Mini 2321: Classic Commercials (Postgame)

[Flavor Leaf]

@Dunn - If I were conf town, who would be the scum team for you?

[Flavor Leaf]

From my POV, it is always 1 of Celeb/Bingle, Maestro, and then one of Dunn/Naerys/Hu Tao.

I don't think there's any chance it isn't this, bar Maestro somehow being town with scum just not ending the game.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, I'm pretty comfortable with you Naerys. Especially after Maestro becomes confirmed scum for me.

I think Hu Tao is outing themselves to me here on purpose and going for the victory, personally.

Means it's probably Bingle, Hu tao, Maestro with the off chance of it being Hu Tao, Celeb, Maestro. It looks like they're trying to misfade Celeb, though.

That being said there is the play where they're waiting for someone to vote Bingle, and then the 3 of them flip.

Or Hu Tao is town with the wrong solve, in which case, gg.

[Flavor Leaf]

Just something that factually has to be true to consider me as scum here.

It's fine to think I'm scum here, but it also 100% means you MUST believe I hard pocketed Bingle since Day 1 of this game.

@Dunnstral - Do you believe this happened here? If I am scum with Celebloki, Bingle would be town who swore that I am town this game from the very beginning of the game to the point where they would eat Titus' hat.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Dunn - I know I've burned you in the past. It's not happening here. I am town. If you're town, we have to come together.

I think Naerys is town here too.

[Flavor Leaf]

Naerys, we're fucked. lol.

[Flavor Leaf]

I actively fuck with my scum meta constantly to get people to think they know how to meta me, and then they get screwed over.

And yet, how many times have I been wrong when I soulread you?

btw, FL is town here, take it to the bank.

Bingle has town read me since the beginning of the game super confidently. Bingle has touted that they could catch me if I were scum very confidently as well.

I want Hu Tao and Dunn to both say they think I've pocketed Bingle since the very beginning of the game, please.

[Flavor Leaf]

Day 1 VC

Spoiler:

ssbm_kyouko

(2):

Thomith

, Bingle

Flavor Leaf

(1):

ssbm_kyouko

AnimatedWiz

(1):

Roden

gob

(1):

SirCakez

Hu Tao (1): Naerys

No elimination (1):

AnimatedWiz

Not voting (6): Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Celebloki,

Flavor Leaf

, Elements,

gob

VC 1.02

ssbm_kyouko

(2):

Thomith

,

gob

Flavor Leaf

(2):

ssbm_kyouko

,

Roden

gob

(2):

SirCakez

,

Flavor Leaf

Hu Tao (1): Naerys
Elements (1): Elements
Dunnstral (1): Bingle

No elimination (1):

AnimatedWiz

Not voting (3): Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Celebloki


VC 1.03

Flavor Leaf

(3):

ssbm_kyouko

,

Roden

,

gob

gob (3): SirCakez,

Flavor Leaf

, Bingle
Hu Tao (1): Naerys
Elements (1): Elements
Dunnstral (1):

Thomith

No elimination (1):

AnimatedWiz

Not voting (3): Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Celebloki



VC 1.04

gob (3): SirCakez,

Bingle,

Roden

Flavor Leaf

(2):

gob

,

Flavor Leaf

AnimatedWiz

(1):

ssbm_kyouko

Hu Tao (1): Naerys
Elements (1): Elements
Dunnstral (1):

Thomith

No elimination (1):

AnimatedWiz

Not voting (3): Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Celebloki


VC 1.05

gob (4): SirCakez,

Bingle,

Roden

,

Flavor Leaf

AnimatedWiz (3): ssbm_kyouko,

Hu Tao, Dunnstral

Flavor Leaf

(1):

gob

Hu Tao (1): Naerys
Elements (1): Elements
Dunnstral (1):

Thomith

ssbm_kyouko (1): AnimatedWiz

Not voting (1): Celebloki



VC 1.06

gob

(2): Bingle,

Roden

AnimatedWiz

(2): Hu Tao, Dunnstral
Dunnstral (2):

Thomith

, AnimatedWiz

Flavor Leaf

(2):

gob, SirCakez

Hu Tao (1): Naerys
Elements (1): Elements

SirCakez

(1):

Flavor Leaf

Not voting (2): Celebloki,

ssbm_kyouko

VC 1.07

gob

(5): Bingle,

Roden

,

ssbm_kyouko, AnimatedWiz,

Naerys

AnimatedWiz

(2): Hu Tao, Dunnstral
Elements (2): Elements,

SirCakez

SirCakez

(1):

Thomith

ssbm_kyouko

(1): Celebloki
Naerys (1):

Flavor Leaf

Not voting (1):

gob

VC 1.08

gob

(6):

Roden

,

ssbm_kyouko, AnimatedWiz

, Naerys,

Flavor Leaf,

Elements

SirCakez

(2):

Thomith

, Hu Tao

AnimatedWiz

(1): Dunnstral
Elements (1):

SirCakez

ssbm_kyouko

(1): Celebloki

Flavor Leaf

(1):

gob

Roden (1): Bingle


VC 1.FINAL

gob

(7):

Roden

,

ssbm_kyouko, AnimatedWiz,

Naerys,

Flavor Leaf,

Elements, Dunnstral

SirCakez

(2):

Thomith

, Hu Tao
Elements (1):

SirCakez

ssbm_kyouko

(1): Celebloki

Flavor Leaf

(1):

gob

Roden (1): Bingle

Day 2 VC

Spoiler:

2.01

Dunnstral (3): Hu Tao,

Flavor Leaf

, Celebloki
Naerys (1):

SirCakez

SirCakez (1):

Roden

Not voting (6): Dunnstral, Bingle,

AnimatedWiz

, Elements,

Thomith

, Naerys

2.02

Dunnstral (2): Hu Tao, Celebloki
Naerys (1):

SirCakez

SirCakez

(1):

Roden

Celebloki (1):

Thomith

Not voting (6): Dunnstral, Bingle,

AnimatedWiz

, Elements, Naerys,

Flavor Leaf

VC 2.03

Dunnstral (3): Hu Tao, Celebloki,

AnimatedWiz

Celebloki (2):

Thomith

,

Flavor Leaf

Naerys (1):

SirCakez

SirCakez

(1):

Roden

AnimatedWiz

(1): Dunnstral

Not voting (3): Bingle, Elements, Naerys


VC 2.04

Dunnstral (4): Hu Tao, Celebloki,

AnimatedWiz

,

Roden

Celebloki (4):

Thomith

,

Flavor Leaf

, Naerys, Bingle
Naerys (1):

SirCakez

AnimatedWiz

(1): Dunnstral

Not voting (1): Elements


VC 2.05


Hu Tao (3):

SirCakez

, Bingle,

Flavor Leaf

Celebloki (2): Naerys,

Roden

Naerys (2): Celebloki, Hu Tao
Dunnstral (1):

AnimatedWiz

AnimatedWiz

(1): Dunnstral

Not voting (2): Elements,

Thomith

VC 2.06

AnimatedWiz

(4): Dunnstral, Hu Tao,

SirCakez

,

Roden

Celebloki (2):

Flavor Leaf

,

AnimatedWiz

Hu Tao (1): Bingle
Naerys (1): Celebloki
Elements (1): Naerys

Not voting (2): Elements,

Thomith

VC 2.07

SirCakez

(4):

Roden

,

Flavor Leaf

, Hu Tao,

Thomith

Celebloki (1):

AnimatedWiz

Hu Tao (1): Bingle
Naerys (1): Celebloki
Elements (1): Naerys

Not voting (3): Elements, Dunnstral,

SirCakez

VC 2.08

SirCakez

(2):

