Mini 1034 - Castlevania Mafia (Game Over)

[tanstalas]

Vote: drmyshottyizsik

since we are doing RVS

Protected him in a game N1, he was scum, and his scum buddy killed me N1

RE: the game claim, I don't even know what game I came from I'd have to look it up since I only played the ones from the NES days - and I even might be from those ones since it's been like 20 years plus since I played those

[tanstalas]

Right, tans, but would you support one or be against one.

Also, while I'm at it, if anyone who's already answered could provide reasoning for their choice (unless you already did), it'd help immensely.

I'd be against it, just for the fact that someone who knows the castlevania games may know that X number of good and X number of bad characters were introduced in a game and vote for someone just for the reason that there us a higher chance that a person is a bad character - which would be a dumb vote because we do not even know if alignment in the games = alignment in this game.

[tanstalas]

I'm town. and I'm not a lyncher. and coach travis's reaction means bandwagoning scum.

Unvote; Vote: Coach Travis

This is the best tell I have so far for a real vote

Unvote
Vote: Coach Travis

[tanstalas]

and his bussing partner right here^

Believe what you want to believe. However your comment makes me wary of you now

[tanstalas]

^OMGUS

Unvote; Vote: tanstalas

No. What YOU just did was OMGUS, I just stated that I was wary of you now, and am wary of everyone since I do not know who is scum and who is mafia. Now I am starting to think you are scum as you are vote hopping.

HoS: Zewt

Yes, you are getting the whole hand, all FIVE fingers

[tanstalas]

Cause I think tans came off the worse in that exchange. Here is how it read to me:

Tans votes CT.
zwet says its a bus.
Tans says "you can think what you want, but now I'm wary of you"
zwet says "OMGUS"
Tans says "NO YOU!" and then votes zwet

Of the two, tans looks much scummier to me than zwet.

#1 - As pointed out earlier Zwet was the first to go into the whole OMGUS thing
#2 - I had a valid reason to HoS Zwet and I explained it (his vote hopping)
#3 - I also like the way in your little recap above you said that zwet just said "OMGUS" when in fact he said that and THEN also voted for me, and your point below you mention that I voted for Zwet, which I didn't - I just HoS'd him.

So in your short little recap of why you voted for me you misrepresented probably the two most important things for your case, the fact that Zwet voted for me and the fact that I did NOT vote for Zwet

Your vote on me as well as Dekes vote on me are both very scummy looking considering the "reason" you are voting for me is because I HoS'd someone who was vote hopping.

Unvote:
Vote: LMP
FoS: Dekes

I, unlike you have given plenty of reasons why I am voting for you and FOS'ing Dekes, so please call this OMGUS again

[tanstalas]

So...um...basically everyone who votes you is somehow scum, tans? You also don't really get into the Dekes thing.

Meh, whatever, early D1, cases tend to suck.

At any rate I can mostly see now.

What? Where did you get that?

I said his reasoning for voting me was stupid. He (LMP) voted me over Zwet and the reason given was because "He did an OMGUS vote" which isn't even true, I never even voted him - and it was Zwet who did the OMGUS vote. Dekes basically voted me because he said I got defensive to Zwet's vote on me:

No. What YOU just did was OMGUS, I just stated that I was wary of you now, and am wary of everyone since I do not know who is scum and who is mafia. Now I am starting to think you are scum as you are vote hopping.

I don't see how the above statement made me seem defensive.

I HoS'd him for his vote hopping; he VOTED me for my comment that his comment made me think he was a little more scummy (A true OMGUS vote).

[tanstalas]

114 is funny. Its true, I said you voted when you didn't, because somehow in my brain I translated that HOS into a vote, since I assumed you would actually vote, not HOS. What exactly was the point of HOS there anyways? Where was your vote at the time? If you really thought what he was doing was so scummy it was worth a HOS, then why wasn't it worth your vote?

I'm loving my vote.

My vote was on coach, however thanks to you I found a good place to put it.

[tanstalas]

EBWOP - Also you didn't explain why you forgot to leave out Zewt's vote on me in your analysis. Sub consciously protecting your scum-buddy?

[tanstalas]

Cut by tans:

Ok, so, how does stupid reasoning make one more likely to be scum? Please?

It's not a well thought out vote - scum know who is scum and who are town, so they tend to be "lazier" in making their cases against other people.

Oh, right, how does vote hopping make one more likely to be scum?

If they are vote hopping it means they are basically just throwing random votes with stupid reasons (see above) hoping something will stick and hoping they can encourage someone else to hop on their bandwagon (in my opinion)

[tanstalas]

What prevents townies from being lazy, especially in early game?

Fair point on the second. There does exist vote hopping that can benefit scum more.

If you are town you should not be lazy. Being lazy as town does nothing to help the town. Scum still get their kill at night even if noone is lynched during the day. If you are town and are not helping the town you would make a good mislynch. The only reason I can see to not be active in a thread is if you are scum or if you are a PR that does not want to get NK'd N1 (such as a doctor or a cop).

On the topic of no-lynches though, what are your guys opinion on a no-lynch? Since I asked the question I will answer it as well. I believe that a no-lynch can be a good strategy later in the game, however D1 town should ALWAYS get a lynch, even if it ends up being a mislynch as we can gain valuable information from whatever the person flipped, who was pushing hard for the lynch, etc.

[tanstalas]

EBWOP - Also you didn't explain why you forgot to leave out Zewt's vote on me in your analysis. Sub consciously protecting your scum-buddy?

Again you skirted around this question, care to answer it?

I'll tell you what I think, I think you intentionally left it out, just like you intentionally made it seem that I OMGUS voted him, which I didn't; I think you are manipulating what actually transpired to make me look worse because you got caught in a fallacy that you were voting for me because I OMGUS voted someone when in fact it was your scum buddy who OMGUS voted me. Either that or you aren't paying attention to the game that closely, which makes me think you are scum as well.

Let's look how your posts went down

You claim your scum radar went off and you voted me
You were asked for reasons why you voted for me and you replied "Desperation" and that I OMGUS voted
Then after UK pointed out that your scum buddy was actually the one who OMGUS voted you came out and said that I was the one who came out more scummy and then made a summary post with what went down but changed a few key facts to make me look worse.

[tanstalas]

@Mod

Sorry, due to computer problems I will be V/LA for a couple days. If it gets to be too long replace me, but hopefully I'll be back soon.

Any thoughts while you have access?

[tanstalas]

Late, me tired, comp not willing to cooperate much, so few thoughts.

Zwet claim/fake-claim - normal
Zwet votehopping/play after - not so much

Head says scum, gut says town.
What I don't get though, was that if zwet was trapping, why end trap to vote first voter... That said, Travis' reaction was quite overly defensive.

However,

Vote: Tanstalus

. His interaction with zwet bothers me, and he doesn't even vote zwet, but "HOS'es" him. This seems ridiculous to me, and feels like scum afraid to place vote and be accused of votehopping like zwet was. His essentially OMGUS vote on LMP makes me feel good about this vote.

I really love how everyone seems to ignore the fact that LMP ignored the first OMGUS and instead decided to focus on my HOSing Zwet and finding that scummy. Also that that is the main reason why people have voted for me.

Also LMP's responses so far have been a bunch of denial and deflection. Seriously, look at his ISO and tell me that doesn't look like scum.

In a lot of his posts in the game he seems to "misinterpret" or didn't pay attention to the posts.

ISO-3/4 - admits he didn't read the post he was referencing properly
ISO-5 - Votes me without any reason
ISO-6 - Claims he voted me because he is wary of people who shout OMGUS at first opportunity

after

he was asked for reasons
ISO-7 -

After

it is pointed out to him that Zwet was actually the first to OMGUS he makes up a little post and says that I voted when I didn't and leaves out the fact that Zwet actually DID Omgus vote
ISO-8 - Says "oops - I thought you voted when you only HoS'd" Another reading comprehension fail I guess?
ISO-10 - Refuses to answer my question, calls the rest of my post bullshit

@everyone

, what alignment is most likely to not pay attention to detail in posts?

If you are town you are scouring everyones posts for the smallest tell.
Look at LMP, and ask yourself, does it look like he is really paying attention to the game?

