camn's temperamental - Mini 1232 - GAME OVER

[PeregrineV]

/confirm

[PeregrineV]

Vote: kanyeknowsbest

Because I don't think he does.

[PeregrineV]

I found it on the WOTC website and started playing there. I joined MS in February and have played about 30 games here and about 30 elsewhere.

I'd try to build a case on the person without claiming, but would claim before allowing them to live another night.

[PeregrineV]

Heading to work meeting right now, but will be back later to address stuff.

[PeregrineV]

I'm liking the fact that we apparently have plenty of wall-posters this game. It generally indicates more activity, which I like. The bad part is they tend to cross many subjects, so it makes piecing things together a little harder.

@Fishy- I'm confused by your response to Lurconis in your Post 78 because it leads to you voting him, but by this time he has already had a conversation with with Kayne and admits to misunderstanding and in the end actually agreeing with you. Was his misunderstanding faked? I'm not getting it.

@Sathoris- not this game. Seems I'm only allowed to replace into scum roles.

[PeregrineV]

Will read and stay caught up, but minimal posting over the labor day weekend.

Unovte: Haylen since it was RVS anyway (and was supposed to be Kayne)

[PeregrineV]

Labor day over- catching up today.

[PeregrineV]

Johhog - Your votes have been on BBmolla and Zang so far. However, your Zang vote appears to be only for counterwagon purposes, when all prior conversations with Zang indicate little to no suspicion. Please rectify this situation immediately.
Parama- Thank you for all you do for your town. Please continue in this tradition and give your new and current thoughts on the claim, purpose and alignment possibilities of BBMolla.
Haylen- Please report to the thread and give us 110%.
BBmolla- It appears you have realized at this point that a name cop does not provide us with a complete dossier on your intentions in regards to this town. Please state the effect you think your role will provide in catching the enemy if you remain unlynched.
Chair- I am proud that you are able to express your feelings, and am ever so glad that you have feelings. However, in this man's army we would like some facts. Please grab a hanky and present the cases on your suspects.
kanyeknowsbest- I like your posting, son. Carry on.
PeregrineV- Now that my R&R is over, the crying may commence.
RedPanda- I can still see the pimples on your face, son. Your assignment is to investigate two other players, not Fishy or BBMolla, and report your findings pronto.
fishythefish- Good attitude, soldier. You'll go far, assuming you don't throw in with the enemy. Carry on.
Zang- You seem like you have potential, but have not yet been introduced to the decision making process. It is a process by which you make a decision. Here, we call that a vote.
Lurconis- Your assignment is similar to RedPanda. Locate two other players than Fishy and Sathoris, and present evidence as to their disposition towards the town.
twistedspoon- You are part of the RedPanda-Lurconis recon squad. Choose two players other than Zang and Parma, and prepare a report on your findings.
Sathoris- You strike me as the techinical type, with more undirected experience than some of the others. Please utilize this by presenting a list of players and who they have voted for, in the order that the vote took place.

[PeregrineV]

Now that the requisite "introductions" have been made, time to update current events.

@Assignments- You may continue to exercise your individual initiative when completing your assignments, but let's keep the focus on locating and eliminating the spies.

@Name cop- Sathoris, you seem to have indicated that you think BBMolla to be town based on his name finding ability. Frankly, I am skeptical of this plan without further contigneices being presented by your self. You have the knowledge of both your own role name and that of BBMolla. With only that information, how can you reach the conclusion of name cop being a town power role?

@BBMolla's response- Your self-sacrificing attitude does not help your fellows. You ain't dead yet.

[PeregrineV]

Almost forgot the most important part.

Unvote.

FoS: BBMolla

I have yet to see evidence that your role is town-aligned. OTOH, I am loathe to toss aside a potentially valuable weapon. Assuming that that value can be positively identified.
I am really up in the air about your lynch, so will continue to hear evidence for and against you.

Vote: Chair

There is a time for gut, and a time for action. Gut time is over.

@Sathoris-

Then, if you could be so kind to answer my question about your certainty about BBMolla.

[PeregrineV]

Status reports:
Johhog- Currently on assignment

Parama- I think I found your answer.

...a most-likely-useless role than can be proven to be a real ability but does nothing to impact alignment.

In addition, you have followed up with my secondary mission of "If you think BBMolla is scum, who are his partners?" with

if BB flips scum (which he will) then one of Johhog/Chair is scum.

Please carry on, but note my comment regarding BBMolla in the post following this one.

Haylen- Currently AWOL, and being investigated by Joint Chief Camn.

BBMolla- Attention is on you, but you have 2 votes, the same number as two other players. Stop the defense and start scumhunting.

Chair- It does appear you are working on your mission. I did not see anything regarding Lurconis.

kanyeknowsbest- Sathoris is insubordinate (

probably his parents were hippies

), but is this new army we gotta be more tolerant of that (

). I do like his potential, so don't find myself wanting him to hang today. Maybe just put him in the stockade for a day or two.