Roden

,

Flavor Leaf

Bingle (1): Hu Tao
Hu Tao (1): Bingle
Naerys (1): Celebloki
Elements (1): Naerys

Not voting (5): Elements, Dunnstral,

SirCakez, AnimatedWiz,

Thomith

Votecount 2.09

SirCakez

(3):

Roden

, Hu Tao,

Flavor Leaf

Hu Tao (1): Bingle
Bingle (1):

AnimatedWiz

Naerys (1): Celebloki
Elements (1): Naerys

Not voting (4): Elements, Dunnstral,

SirCakez

,

Thomith

Votecount 2.10

SirCakez

(4):

Roden

,

Flavor Leaf

,

Thomith

,

AnimatedWiz

Hu Tao (1): Bingle
Naerys (1): Celebloki
Elements (1): Naerys

Not voting (4): Elements, Dunnstral,

SirCakez

, Hu Tao


Votecount 2.11

SirCakez

(3):

Roden

,

Flavor Leaf

,

Thomith

Naerys (1): Celebloki
Elements (1): Naerys
Bingle (1):

AnimatedWiz

Roden (1): Bingle

Not voting (4): Elements, Dunnstral,

SirCakez

, Hu Tao


Votecount 2.12

SirCakez

(6):

Roden

,

Flavor Leaf

,

Thomith

, Bingle, Celebloki, Dunnstral
Elements (1): Naerys
Bingle (1):

AnimatedWiz

Not voting (3): Elements,

SirCakez

, Hu Tao

Day 3

VC 3.1

Bingle (2):

Roden

, Naerys
Elements (1):

Thomith

Not voting (6): Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Celebloki, Flavor Leaf, Bingle, Elements


3.2

Roden

(3): Hu Tao, Flavor Leaf,

Thomith

Bingle (2):

Roden

, Naerys
Maestro (1): Bingle

Not voting (3): Dunnstral, Celebloki, Maestro


3.3

Roden

(4): Flavor Leaf,

Thomith

, Bingle, Hu Tao
Bingle (1): Naerys
Celebloki (1):

Roden

Not voting (3): Dunnstral, Celebloki, Maestro



VC 3.4 (labeled as 2nd 3.3)

Roden

(5): Flavor Leaf,

Thomith

, Bingle, Hu Tao, Celebloki
Bingle (1): Naerys
Celebloki (1):

Roden

Not voting (2): Dunnstral, Maestro


4.1

Celebloki (2): Bingle, Maestro
Maestro (1): Flavor Leaf

Not voting (4): Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Celebloki, Naerys

[Flavor Leaf]

Alright, Dunnstral.

It's on you. I think you are the clutch vote.

I believe the team to be exactly Maestro, Hu Tao, Bingle.

I'm pretty confident in that solve.

Hu Tao is puckering you up to vote Celeb or myself because that wins them the game.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Celeb stayed alive so I stayed in the pool.

And while Thomith is a Jailkeeper, I feel like Thomith was killed not because of them being a PR, but because they were town reading me.

On top of that, I actively was in a town core with Wiz + Thomith. Wiz died because they would have confirmed Celeb as a Neap.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm leaning celeb and flavor scum. Trying to find the last

This is a scum claim for multiple reasons:

1: It implies Hu Tao thinks that I hard pocketed Bingle from the very beginning of the game. Dunn also would need to think this, but I feel like Dunn wasn't in finished analyzing mode, where as it's obvious Hu Tao's looking to pounce.

2: Hu Tao said "still looking for a 3rd". This is the big one. From a Town Tao POV, they know that it's one of Bingle/Celeb. They picked Celeb. They know it's one of Maestro/Flavor. They chose Flavor. They are directly agreeing with Dunnstral's point. This literally only leaves Naerys. How are they "still looking for a 3rd"?

In addition to the case I pushed on them early on in the game, starting Day 1. Hu Tao was expecting to be the one to 1v1 Celebloki here, and hoping to over Bingle. Bingle was not trying to have Celebloki target me because I got pigeonhole defended behind Celebloki.

My town core has been dying off.

First Kyouko, who I pushed as never being scum based on the way they made their case on Gob.

Then Wiz and Thomith, 2 players I've been town locked with since the beginning of the game.

I am confident that scum is Hu Tao/Maestro. Celebloki doesn't die because if Celebloki died last night, I'd be confirmed town, and Thomith and I would be linked up incredibly tight. Thomith is NOT a kill I make with 3 scum alive.

Dunnstral, you are the clutch vote. Please see why Naerys and I are town here.

[Flavor Leaf]

Nah, it’s Hu Tao over Naerys imo.

I can see it as Maestro/Celeb/Hu Tao, but Naerys was pushing Maestro slot for a while, and Maestro is the only conf scum from my pov

[Flavor Leaf]

And Hu Tao was blanket defending RCE, and inching Dunn closer to voting.

[Flavor Leaf]

They don’t realize that because they are scum, Tao. Probably with you.

[Flavor Leaf]

bc no quickhammer? tell me more, oh wise one

This is literally a scum claim.

[Flavor Leaf]

tbh I think FLeaf has way less idea what's going on than he thinks

& it's very personally annoying/disruptive to me that he's refusing to read my posts or whatev, but I think the little break I took made this bs clear to more ppl; you're just reaching & you barely have an idea who Scum is... we have a fake guilty here, or at least a 1v1, and yet you're reachign w multuipkle different combinations of bs "Solves" & calling Naerys town when they've been coasting, leaning on Dunnstral who has also been kinda whatever- & you're just all over, man

like stop positioning yourself as some kind of Town lead

? You realize flavor is confirmed scum to you right..

Word choice of is instead of ‘should be’ is suspicious here.

Because I am 100% not confirmed scum to them here, and you can see it in their play, and if they were town, I would be confirmed scum to them.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hu Tao, if you’re town here and can’t see why Maestro is scum here, don’t know what to tell ya

[Flavor Leaf]

It’s like always Maestro and Celebloki here. 3rd is up for debate, I guess.

But yeah, Hu Tao, nice ignoring of the Bingle had to have been HARD pocketed for me to be scum comments.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Bingle - from your POV, town reading me as you say you do, you see why Maestro is also conf scum here.

There is merit in fading Maestro here, and letting Celebloki Neap again, if only to force them to tie a string together with them.

[Flavor Leaf]

Celeb can’t die as town because it’ll confirm me as town and Bingle as scum, and Celeb, as scum, has to kill in either Hu Tao/Naerys/Dunnstral/Flavor Leaf.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Bingle - Naerys and Maestro aren’t scum together imo. Naerys wanted that slot dead yesterday, and i dont think that was bussing.

Maestro is always scum here, and I’ve been saying that since RCE was still in the game, at least to Day 2.

Hu Tao has ties there for giving that slot a pass and zero evolution of that read throughout this game—i had the same pass for RCE early, but RCE did a complete 180 from what they did to me the last time they were scum where they called me scum all game and did nothing, here they just did the flip and called me town all game.

Also, Day 2 ending on Cakez heavily implies scum in you and Hu Tao based on the whole Bingle vs Hu Tao.

That’s also another town case for me because Cakez was pushing Hu Tao. I also just don’t take Hu Tao into this late game scenario like this.


The BIGGEST thing that shows that I am town, is why do I have Celebloki claim a Guilty on BINGLE over Hu Tao here.

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, the entirety of 2375 is to appease to Dunnstral.

It’s clear scum are playing to get Dunnstral’s misvote.

[Flavor Leaf]

Maestro also slipped in 2375, by the way.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm leaning celeb and flavor scum. Trying to find the last

From Hu Tao's POV, with this, the last would have to be in Dunnstral or Naerys. They had just agreed with Dunnstral right before this, so it makes no sense for Hu Tao not to say who they're leaning for the 3rd.

From Hu Tao's perspective, it should be 1 of Bingle/Celeb, 1 of Flavor/Maestro, and 1 of Naerys/Dunnstral, and the omit of that last one proves to me they are scum.

