Mini 508- Trouble in New Catania-Game Over

[The Fonz]

Deadline currently stands for two weeks today.

[LoudmouthLee]

If it is, this is a supremely bad time to use it. It seems that that bussing technique (and most others) rests on the scum you are giving up being much more suspicious than you. Since Lowell is much more suspicious than either of them it doesn't really help. Also, this early in the game a myslynch & a scum lynch packaged doesn't really help the town.

Yes and no, in my opinion. This fully lends itself to the fact that the town is more likely to believe someone who has correly found scum. If you're scum and you successfully lead a bus on a mafia member, you get "brownie points" with the rest of the town.

@Sadist - Aren't you more likely to believe someone who has given the town scum rather than someone who hasn't given the town scum?

I see Lowell's play as trapped scum who is trying to bus his partner to gain favor with the town. It would be very foolish to name two parners, but I firmly believe that Lowell is scum and one of the other two people he named is scum as well. I am leaning much more towards Streeflo (as that is where his vote is, currently)

Mod, we'e had quite a vew vote changes, could we have a new and imporved VC? thanks!

[The Fonz]

Votecount 4: In partnership with WNCT, the East Coast's only all swing music and mafia news station!

Lowell 5 (rite, Happiest Sadist, kuribo, BrianMcQueso, LoudMouthLee)
LoudMouthLee 1 (Someone2)
Streeflo 1 (Lowell)

Not voting: death_omen, Streeflo, Beastly, Rishi, Claus

[Rishi]

Wow. I had no idea that Lowell was so close to a lynch.

[kuribo]

I firmly believe that Lowell is scum and one of the other two people he named is scum as well.

Personally, his "naming" me comes across as OMGUS to me, but then again, I'm biased.

If one were to take his word that I'm scum, one would also have to assume that I was bussing him first, for no apparent reason.

[Happiest Sadist]

Everyone needs to be careful about this discussion we are having now. We have not lynched

Lowell

and are still unsure of if he is scum.

LML

brought up bussing, and although this is a good topic to discuss it can wait until tomorrow if we lynch

Lowell

. Bringing it up now can switch our debate from "Is

Lowell

scum?" to "Given that

Lowell

is scum, what does his behavior mean?"

If we continue to argue on the second question it makes

Lowell

look more and more scummy while producing no new evidence against him. Because of this, switching the debate in this way can be a very effective scum tactic. It can cause a mislynch while keeping the scum at arm's length from the action or even allowing them to defend the person they doomed.

Because of that, I suggest that we stop discussing what

Lowell's

behavior means assuming he is scum until tomorrow and get back to the relevant question concerning him. "Is

Lowell

scum?"

[LoudmouthLee]

I can only speak for myself, HS, but would it be a lot to ask for for you to use bold a little more sparingly? I have a hard time reading your posts, as the boldness detracts from my line of sight.

I will respond to your points later.

[Rishi]

I can only speak for myself, HS, but would it be a lot to ask for for you to use bold a little more sparingly? I have a hard time reading your posts, as the boldness detracts from my line of sight.

QFT.

[Claus]

Mod

I would like to ask for a replacement. I have to remove myself from Mafia Scum from an indeterminate amount of time.

To everyone, I'm really sorry about this. If there is anything I can do to help hunting for replacements (posting to specific threads or the like), please PM me.

For closure, I'll make a brief analysis of each player, as I had promised that last post.

[Claus]

Analysis of each player by (mostly) reading their posts individually:

Beastly - Seems to have put genuine effort in his last analysis post. The only think that strikes me is that he didn't come up with any conclusion from that post - if he fixes it up by next post, and keeps up with similar efforts, I'd feel safe about him.

BMQ - I liked his first two posts (including the vote on me, wowzers!), but his latest posts have left me wanting. He is not aggresive as LML is aggressive. He took the time to explain his vote on me, and now is just pointing out who he thinks is scummy without explaining. Don't like. And he deserves a prod as well.

Death Omen - Don't like. Posts 3rd silent vote on rite during random phase. Points out that FoSes are flying around, but just FoS himself. "Don't get why someone2 is not defending when he is close to a lynch" - he's not close. FoSes beastly for not posting his analysis - not fair when he himself is not posting any analysis either. Seems like lurking in plain sight.

Happiest Sadist - I'm not sure of him either way. His point about discussing the bus Vs. discussing Lowell is interesting, but I disagree partially. Discussing the bus obv. makes the assumption that lowell is scum, but switching the discussion to lowell seems to make the assumption bigger. I think more productive would be to see closely other people's reason to vote, or not to vote Lowell. Anyway - neutral list.

kuribo - Don't like him, has been making mountains out of molehills on his accusations of me, and his first accusations of Lowell.

LML - His style seems consistently aggressive. I'm neutral, slightly positive towards him.