RedPanda- Now, I can not see a worse violation of direct orders than your latest report. Is there a reason for that?

Fishy- Outstanding work! I may put you in for a promotion if you keep this up (and keep your boots polished).

Zang- Your non-vote has me head-scratching still, but at least your not REMF and are putting something out there. Carry on.

Lurconis- I see you are in the spirit of things, but personally feel the tree your barking up may be the wrong one. However, carry on.

Twisted- Currently on assignment.

Sathoris- Sass is generally frowned upon, but due to new rules regarding the physical abuse of soldiers, we will put it towards "diversity". Since you are not currently voting, please provide reports on two players of your choice.

[PeregrineV]

BBMolla Role- While I do not think that his role in and of itself is useful, I can see it as part of a 2-part system, like a sniper team. The sniper and the spotter work to accomplish the mission. While his name cop abilities appear to be useless, I would like to think that if we combine it with further information that it may provide us clues.
For example, he name cops "Peacenik", and someone else has information that "Peacenik" is an enemy saboteur. This is a mechanic that would benefit town, but require us to work as a team. So, before a BBMolla lynch, I want to know if he is a weapon, or the equivalent of latrine duty.

RedPanda- Your explanation seems to be (if I am reading correctly) that you
1. Suspected BBMolla and Fishy as enemy partners.
2. Agreed with Fishy so he wouldn't think you were on to him.
3. Voted BBMolla to "go along" with Fishy
4. Think that he is now voting you for voting BBMolla

Is this correct? Your last post was less clear than I would have liked.

[PeregrineV]

I'll be back in roughly 8 hours.

...........

[PeregrineV]

@RedPanda & Parama- Please see my discussion on the use of BBMolla as a possible two-part weapon system. If he is not, then I would suspect his role being more enemy oriented than not. But until that is determined, please go with your second suspect.

@Jahhog- Without reasons for your reads, how on God's green earth do you expect to convince us of anything? Thinking like that's going to keep you on KP duty.

re-other stuff- I have additional recruits (nephews) this weekend, so anything else posting-wise will have to wait til Monday, although I'll probably stay caught up on the reading part.

[PeregrineV]

So in effect we have a counter claim to BBMolla by Parama?
Outstanding!
The last time cops counterclaimed each other, they were both allowed to live and scum killed the town cop. The scum cop was lynched the next day despite his protests, but we had already lost the cop.
But these aren't even real cops, they're claiming rolename cops.
Both town?
Maybe.
One scum, one town.
More likely.
Both scum?
LMAO- That would be a kick in the dress greens.

I might be convinced to lynch neither and let is resolve like last time, or we can take a chance and maybe get the right one.

I'd like to see more from both over the next few days while we weigh our options.

Disappointed my two-part weapon system theory doesn't seem to apply.

If you have not yet weighed in on this, you are on TDY to do so.

[PeregrineV]

Reports by all claimed roles should be made, pronto. This will give the target a chance to verify that your role is legitimate.

If it is not one of these, then I would see immediate cause for concern as a securtiy leak.

Architect
Champion
Composer
Counsel
Crafter
Fieldmarshal
Healer
Inspector
Inventor
Mastermind
Performer
Promoter
Protector
Provider
Supervisor
Teacher

[PeregrineV]

I see multiple votes for Twisted, but just because he is a woolly foreigner is no reason for us to neglect our premise of an all volunteer force. Please present reports (with links) to cases, or use words to present your reasons. Ever since my wife ran off with a woolly foreigner, I've tended to be suspicious of them myself, so I wish to remain objective before issuing a court marshal.

@Chair- You gave a reason, but it is as bad as you were yesterday. "I don't know why he is scum?"

Vote: Chair

Attn: This is a non-sheep wagon. So I won't ask, but you gotta tell why before voting Chair.

Reveille was yesterday you lazy bums! Get out of the sack, gear up, and get to work!

(ie posts, please, topics already mentioned)

[PeregrineV]

I'm glad to see the initiative, troops!

Chair, I will peruse your report, and you are relieved of latrine duty until such time as it is duly authenticated.

Haylen, son, I don't know where you hail from, but we do not desecrate the memory of our fallen comrades.

Unvote.
Vote: Chair

Promote: Zang to Private First Class

for some right thinking.

Note: This is a temporary promotion pending a full background check.

[PeregrineV]

Peregrin, what makes you privy to such information as that list of roles? I might aswell confirm that my role is on that list somewhere.

That is why your gun is not loaded. You are appearing to be a possible danger to yourself.

Please note this post:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 3#p3426273

[PeregrineV]

I'm glad to see the initiative, troops!

Chair, I will peruse your report, and you are relieved of latrine duty until such time as it is duly authenticated.

Haylen, son, I don't know where you hail from, but we do not desecrate the memory of our fallen comrades.

Unvote.
Vote: Chair

Promote: Zang to Private First Class

for some right thinking.

Note: This is a temporary promotion pending a full background check.

Mixup in the orders:

Unvote: Chair
Vote: Haylen

Checking Chair case/links now.

