OPEN 310 - Medical Mafia - TOWN WIN

[Amrun]

A. Y
B. N
C. VOTE: DeityKabuto

[Amrun]

What?

[Amrun]

Both.

[Amrun]

N. It's null.

[Amrun]

Unvote

[Amrun]

I also said it was null, ftr.

Hypodoc still a yes from me. 1st night doing the playerlist thing is okay but at some point we need to move away from that, asap.

If the nurse claims, I'd rather it be d2 so we have some interactions to build off of.

[Amrun]

Does a quck doc kill his target? I thought it just didn't work on him.

[Amrun]

Oh I see.

So, potentially, the weak, quack, and cpr docs could all die tonight, hoo boy. Plus a potential scumkill.

Our lynch today needs to not suck.

[Amrun]

Worst case scenario, we lose n1.

[Amrun]

Also, maybe nurse claims before the hammer?

[Amrun]

Deity Kabuto, please attempt English.

Everyone else, discussion time is go, if you hadn't figured it out.

[Amrun]

DK, how come you still haven't commented on the hypo-doc situation yet?

This is the first time I have heard the phrase "hypo-doc" so I have no clue what that is.

We all claim to be doctors and claim our targets. The currently discussed system is each person protects the person below him on the playerlist.

Then after tonight's results we can try and figure out who is what.

[Amrun]

It doesn't, really. Everyone's a doctor but the nurse and the 2 scum, who will claim doctor.

[Amrun]

No.

[Amrun]

I disagree on Moratorium.

I am sitting very null leaning scum on HN, but I just nailed him as scum so I'm choosing to ignore that as possible bias.

I agree on jilly, but I have a feeling she's an easy mislynch.

I KNOW DK is an easy mislynch.

That makes me wary since mislynching today can potentially lose us the game.

Need more from timhill. I played a newbie with him once and he was lurky, easily readable scum. That was a long time ago, and I don't know anything else about him.

[Amrun]

Is that just omgus or what?

[Amrun]

chkflip, explain how hypoclaiming benefits scum more. Break it down.

[Amrun]

They don't know our sanities any more than we do.

So, no, your explanation makes no sense to me.

[Amrun]

Exactly; town isn't going to arbitrarily assume scumkill etc. We will account for all possibilities.

[Amrun]

Explain how that wouldn't happen if we didn't hypodoc.

It's a good way to detect scummy behavior.

[Amrun]

True, but think about this. If the scenario I spelled out were to happen, the scum would know who the QD is and exploit that fact. Without the claims, they won't have extra intel over us.

I think that is what it boils down to. Going through with the hypo doc stuff gives the scum way more information than it gives the town.

Incorrect. Scum might be able to narrow down weak/quack/cpr doc, but SO CAN WE. That's excellent information for us.

We have to lynch perfectly in this game to win, basically. We need all the information we can get.

If we play this game blindly, we will lose.

[Amrun]

HN: Scum won't do any better knowing our quack than we will. We will likely have two doctors plus a probable scumkill tonight dead. They'll know which one was theirs, but no more. And we could have 4 dead tonight.

If we mislynch tonight, we might lose. Either way, tomorrow is probably lylo.

We need all the information we can get or we lose. Period. If we just let it go willynilly, 9/10 we lose.

Forcing this structure gives us an expected behavior we can judge scum by.

[Amrun]

That just turns it into a mountainous. I didn't sign up to play a mountainous. I am playing. High stakes mountainous right now. And I would not have joined this if it were mountainous.

Plus I don't think 2v7 mountainous odds are good either.

I want to test the setup. Ultimately I think it's too scumfavored, but we can't work out the kinks unless we utilize it.

[Amrun]

Scum will know our quack. They know who they killed. They would know who targeted them (via the hypo docing). So, if that person died, they would know that the CPR Doc is dead. Hence, another death would be the Quack.

That is not how the CPR doc works. Read the rules and come back.

[Amrun]

Except it's not. All 3 of them existing changes things drastically.

[Amrun]

So, IceGuy is town.

[Amrun]

Can we prod jilly and tim-hill, mod?

[Amrun]

Chkflip is no longer in the game...

I'm having a hard time distinguishing between "townie making a bad argument" and "scum trying to push a bad plan" with Hello Newman.

[Amrun]

Confused about what?

[Amrun]

That's a terrible vote. Get a hold of yourself.

[Amrun]

Sadly, I am fairly certain DK is town.

