The Aftermath - Victors Announced

[chunkykev]

Confirming

And...

VOTE: xReckonerx

For being too good in the last game I played with him and catching scum before I'd had a chance to do it myself

[chunkykev]

UNVOTE: xReckonerx

No need for that joke vote to sit where it is anymore.

Only game I've played here so far, Reck had some great reads early on so first instincts for me are to follow his reads on day 1 here when there is little other information, and I'm not familiar with any of your styles. I've not seen anything greatly different in his style so far, but it is only based on that one game I have played, where he was town. Liking the poking and prodding going on from all that seem to know each other so far, and hoping to get some reads on the interactions - and hoping some of you find the "Caps Lock" button and turn it off

At work just now but will reread later when at home and hopefully find some reads of my own.

[chunkykev]

Can everyone really not even see that kuribo isn't even trying to scumhunt?

You do realise that when you posted this you had added very little to the scum hunt yourself, apart from some votes with no explanation. You may have great reads on people and your observations are spot on, but unless you are going to share your reasons then how are the rest of us supposed to know? Even since that post, you still haven’t made a case against Kuribo apart from he is “scummy as fuck” (your words). A little explanation of why, and maybe even some evidence to back it up, wouldn’t go a miss.

---

unvote, vote kublai, sleeplessassassin is also scum.reck, spring, sociopath and kuribo are town.Print this and put it up on your wall. Someday it will be worth money.

Exact same thing I said to Sleepless: any chance of reasons for your reads? Again, they could be great reads, but why no reasons to back them up if you are confident of them.

For those that have mentioned Lowell being town, could you tell me if you are joking or explain why? He has made 3 posts, a confirm post (#12), a joke/random vote post (#46) and the post I just quoted with his reads, but no reasons. How the hell can anyone have a read on Lowell just from this? I’m not saying he isn’t town, I am saying he has done nothing that would give me a read on him and I’m always looking to get better, so would love to hear the reasons why these 3 posts confirm him as town.

---

Also, after sleeping on it, I'm not digging the case on kuribo anymore.

Any reason for not “digging the case” anymore or have we to guess what you were dreaming about?

---

Oh my shit what is this 8 pages already how have I not been keeping up with this game.

If that was me, I would have just got up to date and then posted. You sure you haven’t just been lurking and feel the need to make it look like you haven’t been keeping up to date?

---

Why the fuck do you think I usually replace into games instead of starting from scratch? BECAUSE I FUCKING HATE STARTING FROM SCRATCH. I can't read people for shit unless the ball is already rolling. It's one of my weaknesses as a mafia player, and one that apparently has only been excaberated by taking two years off.

Self proclaimed as no use in day 1, yet you have mentioned reads on many different players.

---

Chunkykev unvotes his RVS vote without revoting. Scummy.

It’s a pretty standard thing to do where I normally play, unless you have a reason to vote someone else. When I removed my joke vote, I didn’t have a good reason to vote anyone else. Of course, I could have just voted to put pressure on someone, but wanted to catch up properly first and try and get some reads. I did say that in the very same post I removed my joke vote…

At work just now but will reread later when at home and hopefully find some reads of my own.

---

I didn't say I wasn't angry, I said I'd type however the fuck I wanted

Seems angry to me. For future reference, could you let us know how you would type if you were angry?

[chunkykev]

Hi. Some reads:

Reck -- unsure, but he's ALWAYS hard to read for me. I'll be keeping a very close eye on him.

chunkykev: Was kinda scummish, not as much now. Will also keep an eye on.

elvis: Bizarre, but I've never played mafia with her before; I only know her from GD/MD/62. Will watch.

SpyreX: Another one that's notoriously hard for me to read.

kuribo: I'm biased, because I still loathe him from our last game. Will try to be objective.

Fate: Fuck me running, I still hate this guy. Useless, and likely scum. His joking of bussing is likely not a 'gambit' or 'ploy' so he's probably pretty much the scum mouthpiece.

KK: Don't think I've played with him before; must read older games.

DGB: Always scum. Always.

Elli: always scummy-looking, but never scum. Absolute town here.

Grimm: Don't know him; had a dream of him recently which makes me wary; reserving judgment.

Hindu: Must refrain from kneejerking on him. He's probably town or 3rd party.

Rhinox: Annoying avatar, what else needs to be said?

Lurkalicious Lowell: Pssh. Non-entity.

This is totally pathetic.

In case you haven’t noticed by my previous questioning of players who have posted “reads” or votes with no substance, I don’t care for them much unless you back them up with some good reasoning or evidence.

Comments like “I’ll keep an eye on him” or “will watch” are nonsense. Unless you are mafia and know who the other mafia are, then surely you will be “keeping your eye on” everyone? Analysis like “always scum” or “never scum” are even more useless as are not even based on a so-called “read” but have no basis at all. I could go through every single “read” you have posted and point out why it is useless, so all in all your post was useless and just gives the impression that you are trying to look useful when you are really not. I need to decide if the reason for your post is because you are scum trying to appear like a useful townie or because you are a useless townie.

Feel free to redo your list at any time, but this time include some reasoning (that is intelligent thought out reasoning, not stuff like “always scum” or “always town”) and evidence to support what you say.

---

Chunky, kuribo's scumminess should be obvious. It's almost like he WANTS to be lynched. He is posting random nonsense and getting overdefensive rather than pursuing a suspect.

Kuribo is just obvscum. He isn't pursuing any suspects and is just wasting space with his posts. Anyone who calls him scum is just an asshole in his eyes.

While I agree that Kuribo is looking scummiest just now (nice of you to give some reasons, finally), I can’t see how you can be as certain as you make out. Surely you have seen townies getting overly defensive when attacked as well? In the absence of a clearer candidate, if I had to vote now, it would be on Kuribo but I’ve lynched many a townie on day 1 for appearing scummy due to being overly defensive (usually weaker players that don’t have a good reason why someone else appears scummier so they panic when targeted) so I don’t want to just jump right on the wagon while we still have plenty players who have added nothing yet.

[chunkykev]

UnvoteVote: Sleepless Assassin

And we have another vote with no explanation. Very helpful there, Socio Any thoughts or reasons to add at all?

[chunkykev]

Chunky, it looks like we can get used to that with this group.

Are you having a laugh? You were one of the first people I pulled up for not giving reasons or evidence and you have done the exact thing with previous votes so how can you seriously comment about anyone else doing it?

---

In post 301, chunkykev wrote:In post 300, SocioPath wrote:UnvoteVote: Sleepless AssassinAnd we have another vote with no explanation. Very helpful there, Socio Any thoughts or reasons to add at all?I find it weird that you care so much about this, actually. You and sleepless dating or something?

I don’t care about the vote on Sleepless. In fact, after the post from Sleepless I’ve just quoted, Sleepless has moved up my scum list as the post seems inconsistent with his own actions and nothing more than buddying up to me. What I do have an issue with, I have already stated I have an issue with, and I will continue to have an issue with, is voting (or giving a read on someone) without any reason or evidence.

In fact, Lowell, I already asked you for the same thing (see post #262) and I am still waiting on a response.

[chunkykev]

@DrippingGoofball, will you be adding anything at all on day 1 or just continue with seemingly random scum/town reads with no reason or explanation to discuss?

---

Chunky, I always do that with my first vote.

I don't expect a reason for a joke or random vote. But what about your 2nd vote? Or your 3rd vote?

[chunkykev]

I don't joke/random vote. Second vote in this specific game was early enough that I treated it like a first. I haven't made a third vote, but when I do, reasons will probably either be obvious or stated in that post or both.

Really?

Vote Reck

unvote, vote spring

unvote, vote kuribo

I count 3 votes.

[chunkykev]

@Sleepless Assassin: Are you happy for people to vote or say they have a scum read on someone without a good reason or explanation? Post#302 suggests that but I just can't get over the feeling you were just trying to sound like you were agreeing with me for buddying up purposes. So what are your views on voting or giving scum reads without reasons (at this point in the game, not in the random/joke vote stage)?

[chunkykev]

EBWOP

@Sleepless Assassin: Are you happy for people to vote or say they have a scum read on someone without a good reason or explanation? Post#302 suggests that

you are not

but I just can't get over the feeling you were just trying to sound like you were agreeing with me for buddying up purposes. So what are your views on voting or giving scum reads without reasons (at this point in the game, not in the random/joke vote stage)?

[chunkykev]

Vote reckI still find sleepless ass scummy. But reck's wagon jump is scummier atm.

And nothing to do with you being nervous that Sleepless had moved on to L-2?

---

@DGB: What are you doing this game? Other than just popping in to make random assertions as to who is scum and who is town.

Any need for you to ask pretty much the exact same question I already have?

@DrippingGoofball, will you be adding anything at all on day 1 or just continue with seemingly random scum/town reads with no reason or explanation to discuss?

