Large Normal 247 - Postgame

[KayJayQueue]

all aboard everyone

Only if it’s a party bus

[KayJayQueue]

Is this real? lol Day 1 is silly

[KayJayQueue]

I claim VT

Serious claim BTW

Gunslinger it is!

[KayJayQueue]

Is this real? lol Day 1 is silly

In contrast, I'm finding myself disliking this reaction.

VOTE: KayJayQueue

Do you have any opinions on the speed wagon? Any votes you find weirder than the others?

I find it crazy that it was that close to an elimination. I have done the random vote at the very beginning before but I’m much more tentative to make a real vote initially until I get a better feeling so I can’t tell if the speed voting is just for fun or is something that I’ll get used to with more games. I don’t know how to read the people that jumped on. I can say I don’t think it was bad from the first vote or maybe the second but I don’t know what jumping on is usually indicative, alignment wise. Or how to tell the 3-7 votes apart.

[KayJayQueue]

Is this real? lol Day 1 is silly

In contrast, I'm finding myself disliking this reaction.

VOTE: KayJayQueue

Do you have any opinions on the speed wagon? Any votes you find weirder than the others?

I find it crazy that it was that close to an elimination. I have done the random vote at the very beginning before but I’m much more tentative to make a real vote initially until I get a better feeling so I can’t tell if the speed voting is just for fun or is something that I’ll get used to with more games. I don’t know how to read the people that jumped on. I can say I don’t think it was bad from the first vote or maybe the second but I don’t know what jumping on is usually indicative, alignment wise. Or how to tell the 3-7 votes apart.

What do you think of Oblivions reaction to the wagon?

I think scum would be trying to hide a bit more and not be putting so many opinions out there, especially if it welcomes a back and forth. To me, it’s reading town at the moment. I’ve never played with it before so I can’t base anything off meta, just these first pages.

[KayJayQueue]

Good morning fellow townies!

Wait, I’ve seen this one!

[KayJayQueue]

RN is sus too right now. Why so much sus.

I don’t sus him at all at the moment, what am I missing?

[KayJayQueue]

RN is sus too right now. Why so much sus.

I don’t sus him at all at the moment, what am I missing?

...

...and why don't you suss me at all at the moment?

My feeling of you right now is based on our previous games together as well as one I watched as it was playing out. The things you are doing feel like how I’ve seen you as town previously. So far nothing feels off or too far removed from your other town games. (that I’ve personally experienced or watched) We’ll see if that changes as time goes on.

[KayJayQueue]

RN is sus too right now. Why so much sus.

I don’t sus him at all at the moment, what am I missing?

...

...and why don't you suss me at all at the moment?

My feeling of you right now is based on our previous games together as well as one I watched as it was playing out. The things you are doing feel like how I’ve seen you as town previously. So far nothing feels off or too far removed from your other town games. (that I’ve personally experienced or watched) We’ll see if that changes as time goes on.

...

Do be aware that despite me saying I'm terrible as Mafia I do have rare moments of being very good at it if I'm feeling it.

Point is, don't get too trusting.

It’s just an early read. I have good feelings about a few, semi-good feelings about a couple, a lot of nulls, and a few not-great feelings. I just figured I’d be honest that I’m feeling good about you at the moment to see if anyone has insight to the contrary.

But also, noted. I’ll try not to trust too quickly, be it of others or of my own early reads.

[KayJayQueue]

Could it be that Hu Tao is yet again Scum?

If she is, she needs to pocket me immediately. For revenge.

[KayJayQueue]

Right now, my initial callout is Snow Naerys geratim and Dave.

Can you expand your reasoning for Snow and Naerys?

[KayJayQueue]

VOTE: NotAScum

[KayJayQueue]

Geratim hasn't said much but is sheeping wagons.

i can't not sheep if i am just trying to join the longest wagon!

I’m assuming this is sarcasm but…is it really?

[KayJayQueue]

I might have a really busy day at work today but I’ll be checking in as often as I can!

[KayJayQueue]

VOTE: Naerys

I’m not seeing it

[KayJayQueue]

what did willow do to get so many votes?

It’s crazy what you can learn when you participate lol

[KayJayQueue]

what did willow do to get so many votes?

It’s crazy what you can learn when you participate lol

I promise I’m not bitter except the part of me that’s bitter

[KayJayQueue]

I’d probably be obsessed if I had a wagon too but that’s probably just my natural state of anxiety.

[KayJayQueue]

I still think we should go dave

I could do dave too

Ι don't think that you have accused Dave of anything wrong. Why do you think that Dave's lime is good option?

Personally he feels different than his town games. He feels a bit more nervous here or something.

VOTE: hu toa

You were voting Dave, why the change once someone gives reasoning behind the vote on him?

[KayJayQueue]

You’re annoying

[KayJayQueue]

I still think one of Naerys, Kay and Oblivion is scum for their response to the Snow wagon. And Naerys is the only one of those three who commented on it (when she complained about my mocking tone).

I tried to pick a fight with Naerys, but unfortunately she declined to give me one.

Bold of you to accuse 3 people that aren’t currently voting for you when you only need 3 more votes to get hammered. Thats fun, I like it.

[KayJayQueue]

I still think one of Naerys, Kay and Oblivion is scum for their response to the Snow wagon. And Naerys is the only one of those three who commented on it (when she complained about my mocking tone).

I tried to pick a fight with Naerys, but unfortunately she declined to give me one.

Bold of you to accuse 3 people that aren’t currently voting for you when you only need 3 more votes to get hammered. Thats fun, I like it.

Not sure how much I like this post

Because?

[KayJayQueue]

Maybe I just don’t understand the finger pointing. It’s really easy to be on a wagon and then jump off (but not be the first to jump off, just in case, you know, it works) and wall post about how informative it was as if we’re supposed to just dismiss him being on the wagon as well. Feels like a good way to control the narrative, and continuing to reiterate the same reads as an attempt to get the vote off him.

[KayJayQueue]

It has some free time right now and it would like to do some solving with any player who is available. Is anyone available to go back and forth with it?

I’m around.

[KayJayQueue]

If you had a button to eliminate any player this second without ending the day, and they would flip, who would you choose?

My actual answer to that is incredibly biased and probably unfair so for the sake of the game, I’d say Will’o.

[KayJayQueue]

If you had a button to eliminate any player this second without ending the day, and they would flip, who would you choose?

My actual answer to that is incredibly biased and probably unfair so for the sake of the game, I’d say Will’o.

It does not want your political answer, it wants your actual answer.

NotAScum

[KayJayQueue]

UNVOTE:

That Naerys wagon makes no sense to me.

[KayJayQueue]

UNVOTE:

That Naerys wagon makes no sense to me.

How hard did you look at the vote reasons? Are they any more or less valid than typical for d1?
Also how does the comment relate to the unvote?

Well from what I saw, the reasons that people were sussing/voting her were things that I did as well. So if I agreed with the vote it would be like agreeing that I was in the same boat. Obviously, I don't agree with that assessment.

The unvote doesn't really relate but I didn't feel like making 2 posts. I unvoted to be able to add a vote to a someone that was not Naerys but I haven't felt strongly enough to do so. My gut says Will'O but I also have a couple other people I am considering. Just trying to gather info at this stage.

[KayJayQueue]

Do you have any suspicions?

No

Why are you voting Hu Tao?

I think it’s just a reflex at this point.

[KayJayQueue]

Jackson you’re in this game?! Wake up!!!

[KayJayQueue]

I'm not super happy with the amount of people not wanting to commit to any reads atm, but got to think about what that means for each of them right now.

I feel like this game is so stagnated that it’s hard to even feel any read is accurate when nothing has been happening. At least that’s how I’m feeling, personally. Usually 16 pages is enough to get something concrete but with 16 players, I’m finding it a bit more difficult.

[KayJayQueue]

Jackson you’re in this game?! Wake up!!!

I am! Be excited!

I’m

thrilled

! Now quick…give some reads

[KayJayQueue]

I was gonna go on a mass read fest when I got home

I’ve heard this before

[KayJayQueue]

I'm not super happy with the amount of people not wanting to commit to any reads atm, but got to think about what that means for each of them right now.

i'm not super happy with the amount of people not wanting to lay down a vote atm

VOTE: PenguinPower

Your wish is my command!