Jilynne, please try expressing some opinions that are not sheeps of me.

What do you think about hypodocing? Why?

[Amrun]

Yes, explain in detail what you mean by holes, and then why you agreed to it in the survey.

And Deity Kabuto has been this mad at mislynches in the past and the early doctor claim says to me that DK is likely town (didn't understand the set-up). This is not a bring-to-LyLo townread, but for today, I do not want to lynch DK.

[Amrun]

What? Please explain what you just said because I don't think it was in English.

[Amrun]

I am actually starting to agree about Newman, but Ice Guy isn't pushing for a policy lybnch at all. Ice Guy is sooo town.

You look scummy to him because you look scummy to everyone. Don't you get that? Someone who hasn't played with you is more likely to suspect you, not less.

[Amrun]

Take this situation:

X agrees to protect Y. Y agrees to protect X.

X dies.


Explain to me the possible causes of X's death - all of them.

Read the rules and the thread again to help you.

You're only superficiially reading, so I want to make sure you understand the subject at hand before conntinuing here.

[Amrun]

You are only skimming and not truly comprehending what you have read.

No, you are not right.

Try again.

[Amrun]

Regardless of time spent, you are not fully comprehending what has been written. I'm trying to help you.

[Amrun]

I'd feel more comfortable if you understood it.

[Amrun]

It isn't foolproof.

In the situation outlined above, either:

Y is scum and killed X
Y is scum and X is a weak doctor
Y is a quack doctor
Y is a CPR doctor and no one else protected X
Y is a naive doctor and scum killed X
Y is nurse and scum killed X

Even though that's a large pool, it helps us narrow things down.

It's not going to tell us "Y IS DEFINITELY SCUM GAIZ!"

It's going to narrow our lynch pool.

[Amrun]

Timhill is complaining about work... And then says the advantage is scum have to work.

He also totally ignores reads.

Timhill, why did you agree with hypodocing in the questions if you didn't understand it and don't like it?

Who do you suspect?

VOTE: Time_Hill

[Amrun]

Hoppster and Quilford, why haven't you unvoted DK?

[Amrun]

Ugh.

Unvote

VOTE: tim_hil1990

Sheeping me now, eh?

[Amrun]

IceGuy, to be fair, he did give one read.

Tim Hill, why is taking control of town a scum tell?

Why do you think outting people as town is a bad thing?

[Amrun]

If it was, for the love of god, protect the person below you on the list.

[Amrun]

A mislynch could cost us the game... It is not the game for policy lynches.

[Amrun]

Since you haven't posted any reads even though I and other players have asked you to,

I have given reads.

One, which you are now backing away from. Give more

quote="Amrun"]Tim Hill, why is taking control of town a scum tell?

Why do you think outting people as town is a bad thing?

Didn't say it was a scumtell, I just don't like it, I also don't like how a few people seem to have written off him and a few others (such as yourself) as town because giving good discussion etc. I don't think activity levels make the scum, that's more a playstyle.
Outting people as town is great, except no one is ever confirmed until they flip.
Scum can play just about any way they want to so I wouldn't be surprised if the "towniest" players turn out scum.[
/quote]

But that's why you said Hoppster was scum in the last post you made. How is doing something you don't like indicative of Hoppster's alignment?

No one is calling me or anyone town due to activity level.

If outing people as town is a good thing but they can't be confirmed, why post "But wouldn't that out people as town?" As an issue with hypodocing?


DK: we've been talking about hypoclaiming all game. Please read.

Everyone: P sure tim is scum and the "outing town" thing was a scumslip. And if he is, DK likely buddy.

[Amrun]

Scumhunting isn't selfish. "I wasn't bussing tim!" as in, "I'm scum, but I wasn't bussing!" That's how I read it.

Oh, God. DK might really be scum.

I'm conflicted now.

[Amrun]

jilly, there aren't many posts to read. Read them.

[Amrun]

Fair enough. lol

[Amrun]

If outing people as town is a good thing but they can't be confirmed, why post "But wouldn't that out people as town?" As an issue with hypodocing?

Not as an issue, it'd be a good thing to out people as town, if it works/
I didn't say the hypo-docing is a bad thing, i'm all for it.

It really sounds like an issue in your original post.

One, which you are now backing away from. Give more

Am I?
How am I "backing away from"?
And no I won't give more, not if you ask me like that.

But that's why you said Hoppster was scum in the last post you made. How is doing something you don't like indicative of Hoppster's alignment?