Even if LMP is town he is being very lazy with his posts. He posts with not enough facts/information in them. Twice other people (other than me) have pointed out this.

*Waits eagerly for LMP's "Nuh-uh" rebuttle post.*

Also in regards to Zwet - UK asked him a few questions as well, and he refused to answer them. As well as VasudaVa.

@everyone

-Can you honestly say that you get a town vibe from either of these people?

On a sidenote - where the hell is drmyshottyizsik?

[tanstalas]

I'll iso LMP tomorrow, but for me, zwet OMGUS was consistant to how he played after claiming. Your reaction to his OMGUS was suspect.

Tell me this, why no vote and just a "OMGUS HOS"?

Because I do agree that CT's vote on Zwet looked suspicious, he replaced his RVS vote with a serious vote just because Zwet "looked" scummy but didn't offer any reasons (also why my vote is sitting on LMP now) and he basically said "I have nothing so I'll switch my vote to this BW"

Then Zwet made the bussing comment, and I replied with whatever you want to believe and then he OMGUS voted me so I HOS'd him because he DID OMGUS vote me (for no reason - see above on my opinion of that) which is suspicious, however I already had my vote on CT who at that time looked just as guilty - albeit for different reasons so I just gave him the hand (and I gave reasoning) one thing you notice is I give reasoning when I vote people. The people on my wagon not so much, or are just parroting what others have said.

[tanstalas]

OK

UK asked me before if I suspected everyone who has voted for me. I am going to give my full analysis now

Zwet - I think he is town, I think he started this BW on me as a gambit to see who would jump on
LMP - Think he is scum for reasons stated before
Katsuki - Think he is scum as well because:
A)His last post before Saturday's was on Thursday - that means he probably read all the posts before he posted and voted me
B)I made a case on LMP and he said he would ISO LMP tomorrow (his ISO consists of only 11 posts at that point and he had just read all of the posts IN context) Why not just do the ISO then?
C)I make a case on LMP and he says I am "flailing" Really? So let me get this straight, I defend myself and in the eyes of the people on my wagon I am "overly defensive" and that seems scummy. I make a case on someone else (granted I may be a little biased here but I think my case on LMP is much better than the case the people on my BW have on me)
D)Said he would ISO LMP "tomorrow" which made it sound like he wasn't going to be around until the next day. After UK, McG and LMP commented on my analysis of LMP (which didn't go as well as I thought) that is when he decided to comment on my ISO LMP post since he had a few people already shoot my analysis down
Dekes - I had a neutral to scum read on him, as his vote on me just really consisted of him parroting others, but really when you look at the weak evidence on me you would be hard pressed to come up with anything else. Though when he again enforced his vote on me by parroting Katsuki's "he is flailing" argument that kind of cemented it for me

My top 3 picks (in order)
1)LMP
2)Katsuki
3)Dekes

I think this will be my last post for a bit, I can't seem to get anywhere with you guys. I defend myself and you say it's scummy, I make another case on someone and you say it's scummy. If I get to L-2 or L-1 I will nameclaim which should clear me, however I am hesitant to do that because if you know who I am you will probably be able to figure out my ability which will make me less useful to the town.

I have one more post coming in after this to respond to an LMP post - because he obviously has reading comprehension problems

[tanstalas]

Nuh-uh. (See what I did there?)

You still haven't explained where all your recent vote changes and HOS/FOS leave CT, who you apparently thought was so bad he was worse than zwet, but now you can't even be bothered with him.

Do you read my posts at all?

This was a mere 3 posts before you made the above comment

Because I do agree that CT's vote on Zwet looked suspicious, he replaced his RVS vote with a serious vote just because Zwet "looked" scummy but didn't offer any reasons (also why my vote is sitting on LMP now) and he basically said "I have nothing so I'll switch my vote to this BW"

Then Zwet made the bussing comment, and I replied with whatever you want to believe and then he OMGUS voted me so I HOS'd him because he DID OMGUS vote me (for no reason - see above on my opinion of that) which is suspicious, however I already had my vote on CT who at that time looked just as guilty - albeit for different reasons so I just gave him the hand (and I gave reasoning) one thing you notice is I give reasoning when I vote people. The people on my wagon not so much, or are just parroting what others have said.

[tanstalas]

MAYBE KAT WAS ON A CAR FROM 9AM FRIDAY MORNING FOR 18HRS UNTIL 3AM SAT MORNING. YOU CAN CHECK ALL MY GAMES IF YOU WANT.

ALSO, I GAVE MY THOUGHTS ON LMP ISO FRIDAY MORNING BEFORE I LEFT I THINK.

DURP. ROPE PLEASE. TANSTALUS NEEDS IT.

What continent do you live on? I don't see any posts from you on Friday at all.

And you have yet to spell my name correctly even once.

And all caps, nice touch.

@all

- If I seemed "overly defensive" in my post, what would you call the above?

[tanstalas]

Nuh-uh. (See what I did there?)

You still haven't explained where all your recent vote changes and HOS/FOS leave CT, who you apparently thought was so bad he was worse than zwet, but now you can't even be bothered with him.

Do you read my posts at all?

This was a mere 3 posts before you made the above comment

Because I do agree that CT's vote on Zwet looked suspicious, he replaced his RVS vote with a serious vote just because Zwet "looked" scummy but didn't offer any reasons (also why my vote is sitting on LMP now) and he basically said "I have nothing so I'll switch my vote to this BW"

Then Zwet made the bussing comment, and I replied with whatever you want to believe and then he OMGUS voted me so I HOS'd him because he DID OMGUS vote me (for no reason - see above on my opinion of that) which is suspicious, however I already had my vote on CT who at that time looked just as guilty - albeit for different reasons so I just gave him the hand (and I gave reasoning) one thing you notice is I give reasoning when I vote people. The people on my wagon not so much, or are just parroting what others have said.

This doesn't answer my question. My question is HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT CT NOW? Why isn't he on your top three suspects list but zwet is? Presumably when you HOS'ed zwet you thought that voting CT was better than voting zwet, or you would have just voted instead of HOS. This is my point, you HOS zwet but leave your vote on CT, but then you move your vote to me and you apparently drop your suspicion of CT. Why is that?

How many scum do you think are in this game? I am thinking either 3 or 4, 3 if there is an SK 4 if there isn't.

CT is sitting at #4 on my list ATM. Who are your top 3 suspects? Aside from you tunneling on me I haven't seen you do any scum hunting. If I am scum why don't you find my scum buddies?

Reason why I think is you really have nothing on me, and when/if I nameclaim you are going to be screwed because you are going to hope that someone else comes up with a case on someone else so you can BW them.

If you are town you are being extremely lazy and not helping the town at all, unless you think there is only 1 scum and I am it. I could actually say this for most of the people on my BW

@Everyone on my BW

- If I get lynched and when I flip town who is going to be your next suspect and why?

[tanstalas]

ASIDE FROM ALL THIS MISREP-ING, Shotty just v/la'd for a week in another game of mine that just started. Just a note.

Wouldn't this be a violation of Rule A4? Just curious as to why you would post this in the thread instead of just PMing the mod.

[tanstalas]

That's a ridiculously high number, tans. Usually minis are 3:9. If an SK is involved, it's generally more balanced to run 2:1:9. Admittedly, I tend to run 3:1:8. With two mafia groups it's generally 2:2:8.

Why do you think 4 scum ever?

I have fairly limited experience on mafiascum, I have only played 2 games to completion so I can only comment on those - 1 of those was a newbie game, so that is 7:2. The other game consisted of 9 townies, 3 mafia, 2 SK's and a town vig.

The other games I have played on another site have usually been 1 scum for every 3 town + an (SK or Vig)

[tanstalas]

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=14742

Yeah it was pretty scary. Probably because of the setup since everyone town was a doc basically.

If you like I can link you to the games I have played offsite. Be warned if you want to use them to meta me they are LONG games (30 pages @ 50 posts per page) and don't have a handy ISO feature like you do on this site

Just looking at a couple of those I did play, wow, we have bastard mods over there, one game was 8 mafia and 11 town :/

[tanstalas]

At this point I don't have 3 suspects. I think zwet's fake claim is interesting, and the reactions to it will be interesting once we see some flips, but as far as scummy, you're all alone at the moment. The fact that you already have 4 scum reads is quite astonishing.

