Mini 1105: A Mafia Invasion! (Game Over)

[pappums rat]

vote tasky

[pappums rat]

lol, of course, what was i thinking?

unvote vote mute

[pappums rat]

mute wrote:

Right now I'd like to know why pappums rat was so easily swayed by Tasky to change their vote, that strikes me as odd.

well, i think that should be rather obvious, the case on you is overwhelming.

and because its rvs i suppose.

[pappums rat]

rob- all that activity in other games and yet not a single post in this one? your answer does not sit well with me im afraid. for now i have an fos on you, i dont like lurkers.

i agree that all the discussion from vv, ross and mute probably is not going to tell us anything, though ross' posts seem slightly fishy to me. its probably nothing, but i will keep my eye on him.

[pappums rat]

it's mainly just gut, though i thought these first two posts were bad:

Tasky, I can't tell if your request is serious or not because your reason for being town does nothing to prove you are town. Also, am I correct in that we've quickly moved on from random voting?

Tasky, I can't tell if your request is serious or not because your reason for being town does nothing to prove you are town. Also, am I correct in that we've quickly moved on from random voting?

do you think my post was meant to prove I am town?
don't you think it might just be a funny way to start some discussion?
which of the votes seems non-random to you? if you think we are already out of RVS, mind stating who your top suspect is?

So defensive. Yeah, actually I did think you were trying to get people to give good reasons why they were town, which would of started discussion just fine. But you didn't do that. And I believe that as soon as the first non-random vote is cast, RVS is over. And Mute said himself that his vote in Post 21 wasn't random. I don't have a top suspect yet, I've never been good at drawing incriminating evidence in first page or two of posts. I think there might be something between Mute and VP Baltar, or maybe you, but I'm not about to point any fingers when we haven't seen definite posts from the whole cast of players

it was obvious that tasky was not serious (he gave his response to his own question as being because he noticed the mod misspelled mafia ffs) and then he claimed tasky was being defensive, when in reality it seemed to me that it was the other way around. so with that in mind, i will

unvote
vote rosswilliam

[pappums rat]

lol mute and dizzle look really bad right now. mute's reasoning for voting guderian is awful. i dont think we should discount the possibility that they are both scum. either of them could have just said that they did not know the vote count if rosswilliam had been lynched. dizzle's quick unvote and saying 'dont know whats up with mute' was p scummy, sounds like he is trying to distance himself from mute iyam.

tasky, please explain the vote for robcapone.

unvote
vote mute

mute is now at l-2.

[pappums rat]

at this point i guess i will

unvote

to give rain a chance to get into the game, since he or she cant answer for mute's actions.

[pappums rat]

does ellibereth always act this weird? half of the time i find it somewhat hard to get to the meaning of his posts. i also dont like the way he put dizzle at l-2 without warning. and fsr i am the first person to note this...

[pappums rat]

vv wrote:

Okay, I looked back at pappums rat's posts and he's just been following the wagons all game. He initially random voted Tasky in post #15, switched to Mute (the forming random wagon) in post #17, hopped over to the RossWilliam wagon when that was forming in post #81, switched to the Mute wagon when the RossWilliam wagon disappeared in post #111, and then unvoted in post #181 now that the Mute wagon seemed to be going nowhere. All this is in 8 posts.

random vote for tasky doesnt count (it was rvs), random vote for mute dosent count (rvs joke with tasky), voted rosswilliam cuz he was scummy, voted mute for putting rosswilliam at l-1 without warning (which now i suppose is ok to do but wasnt earlier (wtfffffff)), unvoted mute to give replacement a chance (which is generally what i have seen done since i came to mafiascum.net).

[pappums rat]

i dont believe rosswilliams' story,it seems like utter horse shit to me, and considering that he has been on my scumdar most of the game, i will

vote rosswilliam

and tasky does indeed need to start actually posting ffs.

[pappums rat]

i might be willing to compromise on jerbs or agar, though i still think rw is our best lynch for today. for the people voting agar over jerbs, why? and vice versa.

[pappums rat]

well, i suppose that makes a compromise lynch easier for me lol. and since no one wants to lynch rw, i guess i will

unvote vote jerbs

. he didnt help his case imo with his last post. this part:

jerbs wrote:

Hold on a moment. Agar was leading a wagon on Ross, who is far from being lynched today.