No one is calling me or anyone town due to activity level.

He does something i don't like (takes control at the start), this seems scummy to me, I think he's scum> need more explanation?

This is how you're backing away from it.

I suspect, Hoppster to be honest, I don't like the way he's tried to take control of the game from the start. I know he started the whole hypo doc thing, but that doesn't clear him for me. In fact it makes me more suspicious because it's an easy way for himself to look town, practically clearing his name in the process. Hence my vote still on him.

Tim Hill, why is taking control of town a scum tell?

Why do you think outting people as town is a bad thing?

Didn't say it was a scumtell, I just don't like it, I also don't like how a few people seem to have written off him and a few others (such as yourself) as town because giving good discussion etc. I don't think activity levels make the scum, that's more a playstyle.
Outting people as town is great, except no one is ever confirmed until they flip.
Scum can play just about any way they want to so I wouldn't be surprised if the "towniest" players turn out scum.

First, you say Hoppster is scum and talk about him taking control of the town. Then, I ask you how it's a scumtell, and you say IT ISN'T! Then, you say that it is what seems scummy to you in your next post. You're contradicting yourself all over the place. You're trying to paint a so far very pro-town player in a bad light but you're nervous about doing so. You were trying to come off of your scumread after being attacked for it, but then when I attack you for doing that, it's like that post never happened.

Also, I shouldn't have to ask you for reads and refusing to give them is super anti-town.

Does anyone think you or Hoppster are scum? And I know someone, possibly you, commented on iceguy? Something along the lines of "cool so iceguy is town" based on his one post. Seems almost like self clearing posts there.

And I DO not know what hypoclaim means, stop using foreign terminology.

Firstly I didn't use that 'terminology' in that post you quoted, secondly read up on it.
From my understanding everyone agrees to protect the person below them on the player list and then with the night's results work out who is what role

@anyone> couldn't scum choose to not NK someone in this game, thus fucking up all these so called avenues for working out claims etc/

The above is more nervous waffling about town clearing other people as town. You're trying to sow the seeds of dissension in the town. We need to cooperate with each other to win this game. This level of trying to discredit others' townreads - UNIVERSALLY - is a definite scum tell for me.

And scum could choose to NK, but that's not a big issue. We'll cross that bridge when we come to it. It's unlikely that happens anyway.

tim, if calling anyone town is so dangerous and bad, then why are you trying to clear DK as town? If Hoppster trying to break the game is so pro-town that you think it's scum hatching a scheme to try and look town and get cleared and all clears are bad, then why is DK different?

[Amrun]

Yes. mith could happen and my case is wonderful.

[Amrun]

... Wrong game. Sorry.

[Amrun]

Scumhunting isn't selfish. "I wasn't bussing tim!" as in, "I'm scum, but I wasn't bussing!" That's how I read it.

Oh, God. DK might really be scum.

I'm conflicted now.

It's selfish because lynching somebody for scumhunting reasons is a gambit.

This does not make sense and I'm not sure it is English. Next post will be a response to tim.

[Amrun]

First, you say Hoppster is scum and talk about him taking control of the town. Then, I ask you how it's a scumtell, and you say IT ISN'T! Then, you say that it is what seems scummy to you in your next post. You're contradicting yourself all over the place. You're trying to paint a so far very pro-town player in a bad light but you're nervous about doing so. You were trying to come off of your scumread after being attacked for it, but then when I attack you for doing that, it's like that post never happened.

Also, I shouldn't have to ask you for reads and refusing to give them is super anti-town.

It's not contradictory, I don't consider it to be specifically a scumtell.
It's more a sort of out there kind of theory about him and the whole hypo-doc kind of theory. I just like to think outside the box, you have to admit if this was the case with hoppster and he was hatching some sort of super plan for this game, we'd all probably be screwed.
It kinda came about because I was reading the thread and thinking to myself, or gettting the impression, that everyone now just assumes that Hoppster and everyone super supporting hypo-doc are town. To write off people as town, just because they appear to be super active and super townie looking, I think would be a mistake.
However I'll admit it's a far fetched theory, so long as people aren't settling in their reads though i'll be happy.
I may have reasons not to give reads, are you saying I should post my reads on everyone at all times, without provocation? I don't see everyone doing that either...

See, what you're saying here is that the reason you find Hoppster scummy isn't a scumtell and that the ONLY REASON you find your top scumread scummy is that he is being so pro-town that it would be really bad for town if he was secretly scum.

