NY 190: Molla's Large Normal

[FA_Q2]

/confirmed

[FA_Q2]

Oh wait, you actually confirmed.

yup, try reading next time

Only dropped out one time (and by your post I guess that was a game you were in) from circumstances beyond my control.

Wont have an issue this game

VOTE: BananaCucho

That is a scummy GIF!

[FA_Q2]

Oh wait, you actually confirmed.

yup, try reading next time

Only dropped out one time (and by your post I guess that was a game you were in) from circumstances beyond my control.

Wont have an issue this game

VOTE: BananaCucho

That is a scummy GIF!

Hold up, if that's a scummy GIF, then shouldn't choof, who actually owns the gif as an avatar, be scummier?

I question your logic, good sir.

meh.

Choof is acting like town though.

[FA_Q2]

town

Naked statement is, well, naked.

Care to elaborate as to why?

[FA_Q2]

I have no idea why the quote above did that...

Btw i also now have a townread on talah.

^this is what I meant to quote.

[FA_Q2]

^I don't like that at all. Why are you assuming that AJ is going to hang already?

The day is early.

[FA_Q2]

Why does the vote bother you so much?

it doesnt

, you didnt give any reason for the vote aside from quoting a post

If my vote on you doesn't bother you and you're just asking why I didn't give any reason for my vote, can you then please explain to the members of the jury why you ignored posts 63, 66, 73, and 76, which were ALL votes without stated reasons for another person. This normally wouldn't bother me but given this post it calls my attention:

I currently have slight townleans on both Banana and choof, more so Banana than choof.

Wat

What have I done that is alignment indicative at all lol

don't like this post
why bother pointing out that you havent done anything alignment indicative if someone has a townread on you?

I'm wondering how its possible to town read me based off of nothing alignment indicative. Scum know who is town and who is mafia. Cmon now.

tone and presence. I would have had a pretty decent town read on you because of the avatar post but

you seem to be pretty self conscious

on phone so I cant easily edit this
but those votes didnt bother me because they were not on me

That stinks to high heaven.

This tells me you are not bothering with scum hunting but rather only concerned with self preservation.

What does that sound like...

[FA_Q2]

Somehow I missed moving my vote in my last post:

VOTE: choof

It is interesting that no one noted that as well.

[FA_Q2]

Somehow I missed moving my vote in my last post:

VOTE: choof

It is interesting that no one noted that as well.

don't give yourself too much credit, you haven't done much at all in this game so far. why do you think it's interesting that no one noted your lack of vote?

Because virtually every game I have played calling another player out like that and then not voting for them is called out.

It is odd to me that not one player noted that I still had my vote in RVS. I don't know what to make of that yet, if anything.

[FA_Q2]

Hello Vedith btw.

I'm guessing you're town on what could be completely incorrect game meta which is that the person you replaced did not pick up their role PM.

Ergo no full scumteam to chat pre-game, ergo unfair on the scumteam.

How do you feel about that?

?
this dies not make any sense.

Where did you even get this idea. How do you know that the scum team was able to chat pre-game? I thought that was something that is explicit in the rules or does not happen? Can anyone else speak to this site and the general rules as to scum being able to speak pre-game?

[FA_Q2]

UNVOTE: I am Innocent for now, I was hoping to get something out of that RVS vote, but alas. I want you to talk!

VeeGee

and

Talah

both seem confused from what little content that they contributed, which is usually never a good thing. However, while Talah actually asks decent probing questions to clear up her confusion and get a read, VeeGee adds unnecessary comments and doesn't appear to try to understand the situation. I could only see this coming from the perspective of a lazy town or a low-effort scum.
Either way, I'd like to hear him speak more. Soooo VOTE: Veegee Hi.

I still don't like

catboi

's focus on me, when there's others who have lacked content on the whole. I don't see how my post 104 was so egregious, it's pretty clear I was trying to catch up to a game's speed I wasn't used to with some quick thoughts in a lax tone. And my point on IaI is clearly contentious, but I think I still had a point at the time. Choof in some ways agreed with me here: 129, and AJ kinda had the same idea.

Actually, reread and I liked what choof did with Banana that many interpret as an argument, reminds me of what Bacde did with me once.
Also of the TvT argument with Banana that ended bad.
I want to know if the gripes

@Choof

had with Banana is legit or was it all a reaction test. If so the former, that makes me curious about

Kyubey

who went all in for real with the Banana case. I'd like to know from him if he still thinks Banana is scummy.

FAQ's last post does bug me a bit, not enough to vote though. I would expect him to know better though, rather than trying to get brownie points.

@Banana

Care to explain the Luna vote?

@Performer

I'd like to know your reads now that all of your initial scumreads apparently dissipated.

@Luna Fox

You don't interact too much with some of your townreads, like Talah and Kyubey. Wouldn't that make you more sure if that's your playstyle? I understand some people can have town actions, but are they really that strong when it comes to those two?

Know better?

I have been scum one time on this site (and that was my very first game) and have seen it explicitly in the rules that scum do or do not have a pre-game chat. The other site I used to play at never had a pre-game chat for scum that I can remember. I would expect that there be more question without any explicit explanation as to weather or not scum actually had that capability.

[FA_Q2]

[quote="In post 191Actually it was in the sample Mafia role PM:

...

All this drama because I missed that in the OP.

[FA_Q2]

Unvote
Vote: Performer

I think im probably never going to find out about FAQ2 anyway.
#SheepingTownreads

Not true - the game will end at some point and then you will know everything

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: performer

Why the fixation on your own survival? That is a decidedly ani-town mindset. It does not help town if players are simply trying to avoid conflict and getting lynched.

Your posts are also terrible to read. Not a reason for voting you just an observation.

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: performer

Why the fixation on your own survival? That is a decidedly ani-town mindset. It does not help town if players are simply trying to avoid conflict and getting lynched.

Your posts are also terrible to read. Not a reason for voting you just an observation.

iirc there are quite a few posts that relate to you so if you could not ignore them and respond with something original, that would be fan-freakin-tastic

Point them out

[FA_Q2]

yeah that vote is all sorts of terrible

Whatever.
It appears that anything that I fucking out there is going to be a problem for you so just vote to hang me and be done with it then.

I don't care for this asinine bullshit.

[FA_Q2]

Don't have much time to catch up and was pretty busy the last few days. Will read up tomorrow and post.

[FA_Q2]

Eh that last post by performer sounds town I don't wanna lynch him

Why?
His post is entirely a FoS on people voting him because they are voting him. That is terrible reasoning.

AJ, I never read on replacing in.

I like Performer though but I can't say why. Dude looks noob town.

Based on?

[FA_Q2]

100% certain you have 1 scum in four people. THREE OF THEM are basically confirmed town.