I explained why I have 4 suspects. I find it interesting that you do not want to answer a hypothetical question. I also find it interesting that you only have me as a suspect. So, when I flip town if I get lynched you have no reads from the other people on my BW?

[tanstalas]

Well, I'll have a flip and people's opinions on the wagon to go on, plus presumably NKs (or the lack thereof). That's assuming you are town though, which at this point doesn't seem that likely.

Well, at this point it seems nothing I say or do can convince you I am town. So unless someone else comes in and announces they are scum I think I am going to be stuck with most of this bandwagon on me. I think Zwet is probably the only townie on it.

So, meh..

Nameclaim:

Shanoa

Now it will be interesting to see who else jumps on my wagon now and if anyone actually gets off

If you can figure out my ability based on my name do not speculate on it in thread, because if you can figure it out - you know why I do not want scum to know what it is.

Seriously town, if I get lynched look into LMP and Katsuki closer

[tanstalas]

Like I said before the people on my BW are tunneling on me, they aren't listening to my rebuttals / cases on anyone else, and anything I say just makes me seem more and more like scum

And I'm not positive about Dekes, you two I am positive on.

We will see at the end of the game, and I hope I can say "I told you so" in regards to LMP and Katsuki

And as far as the nameclaim, I'm hoping that the other pro-town people have a main protagonist as their role as well, which would show them that I am town, as why would I claim a MAIN person from the game, as that would be a role that would most likely be used (ie: I'm thinking another pro-town person probably has Simon Belmont, etc) so they would see this and not vote for me, since the game is this early and town outnumber the scum at this point, if I am correct in my hypothesis even if all the scum bandwagoned me I would not by lynched.

[tanstalas]

And the reason I am almost positive about LMP and Katsuki is Katsuki made a overly defensive post - even moreso than what people called my overly defensive post. I then asked a question on who - if I get lynched and flip scum would people suspect and LMP said noone, even after Katsuki's outburst, come on, he even posted it all in caps.

Calling it now, those two are scum.

[tanstalas]

Bad logic. I try my hardest to make sure the fakeclaims are relatively major characters when I make a theme game.

"relatively" is the keyword. I am the MAIN protagonist in the game. My point is that I am betting on that the MAIN protagonists in each game are town. Yes it is a gambit, but really does a nameclaim really matter? I only have anything to gain from it, nothing to lose from it.

Do you see any con to this? Maybe there is one and I don't see it

[tanstalas]

Nah, it's just a mildly early claim and might reveal your power as you said. Either way, there are enough Castlevanias so that I'm pretty sure you could even use main protagonists as fakeclaims.

At this point it doesn't even matter, if I get lynched I am sure that the people on the BW have already pretty much hung themselves. With the excessive tunneling that is going on on me and disregarding everything I have said if I get lynched the town will have more than enough to go back on and evaluate.

I love how everyone on my BW ignores everything I say and doesn't answer my questions. Seriously read their ISO's - it is like I am the only townie in this game.

UK seems like he is the only person who has an opinion.

Zwet I asked you a question, or do you not have any opinion on who else may be scum, what is your opinion of Kat's "overly defensive" post.

Or are you just going to say "irrelevant" again?

@all

- If you are town, why am I the only person questioning these guys?

[tanstalas]

Getting overly aggressive and telling people to lynch me (are you concerned that your only suspect will get his name cleared from his nameclaim?) and refusing to answer most of the questions (and not only from me) has earned you this

Unvote
Vote: Zwet

It is very hard to play a game and get information from people when all your posts are 1 sentence long and when people ask you questions they refuse to answer.

[tanstalas]

And I realize that people are gonna be all "oooh you said Zwet was town and now you are voting for him"

I said I thought Zwet set this up as a gambit, however his last 2 posts pushed that thought out of my head. So yes, I do suspect everyone that has voted for me now. If that seems scummy well, so be it. I do not know who is scum and who is town, I can only make cases based on what I have seen, the whole BWing thing on me is ridiculous. The reasons people have for voting me are ridiculous.

The only case on me is that I OMGUS voted someone, which isn't even true. I already explained this a bunch of times, and I refuse to go through it again. So lynch me if you want. I hope the town smartens up after I flip town

[tanstalas]

Oh, right, over aggressiveness is not really indicative of scum. Lord knows I get VERY aggressive when I think I've found scum.

At any rate, rather than tell us to read their ISOs can you give us a link by link rundown of why they are scum?

I've already given you LMP and Katsuki and recently Zwet those are the reasons.

I have put more effort into finding scum than anyone this game so far. I probably just should have posted "irrelevant" as every post as I would probably be sitting better than I am now.

I have given (what I believe) to be good cases on all the above three people. Everyone wants to dismiss it and just tunnel on me. So be it. Tunnel on me all you want. I am not going to link my posts to make it easy for you - I have already done work - it is there, just ISO me.

I am getting very frustrated with this game as we should have at least 7 other townies (not including me) however aside from UK I do not think anyone else is even reading my posts. Maybe you will when I flip town.

[tanstalas]

Getting overly aggressive and telling people to lynch me (are you concerned that your only suspect will get his name cleared from his nameclaim?) and refusing to answer most of the questions (and not only from me) has earned you this

Unvote
Vote: Zwet

It is very hard to play a game and get information from people when all your posts are 1 sentence long and when people ask you questions they refuse to answer.

also, you just answered your own question, so cut the crap.

Pardon? What do you mean by that?

[tanstalas]

you asked me if you were my only suspect, then came back and said "are you concerned that your only suspect will get his name cleared"

And what about my question about Katsuki's "overly defensive" post made entirely with the caps lock key on?

[tanstalas]

What you've produced are fairly weak cases. They are good for early D1, but very...um...

assumptive

that we know you're town. The reason I haven't really jumped in and started catching scum is they haven't played their full intent yet. There eventually ends up a post that reeks of scum intent and that's when I jump in. Course, I still am fine giving town reads as I get them.

Exactly. And that is why if I get lynched and when I flip town you will be able to look back on them tunneling me. Hey - if my mislynch causes two scum or more to be caught I'm all for it. I'll gladly be the martyr.

[tanstalas]

huh?

Way to pay attention to the thread.

Fail

[tanstalas]

Trouble is mislynches don't often work like that, tans. As I said, you have probably one scum on your wagon right now, if that. Further, if the town is so dumb as you say, they won't be able to engage in the wagon analysis that will catch that one scum. And I'm just as fallible as anyone else. It's too subjective. I would heavily advise against 'martyr' strategies.

Well, what is your suggestion then UK? Everything I say is countered with "That's scummy" I defend myself and I am "overly defensive" - thats scummy. I do analysis's on other players - I'm "flailing" and that's scummy. I point out other people are doing more "overly defensive" posts and ask their opinion on it, and they ignore it, or reply "huh?"

If the people on my BW are town, they sure don't act like they want to find any scum. Instead they just tunnel on me and keep repeating "he OMGUS voted" over and over like a mantra. Which is ironic because I didn't even do it, they are so focused on me they come up with other bullshit excuses to cover for their screwup in the first place.

[tanstalas]

VOTING IS TOWN'S STRONGEST WEAPON. IT ALSO APPLIES PRESSURE AND ALLOWS TOWN TO IDENTIFY WHETHER A PLAYER IS TOWN OR SCUM. THIS, PLUS DISCUSSION, IS ALL WE HAVE D1.

YOUR REACTION TO PRESSURE DOES NOT SCREAM TOWN AT ALL. IN FACT, IT'S QUITE THE OPPOSITE.

ALSO IF CAPS = OVERDEFENSIVE THEN YOU NEED TO FIND A BETTER EXCUSE TO CALL ME SCUM, AS WELL AS NOT POSTING ON SITE FOR 1 ENTIRE DAY.

Also claimed you "think" you posted your opinion of LMP on Friday, then you go to say that you were basically gone all day Friday..

And as well, since you didn't give an opinion of ANYONE'S ISO before Saturday in this entire game how could you even "think" you gave an LMP ISO on Friday?

Sucks being caught in a lie eh?

[tanstalas]

EBWOP: Sorry, don't mean in a lie per se, just something about your posts isn't sitting right with me.