That is not a scumread. Try again.

And yes, you should post your reads at all times without provocation. Through people's scumhunting and reads, we can gather what they think (although most people should be posting more reads as well). You're not scumhunting AND you're not posting reads.

And this is not a Newbie game that I am ICing, even though it feels like that, so you don't get a pass here and I'll scumhunt you as I please.

The above is more nervous waffling about town clearing other people as town. You're trying to sow the seeds of dissension in the town. We need to cooperate with each other to win this game. This level of trying to discredit others' townreads - UNIVERSALLY - is a definite scum tell for me.

And what if the people you are cooperating with are scum?
You not liking that i'm casting doubt on other's townieness is interesting, almost like i'm hiting on some sort of truth.
I just want to avoid (as I said above) people assuming others are town, and then us losing because we overlooked other people.

tim, if calling anyone town is so dangerous and bad, then why are you trying to clear DK as town? If Hoppster trying to break the game is so pro-town that you think it's scum hatching a scheme to try and look town and get cleared and all clears are bad, then why is DK different?

Because DK is the kind of player we would mislynch, he's impossible to make sense of. I think you brought that up yourself.

What truth would you be supposedly hitting at? Do you suspect me, tim? If so, why? These vague accusations on things that are not scumtells will not get you anywhere.

No one is suggesting giving anyone a white horse to ride into endgame with for a townie pass. In particular I want to avoid this with Hoppster. But we still must narrow our lynchpool for today. That is how the game works.

It does seem to be what you are suggesting for DK, though. Let me get this straight: we should lynch Hoppster because it would be really bad for town if he was scum because of his apparent pro-town behavior, but DK is unreadable so we should not lynch him?

I know you are nervous that too many people are calling each other town and nobody is calling you town, tim, but you're going to have to think a little bit more before you post if you want to last very long in this game. /IC cap

And scum could choose to NK, but that's not a big issue. We'll cross that bridge when we come to it. It's unlikely that happens anyway.

I think it is an issue, what if say someone was designated to protect someone underneath them, and that person survives the night and no kills were made that night. But the person protecting was scum?
Or a situation in which we all think "cool nobody died, guess these people must all be doc's" or something like that? Scum doing that could throw this theory completely.

No. We would not be scumhunting or clearing people in this manner ever. Please endeavor to understand the subject at hand.

[Amrun]

How do tim hill's answers seem satisfactory to you?

Also, jilynne isn't lying about being 13 and in a billion games. *sigh*

[Amrun]

What do you think of his suspicion on Hoppster in contrast with his townread on DK?

[Amrun]

Your age is on your profile, I'm assuming. I've seen you say you're in middle school.

And I just think you're taking on too much and not giving each game the commitment it needs. I also occassionally play a lot of games, but our level of commitment is not the same. Post count isn't really what counts here, btw.

But that's your business.

P-edit: I like tim's answers. *sigh* I must think and re-read now.

P-edit 2: Good catch, jilynne, but if so, why no vote?

Jily's jumpiness at perceived threats is a scumtell - but it's also a newb tell, so I can't decide.

[Amrun]

But all of your "slips" are things you perceive to be threats to you. It's unreliable in newbies, though.

And just keep on trying. It's a learning curve.

[Amrun]

That happens, but it's not always the best way to find scum.

[Amrun]

It truly concerns me that the top subjects of suspicion and discussion are the three most handicapped players.

HelloNewman, please post your reads and link me to some town neta of yours, since I am unfamiliar with that.

[Amrun]

I checked over DK the lst time I mislynched him... Meta fits, I think. DK is town.

I get distracted by the shiny sometimes, but I won't lynch DK today.

[Amrun]

How is scattered posting a scumtell? How is being a leader a scumtell? Do you have a wiki? If not, please post links to those games.

[Amrun]

So let me get this straight: you think Hoppster is scum because golly gee, he looks just like town and that's what scum want to do? Did you not just see me explain to tim why that's a terrible idea?

Why is your vote not on jily?

Are you always hesitant to throw down votes or do you only do that as scum like I've observed before?

[Amrun]

That post was not even remotely directed at you, jily. You're contesting that what I said about you is wrong, but I was never saying it about you in the first place. A word of advice, though: a townie's most potent tool is his vote.

What I do is scumhunting, and you don't do that while posting a boring reads list of content other people generate. I am basically single handedly generating content at this point. You can't draw conclusions if the questions are not asked. What do you consider content, jily? Do you think you have more content than me?