100% this is avoiding have to take a stance on the remaining 2 because they need one of their votes to win.

Hu Tao's reads objectively are lined up with Maestro's. They are teamed together.

[Flavor Leaf]

It’s really not fleaf. I think m is voting with me because it’s a safe play. If they get support on me, he can just hammer. The lim is never outside of me celeb, so poisoning the well on the celeb wagon with a shit vote just makes sense, and if we vote right and get to see tomorrow he looks better because he jumped onto celeb early.

He just really didn’t expect me to have such strength in my fleaf read.

ex-cuse me? shit vote?

on the person that fake-guiltied?

in a setup this power-heavy where they're claiming another full PR!?
[/quote]

this right here is a scum slip, regardless of who is scum in Bingle or Celebloki.

They have come to the foregone conclusion that Celebloki has 100% fake guiltied with how this is worded.

This means they are either scum who knows Celeb is town and has to discredit Celeb's read further

OR

that they know Celeb is scum who fake guiltied Bingle.

I am coming from the perspective that knows they are scum, of course, so this is 100% a legitimate slip. Whether it convinces you or not, post game it will show.

Scum are actively trying to lead Dunnstral (or myself, I would say) into voting Celebloki

[Flavor Leaf]

[

Maestro hopping on Cele is either really bad play or scummy. It kinda reeks with trying to put some psychological pressure on us. Sheepier townies would give in to that and allow speedy mislim.
I dont like Celebloki´s hammer and his reasoning for it, but that Maestro´s vote... the more i think about the less i like it. Its timing, they way he voted.
I dont think i can see a universe where Cele+Maestro are alligned? For scum to fake guilty and his buddy trying to buss him at this point does not make sense. Bingle and Maestro probably buddies
Therefore Bingle+Maestro+Dunn feels rather likely to me

You don't think flavors jump on maestro was equally as bad btw?

Hu isn't scum w/ Flavor, which we kindas knew; but I could see Naerys/FLeaf/Celeb easily after some of the last page or2

It’s really not fleaf. I think m is voting with me because it’s a safe play. If they get support on me, he can just hammer. The lim is never outside of me celeb, so poisoning the well on the celeb wagon with a shit vote just makes sense, and if we vote right and get to see tomorrow he looks better because he jumped onto celeb early.

He just really didn’t expect me to have such strength in my fleaf read.

ex-cuse me? shit vote?

on the person that fake-guiltied?

in a setup this power-heavy where they're claiming another full PR!?

this. I messed the quote up in that last one.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dunnstral/Naerys - I have screwed you both over in the past, I know, but I am NOT doing that here. We have to line up today, and it's not easy, especially because I think Bingle has spent all game long trying to get to a situation like this, but I am leaning that it is Bingle here over Celebloki.

Bingle/Maestro/Hu Tao here.

Hu Tao's lack of acknowledgement for the fact that if I am scum, I would have had to HARD pocket Bingle here. Just no other possibility in that case.

This is because Hu Tao knows I didn't pocket Bingle because they are partners.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Dunn - I know I've burned you in the past. It's not happening here. I am town. If you're town, we have to come together.

I think Naerys is town here too.

Well I think you're mafia for being manipulative in this game and repeatedly pushing town and then trying to shift blame

I agree.

But the ones who DIED at night are the ones that were town reading me AND that I was town reading since Day 1.

But if you think so, then let's end it. If it's an aimless effort, let's end the game and move on.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Dunn - If I were conf town, who would be the scum team for you?

Celeboki and Maestro, and then 1 more, probably between Naerys and Bingle

Celeb cant be scum with Bingle.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm leaning celeb and flavor scum. Trying to find the last

This is a scum claim for multiple reasons:

1: It implies Hu Tao thinks that I hard pocketed Bingle from the very beginning of the game. Dunn also would need to think this, but I feel like Dunn wasn't in finished analyzing mode, where as it's obvious Hu Tao's looking to pounce.

2: Hu Tao said "still looking for a 3rd". This is the big one. From a Town Tao POV, they know that it's one of Bingle/Celeb. They picked Celeb. They know it's one of Maestro/Flavor. They chose Flavor. They are directly agreeing with Dunnstral's point. This literally only leaves Naerys. How are they "still looking for a 3rd"?

In addition to the case I pushed on them early on in the game, starting Day 1. Hu Tao was expecting to be the one to 1v1 Celebloki here, and hoping to over Bingle. Bingle was not trying to have Celebloki target me because I got pigeonhole defended behind Celebloki.

My town core has been dying off.

First Kyouko, who I pushed as never being scum based on the way they made their case on Gob.

Then Wiz and Thomith, 2 players I've been town locked with since the beginning of the game.

I am confident that scum is Hu Tao/Maestro. Celebloki doesn't die because if Celebloki died last night, I'd be confirmed town, and Thomith and I would be linked up incredibly tight. Thomith is NOT a kill I make with 3 scum alive.

Dunnstral, you are the clutch vote. Please see why Naerys and I are town here.

Well to me Celebloki seems to be the most likely mafia given flips and them not dying at night.

They couldn't die. As town, If they did, I become conf town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m playing in a Timothy-AWiz town core mode.

Thomith*

Autocorrects me to Timothy lol

This is one example from Day 1. This happened throughout the game. I went back and forth for like a second on each of them, but on Day 3, I specifically stated if Thomith is scum, I'm content letting them win. I'll find that for you as well.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Dunn - If I were conf town, who would be the scum team for you?

Celeboki and Maestro, and then 1 more, probably between Naerys and Bingle

Celeb cant be scum with Bingle.

Why not?

Celeb claimed Not VT on Bingle, Bingle claimed Vanilla. This means one of them are lying.

In theory, I guess they both could be scum and gambiting, but Bingle specifically stated, they didnt want Celeb to target me.

I believe this was because they no longer could kill Celeb without confirming me as town.

[Flavor Leaf]

If I were scum, i'd be completely setup that if Celeb and I went down as scum, that my partner would be able to make it through the game alone, and the only other possibility of my partner is Naerys, and that's the most surface scum team out there.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dunn, it is Maestro, Bingle, and Hu Tao.

If you vote Celebloki, this game is over after they all quick vote.

[Flavor Leaf]

i am least sure on Bingle, it could be Celeb.

But they are inching their way to try and get you to vote Celeb.

3 of the 7 players alive here are aligned and are 1 misfade away from victory. They need 1 single town member to misvote.

You are the slot they are setting up to misvote.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why is it Hu Tao?

I've cased them literally all game since Day 1...they were my main push on Day 2, and then even on Day 3 I pushed it was Roden and Hu Tao...

and I literally just cased them last page...

but I will go collect posts again.

[Flavor Leaf]

UNVOTE: Gob

Day got juicier.

Hu Tao TMI’ing Gob possibility tips the scale to where I think Gob is more likely to flip town than scum, whereas before the chance was more likely scum than town, which is always a good roll on Day 1.

Gob got White Knighted.

Fun thing about this is both Gob and Wiz were my candidates. It’s possible they are both town.

I don’t think I was hiding it very well, but I think Hu Tao is pretty obv scum here.

Not necessarily caring about their fade today because I think it’s just infinitely hard to fade someone like Hu Tao Scum on a Day 1, also in ways it’s not worth it sometimes.

But by their own admission, they were trying to ‘do nothing’ to get town read. This means they are actively trying to position themselves in a specific way in the game.

On top of this, when I stated they had done things already, they were salty because they thought they had ‘literally done nothing’. That reeks of scum being upset they got caught for wrong reasons.

Now the advocate for Vig on FL after I advocated for Cop on Hu Tao.

I would say bar a couple players, I am generally a solid town read player for most players. The difference is, I’m wanting Hu Tao checked, which if they are town, is very beneficial in the long run, especially towards someone who has been actively trying to become town read.