Really?
AFAIK, no one is confirmed anything at this point.

[FA_Q2]

Aj do you think there are two scum teams

I do

What leads you to believe this?

[FA_Q2]

Why zakk?

That is a no information lynch. There is zero from his interactions to tell us who his partners might be if he flips scum and if he flips town there is nothing as well.

With performer, even a town flip gives us some info on Titus. I can go for Vegee but that is essentially a policy lynch.

[FA_Q2]

Molla was logged on for at least a while earlier too, post-hammer.
*coughlurkingscumfuckmodcoughcough* what

Speaking of which, these folks should post their thoughts on the lynch, tomorrow etc.

Skybird Sep 24, 11:27am Sep 28, 12:49pm 2 days 4 hours 19
BananaCucho Sep 16, 12:49pm Sep 28, 12:04pm 2 days 5 hours 109
I Am Innocent Sep 16, 11:34am Sep 28, 07:59am 2 days 9 hours 45
FA_Q2 Sep 16, 12:52pm Sep 28, 04:07am 2 days 13 hours 21

Thoughts on the lynch? It was useless unless we managed to randomly hit scum - I don't see much of anything in the way of actual information we get from this. A policy lynch on day one is a bad idea.

Tomorrow is going to have to wait till we get the flip. There are a few people lining up lynches for tomorrow without the flip - that does not sit well with me. The way performers wagon fell apart at the 11th hour without a claim is also bogus - unless I missed something there.

[FA_Q2]

There is the possibility that I got hit as well. However considering yesterday's events, I'm betting it was you that got shot at.

Sky, who'd you send to? Everyone's alive, no one can duck out.

Why?

[FA_Q2]

Okay to be less cryptic, Worst is a friendly neighbor. This is almost exactly what choof/skybird have claimed. There's almost no way I expect there to be TWO in this game.

This is interesting. I have not been in a game with this particular role before so I don't know how rare it would be to have two in the same game. Sky claimed:

I have stuff to do today and will be afk quite a bit. I will send my message to one of these three players:

FA_Q2, VeeGee, IamInnocent.

As soon as the thread re-opens for D2, I will post who I sent it to. I ask that the player who receives the message confirm it in their first post on D2.

I received nothing. I guess we will see when veegee or innocent shows up.
pedit: Why do you think the target last night was you or luna?

[FA_Q2]

Of note: friendly neighbor, if I understand the role correctly, would be an absolute horrible scum claim - it would give them little town credit but tie them with whoever had to lie about receiving the message. I am not quite sure what to take from the possibility that we have 2 claiming it.

[FA_Q2]

@Faq2: I can spell it out for you: I'm a 2 shot bullet proof doctor.

@Luna because I'm not sure what exactly it means right now. Friendly neighbors aren't anything more than innocent children who need night phases to work.

Not sure what to take from that.

Why claim now? this does not make sense to me.

[FA_Q2]

I get that the BP gives you some protection for that claim but...

[FA_Q2]

I must be missing the obvious then. Do enlighten me.

As I said Yesterday, Performer's play was such a clear and deliberate deviation from his normal style of speaking, with all of the lyrics and so on, that there was no way that he was scum. I've played with him as scum recently - he was nervous and noncommittal. His posts in this game are clearly those of someone who is trying to put themselves out there and Do A Thing, and I fully believe that he would only do that if inspired by a town PM.

PEDIT: Didn't mean you, Sala

What do you think he was trying to do then?

I still do not see the performer is so town reasoning.

[FA_Q2]

Good morning from Cali, everyone...
welcome, Salamence

I was hoping to post after the n1 ended (Friday night, since I had plenty of time yesterday) but BB had a show, it got late, I went to sleep, and now I'm reading some incredibly interesting updates...

Confession - my "awkward play" in d1, particularly the post toward Vee - done as a gambit attempt, to draw an

nk against me

This is why I wanted to draw so much attention on d1..
Obviously no one died, which makes me scratch my head....
I don't have enough time at the moment to follow-up on everything, as I have to head off to work in a bit

If I continue my playstyle this game, I see it'll most likely hinder town's chance of winning, so

I will quit my paranoid & musical playstyle for this game, as of d2

And I will just be myself , since the situation has grown complex

I will catch up when I get back home
Thank you everyone

I note that you failed to state why you were so bent on pulling the NK. I also don't understand how you thought your actions would actually draw the NK - you were clearly a lynch candidate and it would have been dumb for scum to have targeted you IMHO.

What are your reads from yesterday as well then now that you are going to be 'yourself.'

[FA_Q2]

I think that he was trying to do exactly what he says that he was trying to do - try to make it look like he had a cool role to draw the nightkill. I'm not saying that he did it well but it's really obvious that something like that was happening.

Perhaps to you - not so much to me.

[FA_Q2]

I agree that such an OP role must have a scum counter (Strongman in this case)

That does make me wonder... if scum have a strongman, why did nobody die?

As I understand it, strongmen are usally X-shot.

That would make sense.

[FA_Q2]

Seriously someone here is a JK, and a BPBG.

Really?

And what amazing roles do you see scum having to counter this setup. That seems awfully powerful as well as the fact that we have 2 confirmed townies.

[FA_Q2]

No, it's pretty obvious. What scum team WOULDN'T go straight for luna unless they suspected the doc protect.

More concerning is that you're not thinking that through.

Why would they go for luna is a better q.

I read talah as a much stronger town read than luna and we had at least one that was town-confirming.

I mean, I know Luna's alignment. Anyone who's town knows her alignment.

Unless you are scum then you do not.
Such a statement is scummy as hell. You assume that you know where the scum NK went. Only scum know where it went.


AJ is still a bad vote for day 2 though. If he is scum we can deal with that day 3 but I highly doubt that scum does not have a strongman with this particular claim in play. It also bothers me that AJ didn't even seem to think about a RB to completely short circuit his role and essentially throws it away. I don't really see a town motivation for this action but we will find out tomorrow though.

[FA_Q2]

I note that you failed to state why you were so bent on pulling the NK. I also don't understand how you thought your actions would actually draw the NK

The reason is implicit, duh. Somebody has to be targeted for kills at Night. Better somebody who

doesn't

have a cool role.

And it's obvious why Performer might think that his actions (in a perfect world in which he executed them properly) would draw a nightkill because people were literally speculating about him being a power role in the thread. So congratulations, you know exactly why he did what he did, just that he did it with not nearly enough subtlety. Given what I've seen of Performer so far on the site, I find it much easier to chalk that up to raw inexperience than a calculated effort to deliberately try to fake a townslip.

you were clearly a lynch candidate and it would have been dumb for scum to have targeted you IMHO.

Attacking the results rather than evaluating the original intention <<<<<<<

Fair enough.

