Mini 142: Guitarists Mafia- Game Over

[Mastermind of Sin]

random

VOTE:tick

[Mastermind of Sin]

lol, KE, comin' from the horse's mouth...

[Mastermind of Sin]

dude, I used a randomizer program, and your name came up...hence "RANDOM" vote...

[Mastermind of Sin]

UNVOTE

now that we are getting somewhere, although still

FOS:tick

for overreacting to a random vote...

[Mastermind of Sin]

hmmm, Tally's got a point there...on the other hand, why didn't you say that in your last post, Tally? Mr. Flay has not posted since you did before, and they weren't simul-posts...

VOTE:Talitha

...I want to see where this goes...

[Mastermind of Sin]

MofS: Oh I know it was a perfectly random vote, I just like people to put more effort and make up an obvious stupid reason to justify their random vote. Much like mine was.
I really don't think I over-reacted.

although still FOS:tick for overreacting to a random vote...

hehe sounds like you are the one over-reacting to my random vote

so is dourgrim evil? I am confused about that.
IS were you just making stuff up?

meh, whatever...works for me...

UNFOS:tick

for now...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Mr Flay hadn't posted, but Assassin did, saying his vote was random.

wrong. Mr. Flay posted in post 27 AND post 29, and you posted right after him in post 31, over two hours later, but didn't post your suspicion about Mr. Flay until post 35, and Mr. Flay had not posted anything since your last post to make you more suspicious of him...

[Mastermind of Sin]

i'm still here...just don't have anything to say, really...

[Mastermind of Sin]

not as sure aboit my own points as before, and since talitha hasn't done anything else suspicious since then, I'll

UNVOTE:Talitha

[Mastermind of Sin]

yup, nonny has made just the one post, not even making a random vote for the time being...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm still supicious of Talitha from before, and Dourgrim has made some pretty good, logical points...I think I'm going to

reVOTE:Talitha

for now until I get something better to go on, if I get anything better...

[Mastermind of Sin]

let's see here...first, there was the incident with Mr. Flay, where you scrounged up evidence on him well after the incident, when you should've mentioned it before if it had mattered...sounds like you are trying to make up reasons to pin someone down...now, there's the incident with dourgrim, where you are (apparently) misrepresenting his posts (i read them the same way he does) and

acting

(you didn't just come right out and say it) like you know exactly what he was trying to say in his posts while calling his posts "odd" at the same time...those two don't correlate...also, I think his reasoning on the offer to name his role was sound, not that I agree with it necessarily, and you are taking it a bit too far for my liking...that one point seems to be your only reason for voting dourgrim, and since I think that point is false, you are voting him for no logic at all...hence, my vote...along with a general "scummy" feeling I'm getting from you...

[Mastermind of Sin]

My opinion on the "Talitha vs. Dourgrim" thing is that I think Talitha is doing a better job explaining things or giving reasons for what she has said. I, however, don't find Dourgrim suspicious either, but what do I know? I don't have much else to say, I still don't see anything suspicious, maybe if we sped things up a bit there would be more to go by..

*Maverick*

you've got a point there...ALL YOU SLACKERS, STARTING POSTING DAMNIT!!!!!

[Mastermind of Sin]

good point, tick...I'll keep that in mind...Justinl, care to explain yourself?

[Mastermind of Sin]

let's see here...first, there was the incident with Mr. Flay, where you scrounged up evidence on him well after the incident, when you should've mentioned it before if it had mattered...sounds like you are trying to make up reasons to pin someone down...

sigh.. I explained this at the time.

New evidence came to light when Assassin explained his vote.

It's not my fault if you don't read and think about my posts.

i did read your posts, and I guess I just didn't feel you explained yourself adequetely...so let's just agree to disagree, unless you have a different explanation for me...in which case you'd be changing your story, and I wouln't suggest that...

now, there's the incident with dourgrim, where you are (apparently) misrepresenting his posts (i read them the same way he does)

Please give one example.

example is below...you quoted it yourself...

and

acting

(you didn't just come right out and say it) like you know exactly what he was trying to say in his posts while calling his posts "odd" at the same time...those two don't correlate...