For the following, assume I'm scum

Why would I use a one-shot ability on Agar? Agar was pretty close to getting lynched, and I would know that he's town, so why kill him early? Also, most of you thought that there was prob scum between me and Agar. Since Agar flipped town, wouldn't that mean that I'm prob scum? So why, as scum, would I kill the guy that other people wanted to lynch when I would know that he's town? How would this save me at all?

is so full of wifom it isnt even funny. considering his behavior day 1, i think jerbs is a good lynch.

[pappums rat]

Gut still says Jerbbbbs is town.
But what the hell: intention to hammer claim yaddiyaddiyaddiyaddi...

Am I the only one that thinks Rosswilliam almost basically has to be scum now given that Agar just proved that he was lying...? I only searched for a little bit through the D names but I don't see which ones that he could have confused with Dizzle that would have been logged on and showing it...

qethqethqeth

Unvote, Vote Ross

jerby, still claim. Unless these people suddenly decide to become my mindpuppets and change wagons.

this is probably the scummiest thing i have seen all game. 'what the hell' is no reason to unvote someone you suspect is scum, especially when they are at l-1 and people have requested a claim. my guess is ellibereth forgot his vote was on jerbs and then realized he was about to get lynched if he didnt unvote. i would say these two are scumbuddies. telling jerbs to claim after unvoting him is absurd, the whole idea of claiming is to avoid getting lynched, and when pressure is taken off there is inevitably a reduced chance of actually getting a claim. jerbs + ellibereth = scum.

and trying to figure out why agar was killed is futile. there is no point in going into that topic as there is no way to know what the person who killed him was thinking. there are so many possibilities as to who killed him and why that it is just a waste of time and nothing will be gleaned from it.

[pappums rat]

welp.

unvoting right after saying that made me think he was unvoting jerbs. he didnt say anything about zdenek in that post.

[pappums rat]

ok now i have had a through read-through this night phase I can finally get my case together that I wanted to make on Pappums

1. he seems to want to establish town cred so he follows Tasky's advice and changes his vote

2. when Jerb's FOS'd me pappums follows it up by saying he FOS's me also. He also says that the current discussion isn't going to tell us anything which seems to me like somebody in that conversation is scum and he wants to deflect to somebody else, no to mention he had just gone over 2 days without posting anything himself (after being called out for his vote switch mind you) so pot:kettle for the inactivity. The going inactive is a classic scum trick to go get the attention off of you

3. he votes Ross and says it is mainly "gut" and using the whole reaction to tasky's questions to start (notice yet again he is following Jerbs, he followed Jerb's FOS and follows Jerb's Vote)

4. un-votes and puts mute at L-2 and basically just regurgitates what had already been mentioned

5. unvotes mute/rain but he seems reluctant to

6. right after I say elleran is indecisive, pappums chimes in with his own comment about elleran being weird

7. tries to explain his votes but isn't convincing enough to me

8. votes Ross right after Jerb's votes him (noticing a pattern here)

9. right after I FOS Jerbs because his post was scummy, I vote Agar and than pappums throws it out there that Jerbs or Agar is probably scum but says we should lynch Ross

10 . he than decides to turn on Jerbs and puts him at L-2

He basically does everything jerbs does in day 1 and than turns on him when he realizes that his buddy is going to get lynched.

I am confident on my vote for pappums, he definitely fits the bill

1. lololol, this was in rvs. anyone can tell that it was a joke. tasky and i had just played a game together as scumbuddies btw.
2. loads of other people suspected you at that time as well, it wasnt just jerbs and myself.
3. already said why
4. already said why
5. already said why
6. ellibereth was irritating me, acting like that seems an easy way for scum to hide.
7. so i dont convince you. that is why i did what i did, and my answer is not going to change.
8. i had my own reasons for voting rw.
9. i didnt say either were 'probably scum' i said i may compromise on one of them. misrep right there.
10. because agar just got killed. with one compromise lynch down, where else would i go?

in other news, zdenek's 'case' on llamagod is just awful, but i suppose you all already knew that. i seems kind of like omgus against lg because he is now one of lg's top suspects. so,

vote zdenek

[pappums rat]

i am going to put my responses in bold in the quote to make this easier to read, just so no one thinks i am trying to misrep zdenek.

I want to lynch LlamaGod today.