[FA_Q2]

FA ignoring me other than bullshit setup spec to discredit me.

Man Im so fucking good at molla games.

I have nothing to say to your 2 massive lines of 'content' on me.

There is nothing to discredit. It is not 'bullshit' either.

[FA_Q2]

As I understand it, strongmen are usally X-shot.

That would make sense.

As I understand it, strongmen are usually not X-shot. See? I can apply an insignificant sample size too!

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Strongman

Strongman is usually X-Shot. It is usually scum-aligned, but has been seen on Town Vigilantes as well (where the overall role is called Juggernaut).

It is not based off an 'insignificant sample size.' An unlimited strongman is certainly possible but it does not make any sense to me.

The point I made earlier is that, in a world in which town has two multiple-night-self-confirming roles and a multiple-BP doc to protect them, telling scum that their strongman is limited-shot (thus increasing the chances that they do not make a strongman kill on Night 1) is highly likely to leave them massively on the back foot if that's their only counter to a town team that can spread confirmation all over the game and keep that confirmation protected. Like, assuming there's not a massclaim on Day 1, scum in that scenario are highly likely to be a long way behind the town. That's what I'm really struggling to reconcile here. Unless scum have some kind of ridiculous superpowers (which a Night without kills makes less likely, though far from impossible), the kind of town power being talked about here is

beyond ridiculous

. So I think it's very likely that a scum strongman in this scenario would have to be unlimited, and the fact that we had no kill last night therefore tells me that either scum have something different to a strongman or, more likely, the scenario being proposed is bullshit.

If strongman were unlimited then roles like doc and bp are almost useless.

I guess I can see that as a possibility but considering the results we know that is likely not the case. Are you willing to put enough stock in that idea that you hang the BP Doc?

[FA_Q2]

Youre defending of Zakk was terrible not to mention he was your counterwagon.

Thats good enough to warrant a vote from me.

Almost Im 99% youre flipping scum now so wheeeeee

Sorry I pointed out the reality of the idiocy in Zakk's wagon.

You do not waste your day one lynch.

[FA_Q2]

I dont want sheep. I want results.

What kind of results? i already said everything i wanted about FAQ2 on D1, along with the fake towntell and stuff.

Then dont say youre sheeping.

"Sheeping" indicates that you dont give two shits about this wagon or you dont care about who dies. I for one do think he is going to flip mafia because he was the counterwagon to zakk and the way he treated his counterwagon. I dont like his D2 play so far and there are nitpicky stuff in his iso. I like this way better than AJ. The more I think about it, the more AJvTitus looks town (Titus isnt one to not pick fights after all).

I have not read D1 as a whole yet. I had some time during my radio show to skim some pages but never had time to do anything detailed other than skim wagons and see what I think.

Stating that I am scum because I was on the counter wagon of a town flip is beyond idiotic.

[FA_Q2]

I dont want sheep. I want results.

What kind of results? i already said everything i wanted about FAQ2 on D1, along with the fake towntell and stuff.

Then dont say youre sheeping.

"Sheeping" indicates that you dont give two shits about this wagon or you dont care about who dies. I for one do think he is going to flip mafia because he was the counterwagon to zakk and the way he treated his counterwagon. I dont like his D2 play so far and there are nitpicky stuff in his iso. I like this way better than AJ. The more I think about it, the more AJvTitus looks town (Titus isnt one to not pick fights after all).

I have not read D1 as a whole yet. I had some time during my radio show to skim some pages but never had time to do anything detailed other than skim wagons and see what I think.

Stating that I am scum because I was on the counter wagon of a town flip is beyond idiotic.

never mind. I was being idiotic. I read that totally wrong.

[FA_Q2]

I'm still thinking wtf? with Worst's claim of FN. I also don't like AJ outing himself as the doc if he really is that.

Technically, worst did not claim it - AJ did.

I don't really see a viable scum tactic of fake claiming FN.

[FA_Q2]

I'm still thinking wtf? with Worst's claim of FN. I also don't like AJ outing himself as the doc if he really is that.

Technically, worst did not claim it - AJ did.

I don't really see a viable scum tactic of fake claiming FN.

InuYasha mafia.

Scum claimed FN when I got them wagoned D1.
Dead guy got the message twice.
Sent to scumbuddy.
In multi ball.
No one shot either one.

Most frustrating town game EVER for me.

What do you think of 2 FN claims then titus?

[FA_Q2]

Seriously someone here is a JK, and a BPBG.

Really?

And what amazing roles do you see scum having to counter this setup. That seems awfully powerful as well as the fact that we have 2 confirmed townies.

Still waiting for this or did I miss it.

[FA_Q2]

The best solution i can think for this is to have both friendly neighbors target someone together, and have the doctor protect that person, unfortunately im not sure whether this would help.

If AJ's town that's setting him up for failure.

So far we have 2 different claims for what the PM states.

One state player name and town, other states player name, role and town :/

[FA_Q2]

I'm not sure i understand, but the mafiawiki says that FN is necessarily town (if the claim is true that is)

One isfake if the PMs are different.

Town-aligned Friendly Neighbor is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. Messages sent on behalf of a Friendly Neighbor must be identical.

From the wiki.

Sigh. The above post was supposed to go with this quote.

I meant to ask in the above - Why does that set him up for failure?

[FA_Q2]

Is he perhaps not a friendly neighbor? I explicitly got his role.

Mailman pops into mind as a role possibility, but mailman generally is clarified not to be written by the mod.

This sounds like Drug Dealer or Unscrupulous Messenger. Both roles in my Don't Trust Titus Setup.

Don't really care what is sounds like - they both explicitly claimed FN.
If one is a lie then it would not have come from town...

[FA_Q2]

Vedith is scumtelling up the ass

Explain?

His interactions are bad - that is true but not really scummy. He certainly is not trying to win any popularity contests. I don't really like how willing he is to lynch a claimed PR out the gate but I an suspicious of AJ myself.

You are also CONTINUING to ignore my question. That is annoying.

[FA_Q2]

UNVOTE:
There's stuff im seeing that im not liking.

Care to share your thoughts then?

What are you not liking?

[FA_Q2]

On lynching a claimed power role: Ordinarily I would let these things shake themselves out over another Night but the claimed array of power roles in this case is

frakking nonsensical

. How is it not obvious that, if we had two people who could confirm themselves to the game at large over several Nights, and a role who could protect those roles for almost forever unless scum were to spend three Nights killing them (and that's assuming, from a design perspective, that the claim comes out on Day 1), that would be broken beyond belief?

I let

plausible

claims live to shake themselves out. This setup isn't plausible, and the quickest way that it becomes plausible again is if Aj is lying about his role. As also mentioned, I think that he's behaving like scum Today anyway.

