Open 778: Nightless Vanilla [Game Over!]

[Alisae]

if you understand the game more then I do, then that should be easy for you, right?

[Alisae]

if you understand the game more then I do, then that should be easy for you, right?

[Alisae]

lynching someone you think is townie when you have other lynchable scumreads is not natural town behavior, bro. surely you would use that allowance for a mislynch on people you think is scum in case you're wrong, right? that's the town mindset because you never know if you'll be right. i see no way town!you would think it's okay to lynch town at around less than 24 hours after deadline without squeezing more out of your scumreads.

instead scum!you would take that opportunity to eliminate ABR because you're widely scumread anyway, and you're willing to take out ABR on your way out.

self-vote, bro.

Are you telling me to selfvote because you know that you actually just have nothing valid on me?

--

Because what flip discredits me more and makes me more lynchable
Cycle Men scumflip, or your townflip?

So you are saying me and Monkey had magical knowledge that you would defend Cycle men the way you did and 'planned' it all out the way you're imagining it? Lmao get outta here.

No I am saying that I interacted with Cycle Men when I came out on a townread on him and defended him and you and Monkey reacted to that.

[Alisae]

By the time I was pushing Elements, that was definitely a strategy you can do.

[Alisae]

like when you tell someone to self-vote, you are so delusional that you think you can convince the person you are trying to lynch that they are scum.
You think I am actually just going to listen to you?

ofc not, thats not even you being over confident town because you have

nothing

on me.
You basically just said "thats not town mentality thats scum mentality"
Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

[Alisae]

I knew if I hammered ABR lie how I did I would be suss’d out for it.

By being straight unlucky with defending Cycle Men and them flipping scum, I knew that in this game scum in this game would want to make it known that I am likely to be associated with Cycle Men.
All I needed to do was perform an action that scum will want to jump to like dogs to a bone and now I am the lynchbait of the game. At that point scum don’t even need to try to lynch me, they just go on auto pilot and push the scummy things I’m doing because its easy to point at me defending Cycle Men and me hammering ABR and say “these are scum indicative things this person is obvscum.”
It’s also at this point in the game where because you are so far in autopilot mode that you make mistakes and start to play sloppily.

With ur push you are not even trying to think about the game.
You are telling me to self-vote and describing me as obvscum.

What town REALLY does here, is they pause when they hear me say “Yeah, I kinda had a townread on ABR and I hammered him anyways because we have the mislynches to spare” because of how absurd that statement actually is.

Instead, you saw that statement, commented about how absurd it was, and continued to push the narative that I’m obvscum

[Alisae]

Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

So you being scum is fact?

no?

[Alisae]

Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

So you being scum is fact?

no?

Monkey is using that to push me because its ironclad and sounds good. This is exactly what they want, they want a stance that they feel like looks good and feels like is strong.
What town want is to be right and have correct reads.
Monkey’s read on me does not look like he wants to be correct, but instead is a stance he feels like looks good and is ironclad

[Alisae]

like when you tell someone to self-vote, you are so delusional that you think you can convince the person you are trying to lynch that they are scum.
You think I am actually just going to listen to you?

ofc not, thats not even you being over confident town because you have

nothing

on me.
You basically just said "thats not town mentality thats scum mentality"
Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

this post gave me dysentery

notice how Monkey is just saying “look at these bad posts!” Instead of trying to explain why the posts are bad.

[Alisae]

anyone out there think alisae will flip town?

I've been asking for reasons why Ali is scum and nobody answers me. I've tried sorting her in the thread and nobody touches it.

Thats because all of the scumreads on me are actually just bullshit

[Alisae]

I can tell you more about that GC but thats part of what I’m trying to demonstrate here.

[Alisae]

like when you tell someone to self-vote, you are so delusional that you think you can convince the person you are trying to lynch that they are scum.
You think I am actually just going to listen to you?

ofc not, thats not even you being over confident town because you have

nothing

on me.
You basically just said "thats not town mentality thats scum mentality"
Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

this post gave me dysentery

notice how Monkey is just saying “look at these bad posts!” Instead of trying to explain why the posts are bad.

that's scummy why?

because its easier to say “POST BAD ALI SCUM” then actually explain why the post is bad.

[Alisae]

I think you’re probably town and I think we just need to lynch Monkey, Deimos, Votato, and Norwee.

I'm confused on how you came down to 3/4 of these players, who I thought you were null or town reading until rn.

the short answer is I think {Firebringer, Isis, Elements, GC, Looker} contain 0 scum and Monkey and Norwee don’t have a natural read on me. Votato and Deimos I don’t care which one is scum because if Monkey and Norwee are both scum then we can lynch both of them in no particular order and the game just ends unless I’m lynched today because one of {Firebringer, Isis, GC, Looker} voted me, which would mean that one of them has the higher chance of being scum.