He was quite clear when he offered to claim. I took it at face value and I still say it was an odd thing for him to do.

fine...but i see his post differently than you, apparently, because it doesn't seem all that odd to me...

also, I think his reasoning on the offer to name his role was sound, not that I agree with it necessarily, and you are taking it a bit too far for my liking...

A fair point, and you're entitled to your opinion.

agreed...

that one point seems to be your only reason for voting dourgrim, and since I think that point is false, you are voting him for no logic at all...hence, my vote...along with a general "scummy" feeling I'm getting from you...

It's one of the most suspicious things that I have seen so far. What would you like me to do, vote for someone who I'm not suspicious of?

no, but I find your actions this game more suspicious, so I am voting for you...I don't really care who you vote for, as long as there is a logical reason for it...I feel that your reasons were invalid, and that is part of the reason I am voting for you

in other news, I'd really like to hear from justinl...he's just jumped to number two on my list, only behind tally because he's not around to explain himself yet...

FOS:justinl

[Mastermind of Sin]

i did read your posts, and I guess I just didn't feel you explained yourself adequetely...so let's just agree to disagree, unless you have a different explanation for me...in which case you'd be changing your story, and I wouln't suggest that...

Why wouldn't you want me to change my story huh? If you really thought I was scum, you'd be looking to trip me up.
And if you really cared whether I am innocent, you'd be asking me for further explanation.
You've jumped to 3rd on my list. (Flay & Dour are tied for 1st place).

i see his post differently than you, apparently, because it doesn't seem all that odd to me...

I assume then, that you have first hand experience of Dourgrim's mafia style? How many games have you played with him?

aww, I'm touched, Tally...thanks ....and no, I've haven't played a lot of games with Dourgrim either, but that doesn't mean I can't read his posts differently than you do...

[Mastermind of Sin]

yes, Tally, you never really explained yourself well there...I got distracted, and you sorta skirted the issue...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Other than justinl, I'm still looking at Assasin and Talitha (and IS, of course), and MoS for seeming to parrot what everyone else is saying without really coming up with anything on his own. "you've got a point there..." seems to be his favorite phrase.

you

might

havea point there, Mr. Flay, except for the fact that

I was the first one to go after Talitha

...couldn't have been parroting anyone then, could I? The only time I ever said I agreed with anyone's points was when I revoted Talitha because Dourgrim's points

in addition

to my own were enough evidence for me to put my vote somewhere.

[Mastermind of Sin]

gah! damn spacebar isn't working...I hate using computer labs...the comps always suck...you don't know how much effort I'm going through to get this post spaced out...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Mastermind of Sin wrote:

The only time I ever said I agreed with anyone's points was when I revoted Talitha because Dourgrim's points in addition to my own were enough evidence for me to put my vote somewhere.

You sort of agreed to my point made in post 110, in post 111. Just thought I'd correct you, you have agreed with some points.

*Maverick*

thnx for pointing that out...I didn't see it before because I felt it was more like you reminded me of my earlier points, instead of having another idea I agreed with...but it certainly could fall in that category...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Other than justinl, I'm still looking at Assasin and Talitha (and IS, of course), and MoS for seeming to parrot what everyone else is saying without really coming up with anything on his own. "you've got a point there..." seems to be his favorite phrase.

you

might

havea point there, Mr. Flay, except for the fact that

I was the first one to go after Talitha

...couldn't have been parroting anyone then, could I? The only time I ever said I agreed with anyone's points was when I revoted Talitha because Dourgrim's points

in addition

to my own were enough evidence for me to put my vote somewhere.

