia don't feel guilty for killing people at night and therefore the psychological factor which pushes them deny things like that is gone. Also, the difference between real life and Mafia is in Mafia it doesn't matter if you can prove it or not - so long as you can show that it's likely, you can take down the scum. In reality, you have to have proof.

Also, that you were criticizing others for lack of content without going after scum first bothers me. You're showing now that you'll post a lot to defend yourself, but you haven't done anything to look for scum. I think being so self-centered and unhelpful is a decent scum tell.

Vote: Phate

This bit I agree with though.

[Phate]

I sincerely apologise for linking to current games; I was completely unaware of this rule, probably because of a large oversight on my part. I'll respond to the rest as soon as I get home.

[tyhess]

I actually don't think of that being to scum like-I don't like it, but it's still early enough in the game that I don't think it's that big of a deal.....however, if he keeps it up, i don't know.....

[Phate]

I actually don't think of that being to scum like-I don't like it, but it's still early enough in the game that I don't think it's that big of a deal.....however, if he keeps it up, i don't know.....

This post is unclear. Keeps what up? Mentioning current games? Harping at people to post? Joking?

You would be trying too hard to fit in and make jokes, like you're acting relaxed. It does look like you are trying to appear townie right now.

"You're acting too much like town, so you must be scum." Ladies and gents, it doesn't get much more WIFOM than this. Have you considered the possibility that I AM town, with a propensity for relaxed jokes?

Also, that you were criticizing others for lack of content without going after scum first bothers me. You're showing now that you'll post a lot to defend yourself, but you haven't done anything to look for scum. I think being so self-centered and unhelpful is a decent scum tell.

Hold up, there, tiger. Let's briefly summarize the accusations.

1. I'm criticising others for lack of content.
2. I'm doing so without going after scum first.
3. I'm willing to post a lot to defend myself.
4. I'm not willing to do anything to look for scum.
5. I'm being self-centered.
6. I'm being unhelpful.
7. The above add up to a decent scumtell.

*looks up, whistles* Lucky seven, huh? Let's go quote the actual post that started this whole mess, and see how they match up point-for-point.

So, now that we're all agreed on that, let's turn to the lighter business of choosing one among us to brutally murder.

=]

Bump.

1. There is no criticism of anyone for anything, much less criticising an anonymous plural "others" for "lack of content." I'm attempting to move from our fairly mutual agreement of the matter of the NPCs to the finding of scum.

2. If you read, the entire point of the post was to revitalise the search for scum. This one's a real stretch.

3. Ummm... yeah. Gonna have to agree on this one. I will post to defend myself from the moment I am accused to to the moment before my lynch, should it come to that. Deal with it.

4. See #2.

5. You're building on a foundation that doesn't exist. What about that post was self-centered?

6. Au contraire. No matter what happens from this point forward, we (or the rest of you, as the case may be) will be able to look back at this page and decide who was genuinely suspicious and who was just trying to get a townie lynched. Considering that all we've done so far is agree a lot about the NPCs, I'd say I've been the most helpful person so far this game.

7. I'm not nearly as experienced as some of you, but I really don't consider my behaviour scummy. Let's see: the main accusations are that I'm trying too hard to act town (which I've addressed) and that I'm trying to spur activity while not actually contributing.

Of those, only the second has merit. It's true; I have been trying to spur activity and my posts to try to accomplish that goal have been otherwise useless (although you have to admit, it HAS spurred activity =P). I apologise for the otherwise-uselessness of the post, but you know what? I don't really regret anything I've said so far (scratch that. I DO regret linking to current games. Other than that, nothing.)

[tyhess]

I meant if you keep on joking AND talking about other games....either or....I don't expect the latter to continue, however, so mostly the former....

[Phate]

I meant if you keep on joking AND talking about other games....either or....I don't expect the latter to continue, however, so mostly the former....

The former is a nulltell and the latter is a noobtell. I'm not going to talk about other games - I didn't know it was against the rules, and now that I do I won't.

As for joking, if you're suggesting you lynch me if I keep joking, I'll gladly be the D1 lynch - I'm going to keep joking, because I play Mafia because it is enjoyable for me. Stupid restrictions like not being able to make lame jokes take away the enjoyment for me.

[kabenon007]

Of those, only the second has merit. It's true; I have been trying to spur activity and my posts to try to accomplish that goal have been otherwise useless

Oh, okay, well if number two is true, I better go check what it is! I want to get to the truth of this matter... ah, here is number two...

2. If you read, the entire point of the post was to revitalise the search for scum. This one's a real stretch.

Wait... I thought he said that number two was true... but here he labels it as a stretch... I'm so confused... Phate, care to explain?