I don't know why you would even "think" you made an ISO on LMP on Friday, for 2 reasons
1)You never did an ISO read on anyone this entire game until Saturday
2)You later said you were basically away all day Friday, so why you would think you made a post on Friday confuses me as well.

I also find it funny you said you were in a car for 18 hours, and as soon as you got home you jumped online to catchup on the thread and make a post, then you went to sleep and you said when you woke up (roughly 6 hours later(by this thread) - if I am allowed to reference other threads I could say that it was actually less than 4 hours but I don't know if I can say that - however you said feel free to check your other threads so..) you jumped back on and posted again.

So after an 18 hour car trip first thing you do is hop on here, read the thread make a post, then go to sleep for less than 4 hours and as soon as you get up you re-read the thread and do another post. I must say, you are really into your mafiascum

[tanstalas]

I FEEL LIKE YOU'RE NOT SCUMHUNTING AND RUNNING MORE OF A POLITICAL SMEAR CAMPAIGN.

I kept the above as I find it quite ironic, as the only "scumhunting" you have done is the following:

His interaction with zwet bothers me, and he doesn't even vote zwet, but "HOS'es" him. This seems ridiculous to me, and feels like scum afraid to place vote and be accused of votehopping like zwet was. His essentially OMGUS vote on LMP makes me feel good about this vote.

I have explained the reason why I HoS'd instead of voting, so why is your vote still on me? Please feel free to elaborate.

And as far as my OMGUS vote on LMP - I would not call that an OMGUS vote. OMGUS votes are a vote where the primary reason for placing the vote is because they placed a vote on you. I gave three reasons for placing my vote on LMP. Which is 1 to 2 more reasons than any of the people on my BW gave when voting me.

So again, I have shot your theory down in flames, you going to get off your ass anytime soon and do some scumhunting? I assume not unless your scum-buddies latch onto someone else

[tanstalas]

Do you really believe there are 3 (or even 4) scum on your wagon?

I refuse to answer this because I have already answered it in a previous post. If you refuse to read my posts I am not going to repeat myself for your benefit.

You've been nothing but accusing every single person on your wagon and that is flailing. Sure, the Newbie we played together, Beanman was throwing suspicion towards people who were questioning him all the time and he was town, so yeah, you could be bad town. But you're acting like the people are solely on your wagon because you HOS'd Zwet instead of voting him.

I find it funny you call it flailing, yet the game we played together when you were on the bubble I could say you were flailing as well, and you were town. So when you do it it is towny, when I do it it is scummy eh?

Here is one of your posts where you are "flailing" - I prefer to call it scum hunting, but hey you are the one that wants to rename the term:
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2422826

That is simply not true. Your wagon is still intact because of how you handled the pressure. And you did a lot of suspicious things:

If I get to L-2 or L-1 I will nameclaim which should clear me, however I am hesitant to do that because if you know who I am you will probably be able to figure out my ability which will make me less useful to the town.

Scummy, scummy, scummy. If it will be so obvious what your role is, why not just claim at L-1? Because you haven't made up a good fake role claim yet, am I right?
And you say you will claim at L-2/L-1, yet you nameclaim at L-3 when no one else threatened to vote you. Why so overeager with your claim? This may very well be the first mod-provided fakeclaim I see.

If I have to ability claim - I have no problem with it, if my BW gets bigger I will, in fact I still have an ace up my sleeve that should pretty much guarantee me being obv-town, however there are some "issues" with it - however I am very valuable to the town, and I will not myself be lynched. Trust me, I will not by lynched today.

Then you go on and try to clear you name by saying it's a main character. Like UK said, there are many Castlevania (well over 20 with almost as many main characters). I'm betting everyone has gotten a main character.

Again, I said PROTAGONIST - I really wish you would pay more attention - I really hate having to repeat myself. Do you have a main protagonist as your character?

Scummy, scummy, scummy. You don't want us to speculate about your role, yet you give away it's an important role practically making you the NK choice number one. Why not just fullclaim at all? (inb4 omg, Dekes is rolefishing) I bet, it's because - like I said - you don't have a proper fake role claim yet. You want us to say "Mh, Rinoa is known for X, maybe tanstalas is a [insert PR here]!" so you can say "Yeah, you got me. See, that's why I didn't want scum to know my role!". Pure speculation on my part but it doesn't seem so far off.

I wish I was NK choice #1 And if I have to reveal my ability you will see why

About your so-called solid cases. Here's what you did to accuse the people on your wagon:
- You make up scumtells that are none (being lazy, skimming and tunneling are done by both town and scum) and pass it off as a solid case

I agree - maybe not any of these things individually would me scumtells - however they are tells, and when I get a few on one person it starts to get hard to ignore.

- You falsely use terms (parroting in the context of mafia is used for people who make statements that have been brought up by others and trying to pass it off as their own. If I say "Like player X said..." and then go on to state it this is not parroting. This is simply acknowledging a point someone else brought up) and pass it off as a solid case

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2419606

And I quote from you -

And dammit, tanstalas, for your #356. There are several things I was going to add into my post as well. Now it will be me parroting and buddying and whatnot all over again.

So in that last game we played together - you referred to it as parroting, now it's not? Hello? Contradictory train pulling into the station!

- You attack people for non-game related things like sleeping habits and writing style and pass it off as a solid case

I admit that was a weak case, however his whole 18 hour trip, first thing I did was log onto pc and read the thread, etc etc thing sounded funny, after an 18 hour trip first thing I would do is go to bed. I admit is a weak tell, but the fact is he did lie about his timeline - ok he said he was just "mistaken" whatever - I'll accept that. Him saying he thought he posted on Friday and then said that he was essentially v/la on Friday kinda struck me as contradictory.

- You even try to get the mod involved because katsuki told the mod shotty announced V/LA in another thread. So what? Stay to game related things.

I was mearly questioning if that was an allowed post, as I would say that goes against rule 4A - I admit, it is NOT related to the game, so why did you bring it up in your argument against me? Are you afraid the mod will agree with me and modkill your scum-buddy?

@Everyone on my BW

-

When

I get lynched and

if

I flip town who is going to be your next suspect and why?

Fix'd. Sorry, couldn't resist.

Well, I see you saw the question, and I am kind of shocked that you didn't even answer it. In the other game we played you had a lot of "If this person flips X then I will assume that Y is scum" You were town that game, and you were not even asked to speculate on what you would think if someone flipped whatever you decided to start doing it because Beanman did. This game I asked you POINT BLANK when I flip town who would be your next suspect and you did not even answer the question. You cannot say you did not see the question, as you quoted me, and then also changed the contents of the quote.. how scummy looking is that?

Here are the posts where you hypothesis on people "flipping" and what that could tell you:
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p2403470
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p2405821
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p2406810
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2419606 (This would also be considered a "flailing" post by your new definition as well)
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p2419921 (as well you admit that you were "flailing" in this post)
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2422826

No, because nobody's believing you on either your claim or your cases.

I know I am

and my vote stays.

You know you are? So you know I am telling the truth? Now I admit this is most likely not a slip, more so the fact that you forgot to put the word "not" after "I know I am" but still, I thought it was interesting that you agree'd with me and I didn't even have to manipulate your quote box like you did mine

@UK
Don't just sit back and defend/coach tanstalas. The game is ten pages old and a lot happened, there must be people you are suspicious of.

UK is the most active person in this game...

@MPR, McGriddle
Please get involved. Who are you most of suspicious of at the moment and what do you think of the wagon on tanstalas.

This I do agree on, however you only mentioned my wagon, why not ask their opinion on Zwet's as well?

Another thing I find interesting. So far this entire game you have had 6 posts. Which at this point in the game consists of 2.7% of total posts. Going back to our first game at the time you got lynched you were at 9.7% of total posts. Again you were town that game, I find you doing a lot of stuff differently this game than in the game where you were town.

To recap, you calling stuff I am doing scummy is ironic because last game when you were town you were doing the same thing.

[tanstalas]

there's a big difference between flailing and defending. town are more likely to do the latter because they have nothing to hide, whereas flailing implies lack of reasoned argument.

I disagree, but to each his own. I think scum are more likely to defend whereas town are more likely to look for other suspects.

Case in point last game I played with Dekes, he said Beanman was doing it - and he was town, as well as you can see from my last post Dekes was doing it and he was town as well.