By their own admission, they’ve been ‘doing nothing’ on purpose to get town read, and that’s like the perfect investigative action onto a slot that’s in the background like that, and especially on a sneaky scum like her.

She advocates for a Vig on me, taking me out of the game.

That is a direct Threat Challenging of me. I want to town read Hu Tao if she’s town.

She wants me to die.

She doesn’t have to worry about reading me here.

It also helps guide a Vig off of scum team and onto a claimed Vanilla Townie.

If I am the only death, and ANYONE claims Vig, Hu Tao is scum here.

None of that maybe Vig targeted same player, maybe someone protected.

I have coasted so many games from a Vig claim, partner Vig claim, that I know how to set things up like that.

That is a potential crumb setup by Hu Tao in case they get Gunsmith guiltied they have that to fall back on.

And let me say, it’s not one of these that make Hu Tao scum, it is the collection of these together.

Individually, some of these could be townie even, but together, Hu Tao is a scum slot.

Celebloki
Thomith
Naerys

RCEnigma
Roden
Gob
AnimatedWiz

ssbm_kyouko
Dunnstral
Bingle
SirCakez

Hu Tao

Bout where I'm at. I think there's probably 1 scum in my top 2 tiers, and then 2 scum in my bottom 3. This is more doing pools rather than a tier list, like for instance, I can make a Bingle/Kyouko town case, but I am paranoid of Bingle. Like I have a hard time seeing Kyouko make that case on Gob as scum, however, the Kyouko/Hu Tao on AnimatedWiz earlier is hard to not see it as potential partner, however, this goes in Hu Tao favor if scum Tao/kyouko town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I called out Gob and Wiz as both likely to be town ( i did push Gob heavily at one point, but I was actively calling them town, and it was just time to get them)

I was correct on Kyouko when I said they were likely town for the Gob case.

I was correct on Thomith.

I called out that Kyouko/Hu Tao on Animated Wiz likely had scum on it, and makes a lot of sense for Hu TaoScum/Kyouko town.

With Wiz also flipping town, Hu Tao is almost always scum here.



IN ADDITION, they had already lined up the Bingle/Celeb 1v1, then the Maestro/FL 1v1, and yet fence sit for Naerys/Dunnstral DESPITE talking about town reading you.

[Flavor Leaf]

I was one of the main players pushing Celebloki on Day 2, I don't push my partner to make a claim like that.

[Flavor Leaf]

I could see a world where it’s

Dunn plus Bingle and RCEnigma,

but I do think my read on Dunn is the strongest out of the 3 by far. I don’t like how he jumped to join Kyouko’s vote on me D1 with no explanation other than sheeping and then today claim

I’m

the one sitting back trying to be quiet when I’ve made twice the posts he has.

I don’t think all votes on me are instantly scummy, but I think a lack of solid reasoning for those votes

is

(the people who were with me in my last game can recount how I townread people voting me D1 and D2 because I agreed with their points). Dunn isn’t very convincing to me because the reasons he gives are very surface-level, and I do think he’s trying to get rid of me because I’m scumreading him.

P.S. Interesting note on the triangle: I currently townread Naerys, and I think she’s townreading me as well, so it’s more of a 2v1 with Dunn than a 1v1v1, I think.

Wiz called this team out, and I believe this is at least 2 for 3. I don't think they were right about Dunn, but they are also town reading Naerys here.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, I was hard town reading Celeblokiyesterday, but some of the things they’ve been saying today just ping me.

And i don’t remember ever being pinged when they are actually scum, even when i would go over the possibility of them being scum.

I only have one game where i had to read them, though, the other i was scum and they were town.

Their reads list looks political too

I just don’t really buy Hu Tao as a top town read here.

Even by Hu Tao’s own statement, they haven’t really done much.

And while I scum read Hu Tao, it doesn’t mean I think they’re always scum here, and I might think that I lean town Hu Tao because I’m scum reading them, if that makes sense.

But the very top? Hu Tao? Someone who actively gets town read as scum?

Yeah, I don’t buy that.

The post they made before Thomith voted also pinged me a little, the “I’m back” kinda post.

I didn’t want to go off of just that, but with the political reads list, Celebloki dropped a bunch for me.

I feel it’s possible Celeb/Dunn?

But Cakez is right, we definitely should take some time for today.

The reason it doesn’t ping me as much when Thomith puts Hu Tao to the top is because if Hu Tao is in fact scum, even if they aren’t at this point, then Hu Tao setup that pocket on Thomith early.

And even if Hu Tao town, I can still see a world where the 2 of them specifically just found each other as town.

That’s the difference between Thomith putting Hu Tao at the top and Celeb here.

Okay, so I was seeing Hu Tao/Celeb team at the time, this is actually good points for Bingle.

I also called out multiple times that I believed Thomith was in a Hu Tao pocket.

[Flavor Leaf]

tbh I think FLeaf has way less idea what's going on than he thinks

this is also a scum slip.

If I were scum in this scenario, I would know absolutely everything.

They know I am not scum here, and it shows in their posts.

Hu Tao also has started to distance themselves, as did Bingle.

I am not confident in Bingle/Celebloki.

However, for Celeb and I be to scum together, you have to believe 1: I HARD pocketed Bingle, and 2: I chose to try and misfade Bingle for the game winning fade, which no, Hu Tao has been my push all game, it would always be Hu Tao.

[Flavor Leaf]

I called out Gob and Wiz as both likely to be town ( i did push Gob heavily at one point, but I was actively calling them town, and it was just time to get them)

I was correct on Kyouko when I said they were likely town for the Gob case.

I was correct on Thomith.

I called out that Kyouko/Hu Tao on Animated Wiz likely had scum on it, and makes a lot of sense for Hu TaoScum/Kyouko town.

With Wiz also flipping town, Hu Tao is almost always scum here.



IN ADDITION, they had already lined up the Bingle/Celeb 1v1, then the Maestro/FL 1v1, and yet fence sit for Naerys/Dunnstral DESPITE talking about town reading you.

Well I feel that you had a big part in pushing through a lot of the miseliminations like Roden

Sure, that's why I think they got killed as a main reason, supplementary reason was because they were my town core.

but do you think I choose to kill them? I'm a day play scum player, and you know this. I can easily play around PR's like that, and losing their voice hurt me a lot more.

[Flavor Leaf]

I have someone else I want to put some pressure on, but I think I want to wait a bit for people to come in and react to the current things before I move on.

I’m open to a Dunn/Wiz town/town world.

I also then ended up here, thinking Dunn/Wiz was town town. I then called out RCE as the scum slot.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why are you so against Dunn or wiz today?

Why are you so against Dunn or wiz today?

i town read Wiz, and im not feeling DunnScum anymore, Bingle convinced me.

I'm usually pretty good at reading Dunn too.

RCE/Celebloki/Hu Tao. trying this out for size.

orly now.

Hu Tao is always scum here, Dunn.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t remember ever thinking Celebloki was fluffy before.

Also really don’t like the idea of Hu Tao town thinking all 3 hard town reading her are town

Cele could be scum sure, but I would prefer Dunn right now.

Hu Tao also protected the 3 people who were hard town reading them thinking there was like no chance of a scum pocketing. They defended the people who were town reading them because she knew they were in her pocket.

[Flavor Leaf]

I want to give other people a chance to respond too.

they're free to.

I'm about to hard case this still, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Then vote me out to break up some of those misconceptions. See my flip and maybe let the game start progressing instead of flaccidly plodding along. Pay attention to who let me egg them onto my wagon and who avoided it with a ten foot pole.

At this point I do think FL is probably scum.

