Mini 539: Game over

[Ythill]

That crumb is so vague I think it's an accident.

I doubt it, though I’d love to hear charter’s word here. I doubt it because it immediately followed my breadcrumb; it was the first line of a short, otherwise pointless post; and I tested the waters with my “definitive town” read on charter (Ho1den was a smokescreen to hide the role talk) which he reacted to with surprise and concern.

I could be wrong though. I just wish someone else had noticed it when Gorgon claimed.

Not looking scummy is something i've been told on multiple occasions I gotta work on.

I didn’t think your playstyle was very scummy. I thought it was a playstyle easily manipulated by scum, but I was pretty convinced you were town, especially mid-game. I did question your alignment at the end but wouldn’t have voted you over Justin. And I did question it a bit on D1 because I hadn’t gotten a solid read yet.

Seriously, I don’t think you need much work. In fact, your playstyle with very minor adjustments would be excellent for trapping opportunistic scum.

Btw, was Ythill really one shot?

Yes sir. And here is the theory topic as promised. I think you did a really good job as scum, Shteven. North was a dead man. You replaced in and managed to take the heat off long enough that we strung up DS. Justin certainly helped you, but good show!

BTW, the DS lynch will forever haunt me as the cost of n00bness and impatience. I will never lynch another absent player as town, at least not on D1.

Xtoxm, you are not the only one that has to work on that part of the game (not looking scummy)...

Don't feel too bad about it. English as a second language makes you seem like an easy target for scum, and it makes your defenses less comprehensible. This isn't the only game where I've seen the bilingual player pushed hard toward mislynch. I think I'm going to start considering that a possible tell.

I think that Ythill killed me not as much as because he thought I was scum, as because my death would reveal the most information about most players, since I had a very strong opinion of a lot of players.

It was both. Your opening town read on me really pinged my scumdar because I had seriously been trying to look scummy and had faced suspicion from many angles. Your read seemed like a lie and it was one that followed scummy motivations. When I pointed that out, your too-casual reply confirmed it for me.

I couldn’t kill Incog because he was the target of my vig gambit and it would have been a wasted bullet (I never planned on killing him). I considered Shteven, SSK, Apyadg, and even Justin for the kill. It was a tough decision (I think I turned in the choice a few hours before deadline) but in the end I chose Claus because, of the candidates, he provided the most information. Based on that kill I posted my final positions and boy was I wrong about Justin.

However, I realized Justin was scum around the same time I realized he was town in mini 542. Too bad I was dead in this game by then… So much for my spotless record.


I really hope to play with each of you again. Especially Incog, so I can redeem myself for that brain-dead read on him.

[Ythill]

Apy: I’m very wary of the case against him because of my current suspicions. Carefully scrutinize any D2 case against his replacement. If he dies and comes up town, put Incog and Justin in the hot seat...

Justin: Reread his first attack against me and my defense, look at how he stretches the truth. I had a town read on Justin for a long time and much of it is still valid but there were a few scumtells that surfaced after I made that statement. Most of the evidence against Justin lay in his interactions with Incog and Incog’s targets...

Shteven: He spent some time as my PE#1. I still find him scummy...

The preceding quote has been shameless self promotion. If we are town together again and I die before you, please examine my last words carefully.

[Justin Playfair]

Ythill,

Not surprised you figured that out. I noticed that whereas when I'm town I seem to think I'm able to find scum (based on not much evidence that I have a clue), in this game I was careful as an elderly mouse. It's going to be a lot harder to figure that out in the future, though, because I'm starting to figure out just how inept I am at actual scum hunting.

Hjallti,

You are one of my favorite people to play with, and I think you're an awfully good player. It's always tough replacing in, but you are hard to lay a glove on and a great counter puncher. If town hadn't become so fixated on Gorgon there was no way I would have gotten you lynched. Kuribo, for one, clearly hated the idea, and he was leading town at that point. If you have a vulnerability I think it's musing out loud in thread about various play possibilities. Your strengths are far greater, though.

[Hjallti]

If you have a vulnerability I think it's musing out loud in thread about various play possibilities.

I guess I will be more careful with that in the future. I don't take notes on paper. All I want to remember and know I might forget I just post in-game. The no lynch idea was such an example. I did see games where town would have had a better chance in winning with a nolynch than with a lynch close to endgame. I was just in a hurry when I brought it up, and shouldn't have.

I am also surprized I saw the tendency here that 3:9 is normal, as I have played apparently only other games (3:1:8). Shteven claiming 3 scum was not something I would jump onto as I did expect it that way. I mean I could have put in the same way.

My other problem, english being my

third

language is also something to work on, and ofcourse useful outside this game as well.

[Xtoxm]

Xtoxm, you are not the only one that has to work on that part of the game (not looking scummy)...

I don't recall finding you scummy.

[Xtoxm]

I didn’t think your playstyle was very scummy. I thought it was a playstyle easily manipulated by scum, but I was pretty convinced you were town, especially mid-game. I did question your alignment at the end but wouldn’t have voted you over Justin. And I did question it a bit on D1 because I hadn’t gotten a solid read yet.

Seriously, I don’t think you need much work. In fact, your playstyle with very minor adjustments would be excellent for trapping opportunistic scum.

Wow...Thanks!

[Shteven]

True that 3:9 is the most common setup and I claimed that in my defense, I just was really surprised to be called on it. I probably would have shrugged it off easier if I was really town, although I don't know how easy it would be to pick up on that tell from the outside. I really am naturally defensive. I might try just responding once to a claim and then not bringing up the defense again in the future.

True, I did feel pretty good going into night 1. I suppose I shouldn't give myself too much of a hard time dying day 2 after surviving day 1

[Jester]

After Shteven died my first goal was to make sure no scum hunting block developed. I could see the possibility of that with Kuribo and Jester. I killed Jester because I didn’t have a feel for Jester but felt sure Kuribo was a good player.

Great comments, thanks, JP. I'm curious about this, though. If you felt kuribo was a good player, but didn't have a good read on me, why not NK kuribo?

I've been getting NK'ed a lot on this board and have been trying to dial down the tendencies that cause it so that I can actually play a game here from start to finish. I thought I had done that in this game... until I turned up dead. It's interesting to hear you confirm that I was a little ambiguous... but that you decided to kill me anyway.

[Justin Playfair]

Jester,

I hadn't seen enough of you to be sure if you would move on instinct alone. Which I couldn't afford, you know, being scum and all. I was pretty sure that in endgame Kuribo wouldn't. I needed not just a player who I thought would examine the evidence, but one I felt sure wouldn't, with the game on the line, go against it. With Kuribo I felt I had seen enough of him to be fairly certain of both. You may have too, but I hadn't seen enough of you to be sure.

And I had to get rid of one of you. No how no way no matter how many masons were in town I felt certain one of you had to die the night after Shteven hung. Killing you deprived town of some of its leadership and energy while not drawing a specific line to me. Killing Kuribo would have drawn more attention to the Shteven lynch and the possible lines from Shteven to others, where I thought I had some vulnerability. There were a lot of reasons that played into it, really. But the final through-line was I needed someone who would examine the evidence and feel compelled to go with it at the end, and of the two of you I felt more sure of Kuribo.

[Xtoxm]

Taking this game off watched topics.

[Hjallti]

Justin, this is somehow pervers: you actually wanted the 'better' player in the endgame to be sure he would miss, as the player you doubted to be equally good might have done the right thing....

[MeMe]

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