I call BS, Mastermind:
Post 8: Echoing my suspicion of KE in post 7 for his vote on you.
Post 36: "hmmm, Tally's got a point there..." after her post 35 about my vote on Assasin
Post 70: "yup, nonny has made just the one post" after my post 69 about the same thing.
Post 91: "you've got a point there...", after Maverick complained in post 90 about there not being much to go on..
Post 93: "good point, tick..." after tick's post 92.
Post 111: "yes, Tally, you never really explained yourself well there..." after Maverick's post 110 (as he mentioned a little bit above)

Each time, you're posting immediately after someone else, and saying essentially the same thing. It's not the entirety of your posts but it is a trend I noticed... still rereading the rest of the thread, not ready to vote yet.

ah, i see...i thought you meant I was trying to agree with someone's point and use it as reasons for voting or some nonsense like that...as for KE, I didn't really notice that you had posted that suspicion, but since it cought my eye, I wanted to point it out. And yes I gave Tally her point about you, but if you'll notice, I also voted for her because of that same post...so I wouldn't say I'm necessarily agreeing with her...post 70 was just confirming that after I looked it up, it was more of a fact than an opinion or a suspicion...post 91 doesn't have anything to do with anything, either, other than that there wasn't much going on in the game to help us vote...post 93 was just anknowledging that his point was valid, and I would keep it in mind, but it had no bearing on my vote at the time...and post 111 was just more for my benefit than anyone else's, except that I felt that if more than one person pointed it out and asked her to explain it, Tally might get around to it that time...I'd already asked her to do that earlier in the game, so I didn't consider that agreeing with anyone...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Maverick, I don't really see your reasoning for unvoting Talitha...she's the second closest to being lynched, and if you really think she's guilty, you should keep your vote there...if you don't think she's guilty, I don't see why you voted for her in the first place...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I understand that, but as I see it, if people are deciding between two votes, they might go for their lesser suspicion if their greater suspicion has too little votes to seem plausible to lynch them...and at this point, if ppl are deciding between Dour and Tally, they might go with Dour just because it looks like he is easier to lynch, even if Tally is their higher suspicion...so for those of us that are way more suspicious of Tally, it is our job to keep our votes there so ppl are influenced less by how many votes someone has and more by whether or not they are the most suspicious...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm not saying you are suspicious of Dourgrim...I'm saying that those of us who aren't but are suspicious of Tally should keep the vote counts close so that it doesn't influence their vote...

[Mastermind of Sin]

true, and now that I've said all that, I'm sure ppl will make sure to not let the vote counts sway them...

[Mastermind of Sin]

huh? where? I never knew he claimed? prove it...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I can vouch for justinl in this case...he is thinking of Mini 140, where Locus Cosecant claimed Doc...I believe I can say that legally, since it's a fact taken straight out of the thread...

[Mastermind of Sin]

nothing to say, just pointing out that i'm still here and I still think Tally's scum, although maverick rose a bit on my list...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm still happy with my vote, and still struggling to get in and check the game every couple of days...

[Mastermind of Sin]

VOTE:Talitha

...returning to my previous suspicions...

[Mastermind of Sin]

let's see here...first, there was the incident with Mr. Flay, where you scrounged up evidence on him well after the incident, when you should've mentioned it before if it had mattered...sounds like you are trying to make up reasons to pin someone down...now, there's the incident with dourgrim, where you are (apparently) misrepresenting his posts (i read them the same way he does) and acting (you didn't just come right out and say it) like you know exactly what he was trying to say in his posts while calling his posts "odd" at the same time...those two don't correlate...also, I think his reasoning on the offer to name his role was sound, not that I agree with it necessarily, and you are taking it a bit too far for my liking...that one point seems to be your only reason for voting dourgrim, and since I think that point is false, you are voting him for no logic at all...hence, my vote...along with a general "scummy" feeling I'm getting from you...

I think this covers most of it...Dourgrim made a couple good points as well, and I'm more inclined to believe them since I now know he was innocent...if you select out my posts and read through, I think I covered everything from about my 10th post to my 14th post or so...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I have no clue where they are, but until I remember why I thought Justin was scummy yesterday, Maverick can stay second on my scum list for being reluctant to vote Talitha even after admitting she was the most likely scum in his opinion...