- LlamaGod random votes, and then does nothing until he points out that Ross is at L-1, and he does this again a few posts later. I often find this sort of pro-town act coming from scum.

alot of seemingly pro-town things can come from scum since they are trying to emulate town, but this dosent mean that acting pro-town is scummy

- LlamaGod, votes Jerbs for making an overly logical post. I agree that this is a scum-tell, but he makes a pretty good case against Agar too, see his ISO 9.

llamagod had to vote for one of them, and just happened to vote for scum. your point?

- I know there is a good chance this isn't a big deal, but in his ISO 9 he says,

The following looks like lining up an RW mislynch for after a Dizzle mislynch.

This is a possible scum slip; how does he know they are both mislynches?

he doesn't. this is a good way for scum to get another mislynch, so llamagod was pointing out that this may be the case. he never said he 'knows' this to be the case

Notice that he calls for the lynching of Agar or Jerbs in his ISOs 9 through 12. Bussing a scum buddy, while pushing a townie lynch is a common scum tactic.

Then there was the daykill, and Agar flipped town.

I think Llama'd painted himself into a corner after Agar's flip. Considering the time left, it was unlikely that anyone other than Jerbs could have been lynched, so LlamaGod decided to bus Jerbs harder.

He says in ISO 14:

Zdenek is looking rather obviously like Jerbsbuddy #1.
He didn't mention Jerbs when catching up despite Jerbs being more important than most topics.
He was on Agar's wagon, which looked like a counterwagon to protect Jerbs.
Now he and Jerbs are both trying to use the pretty much ridiculous suggestion that scum were responsible for the daykill to protect Jerbs.

Point one, LlamaGod was pushing hard for the Agar' wagon, but as soon as its convenient, it becomes a counter-wagon to protect Jerbs. This is an incredibly convenient change of heart over a wagon that he was pushing.

agar flipped town. this can lead one to come to these sorts of conclusions based upon interactions with other players. its not like he started pushing jerbs harder. agar was gone, so there was only one viable lynch at the time.

Secondly, I never said that scum were responsible for the daykill, and when I called Llama out on this, he ignored me, and continued to try to line up my lynch for today. If he didn't read my post, he's scummy for not trying to figure out players alignments and if he read it but ignored it, he's scummy for not being honest about the arguments he's using.

Finally he makes it clear that he wants Jerbs to claim, asking him to in two posts in a row, I see this as possibly in game communication between scum buddies.

or he wanted jerbs to claim? what kind of communication could go on between them from jerbs claiming?

Vote LlamaGod

[pappums rat]

alot of seemingly pro-town things can come from scum since they are trying to emulate town, but this dosent mean that acting pro-town is scummy

I am not saying that acting pro-town is scummy, just that the way LlamaGod was acting protown can be scummy.

llamagod had to vote for one of them, and just happened to vote for scum. your point?

Read my post, I made my point a few lines down.

he doesn't. this is a good way for scum to get another mislynch, so llamagod was pointing out that this may be the case. he never said he 'knows' this to be the case

Do you think he would be stupid enough to say that he knows this to be the case? My point is that the statement was unqualified.

agar flipped town. this can lead one to come to these sorts of conclusions based upon interactions with other players. its not like he started pushing jerbs harder. agar was gone, so there was only one viable lynch at the time.

This is fluff and misses the point.

or he wanted jerbs to claim? what kind of communication could go on between them from jerbs claiming?

Why ask twice? (I am considering saying that we need Jerbs to claim is asking). Scum will ask their buddy to claim, in the hopes that they will get the message and fake-claim.

Rain, I think that most cases in mafia are riddled with speculation.

lol at RobCapone's meta read.

1. its basically the same thing.
2. i read your post, including a few lines down, and i do not see your point. what was it exactly?
3. how is it unqualified? he was pointing out that this could be the case. there is nothing scummy about it.
4. no its not, that is the way i see things.
5. idk. maybe. i suppose it is a possibility. i dont see it though.

[pappums rat]

unvote
vote robcapone

i dont like the way he has buddied up to me the way he has. he goes straight from believing i am scum to voting zdenek after myself and rain do so. he lulz at my defence of myself from his 'case' on me to voting zdenek because i 'actually make sense'. afaict zdenek has a habit of playing scummy (see kgb mafia), and i think rob may be going for an easy mislynch if zdenek is town, or he wants to shift the focus of scrutiny over to his own scumbuddy to avoid being lynched today. personally i think it is the former, but im not completely sure yet. zdenek is still scummy, and has not alleviated my suspicions from his defence of his case on llamagod, but right now i think rob is more likely to be scum. rob is now at l-2.