[KayJayQueue]

I feel like RN and Oblivion have been absent from the game and not just “not voting” so really it was me and Thomith that Penguin had the issue with but I don’t really see why it’s a problem. I explained when I unvoted that I wanted to figure out the best option that wasn’t Naerys since I didn’t believe in that wagon. Unfortunately, the game hasn’t moved much so I didn’t get much info on where to place my vote.

[KayJayQueue]

I am going to push back against saying that not voting means I’m not doing anything meaningful. If I’m actively following the game and gaining perspective on the players, I feel like that’s much more meaningful than someone that rvs’ immediately and then disappears.

[KayJayQueue]

You act like I haven’t been posting at all. I’ve given my views on multiple things. I fail to see how my vote on NAS was giving any more information than my vote on no one, especially when I explained why I unvoted. It just feels like you are only looking at VCs to get all your information instead of reading the game and forming an opinion from the actual content.

[KayJayQueue]

You act like I haven’t been posting at all.

Where did I say this? I was pretty explicity on my stance of posting/voting, but I don't recall saying or acting like you haven't been posting so if you could help me understand where I did that...

I don’t think this argument is worth it, so I’m going to disengage.

[KayJayQueue]

Just because a wagon is big(ger) doesn’t make it the right move.

And I say this as someone who is still willing to vote Will’o. I’m just saying I don’t think that’s a great way to look at wagons.

[KayJayQueue]

Just because a wagon is big(ger) doesn’t make it the right move.

And I say this as someone who is still willing to vote Will’o. I’m just saying I don’t think that’s a great way to look at wagons.

Wanna vote dave?

Oh no is this the peer pressure my mom warned me about…

[KayJayQueue]

I wouldn't be opposed to a NotAScum wagon here either I don't think.

Finally, I’ve found my people lol I only unvoted him because I didn’t think anyone cared about him (which I believe is his strategy)

[KayJayQueue]

Maybe I shouldn’t second guess myself.


VOTE: NAS

[KayJayQueue]

Just because a wagon is big(ger) doesn’t make it the right move.

And I say this as someone who is still willing to vote Will’o. I’m just saying I don’t think that’s a great way to look at wagons.

Wanna vote dave?

Oh no is this the peer pressure my mom warned me about…

Do it

Thom appealed to the side of me that would feel good as shit if NAS was the right lim lol

[KayJayQueue]

NaS can be vigged later. Every game has a vigilante these days, as you found out last game

Dave gives more info

Stop being logical

[KayJayQueue]

Actually I do also remember someone (I think Gera? Might have been dave) say NAS did this before as scum, which added to this a little bit too.

Which is why I originally voted him the first time. (Before my unvote and revote) I was in that same game and originally why I said my vote was probably biased when Oblivion asked who I wanted to yeet in post 290. Gera responded to Gypyx think NAS might be town in post 351.

[KayJayQueue]

Has anyone played with NAS when he’s town? Does he do the same thing? I only have one game with him so I’m worried about being too confident his day 1 actions are AI. Though now that there are multiple votes on him, maybe he’ll appear and say something helpful.

[KayJayQueue]

Has anyone played with NAS when he’s town? Does he do the same thing? I only have one game with him so I’m worried about being too confident his day 1 actions are AI. Though now that there are multiple votes on him, maybe he’ll appear and say something helpful.

I played. And yes, he did the same thing as town.

Well then I have no idea how to read him then.

[KayJayQueue]

I'm really not buying NAS, like, this play seems kinda too audacious to pull off as scum

Well I can at least say that I know this isn’t true lol

[KayJayQueue]

I'm not sure how much I like directing Vigs publicly

In my experience, Hu directs most PR publicly, vig or otherwise. I think she just likes to make her opinion known on what people should be doing at night. I don’t hate it lol

[KayJayQueue]

Every game has a vigilante these days.

so the shift away from complex modifiers in normals really just resulted in ensuring there's a pew pew in every game?

great move

If people can't have fun by making Odd-Night Disloyal Combined Checker Fruit Vendor they will have to give people guns and enjoy the carnage

Mmm fruit

[KayJayQueue]

I’m not fully V/LA or anything but activity level over the next 2 1/2 days will be greatly reduced as I’m starting my insane work hours as per every weekend. I’ll still be around though.

[KayJayQueue]

Jack come back and play

[KayJayQueue]

As I said, my NAS vote is purely biased from how he plays day 1 and how while apparently not AI as others noted, he was scum the last time he did it in a game why me. If he’s town…maybe I’m just overly invested right off the bat but I just don’t get purposely disengaging for all of day 1.

I was leaning Will’o earlier but the vt claim…I don’t really know what to do with that. Again, my experience is limited but the last time someone claimed vt with a wagon on them on D1, they actually had a PR. So now Will’o is a big question mark for me because I don’t even have a guess on if it’s vt, pr or scum.

[KayJayQueue]

NAS not posting will never be indicative of him having or not having a PR lol

[KayJayQueue]

I still think my reads are correct but I'm fine with a miselim if it wakes people up tomorrow

I’m just catnapping, loud noises will do the trick.

[KayJayQueue]

I’m a lil shocked nobody is coming after my ass considering how little I’ve posted compared to usual

I’ll come after your ass

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

[KayJayQueue]

I’m a lil shocked nobody is coming after my ass considering how little I’ve posted compared to usual

I’ll come after your ass

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Why do you refuse to vote dave?

Is that still a thing? I don’t remember the VC, I thought the vote moved to NAS sorry.

If it matters, my vote on Jack is very unserious.

Are we flipping Dave today? How many votes do we need on him to demand a claim? (I’m being serious with that question, is E-1 the usual “claim or die” slot?)

[KayJayQueue]

Wait there’s only 2 votes on him I thought I missed something big

[KayJayQueue]

I’m a lil shocked nobody is coming after my ass considering how little I’ve posted compared to usual

I’ll come after your ass

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Why do you refuse to vote dave?

She wants my ass clearly

He’s not wrong

[KayJayQueue]

I believe that's E-1

He claimed VT, are we hammering him anyway?

[KayJayQueue]

I don’t really have an opinion either way on Dave vs NAS, the person I wanted to lim today got to 5 votes at one point but then most people backed off the wagon so I doubt that’s going to happen.

[KayJayQueue]

Then again, if we’re just going to be limming someone that claimed VT, I think flipping Will’o gives us way more info than NAS does.

[KayJayQueue]

VOTE: Will’o

[KayJayQueue]

I could see scum team as NAS, keyjay, wisp

That’s a weird read

[KayJayQueue]

I could see scum team as NAS, keyjay, wisp

That’s a weird read

I would be surprised if u liked it since i sr u

I mean, it’s not so much the sr, can’t really avoid that entirely in a game of mafia, just the two you think I’d be in a team with is surprising. But I’m probably not seeing it from your pov so I’m not sure what you’re seeing there. Especially because if it was my choice, I’d be flipping one of those two (not the one about to get hammered lol)

[KayJayQueue]

Well that kill is upsetting. I might be losing interest in this game.

[KayJayQueue]

That's a very odd reaction, what's upsetting about it?

It’s more of a personal thing, he’s been like my security blanket in games. I guess it’s just a crutch and I have to get over it but I’m just being whiney about it.

[KayJayQueue]

This game feels incredibly stagnant for such a large player pool. Is this normal? It’s my first large game so I’m asking with earnest. It’s making it difficult for me to develop any substantial reads and it’s also making it harder to feel fully invested.

[KayJayQueue]

Wow all I had to do was mildly complain and bam!


Damn, I really wish I had a million dollars…
(just checking my luck here)

[KayJayQueue]

I have no experience with neighborhoods, so I might look for a little guidance on how to approach this. Are we just playing with the understanding that at least 1 person in that group is bad?

[KayJayQueue]

If you’re a baddie, you should respond to this post with an easily decipherable newbie-friendly code. TIA

[KayJayQueue]

If you’re a baddie, you should respond to this post with an easily decipherable newbie-friendly code. TIA

I Assume you don't Mean to actually Solicit sCum into oUting theMselves.

Hey everyone…you’re never going to believe this.