Were you skimming and missed me asking that question or are you just trying to appear as if you are thinking along the same lines as me, both of which are pretty scummy?

[chunkykev]

skimming isn't scummy

It is in my experience.

Scum know who each other are so don't need to scumhunt or find links the same way town do (of course, they should be looking for possible town PRs) so scum players tend to skim more than town players. It isn't definitive, of course, but it is something that tends to be more scum than town. If town are skimming, they shouldn't be!

[chunkykev]

2) At the time I had posted that, I had just seen DGB's jump into the thread, and it wasn't until I posted that I came across your post.

Fair enough answer. Didn't need your boyfriend defending you after all.

After what Reck said about you replacing out a previous game for not being able to keep up, what is your view on skimming? Scumtell or not?

[chunkykev]

Not happy with the last answer sleepless gave to me about agreeing people should give reasons for reads or votes, especially after him recently listing people as scum with no reasons. I also cant get his earlier agreeing with me post out of my head as just a buddying up attempt. I would put my vote on sleepless right now, but he is on L-1. I have no issue being the lynch vote, but I will wait to see if he has anything else to say before I hammer him.

(Apologies for not quoting what I am referring to but on phone so that is difficult. It's all in Sleepless' ISO, but if anyone wants me to quote exactly what I mean let me know and I will do so when next on at a computer)

[chunkykev]

Goofball, do your claims of suchandsuch being town and whatshisname being scum serve any purpose at all? To continue to do that after I have asked for reasons is annoying and a waste of space. Why are you continuing to do it?

[chunkykev]

That had crossed my mind, Rhinox, and curious if that is her reason. Even if it is, it doesn't excuse her incredible uselessness up to this point.

[chunkykev]

before anyone hammers, let me do a big post with reads on everyone.

I hope there will be reasons with those reads!

Are you not going to defend yourself or tell us why you shouldn't be hammered?

[chunkykev]

Well lots of people have been useless up to this point, and thats entirely independant on the number or lengths of posts one has. This is a large game, you can't expect everyone to be leading the conversation, you end up even worst than the clusterfuck this thread has been so far.

I'm not for one second saying Goofball is the only person that has been useless so far but I've questioned her and yet to receive an answer from her, which is why I have asked again about the lack of substance to her reads as she has done it again. She has admitted to doing it but no reason why.

There are others I have questioned and haven't received a decent response from (if any) yet, and that certainly hasn't been forgotten.

[chunkykev]

Khan - A lot of people say he's town, and I tend to agree. So. Joke votes Spy.

Explains SDC for me.

Asks Reck ab out his "SDC has scum" post. Does his list, votes Kuribo. Explains list to Pine, asks for better reads from Pine. Explains Kuribo vote, admits it's weak because it's early. A lot on Kuribo then switches to reck (huh?). Adds me to his list while removing Fate, Pine, and ZD. Meh, this'll be my weakest town read I think. His reconsideration of Kuribo seems weird, but I think it makes sense. And he seemed to tunnel on Kuribo for a while. Mostly looks fine though.

Could you point out exactly where Khan explained SDC to you, or was it not on the thread? I've just double checked through his ISO and don't see any such explanation unless you mean this…

Reck, I've been away a little while. Wanna fill me in?

I'm not Reck, but I'm pretty certain it refers to the fact that they are a sort of clan...

...that screams at you....

.....Until you die.....

...



VOTE: SpyreX because he needs to spend less time on mafia and more time with his family. C'mon everyone. Let's help him break his mafia habit.

Which I would hardly call an explanation of the SDC as it was incredibly clear before this that they were a clan (you even admit reading it in the queue, which is where I immediately figured out it was a clan).

When you said he explains SDC for you I was looking for him telling you who they are. Did he do that on the mafia thread?

[chunkykev]

I have no issue with being the hammer vote. I was going to vote sleepless earlier, but he was already L-1 when I came on and wanted to give him time to talk (as I said). I am now waiting on a direct response from him before deciding if he is still deserving of my vote.

I will not be voting just because someone says I should be or not voting throughout day 1 looks scummy (which is nonsense). I will vote when I have a reason to as I mentioned earlier.

[chunkykev]

Your play in this game has been composed of nothing be challenging other people's votes and reads, yet your reads and votes are very scarse.

I have made it perfectly clear that people giving their reads and not backing it up with any reasoning is pointless and does nothing but takes space up in the thread. You criticize me for challenging other peoples’ votes and reads but that is exactly what everyone should be doing to work out who is giving reads and votes to try and look active and helpful and who actually has thought out reasoning behind what they are saying. My reads and votes are scarce at this time – we are still in day 1 after all and I won’t claim reads on people that I just don’t have. If someone has said or done something that I find suspicious I’ve questioned them on it. If someone is suspicious to me I have stated that for all to see, along with my reasoning.

Anyone who calls anyone else town is particularly distasteful to you.

That’s either a total lie or you need to re-read.

I don’t like anyone calling anyone else town

or scum

with out evidence behind it. In fact, as I have regularly criticized people for voting with no explanation so I would say I have been critical on more occasions to someone claiming people are scum. I’m not going to go and count which I have done more of as it is not relevant. What is relevant is that my criticism has never been focused on one or the other, but is focused on any reads and votes with no reasoning for them.

Anytime you have expressed any suspicion, you've not backed it up with any kind of vote.

Anytime you have expressed any suspicion, you've not backed it up with any kind of vote. To wit:In post 296, chunkykev wrote:While I agree that Kuribo is looking scummiest just now In post 307, chunkykev wrote:Sleepless has moved up my scum list as the post seems inconsistent with his own actions and nothing more than buddying up to me.These are the only two players you've called suspicious, and both of them have had the biggest wagons on them. By not voting, you're soft-backing those wagons with a "I'm for them, but I'm not going to put myself on record as supporting them". You're playing exactly like a mafioso who is extremely tentative about joining a wagon unless he knows it's going to be a lynching wagon.

I'm not going to throw a vote down every time I believe someone is suspicious. I don't mind moving my vote around a bit if required but I don't like lots of votes and unvotes as it just means that when you do vote it has no real impact. When I vote for someone, I want them to know I am serious and confident of my vote and to respond to it. I have seen (in many past games I have been involved in on other sites) many people ignore votes on them, not giving them any credence, because they have been from someone who has had their vote on half the players in a single game day. So as much as you want me to put a vote somewhere, I will only do so when I decide to.

It has not gone unnoticed that your (Khan’s) attack on me heated up soon after I brought up a possible link between you and SA (You mentioned I should put a vote down in post #420. I questioned SA about a possible link to you in post #473 and then you call me scummy for the first time in post #477). Could be coincidence, but I’ve learned to keep a close eye on any “coincidences” you notice in a mafia game.

---

Okay, so. Reality visited me the last couple of days. In the future, you will most likely be hearing my Great Wisdom much more frequently.Now, who to choose. Rhinox and DGB are quite scumalicious currently.Hmmm. Eeny, meeny, miny, mo.unvoteVote: DGB

Any chance of sharing that great wisdom any sooner? I am incredibly pissed off with DGB as I questioned her about her useless list of reads with nothing behind them, yet she continues to do them, and I do find that scummy. However, I have pulled you up for doing the exact same thing and you have not responded to me (your post #270 which I questioned in post #296). So I want to know why you have a scum read on DGB when she has basically done the exact same thing you did.

---

Still waiting on the rest of SA’s post, but I would hope it would include some kind of defence and not just finishing the reads on everyone else, as well as an answer to my question in post (#473)

[chunkykev]

Your vote isn't more IMPACTFUL because you vote less.

If you vote too much, your vote has no impact as far as getting a reaction goes. I've seen that many times. I've explained this. You don't agree. No point repeating myself.

To wit:In post 572, chunkykev wrote:It has not gone unnoticed that your (Khan%u2019s) attack on me

heated up soon after I brought up a possible link between you and SA

(You mentioned I should put a vote down in post #420. I questioned SA about a possible link to you in post #473 and then you call me scummy for the first time in post #477). Could be coincidence, but I%u2019ve learned to keep a close eye on any %u201Ccoincidences%u201D you notice in a mafia game.What the fuck is this double-talk? You say it might be a "coincidence" (note sinister quotation marks), but you acknowledge that my reason for calling you scummy is for reasons stated prior to the basis of your "coincidence".

I've bolded the important bit. You mentioned that I should put a vote down but you never made any mention of me not voting as being scummy until after I pointed out the possible link between you and SA.

And you don't back up your suspicions with a vote, you just want other people to think of me as scummy so you can jump on the wagon later on. Pussy.

Seriously? Didn't I just explain my views on throwing votes down every time you are suspicious of someone?

---

I know where DrippingGoofball stands on every poster in this game, including who she can't get a read on because they haven't posted enough.