[PeregrineV]

@Chair- Well stated case on Twisted.

@Red- Do you disagree with Chair?

@Jahhog- Present.

[PeregrineV]

@Twisted- Verification of your role is dependent upon confirmation by the receiving party. Also, did you respond to the Chair case on you? If so, I must have missed it.
Also, happy birthday!

@Fishy- Please try a vote or something, to see if the vote count reflects any voting powers you may have received.

[PeregrineV]

@Red- Do you disagree with Chair?

@Twisted- Verification of your role is dependent upon confirmation by the receiving party.

if i invented bad things then i wouldn't have claimed

I acknowledged that i could invent bad things (although i highly doubt it) as it's still a possibility and i like to cover all possibilities. Like you say, a scum inventor was possible (even though I can say with 100% certainty that I am not a scum inventor)

So, do you know or do you not know if you invent bad things? Your first sentence says you know you don't, but your second and previous says you don't know.
Which is it?

[PeregrineV]

I am torn on twisted's loyalty. I am trying to put aside he is a foreign sheep, and I think I mostly do.

I want him around another night to see if he provides an invention (and by invention I am using the wiki definition) and to see if Fishy's appears (if it is a night action, will you be notified when night falls that you have it?).

On the other hand, the only two other inventor roles I've played with were scum. Granted, one was randomly assigned scum, but both were scum nonetheless (I played as scum in one, even).

Also weighing in this hand is the fact that in both cases the players were given a list of "inventions" that they had. Even if the actual assignment was random, the player knew what they had access to at the beginning and after each night. The wiki definition even says the player gets a list, so that's more weight on this hand.

All taken, I'm inclining towards scum inventor or liar. But, in case I'm over-applying the law of similar roles, what does everyone think?

On the "changed mind" thing I'm null, because I've changed my mind before, so I don't see that as a scum tell.

So, if we want to wait until (game) tomorrow to see if anything happens, I'm good with that.

Until then,

Unvote.
Vote:Twisted

Unvote: Twisted
FoS: Twisted

<--this is intent to vote, but I don't want him at L-1 yet

[PeregrineV]

More tonight including vote, but I want to re-read recent happenings first.

[PeregrineV]

Well, Twisted hasn't provided anything else to help his case, and while I don't want to lose powers, I don't want a no lynch.

Vote: Twisted

He's at L-1 now.

[PeregrineV]

Right now,

Vote: Haylen

Extreme shirking of duties.

Going back to look at Twisted interactions, and re-read day1 and day2.

[PeregrineV]

@Haylen- both are scummy. Instead of lurking just post instead.

@Fishy- Only one I give 90% town is Lurconis, since scum watcher doesn't make sense to me.

@Red- I looked (ok, glanced, since it was a lot to read for each one) through the role names and don't see how you can equate names with alignment or even game roles, but please share anything you find.

@Parama- We're in the third day, reasons would be good at this point.

[PeregrineV]

it wasnt the temperaments , its just when i hear the word architect, i equate it to the architect of the matrix.

like from the movie "The Matrix"?

[PeregrineV]

Well, I remember the movies sort of, but who was "The Architect"? And what Lurc said above- not seeing the connection.

[PeregrineV]

@Fishy- Only one I give 90% town is Lurconis, since scum watcher doesn't make sense to me.

Fail.

VOTE: PeregrineV

There's no possible way a player as experienced as PeregrineV don't know that scum watchers exists.

lol...yeah, that's why 90%. But, feel free to link me to a game with a scum watcher. (preferably a mini)

[PeregrineV]

Ok, I see now that scum *could* have a tracker/watcher. Although, compared to the number of town versions, it's less than a percent or two.

I'd like some claim clarification. RedPanda is claiming Healer, and Haylen is claiming Protector. Are both docs? Haylen gave night targets and sort of why. And why is there suddenly SK speculation?

Unvote.

[PeregrineV]

@Chair- Please clarify how asking for clarification from the claimed HEALER and claimed PROTECTOR/PSYCHIATRIST is rolefishing?

And I did not know this

A Psychiatrist turns an SK into a VT.

.

So your name is protector and you convert SKs?

And RedPanda claimed Healer, but nothing else?

I originally thought there was another case of doc/doc claims similar to the cop/cop claims, and was going to semi-rant.

@Haylen- As it stands, I know Marketplace Mafia had scum and an SK and no one had night kills, but I'll want to look over your Jungle Republic game you mentioned. What type/forum is it in?

[PeregrineV]

@Haylen- That just seems like a really bad claim, as I haven't seen any evidence of an SK.

@Parama- You may be a very slightly town read to me, but I find horrible crap posting like that to be so non-communicative that it's like having SCUM tattoed on your forehead. You've not done it at all this game until now, so please go back to posting normal.

@Jahhong- I get Lurc's post. It's like your saying one thing and doing something else. I understand it, he provides evidence, and I've seen it used by scum many times.

Unvote.
Vote: Jahhong

@RedPanda- I don't get this, please explain.