[KayJayQueue]

titus was opposed to revealing this hood but she hasn't updated us for a while and so we (me / thomith / snow kinda) decided to shake things up

To add to this - Me/Gypyx/to an extent Snow wanted to reveal this yesterday when the game started getting a little stale, but opted not to, on the off chance somebody TMI'd the hood, per Titus' suggestion.

We didn't reveal immediately in case there was a PT Cop that we could potentially verify the existence of.

Okay that’s interesting. Thank you for sharing your info with us. What about Dave? He seems to be the least talked about so far since you revealed, of the 5 players in this neighborhood. Do you think this is at all AI from Titus or no? I don’t really think I can comment on the different strategies of a neighborhood but I think I can understand her hesitancy.

[KayJayQueue]

threes probably a bit much. definitely one. potentially two.

can i at least ask you to trust my instinct and not completely shove it to the side? i'm telling you the vibes are extremely off, i could also probably make a decent case on that

sure. i'm not going to discount anything, but it's falls at the bottom of my likeliness pile

i think even if you don't trust it too much, it's more likely for us to have every scum in the hood than none of them

Second to the bottom it is then!

[KayJayQueue]

I’m an American that speaks one language, have mercy please.

[KayJayQueue]

I’m an American that speaks one language, have mercy please.

il n'y auras aucune pitié KayJayQueue

Why thank you, I’m going to assume you’re complimenting my hair.

[KayJayQueue]

I’m an American that speaks one language, have mercy please.

il n'y auras aucune pitié KayJayQueue

Okay I just translated this, I’m ready to start a Gypyx wagon

[KayJayQueue]

Like....I am tempted to just ignore the hood. We have all made The assumption there is scum in there, but i dont think the odds are any better than a Random player in the game so it isn't much use for a scum hunting tactic.

Or am I totally missing something? Some better than me explain it otherwise?

I think the odds are much better choosing 1 out of 5 instead of 1 of 8 (if you’re ignoring the hood, 1 of 13 if not)
Unless you’re arguing it’s not guaranteed that scum is in the 5. But everyone with experience so far has said there pretty much has to be (high percentage)
Sure, I highly doubt all scum are contained in the neighborhood so we still have a shot of catching scum outside but I wouldn’t say our odds are “better”.

But also I don’t fall under the “someone better than me” to explain so feel free to ignore.

[KayJayQueue]

it's almost as if we had a PT to coordiante revealing the hood

[KayJayQueue]

Is the plan to hammer Dave even with a claim, and then do the same the next day? I’m just trying to figure out if this is played differently than other games that don’t have neighborhoods. Can someone be in the neighborhood with a PR or is it just neighbor and they can’t be anything else (I’m just wondering if claiming even matters, or if it’s obvious, since I don’t fully understand the schematics)

[KayJayQueue]

2.03

Votecount 2.03

davesaz (E-2): Hu Tao, Random Nurse, Thomith, PenguinPower, davesaz
Naerys (1): Little Will o' Wisp
Random Nurse (1): Naerys

Not Voting (6): Gypyx, Oblivion, Snow2697, geraintm, KayJayQueue, Titus

With 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to secure an execution.

The day deadline is in (expired on 2024-04-06 10:29:00).

Mod Notes: The combined mod ISO is here.

I think Dave & Gypyx got mixed up

[KayJayQueue]

I'm quoting this to ping you because I don't think there's a specific post I want to talk about, just have a question generally.

Why did you jump off the NAS wagon yesterday near the end of the day, despite seemingly being on board with that execution earlier in the day?

623 & 624

It just felt like a pointless lim at that point. And I was on it most of the day because I’m really just not a fan of how he plays Day 1 but I’m not so stubborn that’s I’d lim just because of personal differences.

[KayJayQueue]

i would love to get more input from people outside of the hood

I want to see Ranger’s input after getting fully caught up. I’d feel bad just voting without giving her that chance. I think the hood will continue to in-fight no matter what because it seems so highly likely that there is scum there. Hu Tao is very convinced of her scumread and was the only one outside of the hood to consistently be voting Dave-slot. Unless Hu is bad, she generally has good gut reads and I tend to want to listen to her, I was just being stubborn day 1. Obviously there’s a chance that this bites me in the ass one of these games but so far, she seems town to me.

Day 1, Titus and snow were voting Dave-slot at certain points (moreso than Thom/Gypyx) and today they aren’t. I’m wondering if they changed their mind or if they’re also just waiting. I want to know why Thom/Gypyx didn’t feel like pushing Dave day 1, was there something that came up? Did he play day 1 weird? Does that slot definitely feel more scum to them than Titus/snow or does the vote on that slot just feel like the easiest to get support for?

If the consensus is to vote out that slot, I think we should, especially since there are a group of you with more info than the rest. However, I am worried that it will begin a tunnel effect on the neighborhood and I’m not sure I love that idea.

[KayJayQueue]

@Kay, A hood doesn't mean more information. Why do you think so?

I mean more information about how those people are acting. I just assumed you all had better reads on each other than the rest of us have on you, only because you have another thread to observe behavior. If that’s not actually true, then don’t mind me. I just sort of made that assumption on my own.

[KayJayQueue]

Not Voting (5): Oblivion, Snow2697, geraintm, KayJayQueue, Titus

Stop it. Stop it now.

What

[KayJayQueue]

Hmmm

Hmmm indeed.

VOTE: Naerys

I don’t follow this at all

[KayJayQueue]

Well I’m not voting Naerys. I don’t understand that vote. I’m willing to vote the Ranger/Dave-slot once she’s fully caught up if nothing really changes, I just didn’t want to be an ass and put her at e-1 when she asked for time to catch up. And now we have yet another person getting replaced.

[KayJayQueue]

Well I’m not voting Naerys. I don’t understand that vote. I’m willing to vote the Ranger/Dave-slot once she’s fully caught up if nothing really changes, I just didn’t want to be an ass and put her at e-1 when she asked for time to catch up. And now we have yet another person getting replaced.

Perhaps consider reading my content and using it to reflect on your stances rather than assuming I should be eliminated immediately after providing my thoughts.

I said “if nothing changes” which includes my read on you once you’ve caught up. Dave didn’t have much content so I didn’t have much to go off of. I’m willing to change my mind, but I’m not going to just assume my vote before I see your thoughts. I’m waiting and giving you the chance to catch up, as I said I would.

[KayJayQueue]

Ranger, vote Naerys with me

Isn’t she already?

[KayJayQueue]

Ranger, vote Naerys with me

Isn’t she already?

The VC wasn’t updated when I posted this lol

[KayJayQueue]

Is the plan for today that we vote inside the neighborhood, no matter which player it is? What is the consensus of everyone here on that? Should we be focusing on those 5 players or is there a realistic chance someone outside that group could be limmed(and is this a good strategy)? It feels like it’s nearly a forgone conclusion that at least one of the five is scum.

I believe I know Gypyx would say absolutely inside the 5 because she thinks 2-3 are bad. Actually it seems like Gypyx, Thom and snow all prefer to lim inside the neighborhood. I believe Hu Tao is going to stay on Ranger. RN is going to stay on Ranger because he won’t be here for 3 days. I’m trying to think if there’s even a possibility of another lim going through other than Ranger here since we need 7 votes.

This is all to say, my vote is still tentatively going on Ranger if I’m not convinced by her arguments once she’s caught up. Not necessarily because I think she’s the scum of the 5, but because I honestly don’t know who it’s most likely to be and her wagon has the most support. Maybe that’s too sheepish of me, but I don’t have a strong enough read to confidently choose someone to lim right now so I’m following others’ leads. I’ll also say that I’m really interested in what snow is saying, and I’m getting town vibes from his latest contributions. However, the neighborhood dynamics still elude me a bit so my reads on those 5 might be a little too influenced by all the neighborhood talk when I should be concentrating on what I can see with my own eyes.

[KayJayQueue]

Ranger, I’ve been waiting patiently for you to catch up. You had been reading page by page originally. Are you caught up? Where exactly are you on reads/do you have an updated reads list? There’s been a lot of talk about how we’re on the wrong path as a town but that argument is feeling cyclical at the moment. I can’t figure out if your latest reads (especially on Naerys) are based on the game as a whole, recent events, or the beginning of the game.

[KayJayQueue]

Well I guess that answers my question. Nevermind. I await updates.