[Mastermind of Sin]

But then why would he say he thought she was scum if he didn't? That's unnecessarily risky if he has some reason to not see her lynched...

[Mastermind of Sin]

yeah, is anyone there???

[Mastermind of Sin]

Sorry about the delay of game, I'm pretty much back for good, and hopefully everyone else will come back too so this game can get started back up.

Anyways, I thought I explained why I took my vote off of Talitha on Day 1? Then I thought she was scum, and I unvoted her still thinking she was scum, but the fact that nobody else thought she was scum (except like one other person) made me take my vote off of her, because it wasn't going to do anything. Now, I don't think Talitha is scum, although I have no reason to believe otherwise, I just changed my mind.

I don't think that Mr. Flay is suspicious either, I don't think that he knows anything that we don't know.

As for KingEnigma, I don't think he is scum, but also don't have reason to believe otherwise, he hasn't contributed much this game (Can't really say I have, that'd be hypocritical*) so even if he is town, it wouldn't be a huge loss. But I'm not going to vote for him, because I would rather lynch someone today that I'm more sure of.

Again, sorry I have been absent, I will try my best to check at least once per day.

*Maverick*

what a load of BS...why take your vote off someone you think is most likely to be scum??? Voting for her was more likely to do something than not voting for her, because, as I explained before, had people been deciding between Dour and Tally as equally scummy, than they would probably go with the person with the most votes...however, the more votes she had from people who actually thought she was scum, the more likely people were to consider voting for her if they thought she was as scummy/scummier than Dourgrim...at this point, I think we've caught you in a major contradiction of your views, saying someone is scum but unvoting them for crap reasons...I think you are scum and possibly trying to protect Tally but wanting to be able to say "but I was suspicious of her and voted for her earlier" if she gets lynched and turns up scum...

UNVOTE, VOTE: Maverick

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm not lurking...this game has just been going really slow, and while Assassin is somewhat suspicious, I am content with my vote at the moment...if it comes close to lynch, I might change to Assassin, but right now Maverick and Tally are above him...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yep, but at least the Assasin diversion is scummy looking.

if it comes close to lynch, I might change to Assassin, but right now Maverick and Tally are above him...

I think it's 3/5.... some people would consider that getting close to a lynch.

oh, i didn't realize it was so little to lynch...I'm too used to big games where it's like 9 to lynch or something

UNVOTE, VOTE: Assasin

[Mastermind of Sin]

Unofficial Vote Count:

Brought to you by:

Jucy Juice!

Assasin- 3 (Internet Stranger, Mastermind of Sin, Mr. Flay)
Nonny- 1 (Talitha)

Not Voting: everyone else

With 9 Alive it is 5 to lynch.

[Mastermind of Sin]

k, so I'm coming out as the other mason. Tally actually thoguht she was going to be the one that was killed. As long as there are no counterclaims I should be confirmed innocent. She says that IS, maverick and nonny are who she thinks are the mafia. We're in a lynch or lose situation, so they need to be claiming right now.

just quoting it for reference, since Mr. Flay asked for it.

So we've gotten a doc and a cop claim out of this so far???
I'll be interested in hearing what Maverick has to say.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Sorry for the double post, by I have a new 100% sure summary:

Maverick - Innocent (cop)
KingEnigma - Innocent
Nonny -
Internet Stranger - Guilty (He claims cop, when I am cop)
Mr. Flay - Guilty
justinl -
Mastermind of Sin -

If there are two mafia members then we've definately got them, if not our odds our good, just trust me. Nonny, I trust that you are telling the truth, so please help me lynch mafia, and protect me tonight. Justinl I believe that you are town as well, so please trust me.