But you have no idea if the reads are based on scum knowing people's alignment, random gut feelings, meta or something that's happened in the thread. That's why Goofball's lists are totally useless without more information to accompany them.

This is a criticism of DrippingGoofball and anyone else that has posted reads or placed votes with no reasoning accompanying it.

I don't know where chunkykev stands

How don't you? Have you not been reading the threads? I've given opinions on several people and questioned others. If I haven't given an indication of where I am about somebody then it is because I don't have a strong feeling either way about them. I'm not going to do a list of everyone like Goofball just so you know who I don't have a read on and who I find suspicious, when my views have already been made. If you were a good townie, surely you would have this information in your notes? But for the record, I don't have anyone as "likely town"

---

Kuribo has made some OK points about Khan, but nothing that can't be explained as a townie scum hunting and sticking to their views (sometimes misguided) and making the odd honest mistake so certainly not among my top possible scum, at this point. Although, I'm not convinced by SA's answer to the "explained SDC" matter and if SA was to flip mafia, it would make me more concerned about Khan.

[chunkykev]

Enough's enough. Khan is going to get his wish and see my place a vote down.

Goofball, feel free to read my ISO, and look at the times I have ciriticized you or the type of thing you are doing. You are adding nothing with your posts and, until you actually say something worthwhile or explain your thoughts properly, I've got to think you are scum trying to look active, trying to look as if you are scumhunting and ignoring questions put to you.

VOTE: DrippingGoofball

[chunkykev]

@Shattered

- Could you please answer my question in post #572?

@Goofball - I'm sorry to hear about your real life situation and hope things get better for you.

However, in the context of the game, don't mean to sound harsh, but that is no excuse. If you can't play the game you should be asked to be replaced. If you are playing the game then you must be held accountable for your play and I still expect reasons for your reads and votes - it would be wrong to treat you differently to anyone else. If you have reasons then share them and you must have reasons if you are town.

I'd rather be lynched than persevere in a game full of cranky people while my life sucks eggs.

That is not a town attitude. Town should never want to be lynched.

[chunkykev]

But your "Enough's enough. Khan is going to get his wish..." post is straight up appeasement and blame shifting. I checked your iso, you've never asked DrippingGoofball any direct questions about any specific reads, you've just asked vague-y "Are you going to contribute?" questions which are insulting to answer for anybody.

I have continually asked Goofball about her posts (yes, not about the specific reads, but if she's going to give reads on multiple people then I want reasons for them all). The fact she has continued to ignore my questioning and continued to post reads with no reason is enough for me to put my vote down and hopefully get some answers from her.

Unfocused scum-hunting

In a big game with so many players and with it being day 1, taking notes on, commenting on and questioning a range of players is more beneficial that focussing on a small number of players, so where you say unfocused scum-hunting, I say gathering information about as many people as possible. You might not take notes during a mafia game, but I do and much of what I learn from day 1 will not be used until later in the game.

Shattered Viewpoint- Absolutely weak lurky play.

If Shattered fails to give me a decent answer to my questions, or continues to ignore them, then I would support a Shattered lynch.

She's also done the "fuck this game, just lynch me and get me out of it" as town (Metropolis:Revisited). Which is what her play in this game reminds me of.

That is noted and adds weight to those that have said her “just lynch me” comment isn’t scummy. In the other site where I play regularly, these kind of “just lynch me” posts are usually a pretty good anti-town tell, but this does bring in to question if that applies here, and specifically if it applies to Goofball.

[chunkykev]

However, in the context of the game, don't mean to sound harsh, but that is no excuse. If you can't play the game you should be asked to be replaced. If you are playing the game then you must be held accountable for your play and I still expect reasons for your reads and votes - it would be wrong to treat you differently to anyone else. If you have reasons then share them and you must have reasons if you are town.

This is such bullshit. I hope I'm still voting you.

Most people in this game are throwing out unsupported reads. Most of the players here are gut players, and most of them are not explaining their reasons. Fixating on somebody who doesn't have the time to fight you off, instead of attacking someone who might eviscerate you, is cowardly and scummy.

Fixating on someone? Are you having a laugh? It's even funnier as Khan has accused me of the exact opposite (I believe he said unfocused scumhunting).

Go throw my ISO and see how many different people I have commented on or questioned about reads that have no explanation to back them up. I am most certainly not fixated on one player. My vote on Goofball came after she continually ignored comments I put to her and continued to give reads with no reason whatsoever and my vote came before her telling us about her personal circumstances (although that shouldn’t be relevant to the game it does prove that I didn’t vote her just because she didn’t have time to defend herself, as I had no way to know that when I placed my vote).

So if you can point out the bullshit, that would be nice. Are you saying that she should get a free pass and I should treat her differently from everyone else?

[chunkykev]

But you're also voting DGB. Why is DGB the worst?

I would say DGB is one of the worst because she has continually ignored my questions and continued to post reads with no reasons behind them. I find this scummy. When I put my vote down, she was online and I was hoping to get an immediate reaction after continually being ignored. I did, and it didn't address any of my concerns. All she said was she didn't care and still gave no reasons for her previous reads so I am happy to keep my vote where it is just now.

However, Shattered Viewpoint is guilty of the very same thing as DGB, and, as I've said...

If Shattered fails to give me a decent answer to my questions, or continues to ignore them, then I would support a Shattered lynch.

[chunkykev]

tl;dr xRECKONERx isn't scum-hunting. He's fucking around and jumping on wagons. Scum-tell.

are you willing to stake your life on that?

because I'll go 1v1 with you in a fucking heartbeat if it gets me out of this game faster

Vote: Reck

Let's tango, motherfucker

Reck, what are you doing?

Up to this point, you don't appear to have mentioned that you think Khan is scummy so I don't understand why you would give up yourself to prove you are town just to get Khan lynched the next day (when he could very well be town too).

Are you confident from his reason play that he is scum?

[chunkykev]

EBWOP

Are you confident from his

reason

recent

play that he is scum?

[chunkykev]

In post 656, chunkykev wrote:@Shattered - Could you please answer my question in post #572?

No. I have bigger fish to fry at the moment.

Bigger fish to fry than what? You voted DrippingGoofball and I want to know why as, when you voted her, the only scum signs I can see are exactly what you were also guilty of. I’m very close to moving my vote off of Goofball and on to you so if you could let me know what makes Goofball scummier than you that would be great.

unvoteVote: Hinduragi

[/quote]

See because you messed up the quote tags, does that count as an unvote and vote on yourself? :/

[chunkykev]

Kill: chunkykev

oh dear god in heaven PLEASE BE REAL

[chunkykev]

Nice to be loved :p

[chunkykev]

I assumed the kill was a joke. Is it not?

If it is genuine then you are an idiot, Hindu. I would still have the first lynch between DrippingGoofball and ShatteredViewpoint just now, both are appearing scummier than you, in my opinion, but you better be able to justify your kill with more than just "pure scum read" as I can't see a townie using a daykill on day 1 unless they are very certain.

[chunkykev]

he disappeared right after the kill

Why'd this happen?

I disappeared? I was away from the computer for hardly any time at all. In that short time I was away, I was putting a pizza in the oven and dealing with some phone calls (work stuff). When I was finished on the phone, I posted. Next time, let me know in advance when you are going to daykill me and I'll do my best to make sure I'm sat at my computer and not doing anything else when you do it.

[chunkykev]

And, just so Hindu doesn't worry about me, I'm now going away from the computer for a while. Probably won't be back tonight (it's 9pm here) but if I'm really killed then that won't matter much :p

If the daykill is genuine (which I doubt) and I'm not back to post again, then let Hindu explain his reasons for using it. Unless his reasons sound like he was absolutely certain, then feel free to lynch him. If his reasons are convincing then Viewpoint and Goofball are the choice for lynch.

[chunkykev]

I would say DGB is one of the worst because she has continually ignored my questions and continued to post reads with no reasons behind them.

oh bullshit, she can't answer your questions if she's not reading the game / half-assing it / whatever she's doing


also, your post assumes that she gives enough of a damn to make a change to her style just because you asked her to

Firstly, how could I have known she was not “reading the game / half-assing it / whatever she's doing”? I don’t know her personal life and she only posted about that after I had put my vote down. I have explained this already…

When I put my vote down, she was online and I was hoping to get an immediate reaction after continually being ignored. I did, and it didn't address any of my concerns. All she said was she didn't care and still gave no reasons for her previous reads so I am happy to keep my vote where it is just now.

Secondly, I have very little experience on mafiascum, but I do play elsewhere, and where I normally play, if someone asks you a direct question you should answer it. Town have nothing to hide and no need to avoid answering questions put to them. Goofball’s has only after my vote given any reason as to why she hasn’t answered me, but she still hasn’t answered me or addressed any of my concerns.