@lurconis i think because like me he chose to believe in the smart scum and not noob scum. thats what i got from his posts and thats why i believe hes town. and this post

a town/scumflip on Twisted or Parama would divide the Town into two camps.

just proves that.

The post you are quoting is saying "A town or scum flip on Twisted or Parama would divide the town into two camps."
What does this mean?
Since Twisted flipped scum, is the "Town divided into two camps"?
Once again, it makes no sense, but since you are quoting it as if you understand it, please explain it.

[PeregrineV]

@Johog you don't see what is scummy about calling someone town in the same post you vote them?

No. Tbh I can see it as dumb, clueless or something like that, but what is the scum motivation in that? Can scum benefit from it at all?

So are you saying you're dumb or clueless? I'm not buying that.

Scum benefits from it by saying "Look, I said they were town." when they flip town, while still contributing to their lynch.

[PeregrineV]

Hmm. If Peregrin was scum, since he's obviously Field Marshall and fakeclaims had been provided, then there would be no way that logically he would play up to the field marshall role, he'd play up to the fake claim role. I'm sure there's 1 scum in each of those 4 groups in that case and third party in the other. Unless on of those categories has no scum and the psychiatrist role is a red herrin which really wouldn't surprise me.

I was hoping it would be that easily broken, hope and logic are entirely different things.

I am indeed the Field Marshall, but since it's harder to play abstract, pragmatic, directive, and expressive at at once, I decided to take the role at face value.

Since I know my role, I know not all the "Rationals" are scum, but one in each group makes sense.
Except, that sort of set-up speculation burned me before, so I will be extra cautious before lynching solely on that fact.

And, there are 4 groups each way, and only 13 players, are you thinking still 3 scum or now 4? I used to think 3 was the max, but I've seen and played in games where there were 4.

Either way, I still plan on going by play and cases and such, however, knowing whether we're hunting 2 or 3 makes a difference in terms of looking for interactions.

[PeregrineV]

EBWOP:
*all at once.

[PeregrineV]

Going to do a re-read, since I want to see what previous vote counts looked like now with more alignments known.

@Jahhog- You say you intentionally don't give reasons for your reads. Why is that? And you give

crappy

reasons for your votes, which are reads too (assuming you vote for those you think are scum).

@RedPanda- I'll have to read back through to see who you suspected.

@Lurc- I think that's WIFOM territory, so dissecting it too much leads to circular arguments.

[PeregrineV]

So I have to say at this point I think Johog is scummy for reasons stated yesterday, however everything else he has done in this game has been town.

RedPanda is confirmed town. Lurconis is probably town too. His thoughts about Parama is interesting and while he wouldn't be my first choice Parama may be a lynch after all. Chair is town for #788 so I won't vote him today after all. Zangscum needs to get lynched, but I doubt we can get enough votes for him. PeregrineV perhaps? I thought it would be better to leave him alive for later but I dunno, he's scummy too.

I would almost agree with you, except then he comes up with this, which seems like 4 layers of scummy.

Vote: Johhog

[PeregrineV]

You don't get it, do you?

No, I usually don't.

And whatever, you might as well say why I am scummy so I have something to comment on.

OK.

What you said, divided by sentence.

RedPanda is confirmed town.
Lurconis is probably town too.
His thoughts about Parama is interesting and while he wouldn't be my first choice Parama may be a lynch after all.
Chair is town for #788 so I won't vote him today after all.
Zangscum needs to get lynched, but I doubt we can get enough votes for him.
PeregrineV perhaps? I thought it would be better to leave him alive for later but I dunno, he's scummy too.

Just to make it clear on the whole thing, I think RedPanda is probably town, but disagree on confirmed. Also agree on Lurconis, mostly due to role but also play seems solid.

Then you say he's not your first choice, but that you'd be OK with lynching Parama. Since this isn't day1 or a large game, I find this attitude scummy. (I'm still mostly null-leaning-town-leaning-null on Parama, mostly due to role)

Chair cannot "be town" for a single post. But, you say he's town then you say you won't vote him

today

?!? You can think he's "more town than before", "less town than before", or about the same, but saying he's town, but then indicating that you're willing to lynch him on day 5 just seems like an ultimate fencesit, all in one sentence. (Myself, I disliked Chair's early game play, but feel better about his later game play).

Then, Zang is scum and needs to be lynched. But then you say "I doubt we can get enough votes for him". But, as you yourself pointed out, you don't give cases or reasons, so why would you expect people to vote Zangscum when you "can't" say why he is scum? (I read Zang both ways, but won't give reasons until I hear some from you).

Then, "leave me alive for later"? What does that mean? Because it sounds like you have some control over where the game goes, which sounds like you know more than us.

After looking closely, it seems like what you are finally saying is you think there is scum in me, Parama and Zang. I understand giving reads, but I don't like:

1. No reasons for any of it, yet you are asking why people are voting you.
2. The way you say it, which doesn't sound to me like it comes from town.