*Maverick*

a few things bother me about this. first of all, maverick claims to be 100% sure IS is lying, when there could be two cops in this game. Secondly, he ends his post by playing the "I believe you are innocent" card, one commonly used by scum to confuse pro-town players and make them vote the wrong way. Top this with the suspicion I already had for Maverick, and I'm not sure I believe his claim very much, especially since claiming cop is probably the only way scum could get around IS's guilty investigation.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Night one I investigated KingEnigma, because there was nobody else to investigate I had no idea about who seemed scummy, so it was completely random. But Day 1 I found Talitha suspicious, but nobody else did, that night I investigated Talitha, and she came up innocent, so my only lead was demolished. Day 2 I told you guys that I had a gut feeling about Mr. Flay, I ended up voting Assasin for the final lynch only to investigate during night. So last night I investigated Mr. Flay, and sure enough it was a guilty. Now why is it today, before I even say anything Internet Stranger decides to come out as cop when he knows he's scum? I'm guessing he was thinking that I was the cop when I said I had a gut feeling about Mr. Flay, he probably thought that I was saying that just to give a clue without completely coming out, when infact it was just a lucky guess, when I had no idea at the time, IS knew that Mr. Flay was scum. So last night they kill talitha and before I can say anything he claims cop and says he investigated talitha.

Anyways, I do have to hand it to IS, and Mr. Flay.. Andy Summers, very clever.

*Maverick*

wait a minute, are you seriously going to claim that you were the only one suspicious of Tally day 1? didn't we go through this already? these was the whole thing with you and I voting her and you unvoting for no logical reason even though she was ur highest suspicion. remember that at all? I don't know what it is you're trying to pull, but please check your facts when you post.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Maverick, IS said anyone was suspicious other than the people who he was voting for. You can look back through his posts. So therefore, it makes sense that he would investigate three of the more active or controversial players, and since he had four to choose from, I'm not surprised that you got investigated. Your actions this game have been quite controversial in my mind, and the fact that you keep misstating the facts seems like you're just digging a deeper hole for yourself. I'm not quite sure I believe IS, but your actions make you look a lot scummier to me than he does.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I really don't like the way Maverick is frantically casting suspicions everywhere. Assuming he's telling the truth, that make Mr. Flay and IS the most probable scum, but maverick seems to think that I am their only possible partner, if they are scum. At first he started by saying he thought I was suspicious and told justin he thought he was innocent, now his latests posts attempt to clear everyone BUT myself. It seems to me that since maverick knew I was suspicious of him before today, he picked me as the person he casts suspicion upon, making me moresuspicious of him while trying to play to everyone else by seeming sure of their innocence. He even changes his stance in the middle of his post. First he says he's sure Flay and IS are scum, and he's not sure of the rest of us. Then, in his scenario post, he lists me as scum/town, and everyone else as town with no possibility of being scum. I guess it just seems to me that he's trying to make everyone else feel good towards him, since he acts like he believes they are innocent. Well, Maverick, mission accomplished. These little flip flops of opinion you're having for no apparent reason have confirmed in my mind that you are the scum we're looking for, not IS. At one point your story seemed as plausible to me as IS's but the misdirections and the repeated changes of opinion in response to nothing make me think you're just fishing for reasons to make yourself more believable, whereas a real cop would just tell his/her story and stick by it, since it'd be the truth. This is what IS has done, and while I could believe that a player of his caliber could pull off an act like that as scum, the scumtells flowing from you have made me think that he's telling the truth this time. So, without further ado,

VOTE: Maverick

and hope my instincts haven't failed me.

[Mastermind of Sin]

What? Changing your mind, Maverick? Let me quote a few things and bold parts of them for you to see what I mean.

Actually Mastermind of Sin, your the least of my worries not to believe me, because

I'm not so sure your not scum with Mr. Flay and Internet Stranger.

And if there are two cops then Internet Stranger is the insane cop because my roll is cop which wouldn't come up guilty in an investigation by a sane cop. Anyways, I don't really care whether you guys believe me or not, I only have a limited way of convincing you of the truth, Internet Stranger can come up with all the lies he wants.