Should she be treated differently due to her real life issues? I would say no. I feel for her, but in the context of the game, she shouldn’t be treated any differently that anyone else. If she can’t play the game due to real life issues then I’m sure nobody would have any problem with her asking to be replaced.

---

Do you REALLY think Grimmjow's town or are you defending him because you're boyfriends?

He has legitimately done nothing scummy or worthy of suspicion, and the way everyone wants to keep throwing shit his way screams apathetic lurkerhunt instead of genuine scumhunting.

I agree with this. Grimm's no scummier than say, MME who's obviously flaking, or Shattered who's a retard, or that guy whose name escapes me that asked to be replaced like ten pages ago

It's pretty obviously shooting fish in a barrel.

I've got to agree with Reck and Kuribo here. I'm not saying Grimm is town, but he hasn't done anything yet which makes me think he is more likely scum than many others.

---

No Daykill Has OccuredI have included the vote in #702 for consistency

Hindu, couple of questions. Firstly, I pointed out your "vote" in 702 due to your misquoting yet you haven't corrected it. Why?

Also, could you explain your pretend day vig play - reason for doing it and where you got the idea from, what reaction you expected and your conclusions?

---

Everyone who just celebrated the fake vig death of chunkykev should be voting him.

For those that commented (Reck, Kuribo), I'm curious to know if you were happy for me to be killed as you believe I am scum, or you were happy for a daykill to move the game on (a genuine day kill of me would have had a good chance of Hindu being lynched).

---

Not sure why the wagon on sleepless seems to have fizzled out. unvote, vote chunky. Let's see if this one can stick instead.

Thanks for joining us, Lowell. Really helpful post there as usual. If you genuinely believe me to be scum then why not tell everyone why so they can support my lynch? I just don’t understand the logic of voting with no reason. Clearly that is something I will need to get used to here, as many are guilty of it, but I don’t need to like it and I still can’t think of any town motivation for doing it.

---

Problem with that is, I do agree with him on that point--- but this isn't MD, and you're not going to change the playstyle of those that do this.

I don’t know anyone’s normal playstyle so I’m not going to just ignore someone as that is how they normally play. On that, is that how DGB normally plays? I’ve not looked at her old games or anything but didn’t somebody comment that she usually does give more detail (I may be mistaken, I’ll need to look through and try and find the comment).

He did finally drop a vote onto DGB for this, but... what? This wasn't worthy of a god damn vote until he was called out for not voting and until Shattered QuoteTags, Elli, Fate, and I were already on the wagon.

I hope I have now covered that (again) at the start of this post. My vote was absolutely nothing to do with being “called out” for not voting. It was to pressure DGB after what I viewed as more scummy play, and the fact she was online and posting at the time.

Why accuse someone of not answering your attacks when you already know they're barely reading the game? I mean, listen, I personally think if DGB has too much shit going on in her life to give this game the attention it needs, she should just replace out and we'd all understand. Not like her slot's in a fucked position anyway. But to try and paint it as if she's intentionally ignoring you? That's disingenuous as all fuck.

Again, look at the order things happened. DGB didn't post anything about her real life problems until after I had put a vote on her.

He doesn't even express an interest in Shittered QuoteTags until after it's pointed out that he's been ignoring people who aren't DGB.

You've got to be joking. If you are trying to build a case against me, how about actually looking at the facts?

I voted DGB in post #637 and being accused of ignoring people that are not DGB happened after that (in post #678 and is clearly wrong). I’ve “expressed an interest” in Shattered in post #296 and #572, and I even asked Shattered to respond to my earlier posts in post #656, in the very same post I responded to DGB and before I was accused of ignoring people that are not DGB.

So why did you claim I hadn’t expressed an interest in Shattered until after I was wrongly accused of focusing just on DGB? Deliberately ignoring the facts to make me look bad or a genuine mistake?

I really don't like how chunky seems to be trying to modify his shit to adapt to the criticisms he's called out on.

Is this referring to my vote again? I've already explained my reasoning and how it was not associated with Khan's comments about me not voting (no matter who or when I voted for after that criticism, someone was always going to accuse me of only voting due to being called out for not voting) and I haven't modified my play in any way so I can't think what else you could still be referring to.

[chunkykev]

Firstly, how could I have known she was not %u201Creading the game / half-assing it / whatever she's doing%u201D? I don%u2019t know her personal life and she only posted about that after I had put my vote down. I have explained this already%u2026

lolwhut

Here's what.

My husband threatened to leave me, said he'd been miserable for 26 years and there was nothing I could do to change his mind. I ran to find a job because I was going to have to make ends meet more solidly than with my web income alone.

I am now spending my days lining up lightbulbs and climbing giant ladders to move merchandise at a hardware store, for minimum wage. At 46. With a Master's degree in Molecular Biology.

He's back, but I'm not taking any chances.

So.

I'm sorry if I'm not in the mood for long winded cases.

You're getting what I can give.

If that's not good enough, lynch me.

I have continually asked Goofball about her posts (yes, not about the specific reads, but if she's going to give reads on multiple people then I want reasons for them all). The fact she has continued to ignore my questioning and continued to post reads with no reason is enough for me to put my vote down and hopefully get some answers from her.

You absolutely did accuse her of ignoring your questioning after she explained what was going on.


This isn't a matter of opinion, it is irrefutable fucking fact.

Fact? Really?

If you take stuff out of context then you can make it suit your argument but let's put it back in context. Post #674 (feel free to go and actually read it) which you have just quoted part of to show that I accused her of ignoring questions after I knew what was going on in her personal life shows no such thing. That was said in direct response to Khan asking me about my "enough is enough vote post" and that was my reason for that post and my vote (which, I'm sure I don't need to remind you, was

before

she mentioned her real life situation).

So are you going to continue to try and build a case on misinformation?

[chunkykev]

You've got to be joking. If you are trying to build a case against me, how about actually looking at the facts?I voted DGB in post #637 and being accused of ignoring people that are not DGB happened after that (in post #678 and is clearly wrong). I%u2019ve %u201Cexpressed an interest%u201D in Shattered in post #296 and #572, and I even asked Shattered to respond to my earlier posts in post #656, in the very same post I responded to DGB and before I was accused of ignoring people that are not DGB.So why did you claim I hadn%u2019t expressed an interest in Shattered until after I was wrongly accused of focusing just on DGB? Deliberately ignoring the facts to make me look bad or a genuine mistake?

I'm not saying you ignored DGB, I'm saying you ignored everyone BUT DGB and waited until it was viable to throw your vote down.

For fuck sake! Where did I ever say that you claimed I was ignoring DGB???

You accused me of only "expressing an interest" in Shattered after someone had (wrongly) commented that I was ignoring everyone but DGB. I just proved that is nonsense.

what does this even mean, expressed an interest?

You really are taking the piss now! I used the words "expressed an interest" in answering you as that is the exact line that you used in your question!

He doesn't even express an interest in Shittered QuoteTags until after it's pointed out that he's been ignoring people who aren't DGB.

[chunkykev]

@Pine - What you said doesn't make sense. How can I have been trying to "take him down with me" when I made that point after it was confirmed that I was still alive and there was no daykill? In fact, before it was confirmed, I was saying that he would still not be my top lynch target, even if the daykill was genuine and he killed a town (although he would need solid reasoning to justify his choice).

I have seen mafia with a daykill ability before. It is powerful, but not overly as long as it is limited (generally one shot), public (so they need to justify it and convince everyone their motives are town) and it doesn't end the day so I don't understand why anyone can say for certain that a genuine daykill proves someone is town.

[chunkykev]

Pfft. You're still in the process of going down hard, so while that added detail is somewhat pertinent, it is also largely irrelevant.

You do realise that pertinent basically means relevant. So you are saying that my point is somewhat relevant but largely irrelevant???

My point is totally relevant as you've just claimed a massive "scum slip" by me when you read the post in isolation, not realising it was from after it was confirmed that there was no day kill. This, along with the fact I actually said Hindu shouldn't immediately be top lynch candidate if the daykill is real (after Fate stated he would vote Hindu if I flipped town), shows that your whole reasoning is wrong.

Also, you've totally ignored my point about there being absolutely no way to state for certain that mafia couldn't have a public daykill, which is another point in your argument.

The townie thing for you to do now Pine is admit you were mistaken. To try and still argue it when it has been proved to be so wrong is scummy.

[chunkykev]

Chunkykev can talk his way out of anything because his answers are honest townie answers. Easy to explain anything when you are honest town.

I've no problem with someone attacking me, but once I have explained myself or it has been pointed out why there reasoning is flawed, you've got to have concerns with someone that continues to push and doesn't accept they are wrong.

Will catch up properly tonight (few hours hopefully) but can someone point out any specific games I should look at to see the Spy's meta? If the case put forward is correct, then Spy should be lynched, but I won't lynch based on meta if I haven't seen it for myself.

Also, how is Shattered avoiding any more attention? He is one of my top scum choices just now.