[PeregrineV]

Meh, I was almost thinking about replacing out anyway, I think I overloaded myself a bit, I'm ICing my first game too and that is my first priority. Will stay in the game though if I avoid lynching.
---
Chair's confused questioning in #788 is made from a townie mindset. I don't think scum would fake that kind of post.
Parama, I can't show you my vision. You should know by now that my reads is based on gut, not evidence.
And of course I think there's a decent chance that you're scum too.

More later, maybe.

Chair's 788 is a normal question and thus null. Town wants to know why, scum wants town to wonder why.

[PeregrineV]

I would of hammered him in a heartbeat yesterday but now a mislynch means LYLO and I think we need further discussion. I am still willing to lynch him I just don't want to rush it today.

I'm good with the discussion, but no one is discussing, and it looks like the weekend came early.

And since it can't ignored, if you are town watcher, why do you think you are still alive?
And who were your three watchees on night1, 2, and 3? I was thread-digging but think it's be faster asking you instead.

[PeregrineV]

Night 1 Red panda Night 2 Johog Night 3 Red Panda and I have no idea why I am still alive.

Did anyone get visited those nights?

[PeregrineV]

Unvote.

We got a week.

Everyone give the one person they

would not

want to lynch today, besides themselves.

For me, I would have to say RedPanda, since he has the least crap surrounding him, and I like his posting in general.

[PeregrineV]

Seriously, no one finds it weird that lurc has claimed watcher, and still not dead yet?

Double bind:
Either
1: He's town watcher
A. Scum thinks that there are more important people to kill
B. Scum is WIFOMing

2: He's scum watcher

1A: The least possible scenario- he claimed watcher, and he's already proven that he is a watcher.
2B: Also really unlikely-
1) scum hasn't been pushing his lynch (we're the only ones to actually bring it up)
2) scum is risking SOOOO much by leaving a town watcher alive for 2 nights to find scum.

2: The only logical scenario.

Also FOS: PeregrineV
Wishy-washyness during the TS bandwagon and just uneasiness after reading his iso (i can go more specifics when I'm not in class)

Johhog is town.
RedPanda is town.

-Misder

I'll wait for you're more. I can probably explain my own posts easier than explaining other people's, since I was the one that made them.
I see your point about Lurconis, but then who is his partner?
I disagree with Jahhog read.
I mostly agree with RedPanda read.

[PeregrineV]

Well, I see what Chair is saying, but I don't want to go the WIFOM route yet when I have more of a scum read on Johhog.

Vote: Johhog

@Camn- I will post every day unless dead or it's the weekend and I'm having losts of fun away from the computer.

[PeregrineV]

Suddenly a hammer xD

Shit, I didn't even think to check vote count since I thought people had unvoted.

Oh well, if not here tomorrow,

Town
RedPanda
Lurconis-Chair
Parama-Zang
Scum

Certain people should be looked at more depending on how Johhog flips.

[PeregrineV]

I watched Peregrine V and got no results, not no one visited him I got no results. I don't know if it was because of something someone did to him or to me.

Well, since as far as I know no one visited me, I can confirm this.

[PeregrineV]

Right now, my top suspects are : everyone.

However, time to address the multiple "town" roles that are still around. ie, Parama and Lurconis. Each time another player with their "role" died and flipped town. I don't know if this means they are scum together, but right now this whole thing leads my suspicions.

Also suspicious of Chair and Zang, just because.

Probably re-read the game since we have many alignments.

[PeregrineV]

Starting Twisted post analysis.

I second the fullclaim, but want it to be popcorn, with each person stating who they want to claim after they do.
Claims should include actions, targets, and why.

[PeregrineV]

OK two part analysis.

First part is the interactions by Twisted with the players left.

I've included post numbers, but not links, as that takes more time than I have right now. Anyone with the time is free to quote/steal this post and link the posts.

Chair
Post 123- Could be scum
Post 372- “have trouble reading”
Post 388-responds to Chair
Post 469-responds to Chair “would vote you”
Post 471-“ I'd join a chair wagon”
Post 486-responds to Chair “blatant misrep”
Post 493-“Chair is entitled to his opinions”
Post 497-responds to Chair

Parama
Post 123-agrees
Post 123-agrees with Parama
Post 123- not scum
Post 140-responds to Parama
Post 160- responds to Parama
Post 372- Parma or BB scum, lynch Parama first, etc.
Post 374-Parama scum if BB flip town
Post 376-Parama scum if BB town and vice versa
Post 391- Parama scum if BB flip town
Post 441-responds to Parama
Post 442-responds to Parama
Post 456-vote Parama
Post 459- “parama can claim his result but that doesn't remove the possibility of him being scum cop”
Post 469- “positive parama was scum”
Post 471-responds to Parama
Post 497-“conf.scum parama”
Post 528- “I guess it's claim time unless we're lynching parama?”
Post 539-“parama is scum”
Post 601-“ it's so obvious parama's scum”
Post 608-“parama is scum”
Post 615- “parama needs to go