*Maverick*

Mr. Flay, your wrong, you and Internet Stranger surely know who my parters are, Nonny, justinl, KingEnigma, and possibly MoS, I'm not sure about.

Here is how things are right now:

Mr. Flay - Scum
Internet Stranger - Scum

Mastermind of Sin - Scum/Town

Nonny - Town/Possibly Doc
Justinl - Town
KingEnigma - Town
Maverick - Cop

Now say the scenerio is MoS is scum, if we lynch me today it's over. But if he is town then we will win as soon as you lynch me you'll know I was telling the truth and hopefully the doc (nonny) will get a lucky protection. So basically if I am lynched today town is screwed.
But I vote not to depend on either of those scenarios and lynch Mr. Flay or IS today, and tonight I'll investigate MoS for the 100% sure win.

It is in the hands of Nonny, Justinl, KingEnigma, and even MoS. So choose wisely.

I never said you were scum,

I don't even find you suspicious

, I'm just

not as sure about you as I am justinl, nonny, and kingenigma

.. that's all.. and you have voted for the wrong person, unless you are scum..

*Maverick*

That's all??? You're not as

sure

of me as you are of

everyone else in the game

? Other than Mr. Flay and IS, who you've already claimed as scum, you've said you were fairly sure of everyone

except

me. First you say I'm probably scum with the other two, then I'm the only one you list as possible scum, and then you say you don't find me suspicious? Really, what's up with that? It looks to me like you are trying to plant suspicion on me without actually claiming that I'm scum, so that my opinion today will be regarded less heavily by those who are having a tendency to believe you at this point. Sounds to me like you're trying to make it look like a group, that in addition to the two you claim are scum, the other person voting for you is he most likely third scum, so therefore his thoughts on the matter aren't really all that trustworthy either. I can understand having suspicion pointed at me when I'm not scum, since my play style tends in that direction anyways, but I hate it when people try to downplay my credibility as much as possible without actually pointing any fingers in my direction, because that looks outright scummy to me. My vote stays where it is.

[Mastermind of Sin]

my point is that you are focusing on me, the other person who had expressed suspicion of you before. You never said you thought the others could be scum, just me, and that's a scummy action to me, especially since it fits nicely with my theory of what's happening here. I imagine that you and Justin are working together, and you have a third person out there waiting to jump on Mr. Flay as soon as an innocent person votes for him. We're at lynch or lose right now, and your actions have all the markings to fit in with what I think you're trying to do here.

[Mastermind of Sin]

IS, you're confusing yourself...he was attacking me, but I still understand the point you're trying to make.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Alright, I've been gone for the weekend and then just didn't feel like posting yesterday, so here goes.

First off, it's pretty obvious that Mr. Flay is working with IS. He's trying to be the voice of reason. It's kindof stupid how he's asking me questions while i'm voting for him like we are both neutral bystanders.

Additionally, in a lynch or lose, which we are at, once a townie has voted for an innocent, it is over becasuet he mafia can jump on the wagon and force a lynch. I am confirmed innocent since no one has counterclaimed my mason-ness. I have voted for Mr. Flay, quite a while ago, and since the scum hasn't jumped on the wagon to lynch him, it means he's guilty. I'd also like to note that i'm the

only

confirmed

innocent, so no one can use the same argument to get Maverick lynched.

So can we please lynch Mr. Flay now.. To reiiterate, IS's argument is purely rhetoric and nothing he says can be confirmed.

wait, how are you confirmed innocent? maybe I missed something, but I just don't see it.

[Mastermind of Sin]

ah yes, fogot about that...

unvote

while I reconsider everything...