[Alisae]

like when you tell someone to self-vote, you are so delusional that you think you can convince the person you are trying to lynch that they are scum.
You think I am actually just going to listen to you?

ofc not, thats not even you being over confident town because you have

nothing

on me.
You basically just said "thats not town mentality thats scum mentality"
Because right now you are not pushing a read.
You are pushing a fact.

this post gave me dysentery

notice how Monkey is just saying “look at these bad posts!” Instead of trying to explain why the posts are bad.

that's scummy why?

because its easier to say “POST BAD ALI SCUM” then actually explain why the post is bad.

You're not pushing a read, you're pushing a fact!

HAHAHAHAHA

I cannot wait to see you come to terms with the fact that I am not lynchable and you don’t have the votes.

[Alisae]

Yeah I'm playing to my strengths as a player, which I believe to be catching scum when they're being sloppy and making mistakes.
Whats your issue with it?

[Alisae]

Like, I am lynchbait within the context of this game given the current circumstances. Scum will invest ALL of their resources to kill me because I am just that easy to lynch.
I recognize I am lynchbait, so I am trying to get people to elaborate on their reads on me and hold them accountable for bullshit.

[Alisae]

Like, this is just how I view the game.
I know that I thrive when players start to slip up and play badly or just be scum.
I am a late game hypercarry because of this playstyle.
My early game is actually just terrible.

[Alisae]

For starters, not sure how you expect town to believe you that you've been purposefully suspicious.


Also, even if I were to believe you, I'm not sure if a player's refusal to engage in "too scummy to be scum?" qualifies as scum being sloppy.

I expect town to believe me because I am town and it will show because I am town. Its pratically self-evident.

[Alisae]

GC, I'm going to go case Monkey/Norwee right now. Give me the opportunity to do that and engage me on it.
My dayplay this phase so far has mostly been consisting of trying to sort people who scumread me and trying to identify what the town mentality is for scumreading me.
I'm trying to hold people accountable for their votes because I believe that town does in fact scumread me, but how they talk about that read is going to be different from how scum talk about that read.

[Alisae]

VOTE: NorwEE

Let's go.

you guys are lame
VOTE: Norwee

This is where it all starts.

VOTE: humaneatingmonkey
im keeping this here for the day

Cycle Men votes Monkey and in return, Monkey OMGUS' Cycle Men.

VOTE: Cycle Men

Okay bro

VOTE: Cycle Men

Like when you post and come with theories maybe turn on your brain a little bit, yeah?

pedit: My arguement against it is that it is stupid, not realistic, and excessive, and I am questioning if you are either scum or just bad.
and honestly
this makes me lean towards bad the more I think about it because this whole fucking take on me is just stupid unless you genuinely believe it.

Then I have a huge interaction with Clemency at the end of it, I come to a townread on Cycle Men.
I'm not quoting the whole interaction because it doesn't matter. What is relevant is that after an interaction, I am townreading Cycle Men and during this time, I am still trying to push Norwee

Alisae, why is Mr. Inorganic and Mr. Sheeps-a-lot town?

I'm still trying to push Norwee and monkey is not at all interested in it. He wants to bus Cycle Men as seen in his next post.

I want to be clear. I'm not finding Looker, GC, Elements, and NorwEE as hard to sort. I am sorting them as likely scum. But I can be very wrong, and I think a flipped Cycle Men will help me be more right.

The only reason I didn't have Cycle Men as my primary lynch option earlier was the lack of counterwagon during that period. However, I can see merit in Deimos' push against him. But now I see that the paranoia around it is outweighed by the uncertainty Cycle Men will bring me later in the game.

So Cycle Men it is.

Yes, Alisae, I can be on the NorwEE wagon. But I also want this Cycle Men wagon to happen.

Now, I feel like Monkey made the decision to bus Cycle Men over Norwee because its just easier to bus the weaker player on your team.

However after this post, I tell him to vote Norwee here

Yes, Alisae, I can be on the NorwEE wagon. But I also want this Cycle Men wagon to happen.

vote
norwee

and at these next posts, he flat out just doesn't care about my Norwee scumread or acknowledge this post.