Lowell - Don't like. He is refusing to answer questions AND refusing to explain his accusations. I can see arrogant town doing either of those, but doing both is pushing it.

Rishi - Aside from his suspicions on LML, he has been lurking in plain sight as well. Lots of posts, low content - neutral-bad list.

Rite - few posts, but give me a pro-town feeling overall. I liked his last two posts. Good list. Deserves a prod, also.

Someone2 - Although I'm not a fan of his posts, or reasonings, I'm starting to think that this is his best effort play. His answers to my post and to Death Omen's seem reasonable. I'd put him on the neutral list and keep an eye on him for consistency.

Streeflo - Don't like. Voted someone2 using someone else's reasoning. Seems too timid, too defensive.

------------
Sum Up (as of this post)

Nice List:
rite
Happiest Sadist
Beastly

Neutral list:
LML
Someone2
Rishi
Death Omen

Naughty List:
Streeflo
Lowell
Kuribo
BMQ

I'll leave votes and FOSes for my successor - which might disagree with me anyway. Thanks for the game.

[The Fonz]

Deadline lifted whilst I search for a replacement.

[Happiest Sadist]

Sorry about the excessive bolding. I will cut back in the future. I was unsure on the protocol. Rather than bolding I all names I will only bold FOS's, votes and other 'keyworded' terms.

[rite]

I don't have to be prodded, I'm right here, I promise.

Unfortunately, I haven't had much to say since my last argument against Lowell that he hasn't made plain enough in his posts. The day has to end in a lynch, and unless someone's acting scummier than Lowell, which seems highly unlikely at this point, I feel like we should be bandwagoning (and ultimately lynching) him.

If he turns out to be town, I'll go on the record as saying he's one of the crappiest and most suspicious town players I've ever seen.

[someone2]

I'm back from my little vacation.

After a quick reread of the last pages, Lowell is the one who is the most scummy to my eyes, like nearly everyone do. Here are my thoughts about his posts.

Post 9: Random vote... nothing more to say

Post 51: Receive a prod, and say Tell me if something interesting happens. This sentence is like Tell me when someone seems scummy and I'll put a vote on him.

Post 52: I explained why I find this post scummy in my post 58. Also, he said that the suspicion on Claus is retarded.

Post 54: Scummy as hell, pass by a question with irony and throw a not explained accusation on Streeflo.

Post 70: Says that it is better to vote than to FOS and repeats what he said in post 52 about the retarded accusations on Claus when he is no more suspected at this point of the game.

Post 71: Seems to try to reject the possible accusations he could get from his last post for over-protection of Claus. Also scummy.

Post 91: Again talking about Claus when all the suspicions are around him.

All of his posts seems scummy, and between 'em he is lurking. He is so scummy that I have no choice to put him to lynch -1

unvote: LML
vote: Lowell

[rite]

Here's the point where someone says "give him another chance to defend himself before anyone puts the last nail in the coffin."

In fact, I think I'll take that duty.

[death_omen]

Here's the point where someone says "give him another chance to defend himself before anyone puts the last nail in the coffin."

In fact, I think I'll take that duty.

I would have actually been the one to say that but I think hes had enough chances. In his last post he stated that when someone actually gave a good reason that was for him being scum he would actually

respond

but its been over 72 hours since he last posted.. So my only conclusion is that he is either inactive or has not come up with a counter arugement sufficent enough for this situation .

[Lowell]

Well I'll feel bad if I die without giving my thoughts on each player. After a quick reread, here's my BRIEF synopsis of the game so far.

p1&2
-claus refuses to random vote
-stree votes and chides him for it
-LML calls that interation "interesting" post 15 (Disagree... mostly uninteresting)
-someone2 makes inside jokes with stree
-23 claus votes LML, says wants to start bandwagon
-24 rite hops off "bandwagon" (overly cautious, only 3 votes)
-31 kuribo out of nowhere chides claus for attempting bandwagon, doesn't vote (this is either waaaay cautious or just plain scummy. "Bandwagon" had exactly TWO votes)
-32 Beastly makes a point about kuribo... why does he care about this 2-person bandwagon?? Is there connection between he and rite? (agreed)

p3
-Lowell accuses Kuribo and stree for whatever reason
-FOSs start piling up: BMQ 56, someone2 58, LML 59, rite votes Lowell 57
-someone2 votes LML for lynch-talk (either crazily conservative [only 2 votes on me] or scummy)
-death omen points out how odd FOSs are (agreed, only 2 votes on me)

p4
-75 rite now decides Lowell looks scummy (looks bad, he was ALREADY voting me, looks like he's just trying to "sell" the case on me more now that others have expressed similar thoughts but have been noncommital)
-77 meaningless post by Happy accusing Lowell, but doesn't vote (looks bad due to timing, as if he's trying to fit in)
-80 kuribo votes Lowell (looks like he's trying to drive the lynch here, for the first time. Something about the post had a feeling of finality to it. Again, this strikes me as opportunistic, given others misgivings about my behavior)
-87 BMQ votes Lowell
-94 LML votes Lowell
-113 someone2 votes Lowell (scummy as hell. this is the same guy who two pages ago jumped all over LML for "ynch-talk when I had ONLY TWO VOTES. He doesn't offer much to explain why the dramatic change from attacking early bandwagoners to now putting the Lynch -1 vote. He just says it's "necessary")