The "shiny" thing means that DK plays in a scummy way that distracts me, and when he's town it distracts me from finding scum and when he's scum people go, "But it's DK!"

I don't actually base reads on meta, but I use it to inform my reads sometimes. This game is about psychology and that's why I like it, and it's easier to get into someone's head with a larger pool of samples to draw conclusions from.

[Amrun]

Why didn't you place a vote on me if you suspected me?

[Amrun]

List of things that bother me about tim:

-Agreed to hypodoccing with no clear idea of what it meant, which tells me he's trying to fit in.
-When asked for reads, objects because "no one else is doing it" (fitting in again) but eventually gives two waffling, conflicting reads on Hoppster and DK.
-His initial actual discussion/objection to hypodocing sounded like it came from a scum point of view
-When pressed to give further reads, refused on grounds of rudeness that wasn't there. What pro-town motivation is there? None. When asked for reads before, he clearly just made something up in panic, which is why he can't explain himself properly.
-he has issues with others giving town reads and pretty much objects to them on a universal basis, and it reads to me like newbscum panicking that his mislynches are going down the drain. Sowing seeds of dissension = common scum tactic. I just nailed scum on it in another game.
-interestingly, he gives a strong townread on DK in spite of this and there is something up with this contradiction.


However, I am concerned because several of these are also newbtells. I don't want to give a pass for scummy behavior, but I don't want to mislynch a newbie, either. Yes, this is fencesitting. Get over it.

[Amrun]

The roles aren't confirmed during death, DK. People just flip doctor, no sanity.

[Amrun]

He means that DK can't be objective about his own lynch.

Hopefully one or two docs can narrow down sanity. Few if any will know for certain.

[Amrun]

Dk, the amount of logic you do not possess is astounding.

[Amrun]

You did know what it meant, DK. We'd explained it about 75 times.

[Amrun]

Town won't get any information.

[Amrun]

This is ridiculous.

It's apping my will to play the game. I may be browbeaten into voting DK.

[Amrun]

If you have to be asked for reads, then my quota of patience with you has already dried up.

[Amrun]

Jilynne has come off as genuine(ish) to me. :/ Jily, can you link your completed scum game for me, please?

Nurse doesn't claim today. Nurse claims in his or her FIRST POST tomorrow. Thoughts?

[Amrun]

I am okay with this.

[Amrun]

But I'm a little annoyed how tim_hill continually dodged answering m questions about his conflicting DK/Hoppster read and "resolved" it by reversing his read on Hoppster.

P-edit: make it stop.

[Amrun]

I'm basically ready to hammer since DK just claimed scum. Just need to iron out hypodocs.

Everyone protect the person below you. Person at the bottom of the list, protect the person at the top.

[Amrun]

You're an idiot.

VOTE: DeityKabuto

[Amrun]

Real doctors do not know their own sanities, for starters.

[Amrun]

Dude. Everyone knows it but you. The only people not getting a doctor pm are scum and the burse - and I am neither.

[Amrun]

YOU CLAIMED PARANOID DOCTOR

THAT IS LITERALLY NOT POSSIBLE

[Amrun]

What the fuck are you talking about?

[Amrun]

I lynched him.

If this is a mislynch I swear to GOD I am blacklisting him.

[Amrun]

Holy shit, that was a lovely bit of luck. <3

H/o brb with analyzation.

[Amrun]

Mod, can we see the playerlist in its original form?

[Amrun]

Thanks, mod.

Of course the doctor above jily is IceGuy... Ugh.

IceGuy was either quack or cpr for sure - and the other one was below the paranoid doc (or was dk).

The weak doc did not protect mafia; the mafia kill was either iceguy or someone else and failed.

Need to go re-examine thread after the flips.

[Amrun]

Okay, that is helpful.

FIRST:

DID EVERYONE FOLLOW THE HYPODOCING PLAN

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT

[Amrun]

I've got to say, Tim gave me a bad feeling, but I don't understand *any* of the reasoning behind the lynch. Someone, explain please?

How have I been keen to jump on your bandwagon? I certainly didn't vote you, and this is all that I said about even the possibility that you might be scum.

Honestly, these posts are enough to lynch tim, imho.

VOTE: tim-hill

[Amrun]

GOOD POINT WELL MADE

But seriously, the people who come out looking the worst from jilscum are:

Tim, HelloNewman, Morotorium (the latter by lack of mention)

There is a big gap between each one.