Okay I can buy that thank you for that

Although isn't sheeping exactly like voting based on trusting that the person you're following is town?

you know what
i hate you norwee (not actually just ur making this frustrating lmao)
i am going to admit
that i probably do not know how you play this game at all
i don't think i agree with it but this is giving me flashbacks to the normal where I had issues reading you and you reacted similarly
and now there is this seed of doubt that was planted

I think its Isis if ur town
VOTE: Isis

if you do that it's just going to be an inevitable cycle men lynch. Everyone wants a lynch and cycle men has the most so the people on it are most likely just gonna leave their votes there adn wait for everyone to panic move onto him.
I'm happy for a cycle or human lynch but i'd prefer the latter
VOTE: human

scrap that, human is pretty locktown for me now
VOTE: cycle

?????? how does this happen in a human brain
VOTE: elements

This is where Cycle Men decides he wants to push Elements and because I was scumreading Elements for his vote movements, I join him here

unless we gonna flashwagon Elements
Im down for that

I'm evaluating whether or not Elements is town for the solve that no one has really took me up on the wagon I made around him, or scumread him because by his own admission he's been lynchable and yet no one other than me has really pushed him.

okay i like Elements now

Now look what's happening.
I am pushing a cw on town!Elements while scum!Cycle is still being wagoned.
The best play that monkey could make here is to continue to push Cycle.
This is the best play for monkey because its at this point that the Cycle Men flip makes me look bad since we're both trying to mislynch town!Elements together. If he continues to push Cycle Men here, he can use the cred he got from the Cycle Men lynch as well as the fact that the Cycle Men flip makes me look terrible to try to lynch me after he lynches Cycle Men.
Lynching town!Elements here doesn't yield the same result. It doesn't boost his chances of winning aside from the fact that they need 1 less mislynch.

Lynching Cycle Men over town!Elements here boosts his chance to win the game because now he can use that flip to try to discredit me and lynch me.

there is no town motivations in your actions.
town does not play this way.

this isn't really true

So now you have him defending Elements and getting me to lynch Cycle Men in these next posts.

Ali, why is Cycle Men town? You missed my question.

Cycle Men > NorwEE

Let's just get the flips, man.

This post was made after monkey interact with Cycle Men where he still maintains a scumread on Cycle Men.
When scum make the decision to bus, they will not get off track and they will not hop off. They want the bus to go through and they will do everything in their power to make it go through.
The rest of these posts are just him trying to push Cycle Men through

no i recognize what you've done and i truly thank you for that. unfortunately i'm reading you as scum

nah. i don't buy that. i think town!you would recognize that it's very easy to scum to hammer you there and get away with it.

i think the more reasonable explanation is you're not worried about scum, because you're scum.

what do you think about my vote on cycle men? why do you like the elements wagon better than cycle men?

Don't you guys find it weird that like days ago, the L-1 wagon who no one hammered, is now very hard to push in deadline? Clemency is scum. Flip this slot.

Okay so whats the takeaway.

The takeaway is
- Elements is likely town based on Cycle Men pushing them and if Monkey flips scum, Monkey defending them. Its just the best position to take here.
- Monkey made the conscious decision to bus Cycle Men and is just doing the best they can to push the bus through. from 902 till lynch, he never gives another lynch the consideration or the light of day.
- Also, he made the decision to bus Cycle Men because he did not want to vote Norwee for whatever reason. Like, after 902, he doesn't even consider the lynch.

---

Now the rest of this post is going to be dedicated to Norwee scum and mostly talking about my interactions with him today.

anyone out there think alisae will flip town?

Norwee why are you voting me

Because scum was bussing Cycle Men and you look suspicious.

Why do I look suspicious

—

okay but Cycle Men is town so just lynch Norwee with me, yeah?

I mean, this is the kind of shit all over your ISO. And then you switch over to Cycle Men when he's close to getting lynch and hammer for the towncred.

I did not lynch and hammer for towncred.
I lynched and hammered because in mafia games, there is a deadline, and using a no lynch on day 1 is not optimal.

If you are associating me with Cycle Men, why are you only reading my ISO by itself.
Why are you not taking into consideration Cycle Men’s posts?

In this post, I want Norwee to elaborate on his read on me because he's not really explaining himself and just saying general statements to just hide behind.
I also notice that he is only making comments about my ISO, and he is using associations to scumread me here.
The issue with that is, he is only considering half of the story. When you look at associations, you also have to consider the person who flipped scum as well.
And Norwee isn't doing that.

Also consider that Cycle Men was mostly afk and doing fuckall at the beginning. So it was a obvious teammate to buss since he really didn't up his game until he was put into L-1.

So why did I not want to bus him earlier in the game?

Norwee is talking about how he was doing fuckall nothing but before I came around to townreading him, I hardly even talk about him. And I'm certainly not pushing Cycle Men and saying "CYCLE MEN IS DOING FUCK ALL NOTHING HE NEEDS TO DIE" and this is what Norwee is trying to describe me doing.
So I ask him to talk about why I didn't bus him earlier in the game to see what he would come up with.
If he's town here, he would look at my ISO and realize that what he's saying doesn't make sense.
Instead he writes 1601 and I respond to it.

So why did I not want to bus him earlier in the game?

I think the late joiners on the wagon are more likely to be scum bussing. That includes you. You were defending him at first, before switching to voting him with a slightly awkward hammer when he was L-1. That's not a good enough reason to suspect you? You seem to be shading the people voting you more than you are actually trying to solve atm.