[chunkykev]

Now that scum daytalk has ended, I think we should lynch Seraphim.

Unvote
Vote: Seraphim

WTF is this? Attacking and then voting a replacement that hasn’t had a chance to catch up and post yet, and replaced someone who also said nothing.

What is the point of this attack and then vote?

---

So SA makes a big post and you pick out one insignificant little point and dedicate a whole post to it? what was the point of this post?

What you refer to as the "insignificant little point," I saw as a potential scum slip. In my opinion, Khan did not explain SDC and, if SA is mafia, it could easily have been a slip by SA referring to something said in their QT. What is wrong with picking out one part of a big post if you believe it is a scum slip?

---

Chunkykev can talk his way out of anything because his answers are honest townie answers. Easy to explain anything when you are honest town.

Yeah, I used to have that "Come at me with your case! Let's wall and I'll prove you wrong!" attitude as scum. It's so painfully transparent now.

OK - stop thinking like a noob. Take a step back and consider that I am telling the truth and I am town. Now reread anything I have said and you'll find it all makes perfect sense as town. You've got it in your head that I am scum and you are letting that affect your judgement and any logical and reasonable analysis of my responses.

On the plus point, I am now seeing your play against me as more blinkered town than scum trying to push through something that isn’t there.

---

Guys Spy is scum

This Spy wagon needs more votes

Also, how is Shattered avoiding any more attention? He is one of my top scum choices just now.

Hush now, the adults are talking.

Are you hinting that you are actually going to say something?

I've spoken with the Mod about this issue.

I thought you referenced yourself as an "adult" but you're going off crying to mummy because you don't like how the other boys play? Lol

@Shattered – You refused to answer it before and I will ask again. Post #572 please! Answer!

In post 555, Shattered Viewpoint wrote:Okay, so. Reality visited me the last couple of days. In the future, you will most likely be hearing my Great Wisdom much more frequently.Now, who to choose. Rhinox and DGB are quite scumalicious currently.Hmmm. Eeny, meeny, miny, mo.unvoteVote: DGB

Any chance of sharing that great wisdom any sooner? I am incredibly pissed off with DGB as I questioned her about her useless list of reads with nothing behind them, yet she continues to do them, and I do find that scummy. However, I have pulled you up for doing the exact same thing and you have not responded to me (your post #270 which I questioned in post #296). So I want to know why you have a scum read on DGB when she has basically done the exact same thing you did.

[chunkykev]

I agree with hindu's assessment of chunky's reaction to the daykill.

What assessment of my reaction?

He accuses me of "disappearing after the daykill" when I wasn't at my computer for about 20 minutes or so, then makes reference to me joking about being loved (fully believing the daykill was not real).

I have asked Hindu about the daykill and he has not answered...

Hindu, couple of questions. Firstly, I pointed out your "vote" in 702 due to your misquoting yet you haven't corrected it. Why?Also, could you explain your pretend day vig play - reason for doing it and where you got the idea from, what reaction you expected and your conclusions?

---

What you refer to as the "insignificant little point," I saw as a potential scum slip. In my opinion, Khan did not explain SDC and, if SA is mafia, it could easily have been a slip by SA referring to something said in their QT. What is wrong with picking out one part of a big post if you believe it is a scum slip?

Is this the first time you mentioned it might be a scumslip? I didn't get that the first time I read it it just seemed like you picked a small part of the post and refuted it as never happening and calling SA scum for it.

I think it was pretty clear what I was getting at. Read the last line of my post…

Khan - A lot of people say he's town, and I tend to agree. So. Joke votes Spy.

Explains SDC for me.

Asks Reck ab out his "SDC has scum" post. Does his list, votes Kuribo. Explains list to Pine, asks for better reads from Pine. Explains Kuribo vote, admits it's weak because it's early. A lot on Kuribo then switches to reck (huh?). Adds me to his list while removing Fate, Pine, and ZD. Meh, this'll be my weakest town read I think. His reconsideration of Kuribo seems weird, but I think it makes sense. And he seemed to tunnel on Kuribo for a while. Mostly looks fine though.

Could you point out exactly where Khan explained SDC to you, or was it not on the thread? I've just double checked through his ISO and don't see any such explanation unless you mean this…

Reck, I've been away a little while. Wanna fill me in?

I'm not Reck, but I'm pretty certain it refers to the fact that they are a sort of clan...

...that screams at you....

.....Until you die.....

...



VOTE: SpyreX because he needs to spend less time on mafia and more time with his family. C'mon everyone. Let's help him break his mafia habit.

Which I would hardly call an explanation of the SDC as it was incredibly clear before this that they were a clan (you even admit reading it in the queue, which is where I immediately figured out it was a clan).

When you said he explains SDC for you I was looking for him telling you who they are. Did he do that on the mafia thread?

[chunkykev]

Put your fucking votes on SpyreX.

can someone point out any specific games I should look at to see the Spy's meta? If the case put forward is correct, then Spy should be lynched, but I won't lynch based on meta if I haven't seen it for myself.

---

You didn't respond as town should, i.e. flip out, show emotion, give a quick list of reads and reasons before flip, etc. You responded more like scum, i.e. joked about it, no emotion, played it off as if you assumed it was fake, didn't try to be helpful in your last posts before flip, etc.

I totally believed it was fake which is why I joked.

If he was a real day vig there is no way he would use his kill so randomly, totally out of nowhere, shortly after making a case and voting against someone else. He'd only mentioned me a couple of times so far in the whole game, and none of them recently. I was there and online and he daykills me without even questioning me, or mentioning me at all. Of course it was fake.

I still await Hindu's answer about what he was trying to achieve with it. Did you notice his "pure scum read" on me was based on things that happened after the daykill? I believe he was hoping to build a case on me based on my reaction, but I'll await his response before commenting on it any more.

---

kev's totally scum, what he's doing is trying to make it look like SA had the SDC explained to him in the scum's daytalk and scumslipped about it in the thread

I wasn't trying to make it look like that, it was genuinely my first impression when I read SA's post as I still don't know who the SDC are so when SA posted that Khan had explained it, I went looking for Khan's explanation and only found him saying "they are a clan" - which was already pretty damn obvious from the sign up thread before the game even started.

While I wasn't convinced with SA's response to this, I am now beginning to think Khan is more likely town (as mentioned earlier) and if Khan is town then clearly this wasn't the scumslip I thought it may have been (which doesn't mean SA isn't scum).

@Kuribo – Can I ask why you are commenting on this now when you never mentioned it at all when I posted about it in the first place?

[chunkykev]

to me, it points to you accidentally using knowledge that you have first hand--- you assumed that everyone knew the scum were daytalking. but why would anyone assume that? 33 pages makes the game feel like it's been going on for weeks and weeks. Not one week and a day. but, maybe i'm just an idiot who didn't notice when the mod said that

So because you "a) forgot they were daytalking" / "b) didn't realise how long had passed" then I must be scum for not making the same error? What a lot of nonsense. Your reason for not knowing they were daytalking is OK (undecided if I believe it though) but it doesn't then mean anyone that didn't think the same as you must have first hand knowledge.

[chunkykev]

Hindu, couple of questions. Firstly, I pointed out your "vote" in 702 due to your misquoting yet you haven't corrected it. Why?

Also, could you explain your pretend day vig play - reason for doing it and where you got the idea from, what reaction you expected and your conclusions?

Fuck you. I didn't think Max would count it since it was obviously a typo.
You're annoying. I got the idea from my wanting to kill you after reading your post about my vote. I expected it to do SOMETHING because this game is boring. Mission accomplished.

That's your full explanation? You expected it to do SOMETHING. And you say mission accomplished so it clearly did do something. What something was that?

I take it you are happy I am not scum then as I'm leading the vote count and you have just...

Unvote; Vote: Grimmjow

P.S. No need to swear. Play nice :p

[chunkykev]

Must have posted at exact same time, as never seen your post there, Hindu, which answers the question about your view on me.

[chunkykev]

Grimm’s last 3 posts…

I am far too hungover for this game right now. I will get back into the game later this evening.

Ok, so my main focus game just went into night phase, which means I'll actually be able to pay attention to this one. And not be hungover, either. I'll get back to this later this afternoon.

Oh my fuck, what is this game. It's moving hella fast. I have to catch up later.

Since first saying you would be back “later this evening” you’ve went over 3 and a half days and around 350 posts with only two more posts from you, to just say that you’re going to catch up. Instead of talking about catching up, how about actually catching up and posting something with content because right now there is nothing to say you are not just scum lurking and only posting enough to avoid being prodded?

---

DrippingGoofball is beginning to post a bit more content, there is no support for her lynch (I’m the only one still voting her) and others are looking more scummy than her just now so…

UNVOTE: DrippingGoofball

---

Shit, that's only about half the players and still looks massive. The rest can probably be expected by tomorrow. Please don't hammer before I can get it up. I want to get these out there and I want them looked back on later in the game.