[KayJayQueue]

Ugh

[KayJayQueue]

I'm getting through the elimination phase of day 1. How do you feel about how this went down, Kay?

After NM claimed, I’d have much rather have had your slot voted because I thought it’d give us more information. I said as much in 621, 623, 624, and 625.

I also think that a lot of my NM opinions are biased and based on playstyle and I didn’t want to be that person.

[KayJayQueue]

I'll get up to that part. Holy hell this wagon goes on for 200+ posts. Was my slot a primary driver in getting this elimination through? Any comments on whether the NAS flip got us anything? Was it all-town? Throw me a bone.

No your slot was voting Dave-slot (Ranger) but preferred voting Naerys.

[KayJayQueue]

Well, do you still want my slot for elim? Did you get anything out of the flip?

I’ll tell you once I see where your head is at after you catch up. I’m trying to be gracious to both rep ins. I did prefer you until the neighborhood information was shared. That made me have to reposition but then the reps happened. So I’m waiting for you and Ranger to share your POVs before I make decisions.

[KayJayQueue]

I deliberately applied pressure to her because i was struggling to read her, but with how she responded to that pressure I am leaving towards her being town.

Last time I played with her when we were both Town I was questioning her and she shut down, tuetled uo, refused to answer any questions, and then got yeeted.

I was in that game (if I’m interpreting this correctly) and I believe her actions in this game resemble those where she was town, especially now with the self vote. It’s not a perfect read but if anyone is wondering why I’m town-reading her and refuse to vote there, that’s why. Also, I’ve just generally agreed with things she’s said this game. (save for a passing scumread on me)

[KayJayQueue]

Well, I just did an entire page and a half of readslists with nobody else contributing.

I was letting you finish your catch up and then Armageddon happened lol

[KayJayQueue]

It’s supposed to be fixed now I think? I didn’t do the IP thing to get in.

[KayJayQueue]

But I’m going to assume all games will get an extension due to the technical issues.

[KayJayQueue]

It’s supposed to be fixed now I think? I didn’t do the IP thing to get in.

Mines still being weird on mobile.

Oh that’s odd. That’s all I’m using! I guess I got lucky.

[KayJayQueue]

Ranger can you please give explanations for these reads more than just names in a list? I feel like you think we should understand why they were moving up and down relative to the page number…it wasn’t as helpful as I think you believe it was. At least not for me.

[KayJayQueue]

That's E-1 I believe

RN was already voting her so I think maybe E-2? I’m thinking I might not get an explanation that I’m wanting for the shifting reads and I feel like I’ve been waiting quite awhile for what seems like a pretty underwhelming catch-up without much explanation. I want to put her at E-1 but I don’t want to accidentally hammer so we can get a claim.

Can we get a VC maybe?

[KayJayQueue]

That's E-1 I believe

RN was already voting her so I think maybe E-2? I’m thinking I might not get an explanation that I’m wanting for the shifting reads and I feel like I’ve been waiting quite awhile for what seems like a pretty underwhelming catch-up without much explanation. I want to put her at E-1 but I don’t want to accidentally hammer so we can get a claim.

Can we get a VC maybe?

Let it ask you this. When Ranger inevitably claims a power role as scum to protect themselves, will you consider that congruent with how they have played?

It doesn't.

I still haven’t played enough to get to an understanding of claiming PR vs VT. I think I’ve seen an even split in what scum claims. I wonder how likely it is that the neighborhood would also contain a PR. Do scum usually claim a PR to bait out a double claim and/or avoid the hammer? If that’s the case, I’m confused why I’ve seen so many scum also claim VT at e-1. I’m not sure I understand the strategy with that one.

Do I think Ranger has a PR? No, not especially.

[KayJayQueue]

Honestly, with how they played, I’d have expected Dave to be more likely to have a PR than Ranger. But since they’re the same slot…who knows. I’m heavily leaning towards no PR though.

[KayJayQueue]

You shouldn’t have said that so openly because if she is scum, she’d surely pivot now.

[KayJayQueue]

I'll say before bed; you all really

have

slacked.

I'm usually not topping the post charts; despite replacing in half a week ago, I'm already the third-highest poster and climbing.

I’m not 100% positive if you are at E-1 or E-2 but once we get a vote count my intent is to either put you at E-1 or hammer, whichever it is. I think we’d all appreciate a claim at this point. I won’t hammer without a claim but I can’t guarantee any one else won’t either.

[KayJayQueue]

I don’t think anyone should be discrediting every person that’s voting you just because you say it’s wrong. Obviously we don’t have a way of knowing what is and isn’t “correct” unless someone has extra info. You saying votes are not for valid reasons seems like an unfair assessment of the effort we are putting into solving.

I do find it slightly odd that there hasn’t been any kind of real counter wagon. That might be my only hesitation currently.

[KayJayQueue]

It is almost as if the scum team got an injection of motivation with a replacement player.

Is that accurate? If the scum team includes Ranger and she’s pretty likely to be limmed, wouldn’t a motivated team be aiding in this somehow? Unless I’ve overlooked some posts, I can always go back and reread but it currently seems like everyone is at least content with the Ranger vote. That is slightly worrying to me. Does anyone else have an opinion on lack of counter? Is this just paranoia?

[KayJayQueue]

I feel like I should disengage with this for awhile while I reread the last few pages. You’re making me feel like I’m an idiot and maybe it’s lack of sleep but I’m feeling a bit out of my depth right now. I feel like I’m defending myself for trying to play the game. I think I was even the most vocal about letting you catch up on your reads too. I was very eager for your input especially since Dave didn’t really give me a ton to go off of. I guess I’m just not used to a play style like yours and I’ll have to adjust to it.

[KayJayQueue]

I gave page by page changes in my reads.

Did any stick out to you? Did you even

look

at them?

This feels extremely condescending. I was very invested in your catch up. I read every single post and actually reread most of the game along with your catch up. It gave me a better appreciation for a couple slots so I think it was helpful for my reads. I was waiting to see if you’d be giving a detailed analysis of your ending reads list and was drafting a post asking when the world ended last night. Then things kicked off today with full force and I jumped in the convo instead of redrafting up the post I was going to make last night. Mostly because I’m traveling all day today, I’m on my second plane headed toward a full work weekend so I was waiting until I got to the hotel later to sit down and get to it.

[KayJayQueue]

That distressed me

Thankfully I had smart people in the discord reassuring me that everything was fine.

[KayJayQueue]

I feel like I’m being beaten into submission with how today is going.

[KayJayQueue]

i feel like if rangers claim is true then Hu should just fly through the window

God I love playing with you and Hu

[KayJayQueue]

i feel like if rangers claim is true then Hu should just fly through the window

God I love playing with you and Hu

What are your reads?

This Ranger stuff has occupied the forefront of my brain for days but I can say I have a better feeling about Thom after rereading during Ranger’s updates. I’m conflicted about Will’o’s slot but I’m vibing more with the slot now with Lucan than on Day 1. I am feeling slightly less good about snow but I was mostly null on him after the flashwagon fiasco. I want to believe Thom and Gypyx are both town but I don’t think I’m fully townreading Gypyx yet. I still feel fine about naerys, Oblivion and you. Though you’d be at the bottom of those three because you’ve been so adamant about the Dave thing and I didn’t understand the read. But it feels like how you play as town, I think. Penguin, RN, gera…I don’t know.

[KayJayQueue]

VOTE: PenguinPower

Until I figure out which person from the neighborhood I think is the best to vote, I’m using my vote to give information about what I’m thinking, since apparently not voting is the work of the devil according to some. (sorry for being hyperbolic) But also, if wanting to glean info from someone’s voting history if they are killed/limmed is a big thing, I don’t mind this being put out there.

I don’t like Day 2 from Penguin. I didn’t really love his D1 either. Maybe it’s just his playstyle but continually prodding people to vote and saying they add nothing to the game unless they vote is odd to me since he seems to vote randomly with no explanation a good amount of the time. He says talk is meaningless yet votes (sometimes) with no (obvious) incentive. Seems like he does that so he can retroactively come up with any explanation he wants for his votes.

[KayJayQueue]

I could vote this. I don't really want anyone in the hood atm

Do you just mean currently or like D2 in general?

[KayJayQueue]

This game sucks.