It’s not a good enough reason Norwee, and let me tell you why.
When I started to townread him was when he started playing the game.
You are taking this moment and this particular moment only and trying to suggest that I was defending my scumbuddy and decided to take an awkward hammer when he was at L-1.

Thats not a good enough reason because you are only evaluating that particular moment and nothing else.
You are not evaluating my read on him before he wanted to play the game, only after.
Also you are not taking into consideration that if scum decides “Hey, I wasn’t doing much earlier, but now I am invested into the game and actually want to play it,” that since they’re starting to play the game and take it seriously, that they CAN trick town into townreading them.

In the post I'm responding to, he basically doubles down on his theory and says that "WELL, THE LATE JOINERS ARE LIKELY TO BE BUSSING AND THAT MEANS YOU" and just doubling down on the fact I defended him and even tries to make the hammer just sound bad, completely leaving out the circumstances around the hammer (It was end of day and its better to lynch Day 1 then not lynch).

In this point, I am basically trying to describe how unnatural this take actually is.
He is also not taking into consideration that it is possible for me to just be wrong on Cycle Men.

You townread him when he was at the scummiest, and scumread him when he was at the towniest. That's not a natural progression Alisae.

When did I scumread him?

Quote the posts Norwee

in 1606 he says at some point I scumread Cycle Men after I townread him.
I tell him to quote the posts in which I actually scumread him because the truth is
I don't even scumread him
and he can't
instead he just doubles down on the read

You townread him when he was at the scummiest, and scumread him when he was at the towniest. That's not a natural progression Alisae.

When did I scumread him?

Quote the posts Norwee

Alright, call it fence-sitting. Call it whatever, you went from TR on Clemency, to changing your stance a lot, to deciding to TR him again and saying "he will probably flip town" after the hammer. Which is a typical scum way of appearing ignorant of the flips.

At this point, I have asked him so many questions that are aiming to try to show Norwee that his take on the events that happened in the game are just flat out wrong and I keep on asking him questions that challenge his views, but instead of re-evaluating and realizing that maybe he's fucking wrong, he comes to this conclusion.

He doesn't want to re-consider his point here because he as scum, sees me as lynchable and wants to keep on pushing it. He just changing his stance to suit his narative. The read itself is unnatural and Norwee is likely just scum trying to push someone he views as lynchable.

[Alisae]

Monkey OMGUS' Cycle Men.

it's not OMGUS if we're scumbuddies, right?

first line and you've already destroyed your case because it's an obvious bad faith case.

thats not a point as to why you are scum, but rather a re-telling of events

[Alisae]

but sure bro
you destroyed my case in 1 line
wow
amazing

[Alisae]

my townreads need to stop fighting

how is monkey town buddy

[Alisae]

Fire you are better then me. You scumread Iconeum correctly in AvP when I identified everyone else on that scumteam but him.
How is Monkey town?

[Alisae]

my townreads need to stop fighting

how is monkey town buddy

I don't have a long case for u.

why u townreading looker

he has an accurate meta read on me

[Alisae]

my townreads need to stop fighting

how is monkey town buddy

I don't have a long case for u.

why u townreading looker

he has an accurate meta read on me

[Alisae]

Looker is a very easy read
when I was scum with him he didn't even make any real attempts to solve or play the game and when we were town together he correctly identified scum!noms in a way that was confident and he believed in himself and was actively trying to poke other slots and try to find the motivations of others.
I see the exact samething I did in that game in here.

[Alisae]

Fire you are better then me.

im def not better than u

u def r better than me at this game

[Alisae]

I def don't think hem case push on u is indicative of anything. This is just how he pushes and he can get in this mindset of so very focused on a read it blindsides him to everything around him.

I don't agree with his push on u being fake in anyway.

my case was mostly about how he bussed.
I just feel like his push on me right now is scum!indicative because he's trying to explain as little as possible

[Alisae]

BRO

[Alisae]

DON'T TAKE THIS AWAY FROM ME

[Alisae]

I AM FEELING FUCKING CONFIDENT ABOUT NORWEE/MONKEY

[Alisae]

Elements what do you think about monkey after reading my case on him

[Alisae]

VOTE: Norwee

[Alisae]

Elements what do you think about monkey after reading my case on him

I don't see how lynching me first would have changed anything except an extra mislynch.

It makes my slot a mislynchable slot.

[Alisae]

Elements what do you think about monkey after reading my case on him

I don't see how lynching me first would have changed anything except an extra mislynch.

It makes my slot a mislynchable slot.

Surely lynching me before cycle doesn't change that though

It doesn't but its harder to do.
He has to justify switching onto you and off Cycle then back onto Cycle after lynching you, and its likely during this transition period that he gets called out for it considering how he's willing to support me to lynch you but not support me lynch Norwee

[Alisae]

Also another thing to consider is that Cycle Men was also pushing you.
Why would Monkey suddenly support a wagon that Cycle Men is pushing when Cycle Men was pushing you.