I think Thomith is confused about what I going on about and Naerys let me egg her onto my wagon. Maybe Bingle is town.

idk why people think I'm panicking, I'm pushing my own wagon since it's the only one people seem to care about. I'm not trying to get people off of it lol. I don't consider what I'm doing as throwing btw. I'm pulling a D1 FL that my flip will maybe galvanize the game to start moving forward.

Were we hard bussing each other here to the point of making Celeb claim?

I can see Hu Tao/Celeb heavily from this day phase, but I want Bingle back in here for sure.

Maestro is 100% the safest fade today.

[Flavor Leaf]

People playing in the background this day phase: AnimatedWiz, Hu Tao, RCEnigma, SirCakez, Thomith

How am I in the background?

You mostly respond to suspicion on yourself or pop in to say you're "still fine" with your vote:

Spoiler:

Interesting night kill?

lol

VOTE: Hu Tao

Why am I scum again?

They feel manipulative. Going after Gob yesterday and pushing Bingle and I today.

I feel I’m pushing Hu Tao more than Bingle here. Me being alive makes Bingle town more likely after their setup yesterday.

Still not sure why I'm being scum read by you. Can you explain?

End of day

gob

(7): Roden,

ssbm_kyouko

, AnimatedWiz, Naerys, Flavor Leaf, RCEnigma, Dunnstral
SirCakez (2): Thomith, Hu Tao
RCEnigma (1): SirCakez
ssbm_kyouko (1): Celebloki
Flavor Leaf (1):

gob

Roden (1): Bingle


Who was the counterwagon? Cakez? I think Wiz was the main counterwagon of Day 1.

1.05

gob

(4): SirCakez, Bingle, Roden, Flavor Leaf
AnimatedWiz (3):

ssbm_kyouko

, Hu Tao, Dunnstral
Flavor Leaf (1):

gob

Hu Tao (1): Naerys
RCEnigma (1): RCEnigma
Dunnstral (1): Thomith

ssbm_kyouko

(1): AnimatedWiz

Not voting (1): Celebloki

Roden and I being on Gob for both of these, Roden never leaving, is pretty townie for them, imo. Like, I just don't see the purpose of going for Gob that way as scum. I won't use that defense for me, but there were much better pushes. It's confirmed to have been a lhf fade. The AnimatedWiz wagon looks bad here. It's a 'there's scum on the wagon, or Wiz is scum' kinda thing.

Gob wagon can have scum or not, i think Gob's the type that scum would for sure just let town try to misfade, which is why I think it's not impossible for either 1.05 or end of day to be all town.

That being said, I think there's only 1 max scum on Gob in 1.05. If there are 2, it doesn't make a lot of sense here that Gob wagon stayed as the main one, even after Bingle/Cakez moved away. And I already explained why it's kinda weird for Roden (and myself, but I digress) to stay on Gob that way.

Also, why is Cakez on RCEnigma over me?

End of day wagon has 1 scum in Dunnstral or Naerys, or no scum at all. I'm already town reading Naerys, but for completionist's sake. RCEnigma, idk, i just dont see this as scum.

Thomith and Hu Tao on SirCakez means there's likely at least a scum in that section, and the fact that overlaps with the Wiz one, I really do think we're living in a Hu Tao Scum world.

Hu Tao, Dunnstral, Cakez is my solve right now.

Sure. Let's vote cakez or Dunn. I'm fine with either you want

I'm okay with voting there VOTE: Dunn

I think we go Dunn still. Bingley I'm not sure om yet. FL I'm leaning town but not sure

I still agree with Dunn gone

Why are you so against Dunn or wiz today?

I don’t remember ever thinking Celebloki was fluffy before.

Also really don’t like the idea of Hu Tao town thinking all 3 hard town reading her are town

Cele could be scum sure, but I would prefer Dunn right now.

You are not saying anything new, have not commented on Celebloki, or really explored other options.

I think I said celebloki could be scum, but right now I'm fine with you or wiz.

If Dunn town, Hu tao pushing for Wiz/Dunn and protecting Celeb while still saying they could be scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

If you’re town, Celeb, you’re wrong on a chunk of your town reads.

Your energy is just different this game, and I’ve never had to wonder about your reads before, so that’s why I feel you are scum here.

Even when I was scum against you, I felt everything you were saying made sense, and that you had reasons for everyone.

I’ve never seen you go ‘I’m trusting my read on Kyouko so I’m trusting their reads’

Seems super lazy, and i don’t see you as a lazy player. That being said, i also don’t get why you wouldn’t try to expand more as scum, so when I think deeper into that, it looks like you’re avoiding saying certain things about players to not draw more associatives.

I’m very willing to change wagons and my view on a gamestate on a whim.

But you are trusting blindly in Hu Tao, Wiz, and Thomith, and trusting Kyouko who was already shown to have incorrect reads this game with their Gob push.

I get NKA, and I’ve been looking into that too, but Kyouku was just obv town for that push on Gob, the how they did it.

This is a decent case for why I believe pushing Celeb/FL as a team is silly because of how much we were pushing each other. I can see the possibility of scum team 'fake clearing me', and that Celeb was potentially following Hu Tao the leader.

Maybe Celeb is scum here.

[Flavor Leaf]

It looks like Hu Tao has done basically nothing today I'd be down for that wagon

You are going off the assumption that mafia are scrambling to try to save me and piling onto you. I'm not mafia so likely mafia are instead sitting back doing nothing, if you are town. I find Thomith's current position suspect, they apparently want to vote me out but are voting for you instead. AnimatedWiz's iso is 85% about me and 10% defending themself. I mean look at this:

Spoiler:

Hu Tao pops in every so often to say we should eliminate someone but gives no reasoning and then makes a filler post and leaves, and then 24 hours later comes back in and says we should eliminate the same person again with no new reasoning. SirCakez seems to be busy but is angling for you in their latest post - it's a bit of a mystery what they think about me. RCEnigma's last post is saying we need votes for pressure and they're the only player not voting. They have offered some talk of the wagon but not much else, including not giving a clear stance - they just call it 'interesting'.

I don't know if this makes him town but this post makes a lot of sense to me. I don't think I'd be interested in a Dunn elim today at least.

I also got really, REALLY, bored with this game yesterday and decided to start playing more unhinged and try to get reactions out of people. I'm still figuring out how this is working out for me. If you guys do vote me off, I almost suspect the people off my wagon look worse. With the way I've been playing I think scum would want to avoid my wagon rather that get behind it.

This kind of stuff reads like flailing scum to me, like Cele doesn't know what to do to get out of the situation and is just flinging out posts
I'd join the wagon but don't want to put to E-1 so I'll go here instead

VOTE: hu tao

Like I'm looking at Hu's iso rn and they are just so vague about so much. They'll declare reads but give no explanation why and their vote movements seem to be driven more by the way the thread seems to be going then by their own scumhunting

It is NOT a coincidence that Cakez started taking a lot more heat after sussing Hu Tao.

Bingle, Cakez, and I came together later this day phase and pushed Hu Tao too.

[Flavor Leaf]

Why wouldn't you check Leaf?

Why wouldn't you check Leaf?

Cuz they’re lying scum.

Why wouldn't you check Leaf?

Cuz they’re lying scum.

False

Why wouldn't you check Leaf?

Cuz they’re lying scum.

Scratch that, they’re probs a Scum Neap here lying about their target

I’m down to move to Hu Tao, though, if we wanna let Celeb go further.

I think they’re blatantly scum claiming Neap here, but Hu Tao is also scum.

Look at this entire progression here.

I was actively calling out Celeb as lying scum

They targeted me to ease my push on Celeb that night.

I am not this type of harsh to my teammates like this.


Hu Tao went from hard hard defending Celebloki to flipping it like they have to be scum.

scum team are bussing Celeb this game, 90% sure of this.