[tanstalas]

And this time - Dekes - I do want an answer of who you will be going after tomorrow if I get lynched and when I flip town. Want to know this before you get to have your quickchat with your scum buddies and decide who to go after tomorrow. Would also like to hear this from everyone else on my wagon. If you are town, I see no reason why you cannot speculate on who your 2nd most scummy person if. Unless you do not want to offend another townie, and have them look into your posts more carefully?

[tanstalas]

@mod

- Am I allowed to post the question I asked you about my ability and your response? (paraphrased of course)

[tanstalas]

And this time - Dekes - I do want an answer of who you will be going after tomorrow if I get lynched and when I flip town. Want to know this before you get to have your quickchat with your scum buddies and decide who to go after tomorrow.

So, now I'm definite scum, although last time I checked I was #4 on your scum list? Because I made a case against you? Great stuff.

I will answer to your last post tomorrow and to your question here, too. But it's 2 A.M. over here and I had to made another post first.
Just wanted to get another question out quickly:

@everyone
What do you think of tanstalas rushed L-3 not-in-danger-of-about-to-being-lynched nameclaim plus PR-softclaim?

Actually "Last time you checked" - which was also your last post - you were #3 on my list

My top 3 picks (in order)
1)LMP
2)Katsuki
3)Dekes

Short memory? You should eat more fish, I hear it is brain food, might help you

[tanstalas]

And after that you voted Zwet so he surely must've climbed up your list to the top. Correct me if I'm wrong but that would make me #4.

No, that would make Zwet #4. I truly do think you three are the most scummy. However I also think Zwet is as well. I placed my vote on Zwet because he already had votes on him, so there would be more pressure, rather than me try to start a BW on one of my top 3 suspects who currently have no votes on them. As well, a few people seem to think you, kat and LMP are town. So maybe they see something that I do not see. I never said I was an expert at playing mafia. I think you 4 are scum. Other people in this game disagree with me but we all agree on Zwet, hence that is why my vote is on him.

[tanstalas]

anyway, to tans,

usually when someone screams out their scumminess to you, you make your case as to why that person is so much scummier than the others on your list

,

and if noone buys it

,

THEN consider joining the bandwagons

. well, at least that's the protown thing to do. from another player I would find your post VERY scummy.

I'm not following?

I had attempted to make cases on people I have suspected, and voted

Case in point: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p2474762 and I also made cases on Katsuki and Dekes

Noone bought it

- and in fact, other people said they had pro-town vibes on my top 3 suspects

I then joined your bandwagon (with reasoning as well)

So I fail to see how from another player you find my post very scummy? Maybe I am missing something, feel free to explain

[tanstalas]

@Dekes

- While I would love to answer your latest post I am going to refuse until you answer the questions I posed at you. I do not know why you will not do this, as I mentioned in the previous game we played you had tons of hypothesis about if X flips then I'm going to suspect Y, and you did these of your own free will, noone even asked you to. I do not think this is an unreasonable request.

@MPR

- WHAT. THE. FUCK.

You come into this game, look at just my posts and vote me? As well, you read them in ISO which means you read them out of context.

This is very suspicious to me. You look like someone who has replaced into a game as scum, skipped to the end, saw who the bandwagons were on and picked one and attempted to make a case. Seriously, this far into the game I don't think you should be placing a serious vote on someone based on reading them just in ISO and out of context. This at the best looks like lazy town and at the worst opportunistic scum. Also when you came in Zwet was at L-1 (I think) and you did not feel the need to ISO him? How curious

I also noticed your posting (a lot) in other games - however I did not think we could comment on them. Can someone clarify that for rule for me? Does it just mean we can't comment on the actual posts in the game?

There have also been a ton of questions asked (not just by me) that you chose not to answer.

I would be tempted to switch to you just to get pressure on you so you would actually read the thread and make an informed decision - but..

@Zwet

- a self-vote? Really? I always thought this was bad to do as town. In fact just by coincidence I happened to be reading some threads last night and one of them talked about self-hammering. Now - I am nowhere as experienced as you are by any means - however a lot of the people in that thread who commented on were, and the main vibe I got from them were that for the most part they were against it, some said that they would self-hammer in some cases as scum, however I don't think any (maybe one or two people) said they would do it as town. I have never played with you, I skimmed your 57 pages of posts last night and I see that you are mostly a 1 sentence posting kind of guy. Can you please advise why though, as a town member you would self-vote? Maybe the above thread doesn't really apply to you as you didn't "self-hammer" you just put yourself on the bubble, but still curious as to why you would do that?

[tanstalas]

I actually just play that way normally. My meta is one-liners in general, if you want to take the time to look over some of my completed games.

I can vouch for that, after his "PUSH PUSH PUSH" post last night I skimmed though all his 57 pages of posts on this site looking for the word "flailing" or "defense" to try and poke holes in his statement that defense is more pro-town than "flailing" (I still prefer the term scum hunting).

Though, you are being asked to answer questions, and in other games you did answer questions, this game you just seem to like to frustrate the entire playerbase of this game by not answering anything.

[tanstalas]

I'm very curious how self voting benefits scum ^-^.

It's a null tell. If anything it's a stupid tell. Call it eccentric, but that doesn't mean it's not stupid.

Assuming that was directed at me?

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14465

That was the post I was reading, people make some valid points on self-hammering yourself as scum.

[tanstalas]

EBWOP - My bad that was probably directed at Zwet. Is there anyway to jump to the last unread post? I see the little icon when there are new posts, so I click on the last page of the thread but sometimes I need to backtrack to see where I left off. I currently have everything under "subscribe" do I have to bookmark them instead? does it matter?

[tanstalas]

You come into this game, look at just my posts and vote me? As well, you read them in ISO which means you read them out of context.

This is very suspicious to me.

Hey look, someone voting tans is very suspicious to him. What a shock, we haven't seen that before...

And also like how you leave out my reasoning.

Do you disagree with my reasoning on that looking suspicious LMP?

[tanstalas]

Haven't I been saying that this whole time? Tans has been a little eager in attacking his attackers. In the interest of helping him help us, I'd like to ask you...

Tans, who are the scum that are NOT voting you or suspicious of you at this time?

drmyshottyizsik - I have a "neutral" read on him

jenniwren - Really hasn't posted enough for me to get any sort of read

CT - Seems to be the only person in the game who can actually see through my POV. However maybe he is buddying with me so if I get lynched he can say I knew he was town - see in this post, etc

VasudeVa - seems townish - he is actually looking at other people and asking questions

UK - You have been the most active, however like you said you haven't posted much "content". You have not jumped on my BW - however maybe this does make you scum because you think that given enough rope I will end up hanging myself and you will be fairly safe because you did not hop on my BW

McG - Probably the scummiest of the people who hasn't voted me - says that he is not lurking but is "busy" and that the cases that have been made do not intrigue him enough to warrant a post. If he was town and everyone else hasn't made a case on anyone why doesn't he start? (however this is kind of a moot point since the people on my BW do not seem to want to try to make a case on anyone else either)

After doing my re-read I am not so sure about Zwet and Katsuki anymore. Dekes I am sitting on the fence about.

I am still fairly sure about LMP and now MPR.

MPR for reasons I made in my last post and LMP for reasons made and also because of this post:

Do you disagree with my reasoning on that looking suspicious LMP?

Yup. Because basically, when you boil it all the way down it reads "you voted me".

Unvote:
Vote: MPR

Seriously - I make a case on anyone and you just dismiss it?

And just to throw a monkey wrench into the plans of the scum:

Roleclaim: Role Absorber

During night if

ANY

actions are targeted at me I will inherit those abilities.

I asked the mod via PM (even before this game started) if that applied to a NK directed at me as well.

I will not tell you the answer, but this is why you all should get off my BW now if you are town because this should hopefully make me obv-town in your eyes as if I was lying about this it would be in violation of A6 - "You may

not

quote or

pretend to quote private communications with the mod

or other players."

Now you will all be like why did you roleclaim, etc..

Well at this point this should get you all off me and actually attempt to scumhunt. Me being alive for the nigh is a huge benefit to the town.