[Alisae]

Looker
talk to me
why am I scum

[Alisae]

I know how you play with a single, shitty scum partner (hurling thinly-veiled insults at me in thread ), and with no daytalk.

we had day talk at the start of teh day and then night talk

[Alisae]

you described me as aggressive but I tried my hardest to avoid lynching you till the very end
did you like, forget about that?

[Alisae]

Looker
talk to me
why am I scum

I don't trust you hinging your alignment on me. That was a totally different game with different mechanics. And these shifting voting blocks are suspicious.

okay but I was able to read you correctly D1 of the other micro we played when we were both town.

[Alisae]

we cannot be scum together because I am town.

pedit: I'm generally aggressive because I believe in controlling the narative and driving the agenda and thats what i did.

[Alisae]

in High Noon D1 was centered around me.
That game practically revolved around me.
and in that game, I lead the town to make bad decisions.

None of that is happening in this game.

[Alisae]

like Looker
what have I accomplished in this game?
think about the whole game and in the big picture

[Alisae]

Bro
you don't need the fingers to be fast enough for it
just trust me
thats all I'm asking you to do.

[Alisae]

I am putting all of my eggs in the Norwee/Monkey scum basket.
if Norwee flips town, I'm out of gas
I got nothing going for me and nothing to save me.

[Alisae]

controlling the narative and driving the agenda

like what you're doing now?

he is talking about his town game dude.

the game im refering to in that post is high noon in which we were both scum

[Alisae]

controlling the narative and driving the agenda

like what you're doing now?

I'm not though.
The difference between this game and High Noon (a game you didn't even read)
is that in High Noon, I played a game where I took the initiative to do everything and I led mostly every lynch.

in this game, before your vote on Cycle Men, I was playing a very reactionary game that I wasn't really invested in.
I was caught off guard by Cycle Men's flip and reacted to it, which is not something I did in High Noon after mislynching, going into night, and killing the other person who scumread me and who I tried to frame as scummy.
As scum with Cycle Men, I don't get myself in that situation that happened on D1. For starters, my entire interaction where I call Cycle Men "scum or bad" and am flip flopping on what to decide my read on him as doesn't happen. Cycle Men doesn't need to align himself with Norwee there, he doesn't need to push me, and I certainly don't react to him the way I did when he pushes that theory and agrees with Norwee. And the way I reacted to Cycle Men was what you could call surprised. Mostly because I was shocked that he was pushing a really absurd theory.

[Alisae]

this is giving me anxiety ill be back. asking for trust in mafia is a doozy lol

dude
I need to sleep its 8am
you have everything you need to determine that I'm not scum here. I told you everything you need to know.
I trust you to correctly identify me as town here because I know you can.

[Alisae]

AMA on anyone that's not Alisae because I don't want to deal with her "you're not pushing a read, you're pushing a fact" horse dung anymore.

I mean if ur scum here, its 100% the play to make me look like a fucking idiot who doesn't know how to play mafia.

[Alisae]

What initial push against you?

[Alisae]

Quote it because I don’t know what ur talking about, and I would need to read the post and the posts that surround it to understand whats going on there.
As long as you don’t vote me Monkey cannot lynch me, so I will be able to respond to it when I wake up, just as long as you don’t vote me.

[Alisae]

Also no one should hammer me w/o claiming intent, because if it so comes to that, I want to get one last post out with my thoughts before hammer.

[Alisae]

Your case against me was so colored with bad faith and misrepresentation that you've gave me nothing to doubt my scumread on you.

You read one line and ignored the entire case completely.

[Alisae]

Can I interest you in an Elements wagon instead?

Oh
This was right before he votes Norwee and Cycle Men.
I thought it was significantly earlier
In which case, yeah I can take a look at it right now

[Alisae]

Also no one should hammer me w/o claiming intent, because if it so comes to that, I want to get one last post out with my thoughts before hammer.

HA! You have the solid guts to say this. If you really believe that this is the pro-town move to do, you would have applied this on your logic when hammering ABR and Cycle Men.

Firebringer
Why is this a town post like at all?

[Alisae]

If human is scum why did no one help him in his initial push against me?

no one helped him because I screamed at him to vote Norwee

[Alisae]

Remember that time ABR was mislynched after Cycle Men was lynched because there was no strong associatives established? I want you to remember that when you and your scum team discuss on keeping you around. Lynching yourself MIGHT give your team a chance.

Notice how through out all of day 3 he has been begging me to contribute to lynching myself?