[pappums rat]

zdenek wrote:

Pappums, I don't know what game you're playing, but the specifics of what people say and do are important, and in your most recent response to my case on LG, you completely ignore the details of what is going on. It makes me feel as though you have no interest in determining LG's alignment and that you are only interested in arguing with me.

lohoooooolz. idk what game

you

are playing, mate. how exactly did i 'ignore the details of whats going on'? i went and commented on every point that i took issue with in your case on llamagod and your subsequent defence of your case. and as for 'determining lg's alignment' i have him as my #1 townread atm. has been since vp baltar got killed. oh and btw, i think it should be pretty clear that i was done 'arguing with you' when i went after someone who appeared scummier than you.

i might be willing to compromise on jerbs or agar, though i still think rw is our best lynch for today. for the people voting agar over jerbs, why? and vice versa.

Looking back at this pappums

Can you explain why these 3 were suspicious? The only one you really seem set on was Ross and your reasons for him were incredibly weak. You don't really post much on the other 2 yet you seem perfectly willing to vote both of them. Seems odd to me, since we have time care to explain?

my reasons for suspecting rw were sound. the other two were compromise lynches since rw wasnt going to happen.

[pappums rat]

Uh, this
"Just ISOed Rob. His posting sounds good/has a town feel, . . ."
Is a LAUGHABLY OBSCENE MISREPRESENTATION because in the rest of that post I make a case against Rob.
THE NEXT WORD AFTER THAT QUOTED BIT IS "BUT"

It's not a misrepresentation and the fact that the word but is irrelevant.

I contend that you are changing your reads to match Empking's, but that you are not so stupid as to so severely alter your read on someone from scum to town in a single post.

actually... yes it is, and the word 'but' and rest of his post

is

relevant. you changed the meaning of that quote by cutting off the rest of it, and in my eyes that is a misrep.

rob has defended himself well, so i will

unvote

. im not willing to vote zdenek yet until i have more evidence that he actually scum and not just playing like scum.

llama and empking's similarities is noted by myself as well, but i think it is likely that they are just seeing what i saw from rob (good defense of himself and sounding townie).

[pappums rat]

zdenek, i would like you to respond to llamagod's last post. i think it definitively shows that you misrepresented him and i would like you to explain why is does not.

[pappums rat]

empking, why is ross town? also, why did you leave off rain and ellibereth?

vote zdenek

llamagod wrote:

My post where I vote Rob after rereading Tasky's post literally comes the minute after Empking decides to flip his townread on Rob to a scumread.

zdenek wrote:

This is not a contradiction to my argument.

You could have easily had the response prepared in advance (and been grateful to be able to use it quickly), considering that it was in agreement with your earlier reads.

this is what made me decide to vote zdenek. the bolded words are just ridiculous and sound like flailing scum. zdenek has not been able to quell my suspicions that i have had on him, and his defence of himself just keeps putting him in a deeper hole. he is now at l-1 and i would like him to claim.

[pappums rat]

thats a pretty interesting case on me greyice, except that it is completely wrong.

Just searching for mentions of one of the larger contributers to day 1 here.

ISO #11: First Jerbs quote/mention. HE VOTES FOR HIM Wait, what? What the fuck? Why? WHY?
ISO #12: Attack Elli for defending Jerbs. NICE CHAINSAW DEFENSE


Day 2:

ISO #14: Case on me? ATTACK ZDENEK! CHAINSAW DEFENSE
ISO #17: Wait, what? Attacking people for buddying and putting them on L-2 while FOSing half this fucking town? SHUT UP SCUM
ISO #18: COMPROMISE LYNCHES? Yes, that's good. Lets lynch any townie, we need to kill most of em to win anyway.
ISO #19: Shit, can't be the last person left on the train, can I? Unvote. I'll play it safe so it doesn't look like I'm attacking town.
ISO #21: BACK TO FIRST EASY LYNCH COME ON GUYS

11-that wasnt my first mention of jerbs, i had mentioned a possible compromise vote earlier.
12-bullfuckingshit, i was suspicious of elli for what appeared to me to be an attempt at derailing the wagon (scum trying to prevent his buddy from being lynched) but in fact he wasnt even voting jerbs at the time.
14-yawn, there was no case on me, all robs points were weak and easily refuted. zdenek's 'case' on llama was obvshit and vote-worthy.
17-wtf do you mean 'fosing half this fucking town'? i didnt fos anyone.
18-lynch > no lynch eod.
19-rob defended himself well, so i unvoted, p self explanatory.
21-zdenek = probscum

also the analysis of my votes is bs, left votes out and didnt take into account the way the people i voted for were playing.