I'll get to those reads when I can. I'll understand if people are pissed.

Damn right people should be pissed! Over 5 ½ full days since the first half of your “don’t hammer me before I finish them” reads.

If I don't, feel free to hammer" Monday, not a "I'm gonna say Monday so come Tuesday maybe people will forget and I can say Thursday" Monday. Seriously, hold me to it.

And you did say to hold you to it, so why shouldn't we lynch you right now? When are the rest of these reads actually going to happen?

I’m worried that you avoiding completing your read list is your way to avoid being voted as, although many have still mentioned you as a possible scum, many votes have been moved off you (if my count is right, you are only sitting on 1 vote just now).

I’ve also asked you to tell us why you shouldn’t be lynched more than once (when you were very close to being lynched – in fact, I could have hammered you at one point but wanted to give you a chance to talk first) and I believe that’s been forgotten about as the votes have moved away from you.

---

My Milked Eek has informed me that he will be posting tomorrow.

Still waiting

---

Having quickly looked through Spy’s ISO, I see the logic on most of what he has said, I agree with a lot of what he has said, and I just don’t get any scum vibes from him just now. I won’t be supporting his lynch today.

---

Sleepless is still looking like scum to me, and his continued missing reads to not help my opinion. He was on L-1 and has managed to get to just 1 vote on him, despite it still being mentioned that he looks scummy by people. Sleepless should be leading the vote count and it’s time to put the pressure back on him. Follow my lead people…

VOTE: Sleepless Assassin

---

Unofficial Vote Count (up to this post) – it’s unofficial, it could be wrong :p

SpyreX (5): Sleepless Assassin, xRECKONERx, Ellibereth, Fate, Lowell

chunkykev (4): elvis_knits, Kublai Khan, Kuribo, Rhinox

Kuribo (2): Seraphim (Malthusis), springlullaby
Sleepless Assassin (2): Grimmjow, chunkykev

elvis_knits (1): Zdenek
Grimmjow (1): Hinduragi
Hinduragi (1): Shattered Viewpoint
Pine (1): SpyreX
Shattered Viewpoint (1): Sociopath
Sociopath (1): Pine
xRECKONERx (1): DrippingGoofball

Not Voting: My Milked Eek

[chunkykev]

Any need for all this shouting?

More to the point, another Sleepless post saying "I'll do it soon." Can we lynch him already?

[chunkykev]

What has the length of day got to do with voting for lurkers?

With high activity, it is easier for scum to lurk by and lurkers shouldn't be allowed to sneak through. They should always be challenged and then voted if they continue to add nothing.

If Grimm doesn't add anything, I would consider moving my vote on to him if it helps force a response, but I do believe SA is still the best day 1 lynch.

If the meta on Spy is so relevant, can someone please point out multiple games for me to look at (you can't get an accurate meta from just one game so Modern Family alone is no good)? I still believe Spy looks town from this game's play but will read what is relevant to other people's meta argument. I am expecting to find nothing worth using, especially as I've already asked about which games to look at and had no response.

[chunkykev]

Why are we wagoning town again?

Why are you posting without your reads again???

[chunkykev]

chunkykev has asked about a week long V/LA from the first, I am considering the appropriate action. Considering the day does not seem to be approaching end I think my first choice will be to replace. If anyone has an objection to this, let me know

@chunkykev - If you do get replaced you should publish your game notes.

If I do get replaced, I will put my reads and opinions on everyone first (and actually do it unlike Sleepless).

To be clear though,

I do not want to be replaced

. So everyone is aware of the situation, my wife has booked a last minute holiday. Great surprise, can't wait to go, but it will mean a week with no internet access (fly out on afternoon 1st and back on the 8th November). I would hope I would be allowed to continue to play as a week so early in the game isn't that serious. The game is moving quickly but I will catch up and I have been active, and will continue to be active, up until I go. There are players out there who have posted very little, if any, content for a week so me missing a week when you know I will be active again after it would hopefully be OK.

I have asked Max to consider this (and ask the group's opinion if he thinks he should), as I really would rather be in the game than replaced out, but if he thinks it is best to replace me then that is his choice, and I would understand that.

[chunkykev]

I'll be doing those reads this afternoon just so everyone knows. Just finished career related stuff that you don't care about that took almost 2 hours, then I have something else that will take maybe an hour, then after my girlfriend's lunch break, this game has my mostly undivided attention.

And we'll believe it when we see it.

I was just about to start taking bets on how many votes it would take for SA to return with the rest of his reads. It's been that long, that the first half of his reads are probably now out of date Will we be getting an update on them SA?

Unofficial Vote Count (up to this post)

Sleepless Assassin (6): chunkykev, elvis_knits, Grimmjow, Kuribo, Lowell, Pine

SpyreX (4): Ellibereth, Fate, Sleepless Assassin, xRECKONERx

Grimmjow (3): DrippingGoofball, Hinduragi, Rhinox
xRECKONERx (3): Kublai Khan, SpyreX, Sociopath

Kuribo (2): Seraphim, springlullaby

Kublai Khan (1): Zdenek
Pine (1): Shattered Viewpoint

Not Voting: My Milked Eek

21 Alive, 11 to Lynch

[chunkykev]

I am not hunting for a replacement for My Milked Eek

Why not? Or should that "not" say "now"?

And am I allowed to keep playing with my week off, please Mr Mod? xxx

[chunkykev]

I'll be doing those reads this afternoon just so everyone knows. Just finished career related stuff that you don't care about that took almost 2 hours, then I have something else that will take maybe an hour, then after my girlfriend's lunch break, this game has my mostly undivided attention.

So you've been doing stuff for 2 hours that we don't care about (so true :p) but that's done so don't see the point in telling us. You still have stuff to do for about an hour, then your girlfriend's lunch break then this game has your mostly undivided attention.

Considering you posted this over 5 hours ago now, that is one hell of a lunch break! Going to my bed now (after midnight here) and curious if they'll be anything when I get up in the morning.

[chunkykev]

Still don't think he's scum but I like this wagon more than reck or spy and nobody seems to be willing to seriously wagon anyone else anyways.

So you are voting someone you think is not scum and you're not making a case to start a wagon on someone else?

---

SA wanna claim? Because you are technically lynched already.

I can pick holes in much of what SA has just said in the "reads" post (and I probably will if I get a chance, but working day and night just now so will be tommorrow (UK time before I can do it properly), but in what was is SA technically lynched already?

[chunkykev]

UNVOTE: Sleepless Assassin

Didn't realise he was so close, and I'm going out to work - won't be back until tomorrow afternoon my time and would rather have a good read of what he's said before he's finally lynched. I may well revote him then if I'm still happy to see him lynched.

[chunkykev]

Hasn't shattered been low activity for the full game? Some could call it lurking :p

[chunkykev]

@Spyrex - is there any town benefit to your claimed ability? Must you use your abilities each night? Would it not be much safer for town if you were dead so I think you sacrificing yourself to save Eli is something that should be seriously considered?

R.e. Pine - I don't like the claim (bulletproof until you sacrifice yourself so surely that would just be bulletproof then?) and I'm very uneasy with the "Misled leader" reference.

R.e. Shattered - Really uneasy with how you felt the need for a vote change so soon after me unvoting to give me time to reread, especially with no reason given for you to vote Sleepless. Putting him back on L-1 like that could easily be for scum intentions as you were worried I would not have revoted him after rereading his posts, and if I had reason not to others may have been convinced of the same.

@Socio - Why did you hammer? Shattered put him on L-1 and your previous post before the hammer was stating Shattered was scum, so why did you follow him, and why no reason from you for the hammer vote?

[chunkykev]

socio is dead dude

Very good point. I'm a tit.

[chunkykev]

VOTE: Pine

I'm off on holiday shortly, as you all know, and I want a vote in place before I go. He just looks scummier the more he tries to explain his claimed role. I don't like it. I don't buy it.

[chunkykev]

chunkykev is town because SocioPath died and he didn't notice

There is plenty in my day 1 play that shows I am working in the interests of town and you should think I am probably town because of that, but definitely not certain. But this reason is poor. Yes, I forgot it was Socio that was killed when doing that post, but there is nothing to say that I didn't do that deliberately. Only I know it was a genuine mistake and anyone else must be aware of the possibility that it could be a deliberate mistake to look town.

---

UNVOTE: xRECKONERxVOTE: chunkykev

You know I'm not going to be here to defend myself as I'm going on holiday for a week today, yet you feel the need to put a vote on me. Why would you attack someone that can't defend themselves? You should know I am on holiday from today, and you had no way of knowing if I would be posting again. I just don't know if it's scummy or silly, but I do have major worries about you, Khan.

---

you bragging about your scum play being so awesome does nothing to make anyone think you're town

Totally agree and is beginning to look very forced from Pine.