It is if the scum team have comparable counter roles as well as the fact that AJ has the role that gives town the most utility if true. Out of the claimed FN, I like sky's claim less than Worst - sky claimed day one where worst was outed, if AJ is telling the truth then sky was not likely protected but survived anyway and a read through sky's iso reads like garbage (or better a blank slate). Vee is not any better. With an open claim of FN, would scum try and claim FN as well? I doubt it. Then the recent interactions with titus look baaad.

VOTE: skybird

[FA_Q2]

I'm pretty sure Vedith just did something that made him jump to top scumread.
Which is also why i'm voting Vedith (This isn't a blind sheep)

You say this but do not point out what it is that makes him so scummy.

So far Vedith is being chaotic and rather dumb IMHO - that is not necessarily scummy. What about his actions help scum? All they seem to do is point out Vedith.

[FA_Q2]

15301519 – FA - you don’t think scum could fake counterclaim the first FN claim?

Of course they could. I never said they could not. However, I find it less likely as I dont see real gains. What do they gain other than cusory suspicion on the first FN. What do they lose? They possibly out 2 scum members as there will be suspicion on them as well. Scum claiming FN in the beginning is much more likely IMHO when they have no idea that an actual FN exists. It is not as though it is the most common role around - I believe this is my first exposure to it.

It has been pointed out though that they can target again. I think that is a much simpler way to 'check' them. If one is scum then they are going to out themselves over the long run or scum is going to have to hand over their entire team with fake messages. Ergo, a vote for any of them is not intelligent.

UNVOTE:

@titus
I understand that you do not ignore scum however why is it more intelligent to pursue the FN's as you are (by targeting Vee specifically because of the message) than look for the remaining scum team? For them to continue the ruse they are going to pretty obvious if they are scum.

Also - are we going to mass claim then? Talah already has and I will go next if this is something that we are behind. This may cause even more setup spec though and that has already essentially cornered this game.

[FA_Q2]

You say this but do not point out what it is that makes him so scummy.

If i could i would have done so

rather cryptic?

Is it against the rules to point it out? If yes I will not inquire further.

[FA_Q2]

@luna, since oyu are here:

What are your thoughts on IAI's request?

[FA_Q2]

Fuck it. Ill play along.

I have a role that can stop a kill. Lets see where this leads.

[FA_Q2]

FNs in my book are guilty

until proven innocent.

Second,

Skybird cannot be guilty

unless VeeGee also is guilty.

That's quite a contradoction there.

Seriously?

It is FACT that if sky is scum (therefore not an FN) then you MUST be lying about the message and ergo are scum. If you are town then it is presumed that you are telling the truth and FN is confirmed town. IOW, you flipping/being confirmed town would prove his innocence. The only way Titus' remark that you point out would not make complete sense with a town VeeGee is if you were actively playing against your wincon by lying about the message.

pedit: ninja'd

[FA_Q2]

So, what's the case IaI?

ditto.

[FA_Q2]

FA I will have a follow up question for u once the other 3 have chimed in.

I assumed as much.

I will be in and out on here for most of the day so I should be able to respond rather quickly.

[FA_Q2]

How? XD

You need to re read that I think, VeeGee.
Is Sky is guilty, then you are as well.

Same as if TheWorst is guilty, so is AJ...

It's simple.

No, she said that skybird CANNOT be guilty unless I am.

And that is true. If you don't understand then you really need to reexamine the situation.

[FA_Q2]

FNs in my book are guilty

until proven innocent.

Second,

Skybird cannot be guilty

unless VeeGee also is guilty.

That's quite a contradoction there.

Seriously?

It is FACT that if sky is scum (therefore not an FN) then you MUST be lying about the message and ergo are scum. If you are town then it is presumed that you are telling the truth and FN is confirmed town. IOW, you flipping/being confirmed town would prove his innocence. The only way Titus' remark that you point out would not make complete sense with a town VeeGee is if you were actively playing against your wincon by lying about the message.

pedit: ninja'd

So, tell me this.


What happens when I'm town, don't get it, and still playing to my wincon?

So you are trying to claim that you can play to your win-con as town by covering up a scum players lie?

Ummm, no.

That is enough trying to make you understand basic boolean logic though - it is no longer helping town. If you still do not understand then there is no point in continuing - it is willful.

[FA_Q2]

@Talah, You just went through great analysis on why to vote VeeGee while espousing a conclusion that cannot be true if VeeGee is town (namely AJ and the Worst are town).

This is a

factually incorrect statement

. Can you tell me what shadow-condition you're overlaying on top of actual facts to reach the conclusion that if VeeGee is town, AJ and Worst are scum?

Assuming Sky and The Worst are town, they'll have zero problem sending the message to someone other than themselves, AJ, TW, Talah, and Sam.

I'm not at all comfortable with you having any influence over who messages are sent to while you're presenting falsities as fact. This is what you did in Gundam - just slipping in bullshit statements here and there and not explaining them when challenged, but rather saying they were correct when they're obviously not. I'm not having that in this game so if you could kindly explain your position on the interdependencies between Skybird/VeeGee and AJ/Worst that would be appreciated.

Nope. If VeeGee is town, Worst and AJ are scum. The wiki requires FN messages to be the same. They claim different messages. So either they are in opposition, or there's a mod error.

Well I am not presenting falsaties as fact. So you can stop whining about the obvious.

We can't have the four send to each other in case of a circle jerk. Sal is scummy. You're too interested in control.

Thus my pool.

And they claimed that the PM was the same ergo your line of reasoning is blatantly incorrect. Considering it was veegee that had to clarify, there is no chance that a veegee town flip incriminates AJ and worst. This line of thought is so convoluted and is really stretching to force town PR's as a mislynch. Further, you are lining up your mislynches as well - veegee then onto AJ or Worst. This stinks to high heaven.

[FA_Q2]

Here I will prove it.

Mod: Are all friendly neighbor messages the same as required by the wiki.

That was never in question. What is in question is weather or not the claims were actually different. I got that they were precisely the same though veegee had to explain further after the paraphrase.

[FA_Q2]

Also, can we not lynch until after we get some actual information out of IAI's supposed plan. FAR to much has been revealed to scum to not get any information out of it for us.

[FA_Q2]

@ the whole luna/AJ thing -
I dont see what the big deal is. Both the points (eyesight and IC) are rather inane. "Secrete" IC is obviously a joke - there is no such thing there. The point of IC is that they are MOD confirmed. The eyesight is clearly not game related.

They both read as jokes and both should really be ignored.

Still here, yo. Catching up later today

And what has your catching up brought?

You have ignored IAI as well - don't.

[FA_Q2]

I guess it was more obvious to me then

[FA_Q2]

@IAI, I think we can rule out BP as FAQ would have CCed AJ.

