Succession Mafia (OVER!)

[Porochaz]

Aim ani

[Porochaz]

I joined the game cause I liked the flavor.
I don't have grudges on anyone so I don't care about the player list.

really? Yet you missed the part about multiple recruiters... and this has nothing to do with you /in-ing into every game you possibly can? Here's a hint maybe you should read the rules and the flavour before you /in willy nilly. Then you don't do something stupid and softclaim or give us info that we should all already know.

[Porochaz]

Please read the pre game info here: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14929 you know, the stuff your meant to read uh... before the game! I don't think its scummy at all, I just think its incredibly stupid. I understand Seraphims frustration, he self admittedly /in's pretty much every large game and if he is playing to this standard then I can understand why a policy lynch might be an option. You might say having his pro-town and pro-scum play the same is a good thing but not when you just play scummy all the time. You just frustrate the other players.

[Porochaz]

Aim: Erg0

That's a poor vote with weak reasoning.

No its not.

[Porochaz]

aim Seraphim

[Porochaz]

Im glad we are being mature about this...

[Porochaz]

Wow, yet another player Ive played with recently who fails at the most basic level. Ive said this to you before - dont even softclaim at L-7, think before you type, maybe enter a few more newbie games (as a newbie), learn the basics, again.

holster

I don't think you can say Frank is scum or town based off of this.

[Porochaz]

Oh yeah and your constant "Im town cause I know it" defence doesn't work for the rest of us.

[Porochaz]

Absolutes.

Also Ive disliked every post thus far.

aim Friend

[Porochaz]

The game is about 24 hours old...

[Porochaz]

Sorry I didnt see that.

I said what I saw, absolutes. How does he know who is town or not?

[Porochaz]

Its not confidence. Confidence is "I think person X is town". Knowing something is "Person X is town". I see it as a scumtell. Its not a ridiculous stretch at all. Making absolute comments when as town you cannot make absolute comments makes no sense.

[Porochaz]

No I was giving you advice which you can choose to ignore.

Trolling would be saying something like you cannot even begin to say who is a terrible player. You are idiotic when it comes to claims and whats more, you don't listen. To anyone. Especially as you are completely wrong.

and thats not even trolling really.

[Porochaz]

Well, I don't consider my play to be any worse than yours.

I consider myself a better player than you, and less of a policy-lynch than you. I guess I have an overly inflated opinion of my play in relation to the quality of play found here on mafiascum. I am actually a lot better than people think. A lot of people underestimate my abilities.

If you'll just note how much I am talked about/discussed as a lynch option, you will see that people really respond to my play. That is my goal. I like to get information flowing when I am of the townie variety.

I also have a habit of claiming a power role to soak a hit. Just something I do for you guys.

If you want to criticize me, and push a lynch on me, how the hell do you expect me to get better? I've had that done to me so much, that I am pretty good at putting off a wagon when I am scum. That's all that has happened, so thanks. Players like you create a lot of pressure that is nearly impossible to alleviate as a townie. "Claim OR DIE!!!" "i'm a vanilla townie" "OFF WEETH EZ 'EAD" basically

Let's not derail this thread any more than we have
Is Seraphim replacing out? Regardless, I want to hear from that slot on what has happened D1
I also want to hear more from gandalf/yosarian2

The stuff underlined is wrong. Wrong in the way that it's not true.
The stuff in italics is wrong. Wrong in the way that your view is incorrect. If you were a power role, we would prefer you to use it, the game is balanced using amongst a few other things power roles. You severely damage the town by claiming that without any reason. In the end this is a team game, as a power role the best thing you can do is use it. If I am VT I would be okay being killed night 1 over a power role, as potentially the power role can be a much bigger benifit to town than I can.

How do you get better? Listen to others advice maybe? Ive been in a couple of games with you now and you just don't. Play in newbie games, read older games, read the wiki and relearn the basics because simply you dont know them. Players create a lot of pressure to find scum, the way you play attracts that, scum think you are an easy target, town think your scum because of your playstyle. The thing is though its noones fault but yours.

[Porochaz]

@Furc:

Point taken. In relation to some Scummers, I'm not that good. I don't take myself to be one, to the best of my knowledge. I'm not sure how on your other site you play how you fair there. But in relation to MS, your not that great. Everyone has there own playstyle, and I guess that's just yours. However, maybe if you read through the Mafiawiki you may find some interesting points and tips.

The best way to act as a VT, if you are one, is to get the scum to think you are a PR, so they kill you, and not the real PR. Also, constant lynching is mroe of the assault method, as I like to call it. eventually, most people, if policy lynched enough, would figure out that there play is bad, and that they can improve. The next time someone says "Furcolow, don't claim at L-7, take it as constructive critisim, and try not not claim at L-7 again. Generally, L-3 is when you should start thinking about claiming.

L-3, really? I'd be very iffy about that.

[Porochaz]

Ive never seen a good use of softclaiming. Ever.

[Porochaz]

Meh I ignored your edit.

[Porochaz]

So if I'm a townie, I should say I'm a power role, and if I'm a power role, I should say I'm a townie

What? If you have no information, dont say anything at all!

The shit underlined is true, you are providing no basis for it being wrong other than your opinion that it is wrong. Your opinion sucks.

Fraid not. An ongoing game would be good enough proof of that, where you were told the exact same things by multiple players. Its not good yet your too arrogant to listen to anyone. Im trying my best to be semi nice here but you are making it hard for me.

You touch on game "balance" in relation to us having power roles, what about the f11 with 7 townies? Is that balanced?

I don't know maybe you should ask the list mod at the time, (or ex-one), oh wait, its this mod! Either way fairly sure they discussed this to make the newbie setup more balanced. You do realise that more power roles doesnt necessarily mean balanced. In fact, its usually more difficult to balance.