Tim is independently scummy: HN is confirmed town unless countrclaim happens; Moratorium has earned an independent townread from me.

Of course, jil could have been good at planting wifom seeds, and if time isn't scum, we'll try a new tactic tomorrow. However, I would have rather lynched tim yesterday anyway.

[Amrun]

Well, it was a big wad of fencesitting.

She never provided me her scum meta that I asked for. I'll go find it and see if she bussed.

But as I said, I wanted to lynch tim anyway before jil flipped.

[Amrun]

In this game that I am pulling a quote from: Jily was scum, Toro was herr scumbuddy, and muffin was town.

I'm going to have to say that Muffin is leaning towards scum the most. Toro may be leaning scum but not that much. I say let's lynch Muffin first. Lowkey...is also confusing me. I'm not sure if he's scum or not, but if I had to choose three people to lynch, there you have it. One thing I need to put out there, is that I'm not trying to defend Toro and please correct me if I'm wrong, but I doubt scum would be that careless. Another thing is that, his precessor seemed to be a townie.

Could I get a votecount?

If Muffin's scum, I'll probably believe that Lowkey's a helpful townie...but if he isn't, I'm going to start questioning some judgement.

For the people I think are most likely town, I'm going to say that popsofctown is leaning town, because of how helpful he is. It wouldn't make sense for him to try to be too helpful if he was scum. Also, I don't always agree with DietyKabuto, but most likely, she's town.

Yeah, tim dies today.

[Amrun]

Unvote

We have stuff to work out first.

[Amrun]

...

Lol

[Amrun]

It's not a lynch so it's all good.

[Amrun]

I thought you didn't want to discuss your plan.

Not everyone has even posted yet: tim could CC HN (though I doubt it).

Personally, I don't see the point of the plan. I probably prefer mountainous to that. Might be safer.

P-edit: if you were actually town, tim, you would know that DK claimed scum because he's an idiot.

I have given plenty of analysis on why I think you are scum - an excessive amount, in fact.

[Amrun]

Tim hill, what is the title of your role? What do you believe that role does?

[Amrun]

So what did you think when DK claimed Paranoid Doctor?

[Amrun]

I thought he was being his usual idiotic self, which as it turns out was about right.

Claiming a role that is not possible to be in the game is claiming scum. Just because he wasn't scum doesn't mean it's not a scum claim. Had you ever played with dk before?


Hoppster: what do you hope to achieve by targetting one scummy player? It's 50/50 our quack is already dead, assuming that would resolve first in the first place.

[Amrun]

Okay, so that's out? Should we hypodoc again then?

[Amrun]

I don't mind mountainous here, I guess.

Thoughts on tim hill, Moratorium?

[Amrun]

So you think posting cases on him in two days can prompt a "you shouldn't lynch someone based off of 2 posts" response and that response is reasonable? Whatever, let's not split hairs.

Well then, who do you think IS scum?

[Amrun]

Whatever gave you the impression I was leaning away from tim?

Quilford has been coasting but hasn't really done anything scummy.

You appear town to me but I don't really like the way jilynne talked about you and I dislike the lack of conviction in some of your reads - still, not willing to lynch here.

Hoppster still feels town.

HN is town - but that nurse clear was quite advantagous because he would be in my lynch pool today otherwise.

So that leaves my lynchpool today between tim and Quilford. Tim is clearly deserving over Quilford, and if I am wrong about that, by tomorrow we have a very good chance of lynching the final scum (whether quilford or someone else as things develop).

[Amrun]

Mod, can we target ourselves?

[Amrun]

Aw, boo, that would have been kind of cool.

OKAY WE DO MOUNTAINOUS

LET'S LYNCH TIM KTHX

[Amrun]

Oh wait, I forgot someone unvoted.

VOTE: tim_hill

[Amrun]

Yeah, I'm not trying to close down discussion. That would be hard to do when I provide 95% of it.

And it would be dumb not to plan for every eventuality.

Yawn.

[Amrun]

Which of his arguments are good? Point them out and show why you agree.

I've had enough coasting from you, Quilford.

[Amrun]

That post lacks reads - even conflicting ones.

[Amrun]

I think it was clear that Hoppster is saying, L- wasn't doing that, but Quilford clearly was, and you said nothing to him."

No one has CCed.

P-edit: how about answering the question instaed of quoting it?