100% sure on Maestro scum, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Kyouko is just such a weird target when we had an actual VT claim that no one really disputed should be investigated

Not true, i soft as town.

But they also claimed that they were town reading Kyouko.

It also doesn’t line up they wanted ‘lower profile’ slots.

Kyouko was one of the leads in pushing Gob and was the only obv town.

This is a scum claim.

RODEN AND I WERE RIGHT


RODEN IM SORRY BUDDY PLEASE FORGIVE ME I WILL NEVER DOUBT US SYNCING UP THAT WAY EVER AGAIN IT JUST FELT TOO MUCH

[Flavor Leaf]

It’s Celeb or Hu Tao for me today. Hu Tao’s either TMI’ing Celeb town or is scum. Or they’re both scum. This isn’t town Tao.

It’s Celeb or Hu Tao for me today. Hu Tao’s either TMI’ing Celeb town or is scum. Or they’re both scum. This isn’t town Tao.

This is you just setting up for when Cele flips town

VOTE: Flavor

No more games

Hu Tao’s also trying to get me to convince

her

that she is scum, whereas if she were town, why would I ever need to do that?

On top of that, it benefits Hu Tao as scum here to defend a town Celeb because Celeb was one of the people here who put Hu Tao at the top.

Hu Tao even said they didn’t think any of the people who put them at the top of their town reads was scummy, or didn’t concern her at all, when the day prior, end of day, by her own admission she was ‘literally doing nothing’ deliberately, and yet she thinks she warrants that strong of town reads and by

only

town?

Then Celeb started getting more heat, and they began to say they could see it, and then the claim stuff happened and Hu Tao flips the other way.

On top of this, was also shouting yesterday for INVESTIGATIVE TO BE ON HU TAO.

Hu Tao’s standing in the game is in a good spot because she had townies defending and pocketing.

And she’s targeting players that disrupt that.


In addition, if I were ever scum here, I have no reason to not play along and then just start killing off the support system, so Hu Tao voting me here is also completely opportunistic of the new energy.

She doesn’t scum read me, she’s trying to prevent the threat to her support system and use the hectic energy to aid the momentum

Just read it.

I'm sold.

The team is Hu Tao/Celeb/Maestro exactly, honestly I'm locking that in, and I'll bet the game on that.

It is safest for the 2 of them to lean Celebloki because they can get bus cred, and then go for me afterwards. If Bingle dies, im conf town, I absolutely never in a million years kill a Bingle who town reads me that hard.

[Flavor Leaf]

Bingle, you sly dog, you successfully slingshotted me again.

The rest is up to you, my friend. I feel if you town read me, you gotta see I'm probably on the solve, and it's on you to convince Dunnstral.

You town read defending Dunnstral is a big reason I started to see Dunnstral as town.

[Flavor Leaf]

Check it out. Hu Tao and Celeb are always aligned here, and we had it right Day 2.

Celebloki is not mafia, they are telling the truth, and no mod error has occured. Explanation coming.

That's enough effort for me not to want to vote you today Dunn.

How would everyone feel about a Naerys vote?

I’m of the mentality that Dunnstral’s defense is solid enough for me to not use that reasoning.

However,

i do think that take the out, and all the other reasons that I’ve been stating look strong.

In addition to that, the fact that this push got minimized to being about that front and center, one that has a damn good reason to stand as a good defense, it makes it feel like there’s a solid defense for Celebloki, and that seems like it was put on the stage, when I even thought the other reasons were better to begin with.

Celebloki felt solid in that post. But when I take out tone reading as well, it leans back to them being scum, which is generally a good sign.

@Roden - the similarities to the Yessiree wagon, down to it being on Day 2 both times, are too similar for me to ignore here.

I also hate the defense of “let the night resolve itself” because i know how much i love hearing that when im scum in danger. A clever scum can work around that and craft a mech puzzle narrative that works in their favor.

And in the scenario I am correct about Hu Tao/Celebloki, I am always fake guiltied tomorrow, at the cost of Celebloki, in a situation where they wiggled out a Flavor take down, not the other way around, and Hu Tao gets to brush it off.

It’s just too similar to Yessiree.

In ADDITION, Dunnstral was the other wagon, and I think Dunnstral was town being wagoned.

Oh, convenient that when Dunn started defending Celeb that Hu Tao decided to flip their read on Dunnstral.


Notice how I said Celebloki would guilty me. They specifically went against that so that I wouldn't be right, and it hard connected me with Celeb and got me to flip my read on Celebloki.

Now we're in ELO and people are pairing me up with Celebloki, the exact situation that caused this came from this set of posts.

[Flavor Leaf]

okay. im gonna take a risk here.

If you are TOWN, DO NOT VOTE.

VOTE: Hu Tao

[Flavor Leaf]

Not voting outside of Celebloki, still.

I’m probably not gonna

I wanna force scum to bus.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'd appreciate you unvoting Hu, FL.

I'm not convinced she's scum 100% right now.

I am.

And I’m willing to bet the game on it

[Flavor Leaf]

If you aren’t voting outside of Celeb, then I have to solve this game today.

[Flavor Leaf]

If Hu Tao isn’t quick hammered, then Celebloki is the only one who isn’t 100% scum for me.

[Flavor Leaf]

If Hu Tao is town this game, then this game is lost anyways because it would make Hu Tao/FL Town/Town.

And association wise, this game ends eventually from the previous day associations.

So i am willing to treat this like an end game scenario and Vote Test, and force drawing lines.

I am shooting the shot.

[Flavor Leaf]

Naerys and Dunnstral are lock town for me.

If any of them pulled the wool over my eye, they did well. Good for them. Gonna feel good that they finally get me back.

Naerys for the game I was traitor in.

And frankly, Dunnstral for Animals Upick way back when I was on April Ludgate, the game from my scum guide.

I don’t think they’ve gotten me back for that ones

I don’t think they will here either.

I’m taking the leap.

[Flavor Leaf]

Naerys
Dunnstral

Bingle/Celebloki

Hu Tao
Maestro

Tiers ARE ordered. That’s why Bingle/Celebloki are on same line. Right now I ‘might’ be leaning Celebloki, but from my pov, that is game ending if wrong, and I can also case Bingle.

But for now, I’m finding the scum outside of Bingle/Celeb, Maestro.

[Flavor Leaf]

If you aren’t voting outside of Celeb, then I have to solve this game today.

I mean... I don't think either of us makes it to 3p ELO.

We're clearly the next two nk's if we make it that far, and Dunn, Naerys, Hu Tao is a trio where I'm really only confident on feeling Dunn town. I'm slightly concerned that Hu Tao/Dunn will mislim you after I get shot here, but I've done what I can to emphasize the townread there.

I'll compromise lim here if I absolutely have to, but celeb is mechanically confscum to me and I don't see a reason to let that go.

Maestro is confscum to me, I don’t see any reason to let that go myself.

[Flavor Leaf]

If you aren’t voting outside of Celeb, then I have to solve this game today.

I mean... I don't think either of us makes it to 3p ELO.

We're clearly the next two nk's if we make it that far, and Dunn, Naerys, Hu Tao is a trio where I'm really only confident on feeling Dunn town. I'm slightly concerned that Hu Tao/Dunn will mislim you after I get shot here, but I've done what I can to emphasize the townread there.

I'll compromise lim here if I absolutely have to, but celeb is mechanically confscum to me and I don't see a reason to let that go.

This is a big reason why going Celebloki, even if they are scum, is just not as good for me.

I think hitting a ScumCeleb here today still ends in a town loss.

From my pov, I have to get one of the other ones.

Celeb scum flip leads Bingle death, which leads to my flip, and I’m town.

That is scum’s plan and if someone votes Bingle, they could quick hammer anyways.

Win-win situation for them.

I have to take these leaps.

[Flavor Leaf]

I compromised on Day 2 with Cakez, and I knew that was a mistake.