I was thinking everyone target me if you have an ability so that I will be able to see what we have on our side. From there I was thinking if we have a cop and a doc I can advise the town tomorrow that we do have both a cop and a doc. As one detriment to being a cop is never knowing if we have a doc and the cop not wanting to come out because if he does than he will be targeted. If he knows there is a doc then after N2 he can start revealing his investigations - if they are innocent or guilty results, without having to worry that he will be NK'd because he knows we have a doc.

However, I do not know if the above is a good plan or not, never had this type of role before. If anyone has any ideas for it, please feel free to share

[tanstalas]

holy shit. does that mean you're NK immune?

As I said, I am not answering what the mod told me. I want to keep the scum guessing.

There are a couple possible outcomes

1)I get targeted and die
2)I get targeted and inherit the NK ability and then I become like a town vig as well
3)I never get targeted - I stay alive until endgame

As well, after N2 (or even after N1) if we have a doc and I announce we do - cop can come out and confirm I am indeed town.

[tanstalas]

Proven role isn't proven alignment. Also, you can paraphrase. You can say "the mod said yes" or "the mod said no" but you can't copy/paste the pm.

Stop fishing MPR - I already said I wasn't going to reveal what the mod said

[tanstalas]

Welcome SpyreX - looking forward to your posts

[tanstalas]

Proven role isn't proven alignment. Also, you can paraphrase. You can say "the mod said yes" or "the mod said no" but you can't copy/paste the pm.

Stop fishing MPR - I already said I wasn't going to reveal what the mod said

Right, and if I was scum I would be so terrified of my own scum-buddies targeting me at night that I would ask the mod if I would absorb a NK

[tanstalas]

Unvote, Vote: Coach Travis

Talk about not wanting to step on any toes. Or say anything unique. This is that guy that sticks in the mob and when things go wrong points at the pitchforkers going "not me".

There's another in the morass of lurkers as well. They will be found and dealt with accordingly.

I see your point here SpyreX, wondering what your opinion is on McG however? Based on my small analysis a little bit ago he seems moreso like the person who doesn't want to step on any toes. His only vote was an RVS vote.

I also find this quote interesting:

[/Facepalm] this game is so not serious. But! I think Zwet is worth looking into. Your lulzy evil doing is very suspicious.

He says Zwet is worth looking into and then ... nothing else? He doesn't make any case against him aside from "lulzy evil"?

@all - anyone have any comments on my "plan" to have everyone target me tonight so I can see what PR's we have on our side (and the bonus fact that I will inherit those abilities) Like I said before with cop and doc thing. Plus if we have both of those and cop outs himself if we have a doc the doc can protect cop and then N2 we will have 2 investigations (myself and the cop). I'm not sure if I can use more than one ability per night that I inherit, will have to ask the mod about that.

[tanstalas]

self-edit: @Tans: Wait, you inherit

ALL

abilities you get targetted with? That seems hell powerful to me.

Just re-read my PM to check, and yes it does sound like I will inherit all the abilities. The exact wording used was "any". There is a mechanism in place though that will not make it OP that I do not care to share.

And based on the wording of the PM I do not think that the person would lose their abilities.

[tanstalas]

ERK, I did not make my question entirely clear.

By all, I meant, say, if 3 PRs target you with abilities, you get all 3?

Yes

[tanstalas]

You're plan sounds SKish Tans. Are you an SK?

Also hai Katsuki, already covered the Tans claim being SKeriffic.

No - I have already told you what I am. As of now I am basically a VT - I only get powers when someone targets me

[tanstalas]

@Dekes: I see no need to lynch SK D1. Let me put it this way. If he kills, we'll know he's the SK and lynch him. If he doesn't kill, the main problem with having an SK around suddenly doesn't matter as much. I'd rather lynch mafia, to be honest.

If that's the case than I would ask that a cop investigate me at least tonight - I'm just covering my bases here - I have what could possibly be an OP role, but only if I'm not lynched. If there is an SK in the game and he does kill I do not want to take the fall for him.

I am assuming that an SK would show up with a guiilty verdict yes?

After I am confirmed tomorrow then we can look into how we want to use my powers? Sound good?

All this is dependant on us even having a cop I realize (and a sane one at that)

[tanstalas]

@Dekes: I see no need to lynch SK D1. Let me put it this way. If he kills, we'll know he's the SK and lynch him. If he doesn't kill, the main problem with having an SK around suddenly doesn't matter as much. I'd rather lynch mafia, to be honest.

Actually, just thought about this. Even if there is a SK NK tonight and you lynch me tomorrow you will see I wasn't the SK, so at least you will then know that you have an SK to be wary of as well as the mafia.

Just frustrating that there is no way I can confirm my role/alignment when I have what could possibly be the best role in the game.

[tanstalas]

And you've practically given out your full role claim so why stay vague on things like this:

There is a mechanism in place though that will not make it OP that I do not care to share.

?
Uh-uh. Not buying it.

If a majority of people want I will reveal this mechanic. It will tell you why it is not an OP role and why I do not believe that I take the powers for good.

[tanstalas]

it doesn't matter how long you take the powers. if you have the potential to harness every power in the game it makes you very suspicious and an instant NK target at best.

If the scum want to try and target me

[tanstalas]

Are you duplicating or stealing?

Regardless, use some common sense ye old power roles tonight.

Additionally, STILL, he's not getting lynched today.

Based on my PM is sounds like I am duplicating, PM doesn't make reference to duplicating/stealing. I'll ask mod if the people who target me still retains their powers. Regardless even if he says they do and I tell you that I don't think anyone would believe me anyhow.

[tanstalas]

Are you duplicating or stealing?

Regardless, use some common sense ye old power roles tonight.

Additionally, STILL, he's not getting lynched today.

Based on my PM is sounds like I am duplicating, PM doesn't make reference to duplicating/stealing. I'll ask mod if the people who target me still retains their powers. Regardless even if he says they do and I tell you that I don't think anyone would believe me anyhow.

If anyone cares/believes - you do not lose your ability

[tanstalas]

I am just going by what the wiki said, as I have not played the game, but it said basically she could absorb runes powers.

[tanstalas]

MPR and McGriddle are both bad. I get a more careless lazy feel from McGriddle though.

This is why I am not sure of the CT BW - SpyreX brought up some awesome points for voting for CT, however I feel that McG is doing the same thing, except McG also seems like you put it "lazy"

I like my vote where it is. I would also go for a McG lynch though. I really do not like the fact that he blames his inactivity in this thread on "Not much going on" and "nothing intrigues me" however he doesn't try to get some conversation going/make cases on people

[tanstalas]

And if, in fact, he'd been on today and opted not to post anything in response?

Good point, and he has had almost 4 hours to reply to Jenni's case.

Unvote
Vote: CT

[tanstalas]

I love holmes as well.

Katie...?

Is so I agree

[tanstalas]

...no, Sherlock. You FAIL, tans. FOREVER.

Is much more appealing to me than



But hey, to each his own

[tanstalas]

Oh, I do both. I'm just not a huge fan of Doyle.

I'm more into Sci-Fi/Fantasy

[tanstalas]

Asian women are hot, asian men, not so much

[tanstalas]

I believe we're not going to reconcile this argument easily on the basis that I assume you are a straight male, whereas I'm a

pansexual

female.

I had to look up what that was, I thought it meant you were sexually attracted to Panda's

[tanstalas]

UK killed the conversation talking about bestiality.

Though if UK is hot, that might be a turn-on

[tanstalas]

This is ridiculous. 4 hours... There are times when someone is able to get on and read, but not be able to either read in-depth or be able to construct a proper post (eg. checking during class).

Same to spyrex. Tans is parroting spy's over-eagerness. TBH, spy seems to be doing the same thing that tans did to me during my road-trip. Not liking that at all.

And the two scenarios aren't alike at all, like you said yourself you were V/LA - no access to a PC, he is not, though I do agree with you to an extent. Sometimes I log on from my phone and do not post as it is a pain to post from the phone. My vote on him is mostly for Spy's first points on him (though I think McG is more guilty of it)

[tanstalas]

Meh, I probably have pictures hidden somewhere on this site. You could go on a scavenger hunt in the picture thread :O.

And yeah, this is the most important conversation of the game. From it I will deduce the scum in lylo.

Oh yeah?