[Mastermind of Sin]

actually, justin, there are a few flaws in your theory. Just because you are voting for mr. flay, that doesn't mean he is scum. perhaps they don't want to just up and vote for him, in case you would catch then and unvote before they pushed the lynch through. Another possibility is that they are afraid of a vig kill, because if they expose themselves today and a vig kills one of them tonight, it wouldn't be endgame tomorrow. Either or both of those theories could be true, and would explain why scum haven't jumped on Mr. Flay yet if he's innocent. The same, of course, applies to Maverick. Also, if IS's theory about Mr. Flay and Maverick possibly being scum together is true, then the scum would need one more innocent vote before they could lynch their scum partner, unless Mr. Flay plans to vote for himself.

[Mastermind of Sin]

perhaps they don't want to just up and vote for him, in case you would catch then and unvote before they pushed the lynch through.

Which is why they have to be sneaky and say things like "I sure hope i'm right about this!!" (like you did tacking the 3rd vote on Maverick). Yes it causes suspicion if done without any talk, but there are ways to be sneaky about it. It can easily be done in the span of 3 days. PLUS, they knew I would be gone for the weekend and Maverick was not going to change his mind about lynching flay, so it should have been no problem at all.

And the whole vig theory, do you really think we have a roleblocker, masons, and a cop AND a vigilante with only 1 anti-town group? (nonny claimed doc too didnt she - not sure)

Also, if IS's theory about Mr. Flay and Maverick possibly being scum together is true, then the scum would need one more innocent vote before they could lynch their scum partner, unless Mr. Flay plans to vote for himself.

You're grasping at straws. If IS's theory about that is correct, then we should lynch Mr. Flay anyways.. duh

i'm not grasping at straws, i'm just not throwing out any possibilities...you could be right as well, but I felt it necessary to put all the possibilities i could think of in addition to that

[Mastermind of Sin]

well, you have been rather...agitated...to put it lightly...

[Mastermind of Sin]

look, if you don't see it I'll try to compile some quote tomorrow, i have a paper to write

[Mastermind of Sin]

I gave you the chance to convince me you were telling the truth, Maverick, and nothing you've done since I unvoted has helped to convince me you are anything but dirty, lying scum. Not much I can do at this point but

revote: Maverick

[Mastermind of Sin]

If I could, I'd vote for me too, because I'm at the point of not caring anymore because you guys are the most stubborn people I've ever played with. Anyways.. Good game guys. *claps* for IS, Flay, and MoS.

*Maverick*

not that I expect you to, but just a technicality: normally, you CAN vote for yourself, unless the mod specifically says you can't. Trust me, i've done it before. Take a look at mini 153, Chewton Magna. I cast the lynching vote on myself on Day 2. Anyways, just wanted to correct you for future reference.

[Mastermind of Sin]

You're conveniently ignoring the other ways I mentioned that Maverick could be scum without you being an evil mason.

so now you know Maverick's mind? If I didn't know better, I'd have thought you conversed last night...

1) Stop trying to play both sides of the die. It only serves to confuse. If you were acutally town you would be trying to find the truth, not using two opposing arguments to try to prove your point.

2) Once again, if I am not an evil mason then you are scum.

3) Yeah, I know Maverick's mind.. because I read the thread. I'll enlighten you with a brilliantly selected quote.

I'm at the point of not caring anymore because you guys are the most stubborn people I've ever played with.

I know it's hard, but if you read deep enough into it you can see where I got that Maverick is frustrated.

does everyone agree that MoS is scummy?

I am willing to lynch IS, Flay, or MOS

I don't think MR. Flay is playing both sides of the die. You're acting as if he claimed Maverick was scum with and without you, when all he really did was point those out as further possiblities. You, on the other hand are ignoring possibilities, something a pro-town play shouldn't (and I'd hope wouldn't) ever do. Obviously, the possibilities you mention don't have to show you as scum, but there are more possibilities where you aren't scum than you are willing to admit. I find that mildly scummy, but since nearly all of the possibilities where I'm not scum involve Maverick as scum, that's where my vote is going, since it's more likely that you are innocent than that he is. IS and Mr. Flay could be scum together with KE perhaps, but after weighing the merits of those possibilities I find it much more believable that Maverick is scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Mr. Flay, I really don't like how you are trying to push around something I've only done a few times and blow it into a big reason why I seem scummy to you. You just keep pointing fingers at me, but I don't see how you get me seeming scummy out of what you mentioned. I think you're just grasping at straws now.