I got paranoid with Roden, my strongest town read on Day 3.

I have been so close all game, but I keep getting slightly pushed out of the way, and frankly that means scum are people who actively know how to manage me.

[Flavor Leaf]

But yeah, Dunn/Naerys, please do not vote if you are town.

Let this sit out, and we can at least prove that Flavor and Hu Tao are not T/T.

If you’re scum, well, gg, you deserve the win.

[Flavor Leaf]

Unfortunately I think town has a very slim chance to win this game. Solely because I don't think the remaining town players will be able to not vote me the rest of the game. Scum will never NK me, my death confirms FL is town and Bingle is scum. If I'm not voted the remaining days I'll have more guilties and clears. They have to bank on getting me voted out and sowing distrust in me. The side effect is that for the rest of the game I'll clear/guilty someone each night.

The scum team is for sure at least Bingle and Maestro. I am stuck between Dunn and Hu Tao for the final slot. I guess we'll see if FL's gamble pays off. I'm not voting outside of Bingle or Maestro. At this point I think the better lim is Maestro on the off chance scum does NK me, it'll damn Bingle. If the game doesn't end today, I'll probably target Dunn or Hu Tao tonight.

If you were town you’d realize that it literally has to be Hu Tao/Bingle/Maestro fypov.

I don't think this is true yet.

It's possible in a world where one of Naerys or Dunn is scum that they havent checked in yet.

I don't think either of them are scum, though, so Maestro/Hu Tao likely lock scum here.

If not, town lose here.

[Flavor Leaf]

I do not believe I am voting recklessly.

I spent hours making sure I was confident in my read, and I took the chance.

Now, Hu Tao is conf scum to me since they still aren’t hammered.

[Flavor Leaf]

At this point I think the better lim is Maestro on the off chance scum does NK me, it'll damn Bingle.

this energy + Bingle still pushing me as town, yet trying to act like Hu Tao could be town here still, is having me lean Celeb as town slightly over Bingle.

[Flavor Leaf]

Unfortunately I think town has a very slim chance to win this game. Solely because I don't think the remaining town players will be able to not vote me the rest of the game. Scum will never NK me, my death confirms FL is town and Bingle is scum. If I'm not voted the remaining days I'll have more guilties and clears. They have to bank on getting me voted out and sowing distrust in me. The side effect is that for the rest of the game I'll clear/guilty someone each night.

The scum team is for sure at least Bingle and Maestro. I am stuck between Dunn and Hu Tao for the final slot. I guess we'll see if FL's gamble pays off. I'm not voting outside of Bingle or Maestro. At this point I think the better lim is Maestro on the off chance scum does NK me, it'll damn Bingle. If the game doesn't end today, I'll probably target Dunn or Hu Tao tonight.

If you were town you’d realize that it literally has to be Hu Tao/Bingle/Maestro fypov.

this line of phrasing shows that Bingle is aware of the situation (i think this was premature talk since it was possible that scum just werent around yet), but also that Bingle is aware of the Hu Tao/FL split, and they even did the 'ill eat Titus' hat' comment if I ended up being scum.

In addition, Hu Tao ignored the acknowledgement of a Flavor Leaf being scum factually would have to have HARD pocketed Bingle.

I don't believe Hu Tao thinks that, and the reason they don't think that is because they know Bingle is scum here, and thus, not pocketed.

Hu Tao is confirmed scum from my POV at this point, Bingle posts shows they are aware of this, and they were HARD pushing me as town all game. Bingle is forced to accept Hu Tao as conf scum or forced to flip their read on me.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't know why I'm responding to what is clearly an attempt to generate noise. Hu Tao is scum because of the whole not actually solving or being interested in helping town thing and using her reads as a weapon to disincentivize voting her instead of looking for scum. The roleblocking stuff is all about reading celebloki. That's... not really hard to piece together if you take even a minute to read my posts.

even weirder considering bingle scum read Hu

[Flavor Leaf]

Sorry for invoking a prod, I've been here, I just have no idea where we are even at with this game anymore.

It doesn't even seem like there is even a concerted push in any direction. I think the pervailing wagons are Bingle and Hu Tao, but each only have 2 votes.

I could be coming around on being willing to give my my 'courtesy' town read of Hu Tao I've been carrying if only because I really don't know who else I find to be especially scummy. I always find Hu Tao scummy, but wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt for once instead of tunneling.

I think Dunn has moved out of being scummy for me. Wiz gets a pass for the same reason I hope I'd get a pass for the day. I TR Thom and FL.

The game recently just appears to be Bingle and Hu Tao sniping at each other. I think in that pair I'd rather vote Hu Tao.

the bold is all correct town reads, and they switched their Hu Tao read because the game was stagnating when Bingle vs Hu Tao started to happen.

I believe Bingle vs Hu Tao were distancing this day to stop pressure on both of them. The fact we ended on Cakez helps this theory.

I'm not positive with Bingle, though, there's still a world where Hu Tao/Maestro are teamed with Celeb, but I do think Bingle also fits the bill with how this end game is being played + the past.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Dunn has moved out of being scummy for me. Wiz gets a pass for the same reason I hope I'd get a pass for the day. I TR Thom and FL.

If Hu Tao is town, why exactly is it so hard to get this wagon through despite there being no actual reason to townread her. Like, even Naerys here is townreading her because "Bingle was wrong last game, so he's probably just wrong again" as best I can tell. There's no town case there, and yet no one is willing to put there votes down with only 48 hours in the day.

doesn't add up with Bingle's current postings especially after they've revealed that they think Celeb should see it as a 100% either FL or Hu tao. With Bingle being super confident all game, it's not looking good for Bingle.

[Flavor Leaf]

Bingle you're not making a convincing case and you aren't going to make people vote Hu Tao by throwing a tantrum

i believe this could have been the reasoning behind Bingle's push on Hu Tao. It did help cause the wagon to split between Bingle/Hu Tao, and then the game stagnated leaving us onto Cakez, a player who was fine with Bingle, Hu Tao, and RCE.

Good on you Cakez. You were threat faded this game.

[Flavor Leaf]

Bingle is also probs scum for end of Day 2 attempt to flash wagon Roden, and I hard put that down. Then imma say they incepted me and forced me to push Roden Day 3

that's my biggest regret this game, and probably in a while.

[Flavor Leaf]

Naerys
Dunnstral

Celebloki

Bingle

Hu Tao
Maestro

No order within tiers now.

[Flavor Leaf]

Naerys and Dunn are actually conf town from my POV now that Hu tao and Maestro are conf scum.

I do not see a world where Celeb fake guiltied scum partner Bingle here. And if they did, then they could have won by voting whichever was the town in Maestro or Hu Tao.

[Flavor Leaf]

my prediction is scum team play with the idea of giving up Maestro today. i think that's their best course of action if they have to bus.

[Flavor Leaf]

The lack of hammer or movement on the Hu Tao vote is pretty damning. I find it hard to believe that the scum team can't coordinate and find a time to throw down all their votes to end one of the wagons FL was on (Maestro/Hu Tao) leaving me to believe both these slots have to be scum. Between the two I think I'd still prefer Maestro gone first

so I can get a check in on Hu

.

why do you need a check in on Hu over Naerys/Dunn if Hu becomes vote lock confirmed scum basically?

[Flavor Leaf]

It is a big red flag, but you got red flags too, and for some reason.

Frankly, it’s a big reason I don’t want to go with Celeb or Bingle today when I know for sure Maestro and Hu Tao are scum.

I even think Hu Tao is the path to winning more often, but Maestro is the limb they’ll cut off.

[Flavor Leaf]

And if it comes down to FL/Bingle/Celeb final 3, frankly i think that’s okay.