You made this setup? You're a master of setups, huh? You know when EVERYTHING is balanced?

No I didn't, no Im not and sometime no I don't. However I do know how to balance a game having had fair experience doing so,

The only game I've played as town with multiple recruiters, honestly, was an overwhelming town win. It was probably "balanced" too.

Why do I not believe that? and even if it was true, I think Flay knows how to make sure a game is balanced.

You know how we won?
More on that later

Really, and your withholding our easy town win... oh jeez how will we cope...

I don't need to "get better", players like you need to get on my level, then you might understand something that is actually more of a deep concept: YOU ARE DETRACTING FROM THE GAME BY PUSHING A NON-EXISTENT "POLICY" WITHOUT A CASE. Get off your asses, and do some scumhunting.

I agree, but Im willing to sidetrack, to deflate your ego.

It is not my fault whatsoever. People are intimidated by me, otherwise they wouldn't be typing my name so much. Half of the player list types my name when they post. I'd rather be talked about badly than not talked about at all.

Technically I type Frank. Anyway, I type it because you are unlike any other player who comes to this site from another.

Most people come from a site where game days last a week at most, and have so many power roles that you can shake a stick at, and if you are a vanilla townie, you must have done something shameful to the mod. Yet when most of these players come to the site they do one of two things, they either adapt to how we play on this site or they leave yet you are doing neither, you think that your playstyle is the definitive playstyle which it may have been on your old site, but here its very suboptimal play. The fact that half the player list are typing your name is because you are not playing well not because you are the god of mafia.

ebwopreview:
L-3 is relative
in a 30 player game, sure
in a 9 player game, not really

I actually agree.

The way that we won as a collective against the recruiters was through a mass nameclaim
I am wanting us to do that this game... Would the mafia have fakeclaims?

I would assume so. If the game can be broken by a nameclaim then that whole 18 months of development would have been all for nothing. The scum team are almost certainly likely to have something to stop claims of any kind.

[Porochaz]

Meh after the first line of the big quote its meant to be ended.

Fixed. - Flay

[Porochaz]

When you write a long case you can't reply to anything at once, in any case, yes I have used it before, its not something Im going to look for now but you should be able to find a game if you care about it. Some may use it when town and whilst I find it really annoying for reasons Ive mentioned before but even then the fact scum know who is likely town and scum they are more likely to make that mistake.

[Porochaz]

The problem with your post, Porochaz, is that you agree with all of my relevant points
that indicates my ego should get bigger, if anything, so your goal was deflated, not my ego

I agree with only one of your points.

[Porochaz]

Oh and Friend, sometimes post do need "quote stripes".

[Porochaz]

Oh sorry twice then.

Once to say I agree this is sidetracking and the other about claiming. Whoopdy frickin do.

[Porochaz]

Anyways Prozac you have no response to the whole "absolutes" business me and Faraday called you out on I see

I responded to it. Go read.

[Porochaz]

Im taking a step back from Frank. I will find the game you want later.

[Porochaz]

It took me 10 seconds using the word "absolute" and my name in the search function which doesnt include the archives.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... e#p2040194, see the quote within a quote on post 900

[Porochaz]

and when I say 10 seconds I mean approximately that.

[Porochaz]

Oh right...

When you write a long case you can't reply to anything at once, in any case, yes I have used it before, its not something Im going to look for now but you should be able to find a game if you care about it. Some may use it when town and whilst I find it really annoying for reasons Ive mentioned before but even then the fact scum know who is likely town and scum they are more likely to make that mistake.

Scum know who is town and scum so they are more likely to use absolutes as they know what everyones alignments are likely to be. Town do not have knowledge of this therefore they shouldn't be doing it. I don't view it as a major scum tell but 24 hours into a thread I view it as a votable scum tell to start things off.

[Porochaz]

So the 4 people with more than 1 vote... dram I find fairly town thus far, L.G. same. Frank I'm half ignoring now, there have been posts since our bust up that have been fine, others that are not good. Lets say Im reading them but am not really putting much weight on them. However I would like to know his reasons for finding me suspicious.

Then there is Friend. Lots of votes with absolutely no reasoning. He just hops on. Policy lynching is scummy? I think not. Misguided maybe, ruins the point of the game, yes. Not scummy though. Absolutes, which you may or may not believe is scummy or not, I do, get over it. Iso 7 and 8 jumps to conclusions. When its pretty clear what Sera is saying. Vezo never softclaimed recruiter.(9) Iso 15 AtE, very bad reaction. Iso 16 is ironic considering iso 20, hmm?

(But as an aside, ani, if you don't like "quote stripes" - a phrase I hate and won't be using again - you can go away and cry, sometimes they are needed. Stop whining)

23/24 devoid of content. Something that is apparent throughout most of your posts actually. You like to deal in absolutes, fine, but when you don't bring any reasoning to the table, thats when it starts getting scummy, the two iso'd are examples. As are 10 and 14. Going onto the next page 26 as well. 27 the irony made me laugh, where has the logic been in your posts? 30 finally gives us a reason - gut. Oh well... Then the rest is just one lined BS.

The thing with Friend is that he doesn't give any reasons for anything and pretty much all his posts are devoid of any content, yet the unusual thing is he frequently makes statements on who's town and who's not with no reason whatsoever. He has 44 posts which is a fair amount, there have been numerous votes but if you look for any reasoning you'll be hard pushed. The fact is he's posting lots and making very bold statements with absolutely nothing to back it up and no content whatsoever and thats why Im currently voting friend.

[Porochaz]

I don't need to explain myself to be right.

Inhim, why is "lack of obvtown" enough reason to wagon?

BEST.ANSWER.EVER.

Now can we lynch this person.

[Porochaz]

Friend really does look obv town. Inhim's probably town too though.

what makes it obvtown? Friend sort of exploded earlier.

There is post 389 as well.