Unvote, Vote: Mr. Flay

I think I finally see what Maverick and Justin were trying to tell us. You've got to be scum. IS, I've got to hand it to ya. You had me going for a while. Buttering me up like that, making me think that you were the real cop. Great job, but I'm not falling for it anymore. Maverick's the real cop, and I'm sticking by that.

[Mastermind of Sin]

no, that's not a lynch, and don't think that whole act of playing pro-town is gonna fool me, Mr. Flay. I would like a vote count to confirm this, though

[Mastermind of Sin]

no, KE is somehow convinced that I'm scum...

[Mastermind of Sin]

unvote

i'm not sure of this at all any more...everything seems to fit so well, until I think of several ways that it doesn't...i'll need to make a full reread before doing anything else...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Here's what I think:
When KE said that He was going to stick with his vote on MOS, MOS realized that it would probably be safe to put another vote on Mr. Flay, so that he would look innocent when Flay got lynched. The thing is, he doesn't really want his scum partner to die, so he's going to unvote now that he doesn't look partnered up with flay anymore..

If I was scum with Mr. Flay, why would it matter? If I helped lynch Mr. Flay, the cop(which would have to be Maverick for your theory to work) would then just investigate me anyways, so there wouldn't be any way to get out of that the next day. So why would voting for Mr. Flay make me his partner? You have yet to come up with any reasonable theories about why I would vote for my scum partner at this point. If I didn't want my "partner" to die, why would I have ever voted for him in the first place? Needless to say, I'm just extremely confused by all of this right now, hence the reason I've unvoted until I rethink everything.

[Mastermind of Sin]

no, i already adressed it...if I'm mr. flay's partner and I help lynch him, the cop will investigate me and it won't matter how I look. And what's this about confusing the non-cops? I thought you were of the opinion that if Mr. Flay was scum so was IS, so it's obvious that if that's true, the only person you need to follow blindly is Maverick. Like I said, you haven't produced a reasonable theory as to why I might try to lynch my scum partner, if I'm scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

vote:maverick

[Mastermind of Sin]

it had to end somehow...i don't believe either of them, so i went whereever i could to save my own skin. If we lynched wrong, i'm sorry...but maverick is just to unconvincing, and he was even willing to lynch me, someone who he doesn't know if i'm scum or not, over the person he allegedly is 100% sure is scum...at least IS is consistent.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yeah, I was going to post some really long BS analyzing the play of all six of us (not Nonny) throughout the entire game, and then I logged on and saw myself being bandwagoned but KE had just switched to Mav, so I ended it. I should've started by "believing" Maverick, but I couldn't be sure that Nonny wouldn't just end the day there. If any of us got lynched, town wins, so I had to try to swing it our way. I think we played a pretty good first two days, but this day we should've lost.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Ughh.. I'm so frustrated. lol, but I gotta hand it to Flay, and IS you guys played a good game. IS, you thought of plenty of clever things whether you were kinda quiet or not, you played well, I think without you town would have won. Flay, you had a good statement to say for anything anyone said to you whether true or false, it was always very believable. MoS, you didn't really convince anyone, but claps anyways.

KingEnigma, you did what you had to do, sorry you didn't believe me and just, and I can assure you we do not share a bed hehe.
Nonny, You should have been here more, we needed you to add some discussion, things may have resulted differently..

Anyways, good game all. Was fun playing with you, I look forward to playing with you in the future. (Hopefully on IS, and Flay's side next time )

*Maverick*

Actually, the fact that I didn't convince people I was innocent is a compliment...I purposely did what I could to seem scum, but I was trying to make it unclear as to which side I was on, hence the vote-switching. I wanted the townies to think I might be working with you, in which case they would hopefully vote for maverick.