Lurconis
Post 123-reponds
Post 123-agrees w/Fishy about Lurc
Post 439-responds to Lurc
Post 503-responds to Lurc
Post 561-responds to Lurc
Post 611- responds to Lurc

Zang
Post 123- “Zang never mentions me”
Post 123-Reponds to Zang
Post 123-Votes Zang
Post 126-responds to Zang
Post 160-“preferable lynch”
Post 181-perfer Zang lynch
Post 493-responds to Zang
Post 520-responds to Zang

PeregrineV
Post 160-“hasn’t caught up yet”
Post 372- “seems logical enough but it might be organised IIoA I'm mistaking for townieness in this case.”
Post 546-Peg is null/town
Post 554-responds to Pere
Post 608-peg is scum

Quotes of interest

2 watchers is different to 2 cops

although I do see where you're coming from with this double mechanic thing (even if the claim was uncalled for). Maybe it matches the psycology theme and is like a split personality theme or something. I don't know

going to sleep now. May change my vote tommorow. Still thing 2 cops is very broken though (perhaps even more so with 2 watchers)

@TS- can you explain why you're not scum by defending your posts? Also, reads (past the parama scum)? Also, if you want to make analysis on parama being scum, that would be nice, cause all I'm seeing right now is that BB flips town --> parama is scum, which really isn't that legitimate tbh.

panda is probtown
peg is null/town
haylen/johog leaning scum
kanye town


more later perhaps

[PeregrineV]

The second part will be the interactions of the living players with Twisted.

Note there is not yet any analysis, just the info. Once all the info is collected, then I will provide my analysis.

If you got something, post it.

If you think you don't have anything to add, go back and re-read, then add something.

Or confess and save me lots of time/energy.

[PeregrineV]

I am the Counselor, town tracker.

I'll go get my night actions if you want but I didn't reallly find anything.

Have you verified that everyone you tracked targeted who they claimed?

no, you claim all your reports

also pere you claim now

watcher/watcher/tracker/namecop/namecop vs rb/???/???

hmm.

Not popcorn, but since there's only

two

three left.

Field Marsall, cool name but otherwise VT

Parama claim (complete list)

[PeregrineV]

OK, now on to the second part. Living players interactions with Twisted. My hope is to use Twisted's posts and each players posts to find connections.

For now, just the players.

Chair Interactions with Twisted

Post 45- votes Twisted, asks “In what situation would the lynch of a town member promote the town win condition? “
Post 134-“Twisted feels town”
Post 153-“not sure about Twisted”
Post 315-“wary of Twisted”
Post 323-“Twisted hasn’t posted in over two days”
Post 390-votes Twisted
Post 426-“ I'm not sure why I think Twistedspoon is scum, but I do. I'll try to figure it out later.”
Post 466-votes Twisted.” Still not entirely sure why I think he's scum, but hey, lets see where this wagon takes us. It could be an interesting ride.”
Post 477-Full monty case on why Twisted is scum
Post 496-responds to Twisted
Post 544-“TS claim just fucks with my mind, esp. fishy not being able to confirm” Asks questions of Twisted
Post 585-“The more I look at it, the more scummy TS seems tbh”

[PeregrineV]

Lurconis Interactions with Twisted

Post 461-votes Twisted
Post 500– “@Twisted at the end of yesterday you seemed to think the existence of two cops was a real possibility then today you voted Param without explanation, what made you change your mind?”
Post 504-responds to Twisted. Unvotes Twisted.
Post 524-“ Well I just finished rereading and Twisted is still coming up my number one suspect.”
Post 541-Happy Birthday to Twisted
Post 556- “@Twisted do you know of cases where a town inventor creates bad powers? If not why would you feel the need to protect yourself from that?”
Post 610- “making me doubt your claim further twisted.”. Votes Twisted

[PeregrineV]

Sorry for weekend absence. Catching up today.

[PeregrineV]

I still have Parama, Zang and myself to go through for the Twisted stuff.

I don't suppose anyone else found something useful out of anything I already posted?

[PeregrineV]

Considering that you're not coming to any conclusions for any of them, your analysis is rather useless. A lot of little things are supposed to add up to a conclusion, but lacking the conclusion means you're just stuck with information not being used for anything. So, what are your conclusions thus far? <_<

Note there is not yet any analysis, just the info. Once all the info is collected, then I will provide my analysis.

If you got something, post it.

If you think you don't have anything to add, go back and re-read, then add something.

[PeregrineV]

So your posts are currently completely worthless. They're just paraphrasing the thread... why aren't you just skipping that step and going straight to analysis, then? :/

Because I would have to gather the data regardless before any analysis. What I'm doing is sharing in the hopes that others can use the data and provide their OWN analysis. Or their OWN data for all to use.

But hell, at this point, I would be happy if people would provide ANYTHING.

[PeregrineV]

Also, the point of all the work is to find the last two scum. Finding one would be great, but if you can't find the partner, then you're stuck in the same place we are today.