[Porochaz]

TL is your scumdar really bad or are you scum here?

Someone's going to need to explain just why 389 is scummy, like in any way. (it's not, but I look forward to people trying to paint it as such)

The Friend wagon's incredibly bad, actually, unbelievable really. Idk why the fuck people can't see that Friend is town.

Because those that say he's town are only saying that and not giving reasoning behind it?

[Porochaz]

Oh and it's not just those against the wagon, its some for it as well. You kinda have to explain your reasons you know. Going "X is town" "X is scum" or "I think X is scum/town" is useless to everyone else. Explain your opinions!

[Porochaz]

Did you read 388?

[Porochaz]

388 doesn't doa lot for me. I think it's pretty unfair to say he's provided no content, I think saying X is town or Y is scum is content. It's the main thing that matters really. IDK the whole thing seems to be you disagreeing with the way he plays.

No its not. Saying whos scum and town is useless posturing. It doesn't give the town anything, at the very least its a very anti-town way to play. Giving reasons is what pushes the town forward and separates us from other sites where lynches start being random. Making cases, working out who is scum and town by analysis helps us work out who to vote and should influence who we should vote or not vote. By cutting that out we are no longer playing a game of skill and we start playing a game of luck.

[Porochaz]

Thats the anti-town explanation, the fact that you are so sure yet you give no basis for it, suggests that you have no reasons your just trying to make sure your directing the town and give the illusion of activity, its essentially a king of active lurking. Your posting, your making statements but your not playing the game properly.

[Porochaz]

388 doesn't doa lot for me. I think it's pretty unfair to say he's provided no content, I think saying X is town or Y is scum is content. It's the main thing that matters really. IDK the whole thing seems to be you disagreeing with the way he plays.

No its not. Saying whos scum and town is useless posturing. It doesn't give the town anything, at the very least its a very anti-town way to play. Giving reasons is what pushes the town forward and separates us from other sites where lynches start being random. Making cases, working out who is scum and town by analysis helps us work out who to vote and should influence who we should vote or not vote. By cutting that out we are no longer playing a game of skill and we start playing a game of luck.

Tell that to DGB......

2 things

1. In the game Im in with DGB and the past games I have been in with DGB (where she wasnt a jester) she didn't give info overload but she did give info

2. There is a reason people dislike DGB's play.

@Friend. No I think its scummy, I explained everything in 388 or whatever the number was
@Andrius. If you link it, I wont read it. Id prefer you to quote.

[Porochaz]

53 posts, lots of "he's scum", "he's town", no reasoning as to why. That IS scummy. You are actively not helping the town, yet you are still trying to direct opinion without actually giving reasons why.

[Porochaz]

@andrius Thats to friend.

@Friend No cause Im right and you still havent given a satisfactory reply. I am currently in a game with her. I am not seeing your point beyond her giving me a slight headache as well.

FICK SAKE STOP POSTING SO I CAN POST!!1

[Porochaz]

In post 361, ooba makes a scum list, listing Lord Gurgi as scum without giving reasons. I don't necessarily have a problem with that kind of post, although I'd be interested to hear why. However, this two posts later, again giving no reason, Friend votes Gurgi. The timing kind of weirds me out; makes me wonder if Friend is looking for some wagon that he'll get support for, not necessarily looking for scum. I mean, he obviously wasn't convinced by ooba's logic, since there wasn't any, so I'm curious as to why he joined the wagon then.

lrn2read?

Learn to read.

Learn to write?

Aim: Lord Gurgi

General vibe of not wanting to step on anyone's toes and draw attention to himself.

I agreed with this vibe, I aimed.

[/quote]

But your only saying that now.

No other reasons beyond a vibe?

[Porochaz]

holster, aim: Lord Gurgi

I find that wagon just as appealing as it was.

xvart, in response to your three linked posts of mine:

1. Already talked about it.
2. No way in hell he looked up my meta
3. I disagree

The vote.

No reason.

[Porochaz]

This game is really painful.

[Porochaz]

I prefer my Friend vote.

[Porochaz]

ani, your title says you make 95.7% noise so thats around 19 out of 20 posts being worthless, yet you have made 38 posts and not one of them is useful in any way. Im expecting the next 2, too actually be saying something useful.

[Porochaz]

@ooba:

I've been helpful in town games. Namely, SWN II, when I pay more attention, I can do real well.

ooba has not been speaking any sense thus far, and thats 39 useless posts.

[Porochaz]

I'm going to ignore you Porochaz untill you stop commenting on playstyle. OK?

What Erg0 found is definitley scummy on Furc.

40 posts.

Tell me something new ani.

[Porochaz]

Right, because your playstyle is anti town, Friends playstyle is anti town, vesok and Frank less or differently so and before you come out with the old line "antitown =/= scummy" sometimes it does. When you are playing in such a way that causes town not to have significant information that starts to be scummy. It stops being mafia and starts being "lets randomly vote people" and call them town/scum arbitrarily. Thats not what I signed up for. I couldn't give a rats shit about playstyle usually, but when it is impeding the game this much. I want to enjoy this game, I signed on because Flays games are the "stuff of legends" yet, everytime I come into this thread I get depressed, because there is a group of players here that want to play mafia properly and yes there are different playstyles within that, I don't like drams playstyle, I dont like what ooba's saying but

at least they are playing

but then there is a handful of players in this game that are basically just picking names out of a hat and when someone pressurises them they jump on them and the rest follow like mindless sheep, no reasons, no basis for a vote just "yeah I agree, hic". So yeah Im going to keep on your back for as long as I need to be before you actually give me something to work with.

[Porochaz]

Sorry replace dram with Faraday

[Porochaz]

Thats all there is to speak about because you lot won't participate properly.