I'm not going to go through that thread though If I really wanted I could just google UncertainKitten (insert name of thread here) inurl:mafiascum.net

[tanstalas]

OK - curiosity got the better of me and... found it

[tanstalas]

You ignored my question about the pic tans. You must be scum.

Unvote, Vote Tans

I answered the question before you asked it.

[tanstalas]

This is ridiculous. 4 hours... There are times when someone is able to get on and read, but not be able to either read in-depth or be able to construct a proper post (eg. checking during class).

Same to spyrex. Tans is parroting spy's over-eagerness. TBH, spy seems to be doing the same thing that tans did to me during my road-trip. Not liking that at all.

And the two scenarios aren't alike at all, like you said yourself you were V/LA - no access to a PC, he is not, though I do agree with you to an extent. Sometimes I log on from my phone and do not post as it is a pain to post from the phone. My vote on him is mostly for Spy's first points on him (though I think McG is more guilty of it)

Ok, at least that explanation is a bit better. Not posting immediately is really a nulltell.

And I was gonna mention McG too. I think spy explained why CT over McG. Can I say the same about you?

p-edit: Huh? Where? I must've missed your answer.

Though if UK is hot, that might be a turn-on

How would I know if that was a picture of UK since I did not know if she was hot or not?

[tanstalas]

L-2 I believe

[tanstalas]

Oh, you went looking? And what, pray tell, was the verdict? For my own curiosity has been piqued.

You look young

[tanstalas]

I seem to get that a lot ^-^;

Like 12 years old, old

Though the pic is kinda blurry - so hard to tell

[tanstalas]

Like I said, it's blurry (and dark) so.. hard to tell

I just put my pic up, because I'm a sexy beast

[tanstalas]

Is he really? Maybe he feels safe since the CT train is gaining traction

[tanstalas]

I prefer a MPR lynch over a CT lynch and CT's last post confirmed it

Unfortunatly I do not know how to bold ny vote on my BB - but when at a pc I'm putting my vote back to him

[tanstalas]

Unvote
Vote: MPR

Yes, you are now at L-1

[tanstalas]

Interesting.

two people are at L-1 now. Be interesting to see if McG comes in and hammers one

[tanstalas]

Hey - sorry to derail the thread again. What are rules for speaking to other members on the site that you are engaged in, is it allowed as long as it doesn't talk about the game?

[tanstalas]

yeah just counted, both at L-2. I fail at math apparently, which isn't good considering my profession.. >.>

I blame the beer(s)

[tanstalas]

Ah, fuck, I missed that.

Ok. So both SHOULD be at L-2. Katsuki, I hope you realize you're the swing vote. That can be both a point for you or a point against you, depending purely on the flips of either CT or MPR (possibly both depending on how things go)

I find this statement funny.

So depending on the flips, I'm your scapegoat for tomorrow. Got it.

I'd bet me dying tomorrow has a greater chance

Especially if there is an SK, hell if an SK makes a kill tonight I may as well vote for myself tomorrow

[tanstalas]

It's rather WIFOMtastic at this point. I'm going to have to reassess your case after a night has passed.

Well, I'm just a VT until N2 at least. And if noone targets me I'll be a VT till N3, etc

Noone answered my ? about communications outside of thread as long as it isn't thread related

[tanstalas]

Hammer votes aren't swing votes.

MPR is still scum, no read on CT except gut town.

Also, ~*~experience~*~ on my part implies ur wrong. So there.

Wait, wait... what?!?!?!

@ Bolded - but... you are voting for CT...

hmmm...

[tanstalas]

*gets popcorn as he waits for UK's answer*

[tanstalas]

No I'm not, tans. Read the votecounts again, please? I've never voted CT, as far as I know. I'll check my ISO to be sure.

Vote: CT

CT is at L2. Tans unvoted and switched to MPR.

Don't give me heart attacks UK, its not nice.

Hello

[tanstalas]

Yep, haven't changed my vote since here

FAKE EDIT: ...you quoted Katsuki?

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

I blame it on the beer 0.o

[tanstalas]

I prefer a MPR lynch over a CT lynch and CT's last post confirmed it

Unfortunatly I do not know how to bold ny vote on my BB - but when at a pc I'm putting my vote back to him

Wait, the post confirmed it, but you prefered MPR lynch over CT before that? Cause you were voting CT.

Yes, I voted MPR first and went with the CT vote only because I wanted to put pressure on him as he came on and didn't post, he confirmed why he didn't post.

Also the reasons for voting CT are silly, if we are voting CT for those reasons McG would make a much better lynch

[tanstalas]

I see UK and Kat's avy's and for some reason I think "anime" for both of them and got confused... I mostly blame it on the beer though

And noone still hasn't answered my question about communication with others outside thread damnit!

[tanstalas]

Tans is votehopping. Went MPR as soon as CT voted MPR too. Noted.

Right. Pretty much this whole game I have been beating the LMP and MPR are scum drum. So question for you Kat. If MPR gets lynched and flips scum what will you think then?

[tanstalas]

Zwet already had his vote on MPR... he voted again for MPR...

[tanstalas]

Did Date take over your body? Seriously what is with all the caps?

[tanstalas]

EBWOP err I meant Fate, not Date

[tanstalas]

MPR lynch > CT lynch.

We finally agree on something

[tanstalas]

...I'm waiting for my wagon to disperse. Hurry up.

I'm not even defending myself as nobody has a decent reason to vote me.

Then make a better case on someone else. As you have a lot of people on your wagon and in their eyes they have enough reason.

[tanstalas]

@tans: Why?

I've answered the "Why?" already, my question to you is why are you so lazy to not look at my reasons why?

[tanstalas]

Interesting that the lurkers team up (McG and MPR)

[tanstalas]

@tans: Why?

I've answered the "Why?" already, my question to you is why are you so lazy to not look at my reasons why?

I

did

read your reason and I flat out don't like it. You do not explain anything, you just told us that CT's defense is satisfactory which I don't buy.

I am telling you to explain WHY you prefer MPR over CT? Why is CT's post satisfactory?

Look closer and stop being lazy - I gave reasons for MPR - that post you linked to is not it

[tanstalas]

Well that sucked - noone targeted me at all

[tanstalas]

After some re-reading, my biggest suspect is McG. Go back and look, he was 6th on the CT wagon, and then immediately jumped to the MPR wagon, and was also the 6th vote (if you ignore zwet's revote on MPR wagon). Both instances McG put people at L1. McG gave the impression that he didn't care who he was voting for (since UK wasn't getting lynched) nor about putting them at L1.

Lurker making noise against UK then conveniently putting 2 people at L1. Yeah.

Vote: McG

For the above reasons, and also the fact that UK tore a strip or two off McG (Maybe not a scumtell - but maybe he was feeling butthurt after UK tore said strips off)

Like I also said in a previous post, found it odd that he said he wasn't posting because nothing interested him and yet he made no effort to start any kind of scumhunting on his own.

Vote: McG

[tanstalas]

CT is simple. I have an ACTION and he gets to target me tonight. And say who I targeted first thing tomorrow.

Thus that'll shake out or draw

either a kill on me which is fine or an RB on him

which opens up a new bag of worms for scum now doesn't it.

Unvote, Vote: McG

Why do you think either or? Why can't they RB him (assuming they do have a RB) and kill you?

[tanstalas]

Unvote; Vote: Coach Travis

Wheee time to play follow the cop

Unvote:
Vote: Coach Travis

[tanstalas]

Considering you are both unverified I prefer to kill the supposed tracker over the supposed cop.

Either way, a scum dies today or tomorrow.

[tanstalas]

I think you're wrong about that. A cop with a guilty verdict is

better off trying to get that person lynched

without claiming right away so that he can live through another night. When it looked like people were not going to pay attention to you, that's when he did claim...because he

did

have a guilty verdict.

I agree with the above, @the bolded part though, Zwet made no case on CT at all during this day, the only thing is we were piling on McG fairly hard. If CT does flip town I'm going to be wondering if zwet or McG should be the first person to go tomorrow (ie: maybe zwet is just a goon and McG has a scum PR)

[tanstalas]

@Zwet - Since you outed yourself as the cop, mind if I ask what your name is?