---

my biggest problem when i hunt scum is that i sometimes confuse idiocy for scumminess

It's a very common thing to be guilty of, and is very hard not to do, especially if there are poor players in the game. What you must be careful of is not to go the other way though. Don't start thinking someone is being so stupid that they can't be scum, as I've seen that happen in games on another site.

---

This is my last post before I get on a plane!

I’ll keep my vote on Pine just now as still very uncomfortable with the claim and his recent play. My next choice would be Shattered, who is V/LA for a bit, so when he is back, question him hard regarding his decision to put SA back on L-1 with no good reason. I’ve been uncomfortable with Shattered’s lurking and unhelpful play throughout day 1, and this has done nothing to make me thing his intentions are town.

Happy scumhunting while I’m on holiday!

[chunkykev]

My next choice would be Shattered, who is V/LA for a bit, so when he is back, question him hard regarding his decision to put SA back on L-1 with no good reason.

Then why didn't you unvote when SA was at L-1? You were on that wagon, too dude.

On phone waiting on lift so you haw my company for another few minutes.

I did unvote when he was at L-1! That is my full point. I unvoted so I had time to review what he had said before deciding to put my vote back on him or not. Shattered then put him back on L-1 with no explanation.

[chunkykev]

UNVOTE: Sleepless Assassin

Didn't realise he was so close, and I'm going out to work - won't be back until tomorrow afternoon my time and would rather have a good read of what he's said before he's finally lynched. I may well revote him then if I'm still happy to see him lynched.

[chunkykev]

no, i totally do for the right price

What's your price, big boy?


Also, I think it's time for a vote-change:

unvote

Vote: Sleepless Assassin

[chunkykev]

You know I'm not going to be here to defend myself as I'm going on holiday for a week today, yet you feel the need to put a vote on me. Why would you attack someone that can't defend themselves? You should know I am on holiday from today, and you had no way of knowing if I would be posting again. I just don't know if it's scummy or silly, but I do have major worries about you, Khan.

not being here doesn't make you town

Totally true. I never said he shouldn't vote me because I am town, I am questioning why he would vote someone now who he wouldn't expect a response from in over a week.

[chunkykev]

Did I miss anything important, as didn't really see much while catching up through day 2?

Is there any reason ShatteredViewpoint or Lowell shouldn't be receiving some heavy pressure right now as they both appear to be lurking, possible scum and no benefit to town?

Who in the fuck is chunky I didn't even know he's in the game.

Was on holiday during most of day 2. Back now

[chunkykev]

Kuribo, can you explain why you are so sure Fate didn't investigate Pine on day 1?

[chunkykev]

Chunky's over curiosity is deciding if the claimed cop is lying or not. If he's lying, why would we follow him?

[chunkykev]

If kuribo has hard evidence, then that is as good as a counterclaim. If he doesn't, then of course I'm following the cop.

[chunkykev]

In fact, it's better than a counter as doesn't out the real cop. So if Kuribo has hard evidence then he should reveal it, even if it means revealing a PR, as it saves the real cop being revealed.

[chunkykev]

I agree, Pine. But giving him the opportunity just in case. My bed time now. Feel free to hammer if kuribo has nothing concrete.

[chunkykev]

any day I don't have to read the thread is a good day by me.

Good quality townie attitude that Lowell has been showing the full game[/sarcasm]

[chunkykev]

VOTE: Hoppster

[chunkykev]

Fate knew what would happen if his lynch choice flipped town, but chose not to let us know that the information was not first hand at the time. Looks scummy as hell now. Fate, why did you not share this info earlier?

[chunkykev]

Fate, why were you so certain the messages came from town and were not fake? You must have considered that surely?

[chunkykev]

So you totally disregarded the possibility they could be fake information given to you by scum, even though they would lead to a lynch of Hoppster then probably you?

Why not Hoppster? Maybe there was no reason behind it. Maybe it was a random townie. Maybe he said something that was too close for comfort about one or more of the scum.

But I find it very hard to believe that you went with the messages with no evidence at all that they were town, and didn't share this information with us even though you must have known the heat you would come immediately under if Hoppster flipped town.

My vote would be on you if you were not up for dying anyway.

[chunkykev]

DGB, I understand your frustration if you are town, but to then work against town is not fair on those trying to play the game. If you are town not making it to morning then I would rather lynch scum today and lose you at night than lynch you and have another town die at night.

I've looked through your posts and I can't find anything definitive enough to be sure of as breadcrumbs, particularly thoughts that change on a new day so could be affected by your night action. Maybe I am being stupid and missing it, but I've really tried. You always have opinions on multiple people so I can't know which one is due to your action and which is not.

If you are sure you will be night killed then a claim and results revelation is in town's best interest. You might be frustrated at town, but would you rather those playing as scum win instead?

---

I want to switch with Fate.

Please do.

[chunkykev]

Certainly, those playing as scum deserve to win more than this ridiculous town.

How can you know that unless you know which players are scum and which are town?

Your attitude is awful if you are genuinely town, and you should have replaced out if that was your thoughts. This thread has gone a bit quiet, but it was the weekend and, certainly where I normally play, activity usually drops at the weekend. Also, personally, I was waiting for a response from you to see if you would be reasonable.

You are either scum trying to play us or you are really town, but really don't give a shit, in which case your lynch and role revelation, and the accompanying breadcrumbs you claimed to have posted, will be able to be analysed and help us out. I tend to be swaying towards thinking you are scum.

VOTE: DrippingGoofball

Lowell and Shattered bother me. As does Eli.

We'll no more once Fate's alignment is confirmed, but I believe he is scum.

[chunkykev]

Again, I still don't see why everyone is loathe to make this lynch.

Where is your vote just now, Lowell?

[chunkykev]

UNVOTE: DrippingGoofball

Her play after thinking she has been lynched swung much more towards being town.

[chunkykev]

The Fate lynch can probably wait for today now that Eli is going bye bye (annoying enough for you, Eli?).

Wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see Lowell and Pine be scumbuddies after their recent distancing antics, especially from Lowell, who is scum.

Heh, I guess not on DGB. unvote, vote DGB, for some reason I'd thought I did that already.

Or you didn't want to put your vote on DGB, while appearing to support the group lynch, so your name wouldn't be on the lynch of another townie?

(For clarificiation, although DGB has started appearing more town, IMO, she certainly isn't def town).

VOTE: Lowell

[chunkykev]

Sorry I've not been on in a while guys, days off work became days in work

Anyway, caught up - and glad to see my read on Shattered was spot on and he's bye bye (although not in the best of ways).

The mason claim is dangerous, but as some have said, their ISOs don't hint at it being false. If it is false it is a great claim at a great time, as increases the chances of a mislynch hugely, which could be virtually game ending as others have pointed out. I will bear in mind the possibility that it is just a very good scum play, but it is more likely true.

If it is true then scum must be between, by process of elimination (and believing Pine, as he's put his sacrifice power in to action so would be quickly found out as a liar if he isn't honest), Katsuki, Lowell, Seraphim, xReckonerx and Zdenek. My preferred choice would be Lowell, where my vote is, as I've found him useless, lurky scum for a long time now. Seraphim is not much better. Reck's recent reactions do not look overly townie either.

My only concern is if the mafia have played this really well. If there are 5 remaining (so 6 scum in a 21 player game, which is reasonable), then if the claimed masons and Pine were all mafia, this would be the day for the mason fake claim and for Pine to put his "sacrifice" in to action. If it is all lies and we mislynch, then a successful night kill is game over. Are elvis, KK and Pine good enough to pull something like that off? I don't have experience on this site, so I can't answer that.

If they are trying to push a mislynch in this way, then they would quickly become screwed if we lynch mafia today (as Pine would be exposed as a liar), so let's make sure we do that.

[chunkykev]

KK was very quick of the DGB wagon following the modkill of Shattered.

While it was obvious that DGB was town, following the modkill, scum KK would surely have just lurked to give Elvis an opportunity to hammer DGB if the numbers were as we believe, and only went the townie route of unvoting DGB once someone else had moved her away from L-1. Because of this I am much more inclined to believe the mason claim. And if the mason claim is true, Pine lying is just stupid, so looks like that's true as well.

[chunkykev]

EBWOP

KK was very quick

off

the DGB wagon following the modkill of Shattered.

[chunkykev]

Everyone was quick off DGB when the modkill happened. The modkill proved DGB Town, as it was a major slip elsewhere that he knew DGB was Town. Pay attention.

But KK was first off. If KK was mafia with Elvis then he would not have been first with the unvote until Elvis had the chance to hammer and win the game. Once someone else had moved DGB from L-1, then KK would unvote as there would be no chance of a quick lynch. As I said, this makes me much more confident that their claim is true, and hence no reason to doubt you, Pine. I am paying attention. Clearly you are just not reading what I am saying.