[Alisae]

If human is scum why did no one help him in his initial push against me?

no one helped him because I screamed at him to vote Norwee

then why did he decide to townread me when a wagon on me was emmerging?

because he wanted to bus Cycle Men and Cycle Men was pushing you

[Alisae]

In other words Elements
He knew that scum was pushing you, so he positioned himself to defend you, because the person he wanted to bus was pushing you

[Alisae]

GC I’ve been trying to get an explanation too and he won’t give it to me

[Alisae]

Also what do you think about my case on Monkey wanting to bus Cycle Men > Norwee and my case on Norwee?

[Alisae]

In other words Elements
He knew that scum was pushing you, so he positioned himself to defend you, because the person he wanted to bus was pushing you

but they have a scum chat so they can organise this.
They gave me town cred by bussing. I can't think of a less optimal play

How is Monkey going to justify voting with the scumread he’s trying to push after you flip town and Cycle Men flips scum?

[Alisae]

In other words Elements
He knew that scum was pushing you, so he positioned himself to defend you, because the person he wanted to bus was pushing you

but they have a scum chat so they can organise this.
They gave me town cred by bussing. I can't think of a less optimal play

How is Monkey going to justify voting with the scumread he’s trying to push after you flip town and Cycle Men flips scum?

would they not have just told cycle not to push me?

But Cycle Men was the first vote on your wagon.

[Alisae]

Votecount 1.41

Target	Wagon
Cycle Men (6)	Deimos27 (588), humaneatingmonkey (902), Isis (904), Firebringer (1234), Green Crayons (1240), Elements (1245)
Elements (5)	Cycle Men (1002), Alisae (1021), NorwegianboyEE (1101), votato (1187), Albert B. Rampage (1251)
NorwegianboyEE (1)	Looker (456)
Not Voting (0)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. The Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2020-05-08 06:42:59).

See?

[Alisae]

How is Monkey going to justify voting with the scumread he’s trying to push after you flip town and Cycle Men flips scum?

[Alisae]

I voted you at the time because I didn’t feel like you were trying to solve with how you were voting
You were changing your votes pretty rapidly.

[Alisae]

Also you adjusted your read to scumread me and I thought at that moment that you were scum OMGUSing me

[Alisae]

From memory no but you can read that particular interaction again and re-read the game

[Alisae]

Like nothing is stopping you from doing that

[Alisae]

I voted you at the time because I didn’t feel like you were trying to solve with how you were voting
You were changing your votes pretty rapidly.

He could say this. That he was scum reading me first and cycle saw that and took the easy counter wagon that had some town support already.

Okay so why isn’t he interested in lynching Norwee when I am pressuring him to lynch Norwee

[Alisae]

Like why would he drop his Cycle Men scumread to support an Elements wagon, when he didn’t drop his Cycle Men scumread to support a Norwee wagon

[Alisae]

Like, he wanted to kill you AND norwee. In that post you were referring to, the people he said he wanted to go after were you and Norwee
Instead he went for Cycle Men.

[Alisae]

How well do you think this scum team has played?

EBWOP

I can’t answer that question because I would need the Norwee and Monkey’s flip to rate their play.

[Alisae]

Also how does that even help you figure out that Monkey is scum here

[Alisae]

How well do you think this scum team has played?

EBWOP

I can’t answer that question because I would need the Norwee and Monkey’s flip to rate their play.

if we assume monkey and norwee scum

I think Monkey wanting to bus Cycle Men > Norwee is a valid option here.
Its not a bad play by any means.
Its just when Cycle Men wants to vote you, and I want to vote you to establish a counterwagon, it is very hard for Monkey to hop off and push you, so I think he made the correct play to continue bussing Cycle Men here.

[Alisae]

It wasn’t planned.
He decided he wanted to bus Cycle Men over bussing Norwee and thats all there is to it.

[Alisae]

In that alternative where your only options are Norwee and Cycle Men, Monkey picked Cycle Men

[Alisae]

Also no one should hammer me w/o claiming intent, because if it so comes to that, I want to get one last post out with my thoughts before hammer.

HA! You have the solid guts to say this. If you really believe that this is the pro-town move to do, you would have applied this on your logic when hammering ABR and Cycle Men.

Firebringer
Why is this a town post like at all?

@Wolfpupper

[Alisae]

GC how is 1770 town

[Alisae]

how is pointing out that youre a big hypocrite not pro-town?

If I am saying to please claim intent before you hammer me so I can get out my last thoughts, then you just do that.

It’s just a thing you do.

[Alisae]

There is no reason not to let someone get their last thoughts out before you hammer them if they desperately want to get their last thoughts out.

[Alisae]

Like there is just no downside to it.

[Alisae]

There is no reason not to let someone get their last thoughts out before you hammer them if they desperately want to get their last thoughts out.

then why didnt you state intent to hammer before hammering the last two days?

the abr hammer was a lolhammer
As for the cycle men hammer,

DO YOU KNOW WHAT A DEADLINE IS

[Alisae]

And the abr hammer didn’t matter he didn’t beg people to let him get his last words out
And even then he was still able to get his last reads out and in the thread.