[tanstalas]

Vote: Unvote

Just until everyone has a chance to weigh in. a cop CC would really throw a wrench into this

[tanstalas]

What could the mafia possibly do to you that would skew a cop read? They roleblocked you AND they made you appear to be mafia on the same night? Riiiight.

And your proposal has one huge flaw...it would STILL be your word against his. He could list any name and you could say you got a different one.

I don't think Zwet is scum framing you. I don't think he's an insane cop. I think he's EXACTLY who he says he is, and I think you're desperate to stay alive.

So if CT gets lynched and flips town I assume you will be voting for zwet tomorrow? What if he says tomorrow "Oh - I must be an insane cop"

[tanstalas]

What about you, Tans? Why does who I vote for tomorrow have anything to do with this? I'll cross that bridge if I come to it, but right now, I think it's apparent CT is just fighting to stay alive. He sure is a popular guy at night, though, isn't he? I mean, he was RB'd, mysteriously given a false alignment by the mafia, and targeted by Zwet all in one night (Ask me which one of those three things I actually believe happened.).

Interesting, though, that you hop on his wagon to follow the cop then hop off when he hits L-1. I think caution is a good thing normally, but it only occurs to you NOW to bring up the idea of a CC?

No - I thought that a CC would have happened by now, however the BW onto CT happened so fast he was already at hammer point without not everyone getting a chance to post. If he was to be hammered and someone came in during twilight and said "CC - I'm the cop" I'd feel pretty shitty. I think it is almost guaranteed that we have a cop-type role in this game.

And what do you mean about given a false alignment by the mafia? Do you mean that the mafia may have switched him as well thinking that a cop would investigate the "outed power role"?

I can see him actually being kept alive and RB'd instead of killing him. If you know what his ability is just RB him and kill someone else hoping that you get the cop or the doctor.

This is all a big theory, however if I was mafia and we had a bus driver AND a RB I think I would have done the exact same thing. RB the tracker and swap him with a scum buddy while killing another person hoping to get a doc or cop.

And I will kick myself in the ass if we lynch CT and he is town and then lynch zwet and he is town as well. Without knowing how many scum there are in the game 2 more mislynches could possibly be game over for us - so yes, I am being a little cautious now. As you can see from my above example (and I am sure there are other scenerios that I haven't even thought about) I do not think we should be too hasty to lynch someone. Would you disagree?

There is also the off-chance that someone had an ability that would clear CT or give us another suspect but

have not yet posted

. While I agree that CT should be the lynch for today - I want to hear from everyone before we lynch someone.

[tanstalas]

Uh-huh. This is a pretty brazen comment to make since you think CT is still the best choice of the day.

So just for clarification, now...the list of things that could have happened to CT last night was that he was RB'd, swapped, protected by UK, and investigated by Zwet? (Oh yes, and he also targeted Zwet himself, however unsuccessful.) (Oh yes, and the one other thing is that CT is lying through his teeth?)

To quote Alice...things are getting "curiouser and curiouser." I'd love to hear from more people now.

He is still the best choice for the day. Like I said in my previous post I would like to give everyone the chance to weigh in on what has happened so far and also if they have any CC or reveals from a N1 ability that they could (or want to) share.

The tone I am getting from you indicates you would rather lynch him without letting everyone weigh in on what has happened.

[tanstalas]

McG hasn't spoken up yet, soo we'll wait for him. I'm willing to hammer if McG is unwilling to bus.

Also, what is/was CT's plan in #626?

We also have not heard from Dekes since the cop claim

[tanstalas]

Well, look at it this way. If CT is lynched and flips town, don't you think someone will do something about zwet?

Also, I can think of too many scenarios where zwet and CT will both make it to tomorrow. Yeah, no, not a good idea.

I'd like to hear one of these many scenerios.

Chances are they only have 1 RBer - if they both make it tomorrow than one of them would get a result on someone. If one of them dies tonight and flip town we lynch the other tomorrow

[tanstalas]

Reaction fishing is not a bad thing.

I'm just waiting to see if Zwet comes in and says "oh hai guys - I was just kidding, I'm not the cop, I just wanted to see what would happen with a pressure bandwagon"

[tanstalas]

Ugh, I don't like how Dekes is misrepping Zwet in his posts

I still can't wrap around my head on why zwet would have any reason to investigate CT last night.

CT claimed a perfect HP mafia style fakeclaim.

I think that gives reason why he would investigate CT last night, no?

But he had other suspects all throughtout D1. Why wouldn't he investigate UK, a person he called scum over and over again?

UK is scum

This was the only time I saw Zwet call out UK as scum. Did I miss another time? I didn't see any "Over and over"

[tanstalas]

Tans trying to gain townie points.

This argument is stupid.

One can have more than one scum suspects. I mean, we have more than just 1 scum player...

Thanks Sherlock.

My point was I don't think that Dekes is paying that close of attention to the game and perhaps he is scum with CT by trying to throw suspicion off CT and onto someone else. I see I will have to be very transparent in my wording with you in the future.

[tanstalas]

*anxiously awaits mod post*

And Zwet, if you could target me tonight - would be appreciated.

Even IF you die by mafia tonight I will be able to investigate N3 (if you really are the cop)

[tanstalas]

I hope Zwet is just messing around like he has most of this game...

If not, and you are town, for gods sake please target me

[tanstalas]

^

/makes some popcorn

[tanstalas]

I'm not avoiding the thread. I am trying to understand why Zwet isn't hanging from a rope yet

[tanstalas]

Vote: Zwet

[tanstalas]

1. Read what I said at the end of the last day as to why I think you are buddy. If zwet is scum, then why would he redirect McG wagon into a CT wagon?
2. Erm, he claimed his name D1. Also, what spy said.

We have 3 scum.

You are probably 1 of them. Unless you can somehow explain D2 to me.

Sound pretty sure of yourself there..

[tanstalas]

Yeah, Katsuki is definitely getting my vote tomorrow after Zwet gets the noose today

[tanstalas]

If you were town why would you claim a fake cop investigation?

[tanstalas]

I know what a gambit is - however to see it all the way through to getting a townie lynched... especially when that could have put us into lylo..

And if we are in LyLo now and Zwet is town I'm going to be upset - had what could have been the best role and noone targeted me either night (Plus that would give me my first real loss here)

[tanstalas]

Well, maybe if you didn't act like a SK D1...

Also, this is the

2nd

game zwet's screwed me over with a gambit...

You know what they say

Fool me once, shame on you
Fool me twice, shame on me

[tanstalas]

Just wondering what would have happened to me if a scum did target me for a NK?

I was told by the mod that he couldn't answer my question

And I'd like to point out this post:

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 3#p2477983

[tanstalas]

I just read the dead topic - man, Dekes was still tunneling on me even after death

[tanstalas]

Wanted to take a bite out of your muffin

[tanstalas]

EBWOP: Just realized that sounded incredibly dirty

[tanstalas]

Wanted to take a bite out of your muffin

Dracula loves his muffins <3

and I have no idea what you were thinking there...


@Spy: What if you added in scum daychat?

I was honestly just going by your Avy - then I realized after I hit submit that I found out you were female in another game.. and was like whoa.. that could be misunderstood

[tanstalas]

@VV: If the hider claims targets, wouldn't the scum kill them both?

@Kats: Vren

The only way I can see it working is if you claim who you hide behind and you die but the person you hid behind doesn't die we know they are scum, but yeah if you announce who you hide behind and scum target the person you would die as well. Though I wonder if say you hid behind me, and scum targeted me and a doc protected me, would you still die?

Guess that would be a question for kdub

I'm just sad that the vig didn't try to kill me - coulda got a NK and protection in one

[tanstalas]

I think next game I am in that I am scum I am claiming this role again, just because it seems noone wants to take the chance targeting me lol

P-edit: Really? You just realized that about Alucard now? lol

[tanstalas]

Ugh - my play was like that because I had such an awesome role - I think I was in shock, then I got Zwet (who I think was an honorary scum this game) who put me against the wall early and then the scum train started on me as well and it was all I could do to answer questions. Then I make cases on other people and that is scummy as well. I had no chance.

I should have gone with my initial read on you and LMP and just stuck with that

[tanstalas]

Sad thing is I also just won a game as scum where a townie claimed he was a cop and got a guilty read on a townie.. I was like "holy shit - this can't be happening"