Here's more specific thoughts on a few players:

Claus

is TOWN. I hope you all find that amusing. He pointed out something about BMQ that everyone else missed, that I think scum would not have bothered to do.

Stree

is Town.

unvote

. His general behavior has been decent, and I no longer blame him for the original "chummy" jokes flying around this thread.

vote someone2

. I don't like his behavior one bit. He led off by trying to buddy up to stree, then attacked an early bandwagoner on me (when it was cool to do so), then JUMPED on the bandwagon later (when it was cool to do so).

I also have reservations about

kuribo

,

happy

, and

LML

. Kuribo seems to have a bit of the "be conservative, be popular" bug, happy has been opportunisitc with the timing and tone of his posts, and LML generally strikes me as a conservative player pretending to be aggressive.

That's all. Now unvote me.

[LoudmouthLee]

I also have reservations about kuribo, happy, and LML. Kuribo seems to have a bit of the "be conservative, be popular" bug, happy has been opportunisitc with the timing and tone of his posts, and LML generally strikes me as a conservative player pretending to be aggressive.

Never, have I ever, been conservative. Do your research before you make unsubstanciated claims.

Vote stands.

[Lowell]

I also have reservations about kuribo, happy, and LML. Kuribo seems to have a bit of the "be conservative, be popular" bug, happy has been opportunisitc with the timing and tone of his posts, and LML generally strikes me as a conservative player pretending to be aggressive.

Never, have I ever, been conservative. Do your research before you make unsubstanciated claims.

Vote stands.

Do my research?? Really? That's an argument?

Also, "I'm always this way, therefore..." arguments don't impress me.

[The Fonz]

CrashTextDummie replaces Claus.

[CrashTextDummie]

That would be me.

[kuribo]

Wait, Lowell, in one post you've accused me of being too aggressive against BMQ and against Claus, and then you say I'm playing it conservative? Which is it?

Why is it that the case against Claus is "retarded?" You've never given any reasoning for your line of thinking.

You question LML's argument, but you've never given any of your own.

Ending your post with "Now unvote me," isn't any more convincing.

[someone2]

-someone2 votes LML for lynch-talk (either crazily conservative [only 2 votes on me] or scummy)

113 someone2 votes Lowell (scummy as hell. this is the same guy who two pages ago jumped all over LML for "ynch-talk when I had ONLY TWO VOTES. He doesn't offer much to explain why the dramatic change from attacking early bandwagoners to now putting the Lynch -1 vote. He just says it's "necessary")

vote someone2. I don't like his behavior one bit. He led off by trying to buddy up to stree, then attacked an early bandwagoner on me (when it was cool to do so), then JUMPED on the bandwagon later (when it was cool to do so).

I think you didn't understand why I voted LML before. It wasn't because he talked about lynching YOU, but when he talked about lynching ME when I putted a FOS on you, even if your behaviour seemed much more scummy to my eyes than my lil' FOS that should have be to LML eyes a vote.

I would have actually been the one to say that but I think hes had enough chances. In his last post he stated that when someone actually gave a good reason that was for him being scum he would actually respond but its been over 72 hours since he last posted.. So my only conclusion is that he is either inactive or has not come up with a counter arugement sufficent enough for this situation .

Pretty strange post, you say that you would hammer Lowell, but you don't do it? Is it because you don't want to be blamed and accused if he turns up town or is it because it is you scumbuddy?

FOS: Death Omen

Welcome CrashTextDummie

[Streeflo]

Y

Stree

is Town.

unvote

. His general behavior has been decent, and I no longer blame him for the original "chummy" jokes flying around this thread.

You say that I am town. While it is conceivable you have stopped blaming me for my chummy jokes, I find it hard to imagine that you think I am town.

You say my general behavior has been decent, but I don't think I've posted nearly enough to get a good read on yet.

[death_omen]

Incorrect someone2, I never stated that I

was

going to hammer Lowell, in actual fact all i actually said that was he had had enough chances already to defend himself but he never really did.

In the end I was left feeling confused so I decided to give him another chance instead of hammering him.

At the moment however I am 60/40 against Lowell

What do the rest of you guys think about Lowell and whether or not he should be todays lynch?