This is not true.

Okay guess it can't hurt to ask the following to FA while we wait on the other 2:

FA, who did you target N1 with your ability. If BP is your ability and don't want to give it away, pick a random person not named IAI. If not BP, I need the exact target (don't need to clarify what the ability is tho)

I might as well full claim as there is going to be a lot of discussion on it.

I am a 2shot BP BG.

That is why I asked over and over again about sal's setup spec - he called out my ability right after AJ claimed. If you want to know why I did not claim earlier it is because, with these claimed abilities, I am virtually positive that scum has something like a 2 shot strongman. It is why I am suspicious of AJ as well and have been the entire time. I was going to cc AJ had he survived the night (as our 2 roles are almost impossible in my mind if scum do not have a strongman) but that is rather useless now. I targeted Talah last night. He has been my strongest town read all game.

[FA_Q2]

Well, your reaction to Salamence certainly looks like you're telling the truth.

If you'll just excuse me for one second, I'll just be in the corner, having my head explode. That makes AJ look about a billion times worse.

In a way, yes it does. I think that tallah had a valid point here though:

See... this is why I don't understand this rabid push on claims when there was no nightkill last night.
Let me fix it for you.
Scum has a Jailkeeper and a Strongman and two goons.
Town has the roles that claimed and one other weak investigative role.

Balanced yet? Or scum-sided now?
Also Molla's no slouch with the combined roles (thanks to I think Salamence who posted this Molla game he'd played in).

IAI had better have something useful.

[FA_Q2]

Possible explanations of mafia's NK dissapearing
They shot FAQ.
They shot talah
They shot me (if AJ is telling the truth)
They shot AJ.
Scum didn't NK.

See... the issue here is that there's 4 possible targets that would nullify the scum NK last night, that's almost half of all possible targets, you really think i should believe that scum had about a 4/13 (30%) chance of getting their night kill blocked if they shot randomly last night?

Of all these night kills that could've been stopped
Why would they shoot any of FAQ, talah, me, AJ over someone like Skybird. It doesn't make any sense, I participated in a town mislynch yesterday, AJ was decently scumread by a few, talah also lynched Zakk, and FAQ lynched Zakk AND is being scumread by a few.

That is only if you believe that AJ is telling the truth.

I doubt I was the target. I was one of the possible lynch candidates day one (though that was mostly due to AJ and if he is scum he might have wanted to avoid having to push that). I could see talah being the target - if this is the case I will not survive the night.

IAI's claim with the fact there were no kills leaves credence to the idea that both my and AJ's claim are possible but that still seems unlikely to me. If scum have powerful roles to counter towns PR's then we might have some serious problems as we are outed. I am not so sure I like IAI's claim though. The manner that he outed town's PR's does not add up to me. Being a vig, I don't see how that would have fingered scum reliably enough to ask for PR claims. He could have been role blocked. Talah could have been BP. He could have been protected (as that is what actually occurred). He could have commuted. He could have been jailed. The list goes on.

I think IAI was fishing for roles and he managed to get them. The more I think about this the worse I feel for claiming. I finally get a damn good role and now it is likely that I will not get to use much of it.

VOTE: IAmInnocent

Please explain what your actual plan was IAI because I really do not see why asking for our roles (and needing specifics rather than simply asking if anyone protected talah) is beneficial to town if you are a vig. It is also the ideal scum claim - scum kill anyway.

[FA_Q2]

If I get lynched, here's how I want the night actions played:

IaI, if you are vig, strike and kill one of veegee, Performer, Vedith or Sal. FA_Q2 protect Luna. No lenience on Fa_q2's protect. The next day, if IaI isn't proven vig, he dies and FA_Q2 follows. Otherwise, I'd like to see that pool of targets drained pretty fast

No. I will not be protecting who you point to. End of story. Don't bother asking again.

I am still leaning on you possibly being scum, why the hell would I allow you to direct my actions. Why the hell would I tell scum who to not target? Why the insistence on luna? You are making it really difficult not to lynch - everything you do is scummy.

[FA_Q2]

That's what I had suspected with your claim tbh. It's a meta stunt I pulled before myself. So I was really annoyed when you earlier said no possibility of lying town. Now, I can't be sure whether it's true or whether you're revising your claim to save yourself.

Why is the new claim better?

ONe of the things that gave me pause was the fact that I was a 2 shot BP as well. Those claims line up a lot. It is also why I suspect a strongman.

[FA_Q2]

No. I will not be protecting who you point to. End of story. Don't bother asking again.

If I'm lynched you better believe I expect you to follow that.

Fine. Lets test that theory scum.
VOTE: AJ

I still want an answer from you IAI. Spell out what you thought you were going to get.

[FA_Q2]

That vote is as forced as your claim.

Uh huh. It would be interesting to see how you twist my claim as forced.

[FA_Q2]

I think IAI was fishing for roles and he managed to get them. The more I think about this the worse I feel for claiming. I finally get a damn good role and now it is likely that I will not get to use much of it.

VOTE: IAmInnocent

Please explain what your actual plan was IAI because I really do not see why asking for our roles (and needing specifics rather than simply asking if anyone protected talah) is beneficial to town if you are a vig. It is also the ideal scum claim - scum kill anyway.

Okay now this is crap. I didn't ask for specifics. I asked if there were any protective power roles out there. I never asked specifically what they were. I SPECIFICALLY asked you:

Okay guess it can't hurt to ask the following to FA while we wait on the other 2:

FA, who did you target N1 with your ability. If BP is your ability and don't want to give it away, pick a random person not named IAI. If not BP, I need the exact target (don't need to clarify what the ability is tho)

That is as unspecific as I could get. All you had to do was say, I targeted Talah last night, and I would have outted my vig shot on him N1. You were the one who volunteered specifics, so don't put that on me. I did my best to keep this as vague as possible (any protective roles that would have prevented a kill N1, FA who did you target, etc).

Yes, as a matter of fact you did ask for specifics:

If everyone proceeds, I'll out my role and night information, which I believe will lead us to scum.

I really do need specifics on those, but if people want to start with yes or no, I'm fine to start there.

And yes, you did claim that I didn't need to give you much more. That really is not what my issue is though - the issue is that after I out my role we ended up learning nothing. I was having trouble even understanding how you think a failed vig shot would lead to a confirmed scum.

I'm only going to say this once, the job of any power role is to help town win. In almost all cases, the best use of a power role is to catch scum. If your role catches scum, it is almost always advantageous to trade 1 for 1 imo. You've done your job, end of story.

I was willing to do that. I thought I had scum Talah caught. As soon as he said, I have no night protective abilities (remember he was first to answer me), I thought surely a town protective role would have CC'd AJ already, so this is money in the bag. I will just wait for no one to claim protective role, then profit.

capisce?