[Alisae]

Also no one should hammer me w/o claiming intent, because if it so comes to that, I want to get one last post out with my thoughts before hammer.

HA! You have the solid guts to say this. If you really believe that this is the pro-town move to do, you would have applied this on your logic when hammering ABR and Cycle Men.

In this post he is actually just trying to silence me by making me look like a hypocrite

[Alisae]

How is that town GC

[Alisae]

sorry ali i don't have an answer for u on the other post.

because maybe I have a fucking point?

[Alisae]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

[Alisae]

How is that town GC

tunneling

Even tunneled town don’t try to call me out as a hypocrite for that.
Tunneled town understands that if I want Intent to be declared before hammering anyone, that person should have the right to get some last thoughts in the thread before the hammer is dropped.

[Alisae]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

It's three consecutive days. Each "day phase" could theoretically be three times longer if we wanted.

Just checked back
So we effectively have 21 day deadlines

Got it.

Are you sold that Monkey is scum?

[Alisae]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

It's three consecutive days. Each "day phase" could theoretically be three times longer if we wanted.

Just checked back
So we effectively have 21 day deadlines

Got it.

Are you sold that Monkey is scum?

I would prefer to lynch norwee over monkey

And if Norwee flips scum?

[Alisae]

i think ur too narrowly focused right now and the people pushing u is making u lose perspective a bit.

I think there is 0 reason for scum to defend me and I think that it is all town that at this moment is voting either norwee or not voting.
I think that its very reasonable for all 3 scum to want to kill me due to how easy it is to do so.

[Alisae]

Deadlines do matter.
You want to save your no lynches for when you absolutely must be correct.
Day 1 is not a day where you must absolutely be correct.

It's three consecutive days. Each "day phase" could theoretically be three times longer if we wanted.

Just checked back
So we effectively have 21 day deadlines

Got it.

Are you sold that Monkey is scum?

I would prefer to lynch norwee over monkey

And if Norwee flips scum?

then i'll have to do a big rethink

works for me

[Alisae]

GC if you have nothing else for me I’m going to try to sleep, so you have 12 minutes

[Alisae]

i think ur too narrowly focused right now and the people pushing u is making u lose perspective a bit.

I think there is 0 reason for scum to defend me and I think that it is all town that at this moment is voting either norwee or not voting.
I think that its very reasonable for all 3 scum to want to kill me due to how easy it is to do so.

ur like not an easy lynch.

All scum has to say is I hammered ABR and I defended Cycle Men and thats what most of the attacks have been against me.

[Alisae]

go to sleep this game will still be here later

I've got nothing for you. Sleep away.

thanks I’ll try

[Alisae]

i think ur too narrowly focused right now and the people pushing u is making u lose perspective a bit.

I think there is 0 reason for scum to defend me and I think that it is all town that at this moment is voting either norwee or not voting.
I think that its very reasonable for all 3 scum to want to kill me due to how easy it is to do so.

ur like not an easy lynch.

All scum has to say is I hammered ABR and I defended Cycle Men and thats what most of the attacks have been against me.

okay but i don't think its working? and i don't know if this is a scum motivated plot. I think u need some sleep to gain some perspective.

I can potentially be placed at L-1 today but not anything higher assuming Deimos is the only one to vote me and thats no on else.
Its wrong to say its just not working because I am a major wagon today

[Alisae]

There is no scum motivation in defending me
And there is all of the scum motivation in the game to attack me

[Alisae]

By the way, if Alisae is town here, I'm willing to be lynched tomorrow. That's how confident I am.

no, i need u for the golden final team.

Don't lynch ali

if ali really is town then maybe we can put you in the final team. we can punish you by making you play for not solving the game now.

Scum!Fire being so adamant to defend me is weird tho

[Alisae]

dude
I need to sleep its 8am
you have everything you need to determine that I'm not scum here. I told you everything you need to know.
I trust you to correctly identify me as town here because I know you can.

I am still triggered. I want to kill Norway because I hate the player and save you because I like you, but I admittedly let my biases get the best of me. Then with the hundreds of posts to comb through, it's a bit much. Also, aren't certain alts for certain playstyles?

I alt because my intention with those alts is to roleplay but I can never commit to it because I want to bring the best possible game to the table

[Alisae]

Do you care about anything I have to say or even want to consider having an open mind to me being town?

[Alisae]

Votato same question to you

[Alisae]

Ali what do you think of Deimos’s Norwegian as town case?

which post?