Yeah it’s not super fun…

[KayJayQueue]

I have the sneaking suspicion that should Ranger flip Town I'll be the convenient scapegoat.

Wait why would you be the scapegoat?

[KayJayQueue]

Am I just being paranoid that I feel like the last couple pages has been a purposeful distraction? I just don’t know who is actually the guilty party, I can’t tell which posts/feelings are genuine and which might not be. I have felt so disconnected from the game a lot of the time. I think the D1 disconnection can be explained by a hidden neighborhood which seemed to produce a less active town. But D2 has just felt so abrasive and aggressive from so many people, I feel like I’m getting lost in the shuffle. I don’t even know if I believe it’s best to vote in the hood or not! Like, I don’t know what the right choice is here. And I want to go to certain people I’m familiar with but I don’t have crazy strong townreads to know if I’ll get genuine advice or not.

Why am I finding this game in particular so difficult? Is it the size? Are large games much harder than mini/micros? I can’t articulate what I’m feeling very well right now. Sorry for rambling. And the tinfoil hat.

[KayJayQueue]

Am I just being paranoid that I feel like the last couple pages has been a purposeful distraction? I just don’t know who is actually the guilty party, I can’t tell which posts/feelings are genuine and which might not be. I have felt so disconnected from the game a lot of the time. I think the D1 disconnection can be explained by a hidden neighborhood which seemed to produce a less active town. But D2 has just felt so abrasive and aggressive from so many people, I feel like I’m getting lost in the shuffle. I don’t even know if I believe it’s best to vote in the hood or not! Like, I don’t know what the right choice is here. And I want to go to certain people I’m familiar with but I don’t have crazy strong townreads to know if I’ll get genuine advice or not.

Why am I finding this game in particular so difficult? Is it the size? Are large games much harder than mini/micros? I can’t articulate what I’m feeling very well right now. Sorry for rambling. And the tinfoil hat.

it's okay Kay we know you are town you don't need to shove it in our face

That’s not what I was trying to do. I just want to have a strong read and it’s fucking me up that I don’t. Anyone that’s played with me (when I’m town) knows how tunnel-y I get, and how stubborn I am about it. I’m not sure how to operate without solid reads. Especially on Day 2! I want to blame the factors that makes this game different: neighborhood & size, but that feels like such a cop out excuse to me. And it doesn’t change anything even if that’s the issue.

[KayJayQueue]

that was just a jokey way of saying that it's a towny post girl, not me criticizing you

Well, maybe to get you started somewhere, what's your opinion on Naerys? I feel like it's a pretty polarizing slot

I’ve been consistent in my townlean on her. I don’t want to vote her. And I don’t think she should be in contention for a lim.

[KayJayQueue]

Oh jk we killed somebody (I did nothing but watch lol)

[KayJayQueue]

sounds in character for the eye pfp person

Nah that’s to imply I’m watcher in every game obviously.

[KayJayQueue]

I’m sorry I didn’t listen to you literally Day 1, Hu. I should’ve just trusted you but then this neighborhood stuff got in my head. And Ranger kinda scared me with how aggressive she was when I was trying to be gracious while she caught up.

So are we continuing on with looking inside the hood? I’m scared of tunneling there and not looking at all options. I still stand behind my Penguin vote but I think I need to take a backseat for the first few days of D2 to reevaluate other players.

I’d like the opinions of the other 4 hood players on if they feel we definitely have another scum in hood. (I think I know where Thom and Gypyx stand)

[KayJayQueue]

I still don’t think it’s Naerys.

[KayJayQueue]

Yet another push on me. Makes no sense from town!players standpoint.
On D1 I identified 4 categories of players:
1 - me
2 - Gypyx-Thomith-Titus-geraintm-Little Will o' Wisp/Lycanfire-PenguinPower-Dave/Ranger who were on my speedwagon on D1
3 - Naerys-Kay-Oblivion who criticized the speedwagon on me
4 - NAS - RN - Jackson - Hu Tao - remaining players.



Noteworthy that all scum kills were in category 4.

What do you think this could mean?

[KayJayQueue]

I have a feeling this neighbor v neighbor v neighbor is going to cripple us going forward. Because if we lim one today that flips town, there’s no stopping a tunnel on yet another one the next day. I think you guys might be right that the hood could have 2 scum but I worry we will get hung up on that and scum will use it as a distraction every day. I’m mostly apprehensive because currently I lean toward the Thom/Gypyx side being town (Thom mostly, Gypyx after) but what if we flip snow and even Titus and both are town? We’re so screwed because we’ll all be too paranoid NOT to flip the remaining hood. Obviously if snow flips red, yay for us but I’m just thinking of worst case scenarios here.

I’ll continue withholding my vote for now (sorry penguin I know you hate that) but I genuinely worry about what we do today and how it might shape the rest of the game. I welcome other opinions and insight on this, especially from anyone with experience playing games with neighborhoods. I might be getting too paranoid but I’d rather stay a bit apprehensive than be complacent.

[KayJayQueue]

I mean, as I said, I still strongly feel like my Penguin vote had merit but I honestly don’t really know where many people stand on the player list in general because of all the hood focus. I’ll make a reads list as well and I’d really appreciate if others could too, just to give us a bigger picture understanding of where we all stand currently on our reads.

[KayJayQueue]

Yet another push on me. Makes no sense from town!players standpoint.
On D1 I identified 4 categories of players:
1 - me
2 - Gypyx-Thomith-Titus-geraintm-Little Will o' Wisp/Lycanfire-PenguinPower-Dave/Ranger who were on my speedwagon on D1
3 - Naerys-Kay-Oblivion who criticized the speedwagon on me
4 - NAS - RN - Jackson - Hu Tao - remaining players.



Noteworthy that all scum kills were in category 4.

What do you think this could mean?

That most of the scums are not in category 4?

I mean..obviously lol I just thought there was a theory on why they were being killed over others.

[KayJayQueue]

This makes sense. We need to understand when we stop voting into the hood.
If not the hood, an option can be to look at Naerys-geraintm (both did not vote scum!Dave, but voted town!NAS)

I feel like I should be included in this group too (unfortunately). Even though I didn’t end the day voting NAS, I started that wagon and was probably partially responsible for that lim happening.

[KayJayQueue]

Situational doesn't match. Lycan was clearly town from replacement and Peguin was disconnected enough to rejoin and simply believe the claim if he wanted. Town and Town. Ranger was very clearly trying to live.

I agree withbthe last statement.

I believe at least one person hard pushing Ranger was probably bussing, because I believe that slot was kind of doomed already.

Oh I fully understand this statement now that I’ve been given aid to expand my mafia vocabulary! And I also agree that someone (possibly hard pushing at times) was doing it strategically. I need to figure out who.

[KayJayQueue]

There was a point at which Ranger was going to live yesterday, after the claim. For it, only Thomith or Gypyx can be bussing, because the others came along to nail in the coffin Ranger.

Okay I’m technically still learning the extent of the vocabulary. Can someone explain why just being on the wagon isn’t bussing? Is it to do with hammering? I’m asking genuinely please don’t think I’m trying to play dumb to look a specific way. I just want to fully understand what the reasoning is so I don’t analyze things incorrectly for this and future games.

[KayJayQueue]

I have a feeling this neighbor v neighbor v neighbor is going to cripple us going forward. Because if we lim one today that flips town, there’s no stopping a tunnel on yet another one the next day. I think you guys might be right that the hood could have 2 scum but I worry we will get hung up on that and scum will use it as a distraction every day. I’m mostly apprehensive because currently I lean toward the Thom/Gypyx side being town (Thom mostly, Gypyx after) but what if we flip snow and even Titus and both are town? We’re so screwed because we’ll all be too paranoid NOT to flip the remaining hood.

I don't think the hood is very relevant right now. What's your take on what is going on in the thread?

I really think the hood is a distraction that is hurting us. I don’t think we should ignore it but I think we would be making a mistake not to look outside of it. Of course I have apprehension that if (and for my current takes, please note that I’m leaning toward the possibility of 2 scum in hood though I won’t die on that) the second scum lies in Gypyx/Thom, which I currently don’t believe is the case but if my reads are wrong and one IS scum, that we’ve gotten so twisted that I think we will end up trying to vote out every hood member and it might lose us the game. I need to look at the numbers and see what the possibilities are with how many people we can vote out and then the number that could possibly get nightkilled before we just lose. This isn’t taking into account any extra deaths due to vig, no kill nights due to some other OR, or what have you. Because I don’t think I know mechanics well enough to speculate on those things accurately.

BUT, if the consensus becomes Naerys today, I’m probably going to rub people the wrong way yet again because I really, really don’t think that’s a good lim.

[KayJayQueue]

Who is scum and why, Kay?

-One of {Titus, Snow, and to a lesser degree Gypyx}
-PenguinPower

Those are my strongest degree. My next tier up would be {gera, RN} and I’m conflicted because I don’t want to put you in that tier because of your D2 but I’m still a bit hung up on your slot from D1 and I think I’m second guessing myself too much to just ignore it. So you’d be 3rd in that tier, after RN. But I am not very confident on any of those 3 definitely being bad so my focus is on the 4 players I listed first.

It may seem hypocritical that I listed hood players first after complaining that we are tunneling as a town on the hood but we also can’t just ignore it. But if I were voting outside of hood today, it would currently be Penguin.

[KayJayQueue]

Who is scum and why, Kay?

-One of {Titus, Snow, and to a lesser degree Gypyx}
-PenguinPower

Those are my strongest degree. My next tier up would be {gera, RN} and I’m conflicted because I don’t want to put you in that tier because of your D2 but I’m still a bit hung up on your slot from D1 and I think I’m second guessing myself too much to just ignore it. So you’d be 3rd in that tier, after RN. But I am not very confident on any of those 3 definitely being bad so my focus is on the 4 players I listed first.

It may seem hypocritical that I listed hood players first after complaining that we are tunneling as a town on the hood but we also can’t just ignore it. But if I were voting outside of hood today, it would currently be Penguin.

reads* not degree

[KayJayQueue]

-One of {Titus, Snow, and to a lesser degree Gypyx}
-PenguinPower

Have they made bad posts?

Ahhh I know where this is going and I’m currently 51 hours into a 58-60 hour 4 day work weekend and then I have to hop on a plane at 5am to travel home. I won’t be able to thoroughly go through and give specifics on these players for a while and I’m just being realistic about my capabilities in multiple capacities: firstly, that I am on mobile only right now and secondly, my mental exhaustion from the weekend. If you’d still like this in a couple days, I’ll happily draft that post as soon as I physically and mentally can. I’m not trying to dodge this in any way, I just don’t want to make promises I can’t fulfill for maybe 2 days.

[KayJayQueue]

Have players casually forgotten that Naerys voted themselves because they did not want to read Ranger's posting anymore, only to them be ignored as a wagon choice by Ranger... And then TRY TO SAVE RANGER AT END OF DAY?

It cannot see past that dissonance. It views either the emotional reaction Naerys had to be faked or the emotional reaction was real but Naerys still tried to save scum anyway.

In either case, it fits Ranger scum partner.

I played a game recently with Naerys where she also self-voted and had an emotional reaction that got her scumread and mislimmed as town. Nothing is telling me this situation is much different at the core. I don’t think the goal was to save scum at all and I believe her frustration because I’ve seen it before. Could I be wrong and she’s using her recent game to replicate “town” behavior? It’s a possibility but it seems unlikely. That combined with how I read her on D1 is enough (for me) to not want her pushed unless we get information that supports it. Not just “probably fake AtE”, that’s not enough when it very well could be real.

Maybe RN can weigh in on this because he was also in the game I’m referencing. I might give his opinion more weight if he thinks I’m trusting this too much.

[KayJayQueue]

Also like

to add onto that massclaim aversion, scum are very obviously afraid of who could be a PR

let's not make their work easier

My thinking was like the last game I played, scum got trapped by the mass claim, their options got narrowed down and the game ended quickly.

Wow sounds like scum sucked ass that game

[KayJayQueue]

who would even claim N2 informed lmaoooooo

What a noob

[KayJayQueue]

Kay, how many scum do you think are in this game?

Will post more later or if anyone catches me in the next 5 min, that's all I can be here for.

At least 3, max of 4. I’ve only ever been in games with 2-3 so sometimes I forget that 4 is possible because it feels overpowered. At least, it feels that way for me.

Why are you asking me specifically? Am I wrong that 4 is a possibility?

[KayJayQueue]

We assume there's at least 4, period.

Wait can there be 5? That’s insane if a possibility.

[KayJayQueue]

What do you mean?

[KayJayQueue]

That the thought there is 5 scum in this game is horridly fake.

Well originally, I never thought that until RN said it could be possible. I didn’t really do much research about large games so I took what he said at face value since I never had 5 in my mind but I am aware that I could be wrong when it comes to game mechanics. Actually I wouldn’t even say that I’m wrong, just ignorant (or a nicer way to say it - uninformed)

[KayJayQueue]

So who you voting KJQ? You’ve already limited yourself.

Well it’s a toss up between Titus/Gypyx/Snow OR you. At the moment. I just don’t want to get so distracted by the hood but it’s really hard to fully ignore. I guess I’m not so sure on RN but it’s not enough to push him.

[KayJayQueue]

We’ve hit one scum in hood. Why are you still wanting to vote in with certainty over out given you keep saying it’s a distraction?



Why am I scum?

I didn’t say I for sure want to vote there but I’m just sharing my current feelings. But since I think you’re bad I guess there’s no reason to try to convince you of anything or argue with you because if I’m right, of course you’re going to argue everything I say.

[KayJayQueue]

So you can’t articulate a reason. Got it.

I was answering the first question but I don’t need to bow to you just because you’re being aggressive. You’re so condescending and I don’t really feel like interacting with someone like that when I don’t think you’re actually trying to help town. Go ahead and sus me all you want, you’re not going to bully me into continuing this cycle.

[KayJayQueue]

Maybe I just don’t respond well to your playstyle and it inherently feels scummy to me personally. I won’t rule that out but I’m not going to just ignore my gut because I *might* be letting my emotions dictate my reads. If we decide we are voting outside the hood, I’m still going to be voting Penguin. I don’t want to be a pushover just because I’m getting pressured.

[KayJayQueue]

Am I supposed to just ignore that happened?


Ugh but I’m not looking forward to another rep-in because Ranger truly did my mind in.

[KayJayQueue]

PP is town without any shadow of a doubt.

I don’t know how this can be such a confident read. Is this all to do with Ranger and the vote?

[KayJayQueue]

Okay, I was just trying to rule out other reasons you might have, so that’s helpful.

[KayJayQueue]

Ranger legit did my head in and I pivoted away from the hood because I was confused what the right choice was. Maybe that was her whole strategy, well it worked on me.

[KayJayQueue]

Well unless this is an insane bluff… snow seems serious and it makes me not want to vote him.

[KayJayQueue]

Well unless this is an insane bluff… snow seems serious and it makes me not want to vote him.

Allow me to remind you of what happened when ranger claimed N3 vig N4 jailkeeper

Yeah I got mindfucked lol

[KayJayQueue]

Are you feeling better now Kay? Hoping to see the things your scumreads have said that tickle your brain. I'm having trouble seeing where you're coming from today.

Honestly, I don’t even know anymore. I’m trying not to give up but I feel like I have no idea what’s happening and that all my reads are shit. I don’t think I’ve added one useful piece of information to this game at all. I think I bit off more than I could chew with a large size game and I hate that I’m making excuses instead of rereading and re-developing my reads. And I have no idea what to think now about this snow v gypyx stuff.

[KayJayQueue]

So I’m caught up and I’m glad the Gypyx/Thom stuff came out because I wasn’t confident on snow but I was very confident on Thom, and Gypyx was in the middle for me but my fear was if the first flipped town, we’d keep going down the hood list especially with the proposed 1 for 1 and that worried me that it was possibly a distraction that scum was trying to benefit from, yet who stood to benefit most? Those outside of the hood, so I’m looking there. I still don’t know how I feel about Titus but she’s hood so I’m got going to focus hard on her yet. I think the others I feel less good about are Psych and Lycan, mostly based on the previous slot owners. I’ll admit I liked Lycan’s contributions more once he repped in and he felt very solve-y but I can’t be sure that was fully genuine based on how Will’o was playing or if Lycan just did a great job turning around the trajectory of his slot. I still think my earlier reads on naerys are good. I am not sure about RN or gera but I feel better about Gera currently. Oblivion I townread most of this game but has seemed a bit different since the Ranger flip so I’m not sure if it’s just a shift in playstyle with gained confidence that felt jarring to it’s earlier play or if it’s something else.