[PeregrineV]

PeregrineV's Interactions with Twisted

Post 239- (Asks Twisted for reads on other players)
Post 277- (Was being ignored but didn’t want to push the issue yet)
Post 472- (Find Twisted’s posting style generally scummy, but don’t like using that as a reason to vote people, since it’s actually not a tell so much as a preference)
Post 540- (You can claim inventor or gifter, but someone’s got to receive it for it to count. You haven’t responded to Chair’s case on you)
Post 553- Asking Twisted for claim clarification
Post 574- Twisted claim not matching up with my experience with those role types. Vote Twisted, but unvote to avoid L-1
Post 600- Vote Twisted

(translations in parenthesis)

[PeregrineV]

Parama's Interactions with Twisted

Post 167- Agrees with Twisted
Post 345- Might address a Twisted quote- hard to tell
Post 440- Doesn’t like BB hammer by Twisted
Post 443- responds to Twisted
Post 455- votes Twisted
Post 470- “Twisted why are you voting me BTW”
Post 597- “can we just lynch twisted”
Post 606- responds to Twisted
Post 609- responds to Twisted
Post 612- responds to Twisted
Post 617- responds to Twisted

[PeregrineV]

Zang's Interactions with Twisted

Post 125-responds to Twisted
Post 127-responds to Twisted
Post 410-responds to Twisted
Post 491- @Twisted “What about the rest of Chair's case? Are you going to ignore it or are you going to defend yourself?”
Post 515- votes Twisted
Post 537- responds to Twisted about his claim
Post 579- “Twisted's claim seems like a fake claim”

[PeregrineV]

OK, NOW I'll do the analysis part.

[PeregrineV]

Looking only at Twisted, he seems non-committal on Chair, has no Lurconis reads, and wants to lynch Zang, Parama, and me.

Looking at living players, Chair has more Twisted reads early on, whereas most didn't have any interaction until his claim. However, Chair as has the most extensive Twisted case prior to claim.

Twisted post 506 seems to me to relate to the "double"roles, mentioning the 2 cops 2 watchers thing, but doesn't condemn, but chases Parama most of day2. But to decide is this bussing or attempted mislych is the question.

So move to Twisted post 546. It responds to Chair. It mentions everyone

except

Parama, Zang, Lurconis.
But he favors a Zand lynch day1, and pushes to lynch Parama day2.

So, for the way Twisted carefully avoided Lurc, that causes me to be suspicious. It also cause suspcion of Parama and Zang, but to a lesser degree.

Secondly, at this point 2 town cops and 2 town watchers makes no sense. BBMolla=town makes me look at Parama. Sathoris=town makes me look at Lurc.

So, all things considered, my vote will be on Lurc at this point.
Mostly think Chair is town.
Zang or Parama is other one by PoE.

Thoughts?

[PeregrineV]

Was going to vote Lurc, but he's the only one talking.


HELLO, WAKE UP!!

[PeregrineV]

BBmolla - Supervisor,

Town Name Cop

, Lynched Day 1.
Sathoris - Promoter,

Town Watcher

, Killed Night 1.

twistedspoon - Inventor,

Mafia Roleblocker

, Lynched Day 2.

kanyeknowsbest - Teacher,

Townsperson

, Killed Night 2.
Haylen - Protector,

Town Psychiatrist

, Lynched Day 3.
fishythefish - Performer,

Townsperson

, Killed Night 3.
Johhog - Provider,

Townsperson

, Lynched Day 4.
RedPanda - Healer,

Townsperson

, Killed Night 4

OK, we have left

VT
VT
Watcher

Parama targeted Chair night 1
Lurc targeted Johhog night 2
Johhog targeted nobody night 3
RedPanda died night 4 so I got no result

Tracker

To answer why I chose my targets Night 1 I chose Red Panda cause I thought he stirred the water the least and had the least strong reads meaning scum killing him wouldn't give town info to analyze.

Night 2 I wanted to watch someone not on the twisted wagon as i figured at least one town member was not on the wagon. I chose Johog as I had a slight scum read on Kanye and I had watched Red the night before.

Night 3 I chose Red Panda cause he claimed healer as his flavour and I assumed that would mean doctor and thought scum would as well.

Night 4 I chose Peregrine V cause he was my strongest town read going into the night.

Flavor Cop

@Parama- can you please post your targets & results in one post? If you already have, please let me know which one- I can't seem to find it.

[PeregrineV]

BBmolla - Supervisor,

Town Name Cop

, Lynched Day 1.
Sathoris - Promoter,

Town Watcher

, Killed Night 1.

twistedspoon - Inventor,

Mafia Roleblocker

, Lynched Day 2.

kanyeknowsbest - Teacher,

Townsperson

, Killed Night 2.
Haylen - Protector,

Town Psychiatrist

, Lynched Day 3.
fishythefish - Performer,

Townsperson

, Killed Night 3.
Johhog - Provider,

Townsperson

, Lynched Day 4.
RedPanda - Healer,

Townsperson

, Killed Night 4

OK, we have left

VT
VT
Tracker

Parama targeted Chair night 1
Lurc targeted Johhog night 2
Johhog targeted nobody night 3
RedPanda died night 4 so I got no result

Watcher

To answer why I chose my targets Night 1 I chose Red Panda cause I thought he stirred the water the least and had the least strong reads meaning scum killing him wouldn't give town info to analyze.