Questioning the validity of Masons and even my suicide

Oh, I'm sorry. I'll just blindly follow any claim without considering other possibilities. That would be very helpful for fakeclaiming scum! [/sarcasm]

continuing to go after Lowell when there's proof that Lowell is not a scum PR,

While I would obviously hope to lynch a scum PR before a regular goon, the most important thing here is to lynch mafia. If that means going for a goon, as I'm more confident they are scum that someone else, then that is exactly what I will do.

[chunkykev]

Pine, you really need to get your fixation with me being scum out of your head. It's not helpful.

[chunkykev]

...there's proof that Lowell is not a scum PR[...].

I can't be certain I wasn't roleblocked.

While I can't speak for Max, I know myself as mod, and any games I have played under other mods on other sites, give a different result for not seeing anything or being blocked - no one vs no result kind of thing. While not conclusive, I would assume that your ability has shown that he is not a mafia with a night action every night. While he didn't make the kill, he could be a goon or could have a passive ability (e.g. Godfather's immune to cop investigation power) or could have an ability that he can't use every night.

[chunkykev]

With two Trackers, a Ninja is also much more likely than usual.

Also a possibility.

So for this reason, Pine, why so keen not to lynch Lowell? DGB's result does nothing to stop him being mafia and what you and I have just said shows that it is possible that he could still be a mafia PR.

[chunkykev]

ChunkyKev, do you think that Seraphim is actually better than Lowell, even if it's not by much? If so, why?

No, I don't.

I've been happy to lynch Lowell for a good while now, which is why my vote is where it is, but looking at Seraphim's ISO, I would happily support that lynch if that was the preference. Either of them is OK for me. As for the other lynch candidates, I'll look more closely at them when I get home tonight (hopefully if nothing comes up to keep me off the computer again), but right now I certainly feel more comfortable lynching either Lowell or Seraphim than anyone else.

[chunkykev]

I don't have a problem with lynching Lowell. Based on actions in the thread alone, he's one of the scummiest players left alive that isn't confTown. However, a null tracking result makes the priority of his lynch decreased. Speculation on possible ways to avoid a Tracker is all well and good, but the odds of dodging said tracker are not super. Odds are very likely that he's a goon, and not the PREFERRED lynch for the day.

I'm sorry. I thought we were 8 town down and only 1 scum, and that due to a modkill. If I knew we were actually massively ahead had some mislynches to play with then I would consider prioritising our lynches. [/sarcasm] [/again]

We lynch the scummiest player. Simples. If two are equally as scummy then I can see a reason for going for someone more likely to not just be a simple goon, but we have no certainty about anything so lynching the most scummy is the way to go. Talk of preferential lynches, especially when we haven't lynched a single mafia yet, is dumb.

[chunkykev]

Why is sera not on the scum list anymore, DGB? Why is the claim so easily believed?

If it is a lie and we lynch sera then we hit scum. If sera is telling the truth (which i have large doubts about) and we lynch him, then at least there is no night kill before we pick someone else for the lynch.

Kat's "I'm a VT, see you all later" post does appear scummy, but reck's defence is strong and that doesn't make a lot of sense if they are scum together.

I'm still confident that a Lowell lynch will get rid of one scum though, although it would be lovely to actually here from the scummy lurker, but I won't hold my breath.

[chunkykev]

Lowell, any chance of adding something meaningful or you outgoing to scummy lurk until you are lynched?

A vote on the leading wagon with no actual reason is pathetic, especially when you are one of the top candidates being spoken about for the lynch. Just makes me even more comfortable with where my lynch vote is.

[chunkykev]

EBWOP

Lowell, any chance of adding something meaningful or you going to scummy lurk until you are lynched?

A vote on the leading wagon with no actual reason is pathetic, especially when you are one of the top candidates being spoken about for the lynch. Just makes me even more comfortable with where my lynch vote is.

[chunkykev]

@DGB- I can't prove my towniness, directly, but something about the way you ask that makes me think you can.

You're not aware that DGB has already claimed forever ago? You were one of his targets. If you really don't know that then you are the most useless player I've ever had the unfortunate honour of being in a game with.

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Spoiler:

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morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons 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morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons 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morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons morons

I hope you are wrong, Reck, but right now I tend to agree with you

[chunkykev]

Sometimes it's shit being right!

Now can we maybe lynch scum today?

VOTE: Lowell

[chunkykev]

Nice to see fate keeping up with things. Go find pine's claim and you'll see why there was no night, you muppet!

I'm a VT. Recruited the day I got my retirement cash (is the mod trying to say I'm old? :p).

My vote on Lowell can stay where it is as I'm confident he is scum (Reck is looking a lot more townie now as scum Reck didnt need to try and stop that last lynch, although I'm certainly not saying he is clear).

We wouldnt be at LYLO if people had actually voted for the scummiest players before now.

[chunkykev]

Also, for those a bit slow, Seraphim is also defscum. Zdenek too.

[chunkykev]

Lowell is today's lynch. Seraphim and Zdenek lynches both coming to a town near you very soon.

If there is another mafia still out there after that, then it gets trickier. Reck is the obvious choice by PoE, but, as mentioned above, while not cleared, looks more townie (although I understand he is very capable of faking the last day's defence for townie creds after the lynch). Are any of the other claimed townies possibly lying? Maybe not about their ability, but about their alignment. Is spyrex def town?

[chunkykev]

I don't need to hear Lowell's fake claim. And we'd probably be waiting forever for him to post anyway. :/

[chunkykev]

Reck, are you the final mafia after the names I have mentioned? Or what are your thoughts on who is lying to us?

[chunkykev]

Zdenek, check your role PM again. You are scum.

Fate is an idiot but he isn't scum for believing the messages. They were sent from scum so if he was his buddy then why would that make any sense? If he was lying about receiving them then why has nobody else spoken about about receiving such messages now we know their was a mafia messenger?

Scared I've hit the nail on the head about the remaining scum an trying to throw someone else in the mix. Give up now, Z!

[chunkykev]

So the same Fate that didn't know why the night phase was short isn't an idiot? OK then, Zdenek. Can you explain to me why scum's messenger would send their message to a fellow scum? And why would Fate claim such when he had no way to know the messenger would be modkilled to clear him?

[chunkykev]

I assume Lowell has a scum PR that you want to push another scum's lynch before him?

[chunkykev]

What a lot of crap!

Fate was going to be top lynch candidate the day after his guilty claim was shown to be wrong. He had no way of knowing that he would avoid the lynch that day and it certainly wasn't even slightly likely that SV would be dead before him. So you are claiming that SV wasted his ability by sending messages to his own scumbuddy for Fate to out a messenger role in his defence and then hope he would avoid the lynch until SV died.

Give it up, Z. You are scum. Fate is not.

[chunkykev]

Zdenek, give it up.

I haven't forgot what I thought about Fate's claim that he had received messages and decided not to tell us. I thought it made him look scummy as hell. But now we know that there was a mafia messenger thanks to the modkill there is absolutely no way them being scumbuddies together makes sense, for reasons I've already given.

Fate, zdenek's lynch can wait. He is scummy as hell, but why is he wanting a sera lynch over a Lowell lynch? Could just be trying to look townie in his analysis, or could be protecting a Lowell scum PR for one more night. Need to check back of what he said about sera's claim in the previous game day as nothing has changed. I'd already explained why Pine had to be telling the truth about his claim so sera was always claiming a 2nd night skipping role.

[chunkykev]

In your heart you may have given up

I never give up until the mod says "Game Over"!

And considering we have 3 defscum to lynch, things aren't as bad as they could be.

I'm VT, if it's my turn to claim.

And if it is not your turn to claim, you are mafia? I didn't ask for you to claim next.

[chunkykev]

Good point about lynching sera. If, as unbelievable as it is, and I don't believe it, he is telling the truth, then a mislynch of him would skip the night phase so we would have another chance at the lynch. As I'm confident he is scum anyway, I'm happy to lynch him today, although Zdenek's push for him to be lynched does make me worry that Lowell has a scum PR, but we should play the safest option so Seraphim it is.

UNVOTE: Lowell
VOTE: Seraphim

[chunkykev]

DGB, obviously I would happily support a Lowell lynch, but the logic behind lynching Seraphim first is sound. Why the Lowell vote? Is there any point prolonging the day?

[chunkykev]

Out of those five, I have the strongest town read on chunky.

You know you are going to be lynched today so you try and make a connection with me? Basic scum play. But seen as there has been plenty idiocy on the part of town, I don't blame you for trying it.

so the scum isSeraphimChunkyNot LowellZdenekThey all want Lowell's blood.

Fate, I've said it before and I'm saying it again. You are an idiot.

[chunkykev]

I have another ability.

Desperate attempt to save himself coming up. Have I got time to get some popcorn?