[Amrun]

I was hoping you'd give a better answer to "who do you suspect?"

[Amrun]

No.

[Amrun]

Also, you'd think my vote on this very page would indicate that.

I'm pretty annpoyed at this point from basically carrying this game by myself after Hoppster's opening remarks.

I just didn't feel like that particular objection you brought up had any real meaning and didn't see any benefit from explaining what I had already explained that you clearly simply disagree with.

[Amrun]

Oh shit, tim's last post reads as town.

Fuck.

Unvote

Tim, I don't dislike you, but I am a little frustrated with the game in general.

Tim might still be the best lynch, especially considering jil's ISO incriminates him, but I need to think about it more.

My gut has started to twitch at both Moratorium and Hoppster, but they both have solid town points as well.

[Amrun]

Vote someone, Quilford.

[Amrun]

Yeeeeah, except he totally has a point. A good one.

[Amrun]

Lol.

I kind of want to be lynched this game just to stick it to this lazy town, but that's playing against wincon.

It's good that you were expressing reads, but you were doing NOTHING to further them - not even voting, let alone questioning your suspects.

You were leaving all THAT hard work to everyone else (me).

That's not advancing the gamestate.

At least you're voting now.

[Amrun]

Are you fucking kidding me, Quilford? Do an ISO for crying out loud. You were sheeping my case EARLIER TODAY.

I hate this game now. It was fun day 1 but this is getting ridiculous.

[Amrun]

Try being less of a sack of useless, HN.

I had a thought about this game. I think only Newman should protect tonight, but he should target someone scummy (assuming game doesn't end today)m

[Amrun]

I also considered having one person who is probably not paranoid etc target you, but thought its utility might be lost after mentioning it... Don't see how to do it without mentioning it, though!

But the way I see it we lose nothing from neman targeting one person of his choice and possibly one doc targetting newman.

[Amrun]

That sounds like a plan.

Let's WIFOM some scum, guys.

Don't say who you want to target, Newman.

[Amrun]

Do you agree to target Newman, Hoppster?

[Amrun]

Okay.

I have decided.

The last scum is in {Moratorium, Hoppster}.

Moratorium came out looking relatively bad in jilynne's ISO, as I stated earlier. A couple of other things I noticed while ISOing everyone:

-Moratorium gives off a strong pro-town feeling in the beginning of th e game, but actually provides very little content. His best content is his reads list, which has jily as "leaning scum" along with some others, amd Hoppster and I as "leaning town" - NO ONE full out town, which is strange.


Even though he lists jil as a suspect, he never pressures her and asks her a total of one question which he never followed up on - in hindsight seems a bit like coaching.

In hindsight, his descriptions of his townreads (esp on me) read like they are a bit scum-minded (threat-guaging).

He also answered a question Hoppster asked jil and specifically asked Moratorium to answer second, possibly giving her something to sheep.
His attacks today on Hoppster aren't good and I think he's encouraging a bit of noise with the formal logic. Ironically, he accuses Hoppster of asking for validation, and offers his meager scumread of jil as a counter, when Hoppster did far more to pressure jil than Moratorium did.

[Vote: Moratorium]

With Hoppster, his attempts to gamebreak come off as very genuine, but I think Moratorium scum would have been less likely to leave me alive than Hoppster, as I've read Hoppster incorrectly in the past. I feel much more confident that Moratorium is scum, though.

A lot of things in my Moratorium "case" could go either way and I realize that. However, I think this is the best move. Whichever scum is left has played a good game, making this decision difficult. I almost considered Quil for the day until I re-read him in ISO and remembered why I thought he was town yesterday.

[Amrun]

TRUE. Kind of forgot.

IceGuy was a reasonable kill, though.

[Amrun]

Actually, I mishammered. So IceGuy as a kill makes more sense than me, now that I think about it.
You might have made a better kill than IceGuy, though, hmmm...

[Amrun]

Not sure how I'm supposed to address the fact that you think I'm... the second worst townie? Thank you? I'm wierded out by this, it's like a reverse backhanded compliment.

I currently have you as my top scumread, simply because I'm pretty sure that at least one scum player was on the early DK wagon, and the other players on the wagon appear towny.

tim_hill: Scummy for posting a minimum of posts containing a minimum of content.

jilynne: May be flaking; if she isn't replaced, same as tim_hill.

DK: Scummy because he went through the roof when Hoppster had a slight suspicion on him.