[Alisae]

Nah i don’t believe you

[Alisae]

You think my case is me confbiasing and you’re unsure that that is part of my scumgame.
Yet ur still making the decision to vote me

[Alisae]

I also don’t really have to care what your alignment is
I think there is 1 town in {Deimos, Norwee, Monkey, Votato}
I don’t need to sort you or Votato and I actually haven’t even really done that throughout the whole game.

I just need to convince Looker or find the 1 town in that group to vote inside it.
If I don’t think its u, then I see no reason to talk to you about it since I’m not going to change ur mind.

Tho if you unvoted me I can believe that you’re somewhat interested in hearing me out.

[Alisae]

ali, I dont see you making any effort to actually gamesolve here.

what the fuck is your definition of gamesolving because I have been doing that ALL of D3

[Alisae]

intent to hammer
say your think ali

sigh

[Alisae]

If u really wanna hammer me Elements then let me write up a lynch order 1 sec

[Alisae]

ali, I dont see you making any effort to actually gamesolve here.

what the fuck is your definition of gamesolving because I have been doing that ALL of D3

doing more than saying "anyone who votes me is scum anyone who defends me is town"

I’ve been going out of my way to show and demonstrate why scum is pushing me and how they’re going about it, you’re just giving it a blind eye

[Alisae]

Norwee and Monkey are scum.
If its not Norwee and is Monkey then I would expect Firebringer to be thrown in somewhere in that, but you flip Monkey and Norwee first before flipping Firebringer.

After Norwee and Monkey flips, you should have the lynches to lynch Deimos and Votato I don’t care what the order is there is definitely 1 scum in there.

If you somehow don’t end the game after lynching Norwee —> Monkey —> Votato —> Deimos —> Firebringer then I don’t know what to say
I just confidently townread {Isis, GC, Elements, Looker} enough that I feel like they’re just all town and you’re on your on at that point. If I had to make a guess as to who is scum in that group it could be Looker but thats only because he made my lynch possible.

Also you should just dead sheep this and it’ll win you the game, because I’m just at this stage of the game, I have the better read accuracy then most players that are actually playing this including you Elements.

[Alisae]

ali, I dont see you making any effort to actually gamesolve here.

what the fuck is your definition of gamesolving because I have been doing that ALL of D3

doing more than saying "anyone who votes me is scum anyone who defends me is town"

I’ve been going out of my way to show and demonstrate why scum is pushing me and how they’re going about it, you’re just giving it a blind eye

yeah except i know that your logic is bad. im town. im trying to lynch you.

How is it bad

[Alisae]

pls dont tell me we are actually lynching ali

all 3 scum are lynching me dude
All 3 scum are on my wagon

[Alisae]

You can hammer if u really want to now
I said my peace

[Alisae]

pls dont tell me we are actually lynching ali

all 3 scum are lynching me dude
All 3 scum are on my wagon

who besides HEM?

HEM Norwee Deimos Votato

[Alisae]

I was town

[Alisae]

Just dead sheep my reads if ur a villager

[Alisae]

I did everything I could to prove my points
Its up to ywall to win it

[Alisae]

Lmao monkey I don’t twilight troll
I’m town

[Alisae]

Fire if you save monkey for last thats fine I don’t need to care anymore
But if one of votato and Deimos flips town you lynch monkey

[Alisae]

Lmao monkey I don’t twilight troll
I’m town

Honestly if you were town, you were so bad.

I just understand the game more then you and you can’t accept that.
Thats all there is to it really.

[Alisae]

Lmao monkey I don’t twilight troll
I’m town

Honestly if you were town, you were so bad.

I just understand the game more then you and you can’t accept that.
Thats all there is to it really.

You were super wrong from the get-go, starting from scumreading me.

Doesn’t matter how wrong you are if you win the game

[Alisae]

Lmao

[Alisae]

Doesn’t matter how wrong you are as long as you are right at the end of the day

[Alisae]

This game can be won by lynching 4 scum in a row on d1 or at F3.
It doesn’t matter when as long as you win the game

[Alisae]

Is mislynching a bad thing

[Alisae]

Answer that question honestly and with as much depth as possible

[Alisae]

Is mislynching a bad thing

A mislynch? It happens. It's part of the game. But making a conscious effort to mislynch as town? You need to cut back on weed.

and this is why you’re bad at the game

[Alisae]

But you're trolling aren't you?

nope
I don’t twilight troll

[Alisae]

I just saw scum hardbus to transition to wanting to promote the counterwagon to them when they started to play the game

Ie they wanted to bus when the slot was doing nothing, and save it when the slot was doing things

[Alisae]

I feel like a deflated balloon

just lynch on my wagon and you win the game.
Thats all there is to it

[Alisae]

[Alisae]

because alisae's not a good player

Cycle Men was lynched Day 1. They were a Mafia Goon.

[Alisae]

This is why Alisae is annoying as balls and i’m pretty sure we just lose if we can’t kill them now.

kekw