And I would agree with the first part.

I can at least follow what you were thinking now (scum doc counter to your vig). I will need to think about this a little more. It does fit in well with what I have been seeing thus far though.

[FA_Q2]

Aj - revised his claim to 1-shot Bp Doc, after seeing Vig used a shot against tal. I could definitely see town using that 2-shot Bp as a gambit because as Doc, they don't want to die at night. Can't think of a scum reason in doing that claim revision.
FA - I have conflicting feelings because he’s been putting up town posts and doesn’t look like he’s working with AJ (voted AJ). But his claim about being nk resistant like Aj, is unreasonable as Bp Bg. That sounds like a balance upset to the 14-player game balance between scum and town.


-----

@mod please prod Vee, he's been missing for the longest time

That is only if you assume AJ is lying about his role and that Talah is not correct in that scum have equally useful roles to counter them.

AJ's scum motivation for revising his claim is easy - he needs to make his role more believable with all the claims and shed doubt on mine.

[FA_Q2]

@firebringer
So far, in the 2 days since you replaced in, you have yet to post a single post with content.

If we are lynching outside of the PR claims then fire would be my top pick thus far. I did not like sal all that much and fire is doing nothing to help that. Veegee is another nothing slot and I am not to keen on titus atm so I do not know how to take his push on veegee.

[FA_Q2]

Considering that Sala was town, that makes FB town. Just saying.
Plenty of time to catch up FB, so don't worry.

I'm sure that someone can give a run down of claims and results that have been said (I won't because I'm lazy).

Luna/Talah you 2 seem good at catch up posts, can you kindly?

That is your read.

I have read sala as scum for awhile now.

[FA_Q2]

Okay read FAQ and I have mixed feeligns on him completely, some parts scum some parts town.
When I read through a few things like stupid comments like the whole "You are only trying to perserve self" off one phone post by choo was just awful. Then their was whole "do they have day chat" nonsense. All that seems scummy trying to fake town.

Later stages FAQ actually looks like he is trying to scumhunt, but parts still feel ingenuine to me.

Anyways, his latest post was for basically a PL on me for not providing enough content.
>.>

So, yeah. Not positive on scum, don't think he is town though either. Town Lean Scum.

No, you are not a PL for content - you are a scum read for for your predecessor actively avoiding questions and his push on me that he never fully developed. Interactions with titus are also garbage - claiming that titus needed to be pressured and then avoiding doing so. When titus pushed back on him he, again, avoids addressing the issue.

Now you are spouting BS.

[FA_Q2]

I'll lyncsh Firebringer at the end of the day if we need to - the Banana/Salamence/Firebringer slot hasn't brought much of anything to the table - I just think my own scumreads are better than yours.

Also jut to get it down - what are you thinking about Vedith's pools from:

Spoiler:

Okay

FN's go to
CDB
Luna
Titus
FB
Performer

If any lynched from here then add FAQ

Vig to

Vedith
Talah
VeeGee

I think that this plan is good enough.

I'd suggest a minor revision that FAQ should be allowed to receive a message since he has BP on him and will probably live to confirm it if he's shot. That differs from AJ only in that AJ has already received a message. I don't really care that Performer's not in the vig pool as IaI won't consider it anyway, and I don't care if scum receive messages as they still have to confirm. The pool is narrow enough as it is.

I'm also going to specify directly to you FAQ: I don't want protection tonight, if you were thinking about it. If IaI decides to kill me he'll have to explain that later.
(although thank you for townreading me yesterday to the point of making a correct decision there )


==
Proposed Pools Revision 1.23984679823659869
==

FN targets

CDB
Luna
Titus
FB
Performer
FAQ

Vig targets

Vedith
Talah
VeeGee

I don't like the idea of making pools for the FN - it gives scum to much to work with - but in any event I do not belong there. I am a very likely target tonight IMHO from either a strongman or possibly both my BP protections have been used (if IAI is telling the truth and I managed to stop an NK last night).

The only thing that may give the scum team pause is my lynch means that scum AJ will likely follow after my flip.

I will settle for fire if AJ is simply not going to be possible (and that looks likely). IAI just does not seem to be in the running and I am not sure why there is so much resistance there. With the claims as they are, I can see this being an issue tomorrow.

[FA_Q2]

At this point i just want this day to end... im getting bored.

That does seem to be the case with the majority of the players at this point.

IAI, TheWorst - put your votes somewhere else. Right now they are achieving nothing whatsoever. There are 3 counter wagons - you 2 need to put your votes on one of them so that we can coalesce around 2 candidates rather than 4.

[FA_Q2]

I almost asked your timezone and forgot u live in the same 1 lol

Off Topic but could not resist:

Oh no - you do not want to bring politics in here - You have no idea where a few of the players here have come from

[FA_Q2]

I like the fire lynch better than the Veegee though not a particular fan of either.

Why did you move over titus?
VOTE: firebringer

[FA_Q2]

Dang it.

Everyone should unvote Firebringer and vote whomever.

Aren't 3 of the Firebringer voters scummy lurksacks anyway?

Why?

Is there something that you wish to point out that makes fire town?

[FA_Q2]

I have voiced the fact that I want to lynch AJ as well and would be glad to move back there but that is another place that town is simply unwilling to go at this point even though it seems so many are scum reading AJ.

[FA_Q2]

Vedith or Performer if we're lynching non-PRs.

Wait, since when was I non PR?
Show me the post where it states this please.

Meh - it is a reasonable assumption based on the fact that so many have claimed. If you are a PR then everyone might as well be a PR, weeeee

[FA_Q2]

Well, this is shit.

Who did you send your message to worst? I know I am going to be in the cross hairs today because of my claim but I am town and my claim is true. There really is not going to be much else to say on that note.

[FA_Q2]

IaI claimed vig. No counter claim, and not killed.
This means that he is not Mafia as there were 2 kills.
However, it doesn't confirm as town.

TheWorst messages AJ N1 - AJ said that he was FN, AJ died and flipped town. Lying about that would not have happened as town.

But thanks for not realising and hoping to push TheWorst as the lying FN.
I would say that means that at least the majority of the scum wouldn't have expected TheWorst to be clear over Skybird.
That gives me 3 primes scum suspects.

Who are...

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: firebringer

Titus is right - the last second change over was pretty bad.

[FA_Q2]

Well, this is shit.

Who did you send your message to worst? I know I am going to be in the cross hairs today because of my claim but I am town and my claim is true. There really is not going to be much else to say on that note.

Who did you protect on n2??

IaI

Seemed like the only possibility given the PR's at play.

[FA_Q2]

Titus, I am blaming you for this game if you are town.