Newman: Neutral. It's pretty obvious that you have something against DK, but that seems to be on a personal level and have nothing to do with the game. Your arguments against hypodoc'ing and for mountainous are strange and scummy, but your posts before that are towny.

Amrun, Quilford and Hoppster: Town.

Even though in his very next post, IceGuy retracted his suspicion of Moratorium, this is the most suspicion that anyne ever expressed towards Moratorium - and the retraction makes it a less obvious threatkill. Plus Ice was totally obvtown.

I was thinking Hoppster would have been a good kill for a jil/Moratorium scumteam - and this is still true, but IceGuy was also a good kill.

I am happy with a Moratorium lynch today. Hoppster is my only workable compromise,but is not at all ideal.

[Amrun]

Sure.

• Amrun
  
• HellloooNewman
  
• tim_hill1990
  
• DeityKabuto
  
• IceGuy
  
• jilynne1991
  
• Mortatorium
  
• Hoppster
  
• Quilford

Aww, eff - hypodoc list makes timhill more likely scum and makes a Moratorium team slightly less likely, because he would have KNOWN Hoppster wasn't protected - but then again, WIFOM.

Sticking by my decision.

[Amrun]

Quil: Now the scum won't know whether to target Newman and have a fair chance of the kill being blocked or have a better chance of killing another townie.

Moratorium: No, you don't really have anything that on its own says OMG HE IS TEH SCUMZ, but no one else does either. The biggest point in your favor is your defense of tim and it threw me off for a little bit.

But I truly believe in my case and I truly believe you are scum, and lord knows if I don't make a case on someone, no one will be lynched.

What do you mean I am trying to "single you for gamebreaking?"

Also how would I be capitalizing on Moratorium vs Hoppster - just because he is the next best candidate by PoE? That doesn't make much sense.

You make the most sense as scum. Just because you're good scum doesn't change that.

[Amrun]

Well, that "point" is so miniscule and looking back you seem genuinely interested in it. It is not indicative of alignment. I don't see a lot of scumhunting potential in it, though, but that might just be me.

[Amrun]

He means I am trying to make a case that isn't there - but there isn't a good case to be made on any single player left, so that defense is meh.

[Amrun]

Moratorium.

When IS deadline?

[Amrun]

Earlier today you didn't like my tim_hill case... Sigh.

I still think tim isn't the worst lynch but that Moratorium is much better.

[Amrun]

P sure you were voting for me up until tat point.

You suspected Moratorium. Why not him?

[Amrun]

I totally am voting for Moratorium...

VOTE: Moratorium

[Amrun]

V/La for an indefinite period of time. My father had a heart attack. I will probably post a little, or maybe even a lot, depending on how much distraction I want, but I may disappear for a couple of days and wanted to make everyone aware.

[Amrun]

Quilford, I don't understand how your plan does anything of the sort - we don't know how multiple docs will resolve, and scum could just choose to no kill if we did pick town.

My plan has already been decided on and involves you submitting no action and Hoppster and HN submitting something.

Tim or Quilford, are you willing to move to Moratorium?

[Amrun]

What problem, Quilford?

Tim, so are you saying you're willing to hammer Moratorium?

[Amrun]

Actually, that sounds okay. There are lots of resolution issues.

Mod: If the quack is still alive, would a normal protection negate that? How do multiple protections resolve?

[Amrun]

Tim.

I would like to wait for mod answers, though.

[Amrun]

Okay!

We all target tim tonight.

Tim, if you are town, target HelloooNewman.

Quilford, hammer.

[Amrun]

I made a case on him already.

[Amrun]

I still prefer my plan but I'm basically going with what Newman wants.

[Amrun]

Already noted long ago.

Newman, which night plan do you want?

[Amrun]

Yes. Hammer, tim.

[Amrun]

Maybe the game is over, Quilford...

[Amrun]

Good game all!!

Moratorium, even though I came around to suspecting you, it was mostly PoE. You played a good game. Why did you oppose the tim lynch so much?

I am so glad we won after all that.

[Amrun]

Even though I got annoyed with you all in turns, the whole town was town nough to give me townreads, which is important and awesome. I enjoyed this game overall. Excellent modding, AntB.

[Amrun]

And I remember being vaguely suspicious of him D1, too. Thanks for attempting to NK me, it lifted my mood a little especially when I remember how much I was lurking D1.

Also: all deaths came from town! xD

It was my suggestion muahahaha. Moratorium is my husband.

Omg really? I had no idea. Cute!