Night 2 I wanted to watch someone not on the twisted wagon as i figured at least one town member was not on the wagon. I chose Johog as I had a slight scum read on Kanye and I had watched Red the night before.

Night 3 I chose Red Panda cause he claimed healer as his flavour and I assumed that would mean doctor and thought scum would as well.

Night 4 I chose Peregrine V cause he was my strongest town read going into the night.

Flavor Cop

fine.
Chair is Champion.

Yes that was the plan. You visited Johog.

And he is the Provider.

Anyways! Zang == Counselor!

In other news, Lurc is Crafter.

NOT LIKE IT MATTERS ANYMORE BUT <_<

also you have the tracker and watcher backwards in that post
...which makes me feel you're not scum with either of those two IMO. Hmm.

also, answer my question kthx?

[PeregrineV]

Basically, I can't believe every currently existing power role is town.

So, I wonder are all three real? Parama posted his targets as they occurred, and if I remember correctly they were verified at the time.

I thought Lurc gave his daily results once he claimed, and someone verified them as they occurred.

@Zang- did you make any claims prior to anyone else. If so, can you show where you gave your results prior to your activity summary? (ie, your post 871 is after everyone elses claims)

[PeregrineV]

Everyone say who you want to lynch the most at this point in time.

And it's not who I WANT to lynch. I WANT to win. Therefore I WANT to lynch scum.

Right now, it's between Zang, Lurc, and you. Chair will never be 100% town to me, but I got him there for now, and just getting one person in that column helps me to narrow the field.

And unless you want to confess, what is more likely to go with

Mafia Roleblocker

,

Mafia Watcher

,

Mafia Tracker

, or

Mafia Flavor Cop

?

Don't forget we already have a

Town Name Cop

,

Town Watcher

, and

Town Psychiatrist

[PeregrineV]

what the hell are you talking about

the person you find scummiest = the person you want to lynch. pick one.

and what are you talking about with the flavor names

Scummiest? You and Zang.

But I want to use logic, since I think town can win that way.

Current questions to myself, since nobody else seems to be asking-
Is Parama scum since town role cop in BBMolla?
Is Lurconis scum since Sathoris town watcher?
Are any of the double roles mod WIFOM purposes?
Is Zang real tracker, or are all his results based on pre-existing claims?

Those are much better questions than "Whose scummiest?"

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Zang

I think he's faking his results from everybody else's results or he is a scum tracker.

[PeregrineV]

The decision was made to bus Twisted, but I wasn't sure why, since it would make the game harder for us to win. I think Twisted mentioned in the dead QT he doesn't hink he was good as scum, but he seemed to be doing fine to me. So if it looked like I was reluctant to bus him, it's becasue I was.

The fact that Parama pulled up the matrix and shared it immediately I think was something that really helped. Usually you expect sharing from a town player, so his sharing of it I thoguht helped him come across as town.

Haylen's breakdown had to be acknowledged, but not encouraged. As town, I would have definitely wanted to lynch from the same group as Twisted was from, if for no other reason than to test the hypothesis out about the rational=scum.

I like the setup. I took the Golden test (a similar one), and if I remember correctly, I got the same result that I was assigned in the game!

@Camn- you did a great job. Vote counts were timely and accurate, prods were sent as needed, and yes, you did provide fake claims.
By the time Parama posted the link to the 16 personalities, I had already posted in the Field Marshall way. I figured backing off of it immediately would be too suspicious, so I kept going, figuring I would just keep my regular claim/name. If I would have known the setup prior to using the posting style, then I would have used a fakeclaim instead of my real name. I was worried that some town player might have role knowledge that our real names was scum. Luckily, that turned out not to be the case.

[PeregrineV]

I forgive you

Actually, I am really thrilled that I didn't have to find any replacements at all!
I think that is great.

Yeah, I'm jealous now that you say that.

[PeregrineV]

I liked this game, setup amused me and was a good revision tool :p The town played really badly. I played badly. Scum should've used their fakeclaims.

But I had already posted many time sin the "field marshal" style (such as it was). If I would have come back and said yeah I'm the COMPOSER, that wouldn't have set off any alarm bells?

[PeregrineV]

Dont blame me for your lack of planning
You are talking to a girl that has been known to breadcrumb multiple fakeclaims in the RVS, so she could choose lies later in the game depending on flips.

I remember. I joined you as scum in one game where you already had it won, and that planning was in the QT.

If Parama had posted the matrix during the night, it would probably have been a different story.
I'll just blame him that we didn't use the fakeclaims.

[PeregrineV]

No scum QT?

Check the role PMs already posted