[pappums rat]

Other than that, his defense is horseshit.

can you explain why?

[pappums rat]

lol why would i get one of my scumbuddies lynched and try to get the other lynched so hard? since there are probably three scum in this game that would make no sense whatsoever. and here greyice goes and says earlier that zdenek's flip practically makes me confirmed town. and here is rob going for an opportunistic lynch on someone that numerous people have had suspicions on. rob seems to have lost his suspicions of me when it looked like zdenek was going to get lynched and then decides to vote for me after greyice's diversonary case against me. i will wait on my vote until i have heard what llamagod has to say, but i think greyice or rob is the other scum. i am sort of leaning greyice atm though because of saying i am p much confirmed town and then voting me anyway, and because of my desire to lynch rosswilliam day 1. both of the players who filled this slot are scummy imo.

[pappums rat]

since we can win this today, and since i am p much vt at this point w/o agar, i am going to go ahead and claim so you all will focus on people who may actually be scum. i am the other mason. part of the reason why my votes were all over the place day one is b/c of my ability to talk with agar. i thought he had made some good points about people (especially mute) which led to me voting him (and others). the other reason my play was like that day one was that i was having a hard time getting into the game.

looking back at our qt i am going to do some reading up on mute/rain again.

[pappums rat]

llama, yes we had daytalk.

i am hereby calling out rain and empking for their lurking. i have seen both of them on today and rain as well yesterday, and at this point there has been plenty to comment on since thier last posts. with us this close to deadline, we need more opinions, dammit. this is no time to lurk.

[pappums rat]

i am p sure we have a dayvig instead of a sk considering the people they chose to kill. but rob, seriously that was a terribad idea to say that you are p sure you found out who it was. i mean seriously...

in any case i prefer an ellibereth lynch to a ll one. elli has been playing scummy this entire game, and while the case on vv/ll is p good, i am not entirely convinced by it. i would vote ll for a claim, but i dont want to put him at l-1 just incase there was a guicklynch. so ll, i would like you to claim now.

i would also like to say that fsr rob still pings my scumdar even with his townie posting during my zdenek flipflop. i dont think we should put him in the almost-confirmed town category just yet.

p. edit: oh, so he was already at l-1. nvm then.

[pappums rat]

MOTHERFUCK.

we still had several days left before deadline, wtffffffff.... goddamnit.

i was giving empking kind of a pass because of guderian's ultratownie play, but i think this gives perfect reason to look back into him.

[pappums rat]

lol empking dont be such a little bitch. little sulky empking screwed up big time and now gets pissy when people call him out for it. lulz.

[pappums rat]

just so everyone knows in case i get killed agar thought there was a mute-jerbs connection. i just saw that again in our qt again and will have to go back and look for it.

[pappums rat]

man, this is going way to quickly. i think we need to think about this more before we do something this drastic. at the very least empking needs to confirm or deny that he is the vig. also, what do you guys think the probability that there would be a mason pair

and

a pair of townie neighbours? we really should talk about this and analyze more imo.

p. edit: actually now that llamagod brings up those points i do think that having ellibereth hammer rob is the best course of action. i still think empking needs to address his claim/gambit though.

[pappums rat]

yeah, that is a pretty solid case on rob iyam, at this point i think he is most likely to be scum.

[pappums rat]

awesome, gg town. great choice of kills by empking, you are indeed the mvp. also llamagod and greyice did great jobs of scumhunting, we almost certainly wouldnt have won without them. greyice had almost convinced me that i was scum rofl.

[pappums rat]

awesome, gg town. great choice of kills by empking, you are indeed the mvp. also llamagod and greyice did great jobs of scumhunting, we almost certainly wouldnt have won without them. greyice had almost convinced me that i was scum rofl.

BTW, totally stealing that last bit for my quotes page

haha, awesome

hey scum why didnt you kill llamagod? he was claimed by numerous people as being their strongest townread and is one hell of a scumhunter.