[Porochaz]

Your "playstyle" is not one though and as I think its scummy, I will vote you/Friend/vezok/whoever else until you start playing because if I havent said it enough already -

the way you are playing is effectively not playing at all

[Porochaz]

43 out of 44 posts says you are not.

I will give you the one with the vote for me.

[Porochaz]

No this is going to turn into a case of 44 of your posts are useless, the one that isn't ironically is the vote against me, which you managed to make a case for all by yourself. In response to that case of yours, I feel that all there is to talk about in this game is playstyles and that people shouldn't get a free pass for playing rubbish. If there was anything else significant to talk about I would.

Im going to hold my opinion and hope that in your next 40odd posts, you make a golden post, until then I am going to say your playstyle is scummy and save myself from going to blue in the face by leaving this conversation at this post. In that neither of us are going to budge, you are going to keep playing the way you are and Im still going to find you infuriating and I am going to find alternate ways to actually scratch a miniscule amount of anything from you, even if it is by doing the annoying 2 year old thing, of Why? Why? Why? something I shouldn't have to do but there you go...

[Porochaz]

No this is going to turn into a case of 44 of your posts are useless, the one that isn't ironically is the vote against me, which you managed to make a case for all by yourself. In response to that case of yours,

I feel that all there is to talk about in this game is playstyles and that people shouldn't get a free pass for playing rubbish.

If there was anything else significant to talk about I would.

Im going to hold my opinion and hope that in your next 40odd posts, you make a golden post, until then I am going to say your playstyle is scummy and save myself from going to blue in the face by leaving this conversation at this post. In that neither of us are going to budge,

you are going to keep playing the way you are and Im still going to find you infuriating

and I am going to find alternate ways to actually scratch a miniscule amount of anything from you, even if it is by doing the annoying 2 year old thing, of Why? Why? Why? something I shouldn't have to do but there you go...

Bold, I agree with. But playstyle shouldn't be the ONLY factor in your decision.

Italics, I think there is something you can talk about. The rest of us have certainly found something.

What have you found to talk about ani? Can you tell me what you feel are the major talking points in the first 25 pages?

[Porochaz]

RC over reacted but I saw his point, I didnt feel it was worth the commotion, Friend clearly sheeped onto it as did Frank but then there is no sprise there. I have the opinion essentially yos does in 531/532. What do you think about it?

What else? surely you have more than one talking point?

[Porochaz]

LA for a week or so

[Porochaz]

Andrius, dont let him pull you in, you'll just get infuriated by it.

[Porochaz]

Alliance time.

Me, Friend, furcolow, zwet, ani, and inHim.

Applications are being accepted.

Take zwet out and this is exactly what Im seeing and Im now trying to work out which ones of you are scum and which ones of you are VI's.

[Porochaz]

Scum
Friend
RC/Inhim
ani
vezok/Frank
VI

Im not counting you and I havent noticed gandalf tbh.

[Porochaz]

zwet:

I was only trying to convince Poro because he was pursuing me on playstyle. I have not tried it anywhere else.

You did not answer my questions. Please do.

[Porochaz]

RC over reacted but I saw his point, I didnt feel it was worth the commotion, Friend clearly sheeped onto it as did Frank but then there is no sprise there. I have the opinion essentially yos does in 531/532. What do you think about it?

What else? surely you have more than one talking point?

This one.

That one about discusison points? That was the only one I saw. I answered it.

But TBH, if you can't find something to read in 27 pages, YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG. goo back and read the last 10 pages, and say that there is NOTHING that is scummy/townish at all that you haven;t touched on.

And don't pass this off, I'm not doing this so I can make my own opinions. We have talked about this already. I want to know what you think, not what I think.

[Porochaz]

I meant lurker.

Please answer my questions.

[Porochaz]

RC over reacted but I saw his point, I didnt feel it was worth the commotion, Friend clearly sheeped onto it as did Frank but then there is no sprise there. I have the opinion essentially yos does in 531/532. What do you think about it?

What else? surely you have more than one talking point?

This one.

That one about discusison points? That was the only one I saw. I answered it.

But TBH, if you can't find something to read in 27 pages, YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG. goo back and read the last 10 pages, and say that there is NOTHING that is scummy/townish at all that you haven;t touched on.

And don't pass this off, I'm not doing this so I can make my own opinions. We have talked about this already. I want to know what you think, not what I think.

3rd time ani, dont make it a fourth.

[Porochaz]

Ah, thanks.

I still stand by my point that if you can't find ANYTHING to talk about in 29 pages, you are doing it wrong, and should do some rereading.

And TBH - You could comment on dramonic vs. Andrius.

I don't have a problem commenting on things, I'll have a look at the Andrius/dram thing when I have more time. I can find things in the 29 pages to gain opinions about. The problem is that you aren't telling me yours and thats why I am asking you the question for yet the fourth time.

RC over reacted but I saw his point, I didnt feel it was worth the commotion, Friend clearly sheeped onto it as did Frank but then there is no sprise there. I have the opinion essentially yos does in 531/532. What do you think about it?

What else? surely you have more than one talking point?

[Porochaz]

Honestly, Poro, I try to comment on most of what comes up, so I couldn't really give you a number of what I think are the best, IMO.

Really? Where.

[Porochaz]

I have, you haven't.

holster aim ani

[Porochaz]

Im voting ani because he has failed to answer the questions set out for him. I want those answers.

However, the dram wagons sucks ass LAL is the only thing I can see here along with lack of scum reads, not worth looking at, at all but Im guessing he'll be lynched due to the fact that the whole VI group is on that wagon.

holster, aim Furcolow

755 and 759 are fairly terrible.

[Porochaz]

Things:

Gandalf has lurked out.

Good

Friend is still scum.

Yes

Dramonic wagon is terrible.

Yes

Chronopie's last post is enough for me to vote him.

Aim: Chronopie

Not top of the list but fair enough.

[Porochaz]

Thats a really big bullshit reason.

Also in other news, I've decided I have become too snobby for this game. Im not replacing out, Im just saying.

[Porochaz]

I'm not trying to incriminate Dramonic, I still think his wagon is dumb. It's a question that occurred to me, and I'm not going to keep it quiet.

BAD GURGI, QUESTIONING IS BAD. WE NEED RANDOM POINTLESS WAGONS IN THIS GAME.

[Porochaz]

@erg0 what is your exact reason for voting me? me wanting a claim from andrius? we have 2 wagons, we've heard 1 claim, which i believe in this setup is a good claim. why not make andrius claim? rectify the situation or remove your vote.

Seriously though, your asking why? I think its pretty damn obvious why.

Yeah well, I'm not giving myself up quite yet.
But. I will not crumb or claim further unless I'm pushed to lynch further than you.
I won't let scum_dram outlive me, no sirree.

unvote
vote: andrius

claim
you're further than dramonic

unvote

now you guys are tied
still leaning dramonic, but i want to hear from andrius
this kind of pressure is good for town


sorry andrius, i like you, but this has to be done

Do you not get the scumminess of this post or has it not been explained to you enough times? Claiming day 1 is pretty much terrible for town. Your pushing for a premature claim with no reasons to back it up. Thats why people are voting for you.

[Porochaz]

He's an annoying, inherently scummy VI, but I'm pretty sure he's town. His pushing for a claim should not be taken seriously. Duh.

I'm really sick of hearing this defence for furcolow. Being a VI is not a town tell.

I agree, it stopped being charming 30 pages ago. I might get annoyed with you or ani, but in the end I know that you know how to play, its what frustrates me. This guy doesn't and I cant really take that in the few games he's played he hasn't picked up the basic concepts. I feel that he's pushing on his VI status to make outlandish comments and I dont think he should be able to get away with that.

[Porochaz]

Your first sentence is correct. Your second sentence I do not like but I dont have the stamina to bother. You may play like that but I have been in a recent game where you played fairly well (in my eyes)

[Porochaz]

mobsville

[Porochaz]

You realise right that breadcrumbing and softclaiming are different things. You did the latter.

[Porochaz]

Pretty much what yos said. Even Im not voting for you based on playstyle anymore.

I explain here:

@erg0 what is your exact reason for voting me? me wanting a claim from andrius? we have 2 wagons, we've heard 1 claim, which i believe in this setup is a good claim. why not make andrius claim? rectify the situation or remove your vote.

Seriously though, your asking why? I think its pretty damn obvious why.

Yeah well, I'm not giving myself up quite yet.
But. I will not crumb or claim further unless I'm pushed to lynch further than you.
I won't let scum_dram outlive me, no sirree.

unvote
vote: andrius

claim
you're further than dramonic

unvote

now you guys are tied
still leaning dramonic, but i want to hear from andrius
this kind of pressure is good for town


sorry andrius, i like you, but this has to be done

Do you not get the scumminess of this post or has it not been explained to you enough times? Claiming day 1 is pretty much terrible for town. Your pushing for a premature claim with no reasons to back it up. Thats why people are voting for you.

[Porochaz]

No. What if there's a framer?

Well that just came out of nowhere... there might also be a clone of yourself from the Mirror Universe which says the exact opposite of what you do and he could kidnap you just before you post and post the exact opposite and we can't really risk that happening.

Seriously though, Im not too sure how useful your claim will be. I guess you should as its more useful now than later but Im not 100%

[Porochaz]

and if your recruited tomorrow? killed tomorrow? what then?

[Porochaz]

Im talking about last nights investigation, if your talking about tonights one then Im sorry I misunderstood, and I dont care.

[Porochaz]

Not a fan of furc being lynched, he's not town because he's a VI, but I think his VIness has been town in a horribly scummy sort of way so far.

This makes less sense to me than just about every other post in this thread.

For once, I agree. Time to lynch him.

[Porochaz]

/headdesk

Multiple Recruiters pretty much means multiple factions.

Ninja edit: I dont like the route of passing off VI as townie. It makes it easy for players to get away with well... murder. As people just go "he's a VI" he

would

do that as town. Also as you can guess by my almost daily rants, I don't think rewarding bad play is a good idea. He has acted scummy, he should be treated as such. VI's can be scum too you know.

[Porochaz]

I will not be changing my vote.

[Porochaz]

52 pages, jeez, loving the fact furc still thinks he's an awesome cool player and everyone else is shit. I don't understand how you ever thought your play in these last 52 pages was anywhere near passable?

[Porochaz]

Right now Im not really sure I understand the votes for Ooba. Looking at it, his alignment hasn't been given away or anything just that no result was given to the enforcer. Best course of action for me at the moment would be to give day 1 another look. Only thats going to take a while to do that (between the length and the vast amount of crap).

[Porochaz]

Kay, I think Ive come to grips with everything. Really having problems staying with this game without feeling truly frustrated.

@vezok http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdWfqKI8x5g, I don't actually want to by the way, but I think it shows my frustration with you well enough.

In other news having read through these "fun" 7 pages, I don't know what to think yos2 has pretty much echo'ed my reading throughout but then yos2 is a very agreeable person (he even has a smilie saying so), reapercharlie has also been posting well (bar one truly terrible post, which by all accounts is like a small pebble in the Pacific here), vezok I dislike but I think its more because Im frustrated, I have a theory that he's a recruiter and that he hasn't actually claimed what is slowly turning into a very convoluted role. I am ignoring Friends case against me. I hope you don't mind everybody else but I think its been pretty well answered already and its not really worth my time. Ooba Im disliking a lot right now, it's all to convenient and Im just not a fan of his playstyle today... but before we open that kettle of worms again, (I should note, when I say playstyle I don't mean it in the same way as I mean Friend or ani - who has been fairly quiet) I move onto Faraday who I feel is very quick to turn things down but hasn't actually given much of an opinion on anything beyond Ooba being town... I don't really know his position on anything.

Aim: Faraday

[Porochaz]

Im sorry but does it not say something about your standard of play. Do you want to be known as an idiot in every single game your in? I don't get this adamant stubbornness to even take a little advice, I mean seriously, trying to help is all. Even if you want to play like ani, there are certain basic principles of mafia that make it A. more interesting to play and B. more interesting for others to play with you. Because its currently like playing (british) football with you where for the first 30 minutes you sit on the middle of the field, then as soon as the ball comes close, you pick it up and run out of the stadium. If you don't want to analyse, yes thats going to piss me off, but in the end if you know what you are doing, that is my problem and I have to deal with it. The fact that you have a problem with even the simplest concept and you refuse to listen to anybody at all, is affecting your game, in that you aren't improving, but its affecting others enjoyment of the game. We signed up for this game to scumhunt, not to prevent you from semi unintentionally try to ruin the game. Mr Flay is what I would call a MS legend in that he has been on the site a while and when he mods games it's a BIG deal. I came here to enjoy what this game had to offer and whilst I can say I am today, (Ive never played in a cult game before), yesterday was a nightmare. Suffice to say, the way to get better is not to just /in as many games as you can and hope you improve, its to enter maybe 2-3 games most and listen to what people are trying to tell you. Until then people are going to just get frustrated and refuse to enter games with you in them.

[Porochaz]

Listen, Im not trying to be nasty here, but its difficult to do that and convey my thoughts honestly, I want to be able to play a game with you where "this" doesn't happen, however I'm not going to sit around and let you carry on this way, I'm not trying to push you out, Im just trying to give you advice, thats not wrapped up in some delicate package. All Im saying is that it would be good if you took a step back and listen to what people are saying, maybe enter some more newbie games and enter less games overall? You will find that your play and whatever playstyle you choose to take on will improve and probably that you will enjoy the site more and you will stop being called a VI, etc.

[Porochaz]

Im sorry but does it not say something about your standard of play. Do you want to be known as an idiot in every single game your in? I don't get this adamant stubbornness to even take a little advice, I mean seriously, trying to help is all. Even if you want to play like ani, there are certain basic principles of mafia that make it A. more interesting to play and B. more interesting for others to play with you. Because its currently like playing (british) football with you where for the first 30 minutes you sit on the middle of the field, then as soon as the ball comes close, you pick it up and run out of the stadium. If you don't want to analyse, yes thats going to piss me off, but in the end if you know what you are doing, that is my problem and I have to deal with it. The fact that you have a problem with even the simplest concept and you refuse to listen to anybody at all, is affecting your game, in that you aren't improving, but its affecting others enjoyment of the game. We signed up for this game to scumhunt, not to prevent you from semi unintentionally try to ruin the game. Mr Flay is what I would call a MS legend in that he has been on the site a while and when he mods games it's a BIG deal. I came here to enjoy what this game had to offer and whilst I can say I am today, (Ive never played in a cult game before), yesterday was a nightmare. Suffice to say, the way to get better is not to just /in as many games as you can and hope you improve, its to enter maybe 2-3 games most and listen to what people are trying to tell you. Until then people are going to just get frustrated and refuse to enter games with you in them.

Maybe instead of adressing the VI adress the fact I pretty much said your reasons for voting me were all wrong? Idunno, seems like something you should do if you think I'm scum.

Yeah I saw it but the defence was really just "NO lulz" and I can't be bothered getting into a discussion with you about that... but if you insist...

[Porochaz]

snip

Then you're clearly not reading the thread if you can't find my opinion on anything but that.

Oh noes, quote stripes!

Where, where is your opinions on anything at all? Your good at playing mediator but thats about it.

Friend is town.

You said it a lot on the first page but never expanded. Why?

Inhim is town.

This is the 4th time you personally mention Inhim, 3 of those times(including this one) you state he is town. Nothing more. Why should I believe your claim from the man in a trillby smoking a cigarette in the corner with what looks like a shotgun on the table in front of him. Why is he town and why should we take your word for it, like you are expecting us to?

Reapercharlie's also probably town.

Good, so we can cross him off the list cause you said so... again why?

So is Vezok despite his stupid play.

At the risk of repeating myself - Why?

I believe Andy's claim at this point too.

At first glance this sounds like a bit more than the crap that precedes it, but in the end, gives us nothing about anything. Andy's claim really isn't under pressure atm and it has no bearing on his alignment within this game. But as the bodyguard protected him last night (at least we presume thats what happened) Im going to go out on a limb and say I believe him as well.

This has already all been said, unless you're talking about just day 2, in which case you're correct I've done fuck all.

Doesn't really matter. Either way you have done next to nothing compared to most of the other players. You havent given us any indication of who is scum and why there are scum. Not even those annoying one liners that ani loves so much. My hatred for absolutes is something that has been documented in this game, and Ive been told to wind my neck in, but when you are using that at the expense of everything else, I start wondering if you walked away from your computer and put a turnip in your place, would it be any less useful?

Aim Gandalf

SingerSigner's someone I probably would have voted but for the fact she helped confirm Ooba's role (I know she didn't have much choice, and I'm waiting for her to definitely get caught up before I expand on that)

[Porochaz]

Crap

mod, thats a quote fail

Fixed. -Flay

Holster, Aim Faraday

Your vote gives us no reason and seems random to me.

[Porochaz]

Crap

mod, thats a quote fail

Fixed. -Flay

Holster, Aim Faraday

Your vote gives us no reason and seems random to me.

You're correct, I gave no reason. Hardly random though, read him in ISO (doesn't take long)

I shouldn't have to make my own reasons up for your vote.

[Porochaz]

A chronopie lynch would work for me.

Gandalf why arent you leading by example?

[Porochaz]

Just to answer before anyone says "hypocrite lols" is to do with his posts regarding and to yos.

[Porochaz]

Ok but suggesting you would move over there anyway still makes you trigger happy.

[Porochaz]

This game is going relatively fast from when I checked it a couple of hours back. Will look through it tomorrow. Sorry.

[Porochaz]

Just checking in. In the middle of a busy week that ends with an exam this evening. So speedreading will commence at that point!

I can already gather that D2 is a much more useful read, so I'll start there unless anyone has a reason for me to start with D1. While I'm here, was there any requests/questions that were asked of Ani around the time he flaked? I'll do my best to respond or answer them as soon as I can. I'll do it even sooner than that.

Honestly please do. Day 1 will make your head cave in like a trombone. Do you know I used to play the trumpewt.

Also

Im exceedingly driunk, which makes this game much more AWESOME, I love you Andrius. I want you to make all your posts in such a way that I am watching you from every street corneer, gettimng ready to jump you and have my way eith you. Of course I am drunk and several hundred miles away from you but oh... dont I wisjh.

[Porochaz]

RC, wants some.

[Porochaz]

Honestly please do. Day 1 will make your head cave in like a trombone. Do you know I used to play the trumpewt.

Also

Im exceedingly driunk, which makes this game much more AWESOME, I love you Andrius. I want you to make all your posts in such a way that I am watching you from every street corneer, gettimng ready to jump you and have my way eith you. Of course I am drunk and several hundred miles away from you but oh... dont I wisjh.

HAHAHAHA! +500

(My name is ReaperCharlie and I approve of this product or service.)

ITT we learn that Poro wants to do me, and RC approves?
Weird. XD

Is that a yes or a no?

[Porochaz]

Actually Ive sobered up sufficiently to say no for you, sorry, maybe next time. Bedtime now.

[Porochaz]

Sorry apparently I become a whore when drunk.

[Porochaz]

Ive caught up now, beyond a few shifts in position of various people, Im still not going to change my vote, I do want to hear from BBM before the end of the day however... so

holster

[Porochaz]

I unvoted, calm down. Say what you have to say "Oh Person X is scum, Person Y is town" "Why?" "Im not telling, nyeh, I can spend a lot more time complaining about how people are being unfair".

[Porochaz]

I didnt say that. I said that your going to make a bit of a pointless last words post.

[Porochaz]

Aim Faraday

[Porochaz]

L-1, I unvoted to hear both of your opinions thus far about a page ago

[Porochaz]

Seriously, you think your going to change the lynch in less than a day?

[Porochaz]

Target please .

Why would you ask for this?

This is getting ridiculous now.

vote ooba

Not surprised Chrono got blocked. He wasn't really town, so town rb-er would want to block him, yet scum roleblocker would want to block a potential bad power role, especially if your targetting his team mate.

[Porochaz]

Yes, I admit that it seems very likely, but... vezok flaking from the site, and Seraphim replacing out,

"all-but-confirms"

vezo/Robo as recruiter... how?

This reads to me like excited scum trying to push a quick lynch on opposing scum.

I agree,

holster, aim gandalf

I think its pretty clear why both flaked from the game.

[Porochaz]

Also, I am hereby announcing my intention to vote for/hammer Robo if/when needed, providing his claim is unsatisfactory.

The world does not revolve round you. Gandalf being ridiculous can only go on so long. Your post accurately summed up that post of his.

[Porochaz]

Lets make a "Cannot be a cult recruiter" list ..
ooba
singersigner -> loose cannon play. Although recent play leans towards "Recruited"
Andrius
Lord Gurgi
ReaperCharlie
Robocopter87

Talking about any of the above is a waste of time until we hit the recruiters.

Porochaz
xvart
Friend
Chronopie -> Leaning towards not being a recruiter too
Erg0
Yosarian2
gandalf5166
Flameaxe
Andrius
inHimshallibe

ISO these folks and give your picks for recruiter .. I'll be searching for behaviour wherein the person tries to lie low - not get into conflict much - or somebody else drawing the heat away from this person ..

You do realise, you are being very dull...

[Porochaz]

Lists are not good for town. Lists with guess what, no reasoning, are pointless and dull. Scumbag ooba fails to interest me with his town reads.

[Porochaz]

Bit of both. Lists give scum a good indication of general town reads, who to go for, who to NK etc.

[Porochaz]

Over exaggerate much? I said lists like the one ooba did, not scum hunting.

[Porochaz]

I haven't. But I'm planning to use it today on town consensus. If I'm recruited, I want to be useless to them.

If you wanted to be useless in case you got recruited why didn't you use your kill last night? You weren't worried about being recruited the next night after you replaced in while being a claimed vig? Wouldn't you want to get your kill off immediately after claiming?

xvart.

I thought about it. But I wanted to use my kill during the day where town knew why I was accountable for the kill. Plus, if I used it last night without having a solid enough feel about what the town/I felt about who was mafia, it wouldn't have been a very accurate kill (probably a mis-kill...does that make sense?). If I used it last night prematurely, it wouldn't have helped town, and if I got recruited last night (I wasn't, for the record), forcing me to use it for mafia, it wouldn't help town either. You see how I was stuff between a rock and a hard place.

So this is what I've decided: I WILL use it today, on the biggest wagon that's formed by deadline. I WILL do L-1 and Hammer. I will not start a wagon, nor join one until town has decided there is one worth getting to that point.

I really hope you guys understand my reasoning for this.

Sorry, when did you claim?

[Porochaz]

My posting standard in this game is becoming as bad as some others. Will catch up and post later on in the day (RL day)

[Porochaz]

In no particular order: ooba, yos2, friend, inhim

One o' thems is a recruiter, almost guaranteed.

IF EVERYONE ELSE COULD PLEASE LIST THEIR TOP 3 RECRUITER CANDIDATES I WOULD BE MOST GRATEFUL.

ITT RC can't count.

Friend, Singer, RC are my 3. I can't comprehend why you would make it so easy for scum by putting all the claimed roles into one nice neat package? Your also splaffing an awful lot, as is Friend on page 78ish. Singers actions with his doublevote/vig thing makes my head hurt.

Im starting to dislike xvarts line of questioning as well.

[Porochaz]

Having said that, RC was investigated town night 0, so replace him with ooba.

[Porochaz]

*facepalm*
GURGI IS TOWN. WHY DO YOU WANT HIM DEAD?

He could have been recruited since then?

[Porochaz]

RC, Can you explain why putting all the towns powerroles and targets together in a big list was a good idea?

[Porochaz]

Im glad we're still making inaccurate tables of roles and results, why don't we just lead scum to all the best power roles, and congratulations to RC who claimed randomly without any reason and managed to give us fuck all in results. Maybe next, we could have an alliance which means nothing, but we could do it "just for the crack", and lynch everyone outwith it, because that seems like a "proper" way to play this game. Or I tell you what, we could just give up on this game and play hide and seek. Wouldn't that be fun, and when we're done we can all have lemonade except for wee Andrius, who's play has deteriorated so much through the last 2 pages, that he will probably keep hiding well into the night.

Jeez, I realise that my strategy of skimming RC's (and now yos2, due to the claim) posts might not be the best strategy but honestly I want to punch myself in the face everytime I try and glean something remotely town from him.

And I know this is going to sound retarded from Mr. Lurker, but why haven't I or Erg0 or now to a lesser extent Gurgi been called out for that, do you think the recruiter is going to be attracting attention to himself?

And no to massclaim, whats the point? In this game it does not benefit the town at all compared to the benefits to scum.

[Porochaz]

and that makes sense how?

[Porochaz]

Ah ok, so while thats happening the other cult team can recruit someone else and go on to win. That makes a lot of sense gandalf. Also its a pretty big assumption that we have 2 cults. You also havent really explained why you think Im jestering, I want a post I can sink my teeth into and you just aren't giving me the satisfaction of ripping your case to shreds... if you want to mention me highlighting the fact I pretty much lurked through the last day and only posted one liners when I did post which is a bit of a contradiction from earlier, (see, I can make a case against myself, why can't anybody else) its because you haven't given me much to be interested in and honestly, seeing that table of roles and results made the cute kitten that I have for a soul die a little and I don't want my cute little kitten soul to die. Why do we have a fixation with the roles? I have no idea. From my point of view this game should be played as a mountainous. Yes the roles do things but can we trust any of the 3 cops going around? Nope. Can we trust the docs will protect who they say they will? The roleblockers? etc. etc. The fact that anyone is taking yos2 seriously at the moment astounds me. He is claimed cult! Ignore him! Shouldn't that be on the first page of Mafia: the Basics handbook?

[Porochaz]

Do you have another explanation for him repeatedly being an ass?

Heh, Gandalf, http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Team_Asshat. In all seriousness though, maybe it's because you have given me no reason to believe that you have been useful in any of your 106 posts and towns action which are basically just repeatedly shooting themselves in the foot has gotten pretty tiresome.

[Porochaz]

Yos2 - Is there any point in asking you question when you are confirmed scum and anything you could say is bullshit?

[Porochaz]

In any case, the bottom line is, it doesn't really matter if you believe me. Town can't afford to lynch a recruit today; not any recruit, not at all, and I'm confirmed to not be a recruiter.

How?

[Porochaz]

Never mind. I saw why.

[Porochaz]

Haven't decided yet, trying to work out the best way to play this game. However your 309 posts seem to be more a hindrance than a help.

[Porochaz]

Or you know, you could keep asking yos2 questions which he will answer in any way and effectively be useless, maybe someone else can claim and effectively be useless and maybe we can have some more role discussion and that would make all partaking in said conversation, yep, you guessed it, effectively useless.

[Porochaz]

On what premise do we know that his cult has the least members?

[Porochaz]

I have a theory, will be posting it soon.

[Porochaz]

Yes he was, no he didnt, Andi got a guilty.

The second paragraph is total WIFOM, you and by extension he could have been recruited a night previously.

[Porochaz]

My Notes (rather than a theory, I do make a few assumptions including the recruit or kill one)

We have only had 1 unexplained death a night. Initially this lead me to believe there was one scum group with 2 recruiters who could potentially kill instead. However this doesn't explain M=W's death.

Table 1.
Night 1, Dram - Body Guard - Killed by ???
Night 1, zwet - Loose Cannon - Killed by ooba
Night 2, M=W - Recruited Goon - Killed by ???

Important: My Initial Theory rested on there being one group based on the NK's, if you are a vig and killed M=W, you need to speak out now! If I am correct we are pretty much in lylo!!!

I believe that we started out with just 2 recruiters, with the option to recruit or kill each night.

Table 2
Night 0 - both recruit
Night 1 - one kills, another recruits - kill gets redirected to dram
Night 2 - If we have 2 scum teams, one kills, the other recruits, if 1, then both recruit
Night 3 - Both recruit.

If there is only 1 group then 5 recruits and 2 recruiters. (-M=W who is dead) so by effect we are in LYLO and its down to rb'ers and any other role to win for town.

the more I think about this, the more it seems unlikely

(If we have 2, then the max on one side will be 5 recruits and on the other side 2, however that can be rearranged depending on how many kills each side made)

The worst expanation is

Table 3

Night 0 - Recruiter 1 recruits, Recruiter 2 recruits
Night 1 - Recruiter 1 recruits, Recruiter 2 kills
Night 2 - Recruiter 1 kills, Recruