Mini 1190: Game over

[Empking]

Vote: CC

- They are awful questions.

Also: I'm a miller.

[Empking]

FoS: PBug

- On the condition that CC flips scum.

[Empking]

I don't think scum would make a mistake like SK did.

[Empking]

Especially given that Empking's initial vote for CC seemed semirandom, and between that and the FoS on me, it seemed to have solidified. Empking, why did you claim so fast?

1. I think I'm a semi-likely Cop investigation and didn't want to waste a lynch and investigation.
2. To get us out of the RVS.
3. Just to inform you, its the done thing nowadays. The choice was mostly instinct.

Preview
Hoppster: Possibly but I think overeagerness in the RVS is a null/town tell.

[Empking]

By "nice roleclaim", I mean "good job on claiming that straight-up".

They shouldn't, imho, Sleepy. That's what I was getting at when I said "Nice roleclaim".]

What are you getting at?

[Empking]

Yeah I agree with CC here.

[Empking]

Batman was the last question.

Sundy: What do you think of Sleepy's mistakes?

[Empking]

But I won't be investigated by a Cop. That's the point of claiming Miller.

Unvote

Vote Toro

- IGMEOYing before having a serious vote along with the weak "Don't take this as me wanting to get rid of Empking right off the bat but it's certainly something to think about."

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote Toro

- IGMEOYing before having a serious vote along with the weak "Don't take this as me wanting to get rid of Empking right off the bat but it's certainly something to think about."

I'm merely throwing the thought out there,

Yes like scum would. Scum would subtly try to plant an idea in people's head. Town would at least vote.

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote Toro

- IGMEOYing before having a serious vote along with the weak "Don't take this as me wanting to get rid of Empking right off the bat but it's certainly something to think about."

I'm merely throwing the thought out there,

Yes like scum would. Scum would subtly try to plant an idea in people's head. Town would at least vote.

It's not like I'm the only person here who considers this a possibility, and it's not subtle at all I flat-out provided my reasons for thinking. Nice try trying to say I'm subtly trying to plant an idea. Would a vote legitimize my case for you?

"I'm merely throwing the thought out there, " is scum talk. That's all there is to say.

[Empking]

No it's not. Once again, would a vote legitimize my case to you?

If you weren't merely throwing the thought out there then I wouldn't be voting you for merely throwing the thought out there. That's true.

[Empking]

No it's not. Once again, would a vote legitimize my case to you?

If you weren't merely throwing the thought out there then I wouldn't be voting you for merely throwing the thought out there. That's true.

I think you're trying to mis-read what I'm saying back there, you're trying to make it look like I'm pushing it as scum, but it is a strong possibility. Why so jumpy?

1. How am I jumpy?
2. If it was a "strong possibility" why did you "merely throwing the thought out there,". Surely a strong possibility deserves more than that.

[Empking]

No it's not. Once again, would a vote legitimize my case to you?

If you weren't merely throwing the thought out there then I wouldn't be voting you for merely throwing the thought out there. That's true.

I think you're trying to mis-read what I'm saying back there, you're trying to make it look like I'm pushing it as scum, but it is a strong possibility. Why so jumpy?

1. How am I jumpy?
2. If it was a "strong possibility" why did you "merely throwing the thought out there,". Surely a strong possibility deserves more than that.

1. You're attacking me over doubting your Miller claim.

That's not true. I'm attacking you because you practically claimed scum with your "I'm merely throwing the thought out there," post. I have a hard time believing you don't know that considering I've quoted it enough times.

2. No one else doubted the authenticity of your Miller claim, so I "threw it out there" to remind people that there's a chance you're lying.

But why? If you were town that'd be a bridge you'd croos when you decided I was scummy, surely.

Also: Last post from me today.

[Empking]

Toro is acting scummy but I really don't think he is part of the scum team.

Why?

[Empking]

Toro is acting scummy but I really don't think he is part of the scum team.

Why?

[Empking]

1Joe60, Sundy, Thomith, Captain Corporal, Jakesh97, Elfen

You guys suck. Seriously, he admitted to "just throwing it out their" that's the same thing as claiming scum.

[Empking]

1Joe60, Sundy, Thomith, Captain Corporal, Jakesh97, Elfen

You guys suck. Seriously, he admitted to "just throwing it out their" that's the same thing as claiming scum.

Not... really...?

Yes really. That's scum play 101.

Elfen is also scum BTW.

[Empking]

You can't tell until I'm either dead or the game is over but quite frankly its irrelevant. Only scum would still be focussing on it on page six with Toro having claimed scum.

[Empking]

But if they claim early they would get alot of attention which they probably would not want that much attention drawn to them early in the game where as if they claimed later then they would be able to go through a while without having that attention on them

According to SleepyKrew Emp is a "famous player" so we can always assume that the attention is going to be on him.

No. Meta me if you want.

[Empking]

But if they claim early they would get alot of attention which they probably would not want that much attention drawn to them early in the game where as if they claimed later then they would be able to go through a while without having that attention on them

According to SleepyKrew Emp is a "famous player" so we can always assume that the attention is going to be on him.

No. Meta me if you want.

So SK is wrong in assuming you're a famous player?

I think people might recognize the name just due to my being profilic but no I'm not an attention grabbing player.

Preview:
Elfen is playing like an idiot but is also lining up lynches.
Toro doesn't want to be blamed if I get lynched thyerefore he's careful to point out that he's only throwing it out there. He wants me mislynched but doesn't want the blame.

[Empking]

Toro doesn't want to be blamed if I get lynched thyerefore he's careful to point out that he's only throwing it out there. He wants me mislynched but doesn't want the blame.

Where did I say I want a mislynch?

Don't be an idiot. Scumhuntiong is all about making educated guesses for why someone posted what they did.

[Empking]

Toro doesn't want to be blamed if I get lynched thyerefore he's careful to point out that he's only throwing it out there. He wants me mislynched but doesn't want the blame.

Where did I say I want a mislynch?

Don't be an idiot. Scumhuntiong is all about making educated guesses for why someone posted what they did.

Once again, where did I say I want a mislynch?

Once again, Don't be an idiot. Scumhuntiong is all about making educated guesses for why someone posted what they did.

[Empking]

Elfen is playing like an idiot but is also lining up lynches.

Ah, I thought I wasn't the only one who saw this.

I agree, except I think he's scum with you because he started with agreeing with you and now there's this slow distancing you guys seem to be doing. You voted him with flimsy, easily debated reasoning, then unvoted him even though you still seem to think he's suspicious.

This is good posting.

Toro: When did I say that you said that you wanted a mislynch?

[Empking]

Toro: When did I say that

you said

that you wanted a mislynch?

[Empking]

Toro: When did I say that

you said

that you wanted a mislynch?

Holy shit. I just provided the quote, you said I wanted you mislynched. Ignorance is bliss eh?

OK. I'm not going to drown this by posting anymore but I think we can all agree that Toro is pretty clearly scum at this point.

[Empking]

Toro i think EK is trying to say you are playing as if you wanted a mislynch not that you actually said you wanted a mislynch...

That's the thing, I DON'T want a mislynch. I've said earlier in this thread that if Empking's play starts to look town-ish than I will start to believe the miller claim. His play as of late reeks. He still said I want him mislynched, which is complete bull.

Scum want mislynches. You saying you don't want a mislynch is as trustworthy as you saying you're not scum aka not trustworthy at all.

OK. I'm not going to drown this by posting anymore but I think we can all agree that Toro is pretty clearly scum at this point.

Why, because I doubted your miller claim?

No because you refused to answer the simple question that you made a big deal over.

I'm completely open to having the cop investigate me to clear myself,

This is a Godfather claim. No ifs, no buts. This is a godfather claim.

[Empking]

Toro: When did I say that you said that you wanted a mislynch?

[Empking]

Toro: When did I say that you said that you wanted a mislynch?

You never said that. Why the hell would anyone ever say they want a mislynch?

So how did I misrepresent you?

Elfen: Toro claimed Godfather. That's a scum role. Mind bussing your buddy?

[Empking]

Toro: When did I say that you said that you wanted a mislynch?

You never said that. Why the hell would anyone ever say they want a mislynch?

So how did I misrepresent you?

Elfen: Toro claimed Godfather. That's a scum role. Mind bussing your buddy?

OMFG SURE WHY NOT >_> No. This day is not going to end so soon, i still want to see more people... mainly the ones who have not posted much....

You voting a player =/= day ending.

[Empking]

And you've been saying that I've been purposefully trying to mislynch you all of this time.

It's absolute horseshit Emp.

Any evidence for that claim.

[Empking]

holy shit.
this is fucking ridiclous.

Noone posts every time I check every hour or two, come back from school to find.. two pages.. holy damn.

VOTE: Emp

Why?

Hoppster: Why would arrogant-and-oh-so-wrong-in-sooooooooooooooooooooooo-many-respects-town fake answer questions and then as-good-as claim godfather? I don't understand?

Also, how have I tunneled? I'm the only player in this game who's scumhunted even a little (as shown by the fact that Mr. "I'm just throwing it out there" "I'm not gunning for a mislynch because I say so" "The Cop should investigate me because I'm a godfather" "Where did I say that" hasn't been lynched yet despite comitting every serious scum tell in the book.)

[Empking]

Maybe tunneling was a bit strong, but your adamance that he tell you where you said that he said he wanted a mislynch was frustrating in that you refused to clarify your question.

I used formatting to clarify my question multiple times.

"The only player who's scumhunted even a little" is just plain offensive.

Maybe I'm just a little bit frustrated but loooks at that last vote count. The only vote with actual reasoning behind it was mine (maybe SK's) in that vote count.

Toro has not committed every single scumtell in the book, you have extrapolated his behavior at every turn. Yes, he's quite scummy, but the way you've been reacting is just as scummy.

No it isn't because, as Panzer said, Toro has as good as claimed godfather.

[Empking]

You don't think he's oh-so-wrong-in-sooooooooooooooooooooooo-many-respects anymore?

[Empking]

Panzer should be unlyncvhable just because he's not part of the atmosphere of lurking and not voting that will screw us over.

[Empking]

Panzer should be unlyncvhable just because he's not part of the atmosphere of lurking and not voting that will screw us over.

And you're voting for Toro why then?

Yeah, I thought about that when I made my post. There's around a 90% chance that Toro is scum, its worth it in this specific case.

[Empking]

Panzer should be unlyncvhable just because he's not part of the atmosphere of lurking and not voting that will screw us over.

And you're voting for Toro why then?

Yeah, I thought about that when I made my post. There's around a 90% chance that Toro is scum, its worth it in this specific case.

Well your vote's fine. Personally I wanted to see conversation about something besides you:toro since the long fights were confusing me. I'm sure you feel quite justified in your vote however

nonetheless I do dispute the claim that Panzer is one of the ones who is keeping the game from lurkerdom, since I specifically pulled his name from my list of lurker-esque types

What current votes do you consider justified? (From my POV its mine, Toro's, Panzer's and your's)

[Empking]

What current votes do you consider justified? (From my POV its mine, Toro's, Panzer's and your's)

Hoppster's vote on SK was reasonable, though now a bit dated
Why do you say Toro's vote on you is justified?

Misrepresention, though not accurate in this case, is a decent reason to vote.

Why is Panzer's vote on Toro justified and not SK?

Panzer's vote is based on more concrete ground.

[Empking]

Panzer & Sundy are both big town reads to my mind (Sundy for clearly scumhunting and Panzer for talking complete sense.)

[Empking]

[quote]Empking - have you ever participated in a miller MD thread?
[/quote

I don't think so.

[Empking]

Empking - have you ever participated in a miller MD thread?

I don't think so.

[Empking]

Also, REALLY liking xvart right now.

Toro is becoming more and more obviously scum at this point. Really happy with my vote.

+1

[Empking]

Toro: You should act as if you were on L-1.

[Empking]

Vig yourself tonight.

Unvote

Vote Elfen

[Empking]

Actually, take out a lurker of your choice.

[Empking]

Not really digging Emp's Elfen vote though.

And still would rather him Vig himself. Betting he's SK.

One-Shot

[Empking]

I totally feel like hammering.
I'm kind of cautious about this vig-claim of Toro's. Couldn't he be a SK or something?

One-Shot

[Empking]

Its not the case that lurkers can be replaced. Flakes can be replaced but not lurkers.

[Empking]

Its not the case that lurkers can be replaced. Flakes can be replaced but not lurkers.

I'm fine with a lurker vig provided we tie down Toro to a specific shot.

But whae if scum has a roleblocker?

What are your thoughts on SleepyKrew?

Leaning scum.

[Empking]

You call the case on you massively solid, Toro? :/

@ Mod: If there were any Mafia PRs in this game, would they be able to carry out both the NK and their own action?

Good point I forgot about Mafia-aligned vig.

Well if the chances of harm being done by 2 kills outweigh the advantage of giving Toro the benefit of the doubt and letting him try and hit scum, then I'll put my vote on Toro. Especially if he considers the case on him solid.

I find the odds of us having a Mafia OSV very low.

[Empking]

Not himself, he can become pretty much confirmed town.

[Empking]

Mod:

Vig yourself tonight.

Unvote

Vote Elfen

[Empking]

Toro (2) (L-1)- Empking, Torquez

[Empking]

I'm still voting two people.

Fixed, ty

[Empking]

Empking: I don't like the miller claim or the reason. I still think he is lying.

Really? so you would have prefered if he stayed quiet untill the cop investigated him which COULD have been in LYLO and screw town over? Why do people think the claim is scummy, i don't see why.

Ugh. It pains me to do this but

FOS: Thomith

- He seems to know I'm town.

[Empking]

A) i know, i had to search all your posts,
b) one was a mini-normal, not sure on the name/number, but it was near the end of your search history.

You can't meta someone from 2 years ago, people change

You can't meta someone from 2 games, Sample size.

You can't meta someone from a game that they made 10 posts in, sample size.

Meta in general is garbage.

FoS:Hiplop

Why is all that suspicious?

[Empking]

Hoppster is starting to look scum, but i cant get over the town read i got on him from earlier on :\

If I wasn't already voting him this post would have convinced me to.

[Empking]

Hoppster is starting to look scum, but i cant get over the town read i got on him from earlier on :\

If I wasn't already voting him this post would have convinced me to.

By "him" you mean Hiplop? What is your view of El Hoppster???

Hoppster is null.

[Empking]

Hoppster is starting to look scum, but i cant get over the town read i got on him from earlier on :\

If I wasn't already voting him this post would have convinced me to.

why?

Opening options.

[Empking]

Sorry. My question was whether a player can target another player twice in a row on two consecutive nights.

why not?

Could you also tell us whether, in a version of the Tspoon universe that included a 1-shot vig, whether a role-blocked vig would have used his 1 shot?

A roleblocked vig would still keep his shot. I am not saying there is a vig or roleblocker in the setup though

Would they be informed of keeping their shot?

[Empking]

Mod: If a roleblocker was performing the kill while roleblocking a JK and the JK was jailkeeping the roleblocker, what would happen?

[Empking]

Hoppster: Vote Hiplop if you want to live.

[Empking]

Empking, do you think Hop is town?

Null.

[Empking]

Would you be willing to hammer if he's L-1?

At deadline, yes.

[Empking]

Twisted: The Fool isn't in the VC

Pbug: Stop wasting your vote.

ta

[Empking]

SK: Stop wasting your vote.

Also, you might as well claim.

[Empking]

Just checked something. When hip joined the game, Panzer was all:
"Meta sucks."
"You can't meta from one game."
"Meta is garbage."

Now let's look at his latest post... Hmm...
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Panzer

[Empking]

Vote: SK

- I don't buy the claim and there's no real loss on the off chance I'm wrong (even as town he won't be nightkilled.)

[Empking]

Sunday:
1. One-Shot Vig, Miller, Two-Shot Bulletproof too little VTs (since surely we have some useful roles to go with it.)
2. My view is that once somebody claims a useless role they should be lynched.

[Empking]

Empking, it should be asserted that there is a real loss on the 'off chance' you are wrong; you have lynched a town-aligned player who, for example, I could easily clear with my vigilante ability.

No you couldn't. (Proven ability =/= proven alignment.)

Empking, this is a closed setup; we do not know the role distribution and lynching somebody because they are not a Vanilla Townsperson is a poor idea. If you truly believe that once one 'claims a useless role they should be lynched', would you kindly place a vote on yourself?

Obviously that isn't the case if I know them to be town.

Your points on Toro 'claiming Godfather' by requesting the cop target him also work in reverse in that by claiming Miller you are essentially requesting the cop not to target you.

Your point?

[Empking]

Answer my question Emp.

Oh I thought that was rhetorical. You didn't think/wanted to WIFOM us.

[Empking]

SK: I think you're bulletproof. I also think you're bulletproof scum.

[Empking]

@Emp
That's allowed in Normals?

Yes.

[Empking]

How the hell do you balance a BP Scum?

Very easily.

[Empking]

By giving the Town a ton of PRs?

No. Presuming the OSV is our only killing role then BP is pretty weak.

Sunday: If you want to avoid lynching town then there's this wonderful thing known as No Lynch. My vote on SK is about managing risk.

[Empking]

Hoppster is starting to look scum, but i cant get over the town read i got on him from earlier on :\

If I wasn't already voting him this post would have convinced me to.

[Empking]

Sunday: If you want to avoid lynching town then there's this wonderful thing known as No Lynch. My vote on SK is about managing risk.

No Lynch is how you avoid lynching. Lynching non-town is how you avoid lynching town.

No. If you don't lynch then you're not lynching town.

[Empking]

FoS:Empking

for his stance on useless roles. If we all decided to lynch useless roles, he would have been lynched page 4.

Yes but you don't all agree with me so that doesn't really matter.

Also, he just seems so throw together.

Pardon?

[Empking]

Oh God.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Emp

Why?

[Empking]

Yes but you don't all agree with me so that doesn't really matter.

And that's scummy because...

[Empking]

"We should lynch Krew for this but not me because you don't listen to me."

No.

I

should vote Krew for that but not myself because I already know I'm town.

[Empking]

Yes, but if we all listened to you, then you'd be dead.

Yes but you don't so that doesn't matter.

[Empking]

I think you're grasping at straws, jumping at Empking because now Sunday is here pushing him. Why isn't SleepyKrew dead yet? Oh, right, because Sunday thinks he's town and is holding his "vig" kill over our heads to keep us from hammering. Fantastic.

Good posting.

[Empking]

Vote: Thefool

- I think SK's vote was distancing.

[Empking]

Vote: Thefool

- I think SK's vote was distancing.

I'm not sure I understand; he wasn't voting for me.

He voted for you.

[Empking]

Fine, we let Toto live.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: jake
I'll just put that there while I read up on Hop.

[Empking]

Fine, we let Toto live.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: jake
I'll just put that there while I read up on Hop.

Looks like an easy jump on a lurker when the old wagon didn't work to me.

Looks like a vote designed to be jumped off of to me.

[Empking]

Sunday; How many people are you?

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: xvart

[Empking]

it was not L-3 it was L-2 i didn't see PBuG's unvote and thought it was L-1. either way i still want to hear from each person why they think he is scummy so we know they are not just jumping on a wagon.

blah nevermind it was L-3. sunday why did you unvote with no explanation Empking why is xvart scum.

1. Wagon
2. Wagon wagon
3. Gut
4. I thought 791 was a big load of nothing./

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: Panzer

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: Panzer

Reason?

Gut.

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: Xvart

[Empking]

monk is Towny McTownperson. I say we turn this wagon around and lynch Xvart.

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote; TheFool

Mod: TF is voting twice.

fixed ty

[Empking]

I'd prefer a TheFool lynch.

[Empking]

Empking: compare TheFool's read list and Sundy's read list and tell me why TheFool is a better lynch than Sundy.

Well, Sundy's reads are sensible and TF is smoking crack. Not really a tell from either of them from those two posts.

[Empking]

I think xvart is town.

xvart: Do you think monk is up for lynch today?

[Empking]

I think xvart is town.

Why do you think this?

His general posting.

[Empking]

Stubborness

[Empking]

you know what, although i REALLY dislike xvart twisting my words my gut is telling me sum wouldn't draw so much attention to themselves by posting so many walls in a row...
UNVOTE:

Halfway there.

You've still yet to finish with a TF vote.

[Empking]

TF needs votes.

[Empking]

I was stuck into the mason claim because I had breadcrumbed it for later in the game and I was trying to play in a way where Thomith wouldn't vote me, than he was lured in by Xvart's very silly case. I should have just played head up and let monk/CC get lynched.

I think traitor is a pretty difficult role to play, and I think your breadcrumb was a pretty smart way to play it such that scum would want to kill you (I'm guessing if the scum tried to kill you you got recruited instead?)

No.