I’d say I’m here:
Town: Thom, Gypyx
Townlean: Naerys
Slight town: Oblivion, Gera
Unsure: Random Nurse, Snow
Scumleam: Titus, Psyche, Lycan

Sorry for being around less, and i just began my work weekend so until Monday I might be less active but I’ll stay caught up as much as possible.

[KayJayQueue]

With all that said, for now I will be here:

VOTE: Psyche

[KayJayQueue]

Kay i'll ask you too, what are your reasons for TR'ing oblivion exactly?

I think it was mostly Day 1. Day 2 was not super AI either way for me but it didn’t make me like it wasn’t town. But today it has been very aggressive and has made me feel less good about the townread. I’m not sure if the change was just nailing scum or what but it felt like it was making it seem like it held the power to lim or save Ranger before the lim happened. So I’m having difficulty reading that situation especially after D3 started and it was very adamant it knew the solve going forward. Maybe that’s enough to take the town lean away and be squarely in the middle of my reads.

[KayJayQueue]

VOTE: kjq

also, im kinda surprised gypyx still scumreads me!

all of the votes for me are quite mysterious. penguinpower must have been quite the rascal

1291 was my original reasoning for voting this slot and I haven’t gotten anything since that has made me feel better about the slot or that I was wrong with my opinion. I’m sorry I didn’t rehash all of my feelings in an above post but I figured you had caught up on the game and would’ve paid particular attention to posts/votes regarding your slot. So to say I didn’t say why I voted feels like just trying to make something out of nothing to make me look sus.

[KayJayQueue]

- if you yourself were caught up on the game, you'd have noticed the several times i've said that i'm not
- 1291 is almost 30 pages ago!

Then why are you voting without the full scope of the game? And it may be 30 pages ago but like I said, it was directly referencing your slot so I figured it’d stick out more than others especially since your slot wasn’t really on the radar much especially when the neighborhood stuff happened.

I guess I’ll just eagerly await you getting caught up, I’m sorry for being pushy.

[KayJayQueue]

Then why are you voting without the full scope of the game?

I think it's reasonably likely that you're scum based on what I've read.

Well then I definitely will be waiting for you to get fully caught up because I’m not and I hope you’ll see that. If there’s anything you want an explanation on, just ask please.

[KayJayQueue]

I guess that’s just how I play the game at this stage in my mafia career. It’s unfortunate that I haven’t developed the skills you so desperately think I need to be exhibiting or else you just assume I’m scum. I’m sorry I’m not a pro that knows exactly what to do and how the best way to analyze posts are. I don’t even know how to argue against this because I have no defense for literally just playing the game the way I know how. This game has had things I’ve never encountered and a lot of it was focused on for Day 2 and then the rep-in stuff that was very overwhelming because Ranger was doing whatever she was doing. I’m falling back on the only non-hood reads I’ve had this game and so no, they’re not going to be fully developed as if I’ve been focusing on them for 3 days, because I haven’t been focused on them. And the next thing I’m sure I’ll be told is to just go back through the entire game and come up with something better which feels a bit hypocritical from someone who isn’t even caught up themself.

The point I’ve been trying to make is that I don’t have much to go off of but these are the reads I do have. But also I feel a lot more targeted whenever I attempt to contribute with my reads when some players barely explain anything because what? I’m an easy target to try to fluster and make to appear like I’m scum? I don’t know the motivation but it’s getting exhausting because I don’t know how to play the way people seem to be expecting. And the way I do play is completely dismissed of all merit. I’m trying my best.

[KayJayQueue]

i think kay is doing the same thing as in that other game

the wallpost doesn't attempt to address my core problem with her iso. it's excuses that should frankly be stale at this point and tries to explain in terms of a gap in apparent skill what is actually a gap in apparent interest.

it doesn't take experience to be genuinely interested in whether your reads are correct or not. all it takes is being town and caring about winning as town.

imo kay's posts only barely veil that she doesn't really care if her reads are correct this game

So my points are stale that after 3 completed games, I should be playing up to the level you’re expecting? I’m so sick of being told that either I’m too new to be trusted to make the right moves or not new enough anymore that I shouldn’t be making all the mistakes I’m supposedly making. And then if I make wall post, I’m just making excuses or being emotional. Check any other game besides that first game we played together and tell me I don’t act like this and get defensive and upset no matter my alignment. I am just exceedingly frustrated every time I have to deal with this. It’s so hard to enjoy a game when I can’t just play how I’m learning to play and still developing these skills without being shit on for not having everything down yet. Up until Psyche, no one was really doing that to me this game even though I’m sure I was making mistakes and not playing optimally, at least I was given room to play and I appreciated that more than you could know. Now I have the audacity to scum read someone, he reps out and his rep in decides to jump on me instead of anyone else because it’s easier to point out my flaws than anyone else voting him.

[KayJayQueue]

i think kay is doing the same thing as in that other game

the wallpost doesn't attempt to address my core problem with her iso. it's excuses that should frankly be stale at this point and tries to explain in terms of a gap in apparent skill what is actually a gap in apparent interest.

it doesn't take experience to be genuinely interested in whether your reads are correct or not. all it takes is being town and caring about winning as town.

imo kay's posts only barely veil that she doesn't really care if her reads are correct this game

You think I don’t care about my reads being right? That’s literally ridiculous. I’m sorry but at this point you’re just trying to upset me because that accusation doesn’t fly since as I said before, you aren’t even caught up on the game. You’re now just tunneling because you think my reaction is proving your point.

[KayJayQueue]

I've provided detailed reasons I think you're nit invested in having correct reads. In that context, it is unduly dismissive to call my stance ridiculous. It's also frankly insulting to assert that I've only said these things to make someone upset. I'm actually really against making people upset on a moral level! I am just trying to develop my reads and play the game.

Well if you’re really against making people upset on a moral level, I’d suggest you reread my posts from a human level and understand that what you see as excuses is me desperately trying to be understood for exactly how I’m feeling. You continually berating me and telling me I’m purposely playing the way I am because I am uninvested or insinuating I’m scum because of it and then tossing aside anything I say to justify your stance (at least that’s how it feels) feels pretty damn terrible.

And I think you’d understand that it’s a delicate subject for me seeing as I know you know that I’ve expressed my feelings on this elsewhere in this forum because it was such a big deal and something I’ve been dealing with ever since my first game, as it’s been extremely disheartening to encounter consistently and thus is regardless of alignment in my games. So I apologize for being defensive but I’m not sorry for feeling this way.

[KayJayQueue]

kqj, if you thought there was a reasonable chance that PP's posting was just his playstyle, what have you done or used to rule out or discount this possibility? Is the answer "nothing"? I know it's inconvenient if it's nothing, but a clear answer would objectively help town sort whether what I'm saying has any merit.

I can’t give you a full explanation because of ongoing games but yes, the answer is nothing. It has lot to do with my frustration with the player and wasn’t in a good headspace to look through tons of his content. I also didn’t really have the time when it came up, not even taking into account my feelings, and then he repped out and I didn’t feel like doing it at that point because I wanted to see if things felt different with you in the slot. If you think that’s AI, which I’m sure you do, then push me I guess but I highly doubt anything I say will change your mind about me at this point.

[KayJayQueue]

I guess the problem is with my personality in general because I think I’m bad at everything and it dictates how I do pretty much anything, including play mafia. I’m always scared of doing the wrong thing and I’m learning that that makes for a shitty mafia player. It sucks because I really love playing but this seems to be consistently an issue in my games, and that means I’m the constant in the equation. I’m sorry I was taking it out on you, psyche. This is definitely my own issue that I need to work on.

[KayJayQueue]

First rule about hood club, you don’t talk about hood club.

[KayJayQueue]

i’m lowkey thinking of not really bothering to try finishing the readthrough when the odds are so good that i won’t survive the day
but i guess that would be kind of immature of me

I’ll unvote to give you the time to catch up, would that be enough for you to want to try finishing?

[KayJayQueue]

like seriously kay. still find it very frustrating that you know your read could be wrong, know exactly how your read could be wrong, all that but aren’t taking straightforward steps to sus the matter out. you have so many options here!

I’m sorry but since Thursday until Sunday I’m working insane hours, I literally can’t do what you want me to do because I’d want to be on my laptop. I just have my phone and won’t have laptop access until I fly home Monday and even then I’ll be wiped because my travel/work weekends are exhausting. Yeah, I know, another excuse in your eyes but some people (I think in this game) have seen my timesheets and can tell you I’m not lying. My job is crazy. Im still staying caught up on the thread though. Why is none of this energy being directed toward those that barely show up at all? I’ll do what I can. I’ll try to make some notes on my phone today and maybe at the airport tomorrow morning and put together a post on the plane unless I pass out, then I’ll try to finish it when I get home.

[KayJayQueue]

UNVOTE:

[KayJayQueue]

I’m willing to vote Lycan or Oblivion since I think I need to refresh my perspective on Psyche’s slot. But I’d rather just commit to one instead of oscillating.

[KayJayQueue]

bahhh i give up

Well don’t do that

[KayJayQueue]

i would be happy to do Lycan too but less confident on him

If you’re more confident on Oblivion, I think I can get behind it. I didn’t really like how it came into the day phase after Ranger flipped. But I was loudly on its sus list after that vote so I didn’t think going against it was going to be helpful when we were still trying to sort all that hood shenanigans.

[KayJayQueue]

VOTE: oblivion

Bestie-masons have spoken

[KayJayQueue]

bahhh i give up

Well don’t do that

fine i wont

That’s better

[KayJayQueue]

I know this won’t do me much good but I really think this is town!Naerys. So much of her frustration feels genuine and I’d be just as annoyed if I just got pushed out for being wrong (and I might be next, it seems). Maybe it’s because I’ve sort of been in the same boat as her much of the game, or at least adjacent, but I feel like I get where she’s coming from. She was wrong, but she wasn’t the only person who was wrong and it seems weird to not be considering anyone that was on the wagon to be bussing.

[KayJayQueue]

Woke up to 8 pages! This playlist is definitely most active when I’m asleep and that’s unfortunate. Was that hammer from RN?

[KayJayQueue]

But for sure -- I'm not going to vote oblivion today under any circumstances I think. I don't know what people who have actually been around during the ranger wagon are thinking tbh.

I’m thinking that I believe Naerys is town and that Oblivion is pushing so hard and using its actions during the Ranger wagon as locktown indicative immediately pings me and makes me nervous. On top of that, I believe Thom/Gypyx are telling the truth and are town, which made me feel better about voting where they were (originally) voting.

[KayJayQueue]

should we do me? just to be sure? i'll self-vote if you're sure a mislim is really better than a nolim

i guess the question doesn't work if you think naeyrs is scum

This post feels weird.

[KayJayQueue]

one day Kay will take a possition

Right because not taking the popular position = not taking any position.

[KayJayQueue]

i would like Kay to claim first, think it's something everyone would be ok with?

I don’t mind, let me know if this is the preference/consensus.

[KayJayQueue]

I’m open to suggestions.

[KayJayQueue]

but go now or you'll look scummy

Can I claim now but then decide who goes next after, I haven’t done this popcorn thing before (last time Hu Tao dictated the order of claims and I was lying anyway lol)

[KayJayQueue]

it's how popcorn works yeah

I just meant I don’t know if there’s a specific person that would be best to have claim after me.

I’m just a VT.

So is asking Enchant to claim pointless then? I should pick someone else?

[KayJayQueue]

Well, yeah I’d like to pick Enchant and have them claim here.

[KayJayQueue]

The optimal person you want to choose is scum because it locks them into their claim. That way they can't go "aha! I counterclaim that exact same role"

Well I’m not picking the players that I believe I already know their role. That gives me 5 options. Enchant(well, Titus-slot) definitely worries me most out of those.

[KayJayQueue]

The optimal person you want to choose is scum because it locks them into their claim. That way they can't go "aha! I counterclaim that exact same role"

Well I’m not picking the players that I believe I already know their role. That gives me 5 options. Enchant(well, Titus-slot) definitely worries me most out of those.

Why does Enchant/Titus worry you the most?

I already wasn’t too hot on that slot then when Enchant repped in, you guys said he claimed in the hood but not sure if it was joking. So without being in there and knowing exactly what was said, just getting that info secondhand, I was worried and remain unsure about that slot.

[KayJayQueue]

Why don’t you tell us why it’s right and we can just poke holes if/when necessary?

[KayJayQueue]

well, i'm time/effort-constrained.

Relatable

[KayJayQueue]

I only have one experience with gera and you know what it was. This definitely feels night and day from that train wreck of a game (for him and me, that is) but maybe that’s a good thing.

[KayJayQueue]

Ahh yeah I guess you have a point. But that really worries me then. Because I don’t think I’ve meaningfully advanced the game much either and my reads haven’t been very fleshed out. This hood has been incredibly distracting for me and it’s made me feel like I’m literally in the backseat of this game. And I was pushing you/your slot at a point too. I feel like you could be describing me with some of what you said which feels weird since I don’t really feel like I can relate to gera in mafia (in general) but he just seems so different from the last time we played. He literally never did anything unless his ass was on the line so I guess maybe I’m just misconstruing the bare minimum with towniness. But it’s all I have to go off of with him.

[KayJayQueue]

Random Nurse - VT
Gypyx - Best Friend Neighbor
Oblivion - VT
geraintm - VT
KayJayQueue - VT
Enchant - Neighbor
Psyche - VT
Thomith - Best Friend Neighbor
Lycanfire - VT

Can someone explain what the most likely breakdown is in terms of “balance” for this (claimed) game? What are we looking for? 2 or 3 more scum? Or whatever, traitor.

Do the not-masons have a read on what exactly Enchant could be? Does anyone else?

Are we done looking at the hood?

Does anyone actually believe Thom/Gypyx are scum running a long con? (I don’t)

Who is everyone’s most “town” read? Not including the besties, I’d rather get opinions on anyone else.

[KayJayQueue]

I think it’s smart for me to trust someone that can base a read on Enchant-slot off of both the game thread and hood thread. If you feel this is the right move, I’m in.

I do worry about what happens if we’re wrong though. I don’t think RN would rest until you’re voted. I don’t know if that would happen but I worry it would get pushed and helped along by scum taking advantage of the situation if Enchant doesn’t flip red. All that being said, I do think Enchant-slot is the current most likely to be bad.

VOTE: Enchant

[KayJayQueue]

actually a lot of titus's posts cue town. wasn't this a more common view just yesterday?

Not from me. But honestly, Titus pings for me in every game because it seems like she’s never here so I might be leaning that way just because it’s comfortable for me to lean that way. Have I ever been right about her being scum? No, not yet. (nothing confirmed, at least)

[KayJayQueue]

Oblivion thought there was a bus on Ranger, but no read on Titus.

Maybe this is worth looking into then. Who exactly does it think was bussing?

At this point, I agree at least one scum was on that vote because only two of us are still alive that weren’t: me and gera. I know it’s not me and we have at least 2 scum left to find so someone bad voted Ranger.

That’s actually really interesting that everyone that voted there is still alive. Is that weird? It feels weird but maybe it’s a strategy.

[KayJayQueue]

In my experience, Titus doesn’t usually suggest self-consciousness either way. I don’t know how AI that is for her.

[KayJayQueue]

i agree that titus's

townplay

doesn't usually have much self-consciousness

Ah, you know, you’re right. I don’t have any confirmation that I know how scum!Titus behaves. I haven’t looked at a scum game of hers and can’t comment on anything ongoing.

[KayJayQueue]

Snow liked Titus

Can't see geraint's opinion on Titus. Doesn't have one it seems.

Think the homies, Kay, and definitely random nurse didn't like her. Neither did Naerys. Oblivion thought there was a bus on Ranger, but no read on Titus.

I think our main read differences actually was that I townread Titus but scumread Gera, but Gypyx felt the opposite?

Did you townread her more from the hood or game thread, or combo of both?

It feels so hard to have an accurate read without all the info. I don’t think I like this neighborhood mechanic lol (I’d probably love it if I was in it though)