Why not blame ME instead

Perhaps because titus is driving town. Quite dangerous if she is actually scum...

[FA_Q2]

vote firebringer

L-1 people.

At this point the only person I'd rather lynch more is DGB, but I'm content to use a vig shot in that direction as well.

Shame on you, are you buying Titus' BS too?

Which parts do you agree with?

I want to you commit to some of the idiocy you appear to agree with.

Really, his case makes sense and has since you changed the wagon over yesterday from FB over to the town doc. You have yet to point out the actual flaws with the argument and simply insist that FB is town because you said so.

What is incredibly weak is your reasoning up to this point. FB should have been lynched a long time ago. All I get from you is that you think titus is scum and that is about it. Are you still thinking IaI is scum as well?

That argument no longer makes any sense. What are your alternatives other than Titus - a lynch that apparently is not happening right now.

[FA_Q2]

What are your alternatives other than Titus - a lynch that apparently is not happening right now.

VOTE: FA_Q2

Does that answer your question?

Not really. Your vote is nothing short of OMGUS. I notice that it lacked any reasoning other than you don't like the fact I addressed you or voted fire.

And you have the gall to call titus reasoning shitty. I guess since you managed to push town into lynching their BP Doc yesterday you think that you can push town into lynching their BPBG today. Good luck with that.

[FA_Q2]

What are your alternatives other than Titus - a lynch that apparently is not happening right now.

VOTE: FA_Q2

Does that answer your question?

Not really. Your vote is nothing short of OMGUS. I notice that it lacked any reasoning other than you don't like the fact I addressed you or voted fire.

And you have the gall to call titus reasoning shitty. I guess since you managed to push town into lynching their BP Doc yesterday you think that you can push town into lynching their BPBG today. Good luck with that.

You seem to know I am town.

I have a scum read on you so I dont know where you get that idea.

My statements were pretty easy to understand - methinks you are trying really hard to pull something out of them that simply is not there.

[FA_Q2]

lol. Speak for yourself. Anyway, this exchange is getting nowhere and you are simply fluff posting. Make a point or I will not bother responding.

[FA_Q2]

Their bp doc?

Yes - towns BP Doc. Read the statements I made AND the tense that they were in.

He drove TOWN to lynch THEIR doc. That should not be difficult to understand. You are digging for slips that are not there.

[FA_Q2]

Ok so
Im not sure Mafia Vig is considered Normal, so i'll put that on the back burner for now, granted there's 3 possibilities for IaI's role: Town Vigilante, Serial Killer, Werewolf (or some other faction name, but for the sake of simplicity i'll call them werewolves). This puts us at 3 possibilities, 4 townies are dead

6-2-2
6-3-1
7-3

Going with either of the first 2 and being wrong today means we likely lose unless scum cross kills. Even in the later one mislynch + misvig = 4-3 which is LyLo.
BUT if IaI is NOT town and it's one of the first 2, this would put us at 3-2-2 or 3-3-1, in which case town doesnt really control the lynch anymore.
Given this i rather take the risk and lynch IaI which would give us more breathing room and would have a 66% chance of netting scum, and also would make the secondary kill dissapear on 66% of the cases.

On other news FAQ is as much as confirmed town unless this is multiball (and they are both werewolves) so if IaI flips anything but werewolf FAQ would become confirmed town, which gives me even more reason to want to lynch IaI.
Reasoning being FAQ is proven to have protected a townie unless both FAQ and IaI are lying as brought up by Titus previously, and the only way this would happen is if they are a separate mafia faction. On top of that if IaI doesnt flip werewolf FAQ is (possibly?) proven to still have a 1-shot BP which is a great boon for someone that's about to be conf town since scum cant easily kill them and on top of that can interfere with their kill.

--On another note--

I also disagree scum doesn't Bus D1, i came out of a game where scum literally cross bused each other (12p open 3 scum) on Day 1.

VOTE: IaI

If those were the case, why would IaI claim?

I don't think it makes any sense that IaI would claim vig as a third party or a second faction. Normally it would be to flush out PR's but we already had a protective PR out there.

[FA_Q2]

The math would be we lose. What is your point?

[FA_Q2]

You do realize I am already on fire, right?

[FA_Q2]

The math would be we lose. What is your point?

Type it out please. I'm drunk.

Well, so far those that are left alive are:

Performer
Titus
TheWorst
ChannelDelibird
Vedith
Luna Fox
I Am Innocent
FA_Q2
Firebringer
DrippingGoofball

If we take out the three you suggest:
Performer
TheWorst
ChannelDelibird
Vedith
Luna Fox
I Am Innocent
FA_Q2

That leaves 7. If there is a 3 man scum team we would have one more day. I am not totally confident that there are 3 scum though - we have some epic PR roles and it does not appear that scum have a RB and we really do not know about a strongman. We are back to setup spec again with that though and that worked out terribly last time around. Again, what is your point with this?

[FA_Q2]

Their bp doc?

Yes - towns BP Doc. Read the statements I made AND the tense that they were in.

He drove TOWN to lynch THEIR doc. That should not be difficult to understand. You are digging for slips that are not there.

How do you feel now about Titus's crap "cases" after that "scumslip" of yours?

Titus case against you has nothing to do with titus at all and everything to do with basic logic. Why would this change the case already made against you?

Then add in the craptastic response you had when I made a comment as well as the immediate OMGUS and you really don't have a whole lot of room to talk.

[FA_Q2]

How many scum do you guys think was on that AJ wagon?

I'm willing to bet at least one, maybe two.

Well, DGB and FB were there so....

[FA_Q2]

But if this were multiball, don't u think scum would shoot me if I was faking a town vig claim?

Why? Wouldn't it be better for scum to let you help them diminish town numbers before shooting you?

Sometimes it works out that way, but scum always lives in fear of vig shots.

Which is why I don't like this.

Yeah lynch FB, shoot DGB. That's it.

Stop trying to chain the vigi titus - that is scummy as shit.

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: Titus
At this point I am just not going to lynch:
Vedith or DGB.

Everyone else is terribad.

Very townie of you - town is the one person that is defending you. Virtually everyone else must be scum. You are not even bothering to scum hunt and you wonder why everyone is scum reading you.

[FA_Q2]

We will see when you flip. Our vig can take care of it if you really are town.

[FA_Q2]

DGB-Can’t seeing being scum. Too much attention and I am the only one really defending her, also no one is readily agreeing with her reads or assumptions. Usually at least one scum buddy at least agrees with you on something. If she is scum her teammates are really pushing her for town cred I guess or create distance. Town

Luna Fox-I am unsure with some of Luna thoughts, like she questions me. Her hammer on me was stupid town move, so theres that. I can see some of the things she has done being manipulative or opportunistic but yeah. Unlikely Scum.