[Flavor Leaf]

Personally, I feel like if Hu Tao is scum, this is the only path to town victory by hitting Scum her specifically today.

If Hu Tao is town, we town is a loss anyways, because Hu Tao and I aren’t ever gonna see each other as town.

It’s possible scum haven’t been able to coordinate a quick hammer, and you voting makes me hesitant, and you unvoting made me seem like you didn’t want it proven Hu Tao is scum if I am.

A lot of possibilities, I’m shooting my shot, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Depends where you’re heading.

I’m okay if the day is ending on Hu Tao.

[Flavor Leaf]

At this point, I feel I should try and find guilty people over VTs. There's no way there are anymore Town PRs, any Not VTs I get means guilty. My worry targeting someone like Dunn or Naerys is that they will be the NK and it's a wasted target on the next day. Scum aren't going to NK each other, so shouldn't I target who I think is scum and just confirm it?

That said at this point it's pretty obvious from where I'm sitting that the scum team has to be Bingle/Maestro/Hu Tao. Would scum really just let a town Hu Tao or a town Maestro sit there with a FL vote on them and not coordinate a quick-hammer? If they can't coordinate a quick hammer than they have really dropped the ball on those slots.

Scum are going to NK slots that haven't been making waves. I thought FL might be the next NK target, but scum might want to keep him around because they feel he is volatile and may suddenly direct his ire at a townie.

Maestro and Hu Tao should be confirmed scum to you if you have a confirm on me.

So I would take the 50/50 with Naerys/Dunn, and if they’re forced to be night killed anyways, that’s fine.

If I am killed, my solve is proved correct too, because Maestro/Hu Tao only way they aren’t conf scum is if Celeb/Bingle are scum together gambiting, and I don’t think that?

I think if that is the case, then we just lose sometime anyways, i don’t see us solving that.

[Flavor Leaf]

You played well, Tao.

Close game. I still think you have a solid chance here.

If it’s Celeb as your partner, I think you probably carried your team heavily. Bingle as partner, i still think you were both up there doing work.

[Flavor Leaf]

Celeb, Dunn, Bingle team?

[Flavor Leaf]

Feels like it.

Gg. I don’t think Hu Tao and I ever could get on same page here.

Bingle played that well.

[Flavor Leaf]

Bingle hard defended Dunn and Celeb Day 2.

Day 2, we pushed all 3 of them.

This was a hard ELO to get the right path.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm not on the team. If you're a patsy, I'm a patsy with you.

You can be scum who fake claimed an inno and true claimed a guilty on partner from my pov still, which is why I’ve been 50/50 with you and Bingle.

[Flavor Leaf]

My bad Hu Tao. Didn't think it was Flavor Leaf after some time but wasn't expecting for you to both be town.

i would have probably went Celeb end game anyways.

Like I could feel Bingle was scum this game, there just wasnt really logical things.

I went Hu Tao specifically because it really had to be them if town had a chance here.

Naerys I never would have gotten.

I was ready for the game to end.

I don't think it ends up the right path with Naerys here as scum because had Celeb claimed a guilty, i wouldnt have.

[Flavor Leaf]

2/3 scum was solid. Maestro was obv scum for multiple reasons. I'm happy about that.

I wanted to test with Hu Tao. I was not interested in taking this game down to 3p. I was solving today, and ending.

Just needed the full solve here today, and I never would have went Naerys.

Something about Celeb's posting didn't make sense coming from scum, and I kept feeling it.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Naerys being the deep wolf would have made it hard, but if we had taken down Bingle or Maestro instead today, I would have eventually had a solve at 3p, would have just had to convince whatever townie I was left with. Keeping myself from being limmed was my biggest challenge.

I never would have went Naerys over you.

Naerys setup the distancing on the RCE slot early.

Good to know my soul reading on Day 2 with RCE is good, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Apparently it was enough to sit back and let FL do all the job *wink*

I actually think I played this day phase well. Day 3 was my weak day. I just had to be

PERFECT

this day phase, and I was just willing to risk it for the biscuit.

Hu Tao and I had been against each other all game. For town to come together, Hu Tao and I needed to come together, and see Celebloki as town.

And it just wasn't happening.

But I cased Bingle pretty well imo, and Maestro was hit.

It was really Naerys deep wolf that stopped the solve from happening. I never would have went Naerys.

[Flavor Leaf]

Maestro was caught, so I didn't care about hitting them today. I was shooting for the end game.

With me dead, I don't think Celeb won a 1v1 with Bingle, so had to hit the 3rd scum.

Was a good game, though.

I had Bingle throughout this game, but that Day 3 really wrecked us.

[Flavor Leaf]

Apparently it was enough to sit back and let FL do all the job *wink*

I actually think I played this day phase well. Day 3 was my weak day. I just had to be

PERFECT

this day phase, and I was just willing to risk it for the biscuit.

Hu Tao and I had been against each other all game. For town to come together, Hu Tao and I needed to come together, and see Celebloki as town.

And it just wasn't happening.

But I cased Bingle pretty well imo, and Maestro was hit.

It was really Naerys deep wolf that stopped the solve from happening. I never would have went Naerys.

I had you as town yesterday but you started acting sus today

it was a hard elo. You had Celeb and I as scum, so it felt like you were trying to misfade.

I wasn't going Naerys, though, probably ever this game.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Naerys

Roden had this ping earlier, and I wasn't there. I got the ping in 477, and I can't explain why I think that, so maybe some pressure can help my read there.

I generally think that when I line up with a Roden ping pages later, it turns out to be right. We successfully got a strong town read on KittyTacky in a recent game collectively after we were both pushing Kitty prior. And we town read for kinda weak reasonings, but felt it strongly.

I think I'm interested in a Naerys wagon right now. Curious how gamestate evolves with this wrench.

I've had the pings, but I don't think it's a productive wagon, tbh, given the number of other options I'm interested in.

I even felt at one point during Day 2, but then end of Day 2 I checked out of this game for a while.



Ahhhh, I was so close a good portion of this game, and I KNEW I was too. Bingle was spending a lot of effort making sure I was getting a lot of slight misses, and I KNEW they were. But it just takes little spots of weakness.

[Flavor Leaf]

Bingle spent the entire game warlocking me, and it almost blew up in their face a few times. But they did do it.

And I knew they were doing it at times, just moments of doubt sow.

Maybe, Celeb. I was tinfoiling you and Hu Tao, but it would have confirmed the team wasn't Bingle/Hu Tao unless it was exactly Bingle/Hu Tao/Celeb.


Bingle knows they took some blows to the chest this game, and if they fell off the mechanical flavor bull for a second, they'd be hit.

Maestro/Bingle could have gotten out, but like I said, I don't see a world where Naerys gets killed over Celeb.

[Flavor Leaf]

Getting me to second guess my Roden soul read is what did it tbh, and frankly, I think that had to do with my Hu Tao doubt.

Maestro was locked up. They were in cursed slot, though, so not entirely their fault.

Bingle/Celeb was locked up.

Just needed to hit 1 more (at least to hit the solve, which is what I was aiming for)

Naerys distanced well, and stayed out of line of sight here.

That was kind of the main focus for Bingle looking at it here, Bingle against Flavor. Wincon, get Flavor as a suspect, and warlock them.


It was the hat line by Bingle, the 'i'd eat Titus' hat if FL flips scum'. Something about it just went 'ya right, Bingle just knows im town'.

[Flavor Leaf]

it was a good game, though. thanks for taking over DE.

[Flavor Leaf]

eh, it wasn't your fault. you didn't do anything wrong.

Scum was just manipulating the situation.

[Flavor Leaf]

i dont even think this was a scum stomp. Solid win without losing a member, though. But def not a stomp.

Hu Tao-FL needing to come together was the thread that needed to be sown, and if that happened, this game likely could have started really snowballing the other way.