Vedith-Ohh my god if Vedith is scum I am going to be so mad. This seems like regular town vedith. His indecisiveness and fence sitting though that reads heavily into scum categories with me. I have learned never to trust my reads on Vedith though. If I had to bet, I would say he has a 50-50 on scum. I really doubt it though. Town

I Am Innocent-Either Vigi or SK trying to take credit for kills. Why are we allowing this person alive? He is going to shoot DGB and if DGB is town this game is fricking over. I swear, I got lynched for stupid reasons. Scum.

Titus-Some things titus does like her fricking tunneling and unwillingness to listen to any reasons say scum. My gut says town though. So I am going with that. Town.

FA_Q2-I think FA_Q2 doesn’t really care who we lynch, they just want non town powers lynched for what I assume is to NK. I am leaning scum.

Pignash-The slot is completely null, I don’t like their catchup or reads. Scum, but only from process of elimination. Scum

TheWorst-The guy is just like I know him from being town. Kind of seems to think he knows what he is doing but doesn’t. Town but could be scum. Small Town Lean.


Now watch as you use none of these thoughts for future scumhunting. GL town, you probably already lost though ;(

You must be playing a different game. You are scum reading confirmed town. And you wonder why we all scum read you up one side and down another. Town could not have posted this list.

[FA_Q2]

So you wanted to divert to the vig?....

And you speed hammer before FB has last reads?

I already explained why i preferred the vig in 2943, then i just didnt know where to go, and the game seemed a bit stagnant, i hope DGB gets "vigged" tonight if FB flips town.

If FB flips town then DGB is less likely to be scum IMHO. His big push was to save FB when he would have been a really easy lynch to jump on board with. When FB flips scum that really looks bad on DGB.

[FA_Q2]

@FAQ, Strongly disagree. If FA is town, DGB is doubly confscum. DGB would have voted FA or lurked rather than starting a new AJ wagon.

?

I am confused. Explain please.

[FA_Q2]

So, Vedith, from now on you're the only player that I will address.

Don't do that...

I am town, and vanilla. It's as if you've seen my role PM.

Now, IAI claims to have targeted me.
There are some possibilities:
(1) he was bodyguarded
(2) I was bodyguarded (though very unlikely)
(3) maybe he was actually RB'd by scum (though with him and Titus clamoring for my NK, that would be highly unlikely)
(3) he is lying. Maybe he is one-shot, maybe 2-shot, maybe he used a shot on the BP bodyguard, and is pretending that he shot me and failed instead.

What I find most damning is Titus' post at the day's opening. She pretty much "predicted" what IAI was going to say, and frames it as only one possible explanation:
In post 3065, Titus wrote:
Pretty much confirmed by IaI being let go with his intent to shoot Talah but blocked when shooting DGB. (Supposition here that IaI didn't no kill).


The bit about "let do with his intent to shoot talah" is interesting. Maybe IAI is a has a strongman shot? Why didn't the bodyguard protect talah? I guess in his mind it could be protecting a player against a vig shot, but still... The FN wasn't protected either. So, who did the bodyguard, bodyguard?

Do I have the BG role wrong here? If he was bodyguarded, why would that stop a kill?
Given that it is possible that he is scum, I still think highly unlikely. Lying? Possible, as SK would be fitting. Personally I like him for town as it stands.

Talah said not to be protected. But yeah, lets find out who the BG was on and why.
If he isn't the BG, then IaI is not scum at all for me, the only reason that would have that role is if we really have 2 BP protecting roles.

So for me IaI and FA are not both of the same align.

I was on IaI as I stated in the beginning of the last day. First night I guarded Tallah.

[FA_Q2]

Can't you wait for the BG to declare his target?

Sure i can wait for that
UNVOTE:
I'm not gonna vote who you want me to vote i'll just keep my vote nowhere in the meantime.

I have guarded IaI for the last 2 nights.

[FA_Q2]

Can't you notice Titus's shit cases yesterday, setting up some false dilemma that one of Firebringer and I had to be scum so that she could line up the other one for the next day's lynch?

While i can see this as a good point for scum Titus, that doesn't explain IaI's proven to be a Vig or SK, is Mafia Vig normal?
What im bothered about is FAQ not protecting the FN, and i doubt he protected you when he was agreeing with Titus yesterday (I think?) about FB scum and possibly you scum, disagree? I'll still wait for his answer but im not sure if it'll change my PoV.

It is an interesting theory of a mafia vig. It does fit considering all the PR roles that were in play. If that was the case though, where did the night kill go? It does not make any sense to have targeted me (and waste a shot on my vest) and if he was mafia then he certainly was not the target of that missing kill.

I think that is the largest problem with that theory.

@vedith - you claim that you don't think me and IaI share alignments. If that is the case and you think he is town then you, by extension, think I am scum. Correct?

[FA_Q2]

Pretending? What the actual fuck? I am currently reading through Vediths and looking for something conclusive. But I don't think anything is going to compare to you and him berating me once I put my vote on you.

I am done for the day. I don't need the personal attacks. I will unvote for the time being on the off chance you're just mean spirited and not scum.

UNVOTE:

....

This timing is bad.

[FA_Q2]

Unless he was bodyguarded, which is weird given that the Friendly Neighbor was left unprotected, he is lying outright about targeting me.

No, Titus claimed RB the moment she said he was blocked...

Considering that titus has essentially run town thus far and we have whiffed every time, I am willing to go here. Town needs a new strategy as the last one has brought us to lylo without taking out a single scum.

[FA_Q2]

^ IaI claims to have shot tallah night one as well. The claim comes after I announced I protected Tallah.

I protected the vig because we either need to deal with that threat or I will assume the PR is as it is claimed and protect it. Vig represents the largest threat to scum. If town refuses to lynch that slot then I protect it.

[FA_Q2]

I got TW's message N3. Is there a gap?

I want to say DGB Vedith FAQ.

IAI you were obvious where your shot was going to shoot. Didn't take a rocket scientist

Only because you have been pushing to chain him as much as possible.

I really do not see a town motivation for that.

[FA_Q2]

It's much more plausible there's a scum blocker than IAI being a mafia vig.

With how day one played out, I don't think so.

VOTE: titus

Stop being a dunce dgb - if you really are town then there is no reason for you to self hammer. That is a dumb thing to do.

[FA_Q2]

mafia doc.

I am town, I wasn't mafia-doc'ed so... WTF is going on???

You are either scum or IaI is. That really is the only possibility here that I can see.

[FA_Q2]

very sad.

Had IaI at the end but no one wanted to go there and mistakenly thought titus was with you so that it was an acceptable compromise.

Very nice job scum team - a mafia vig was just not something I about until it was far to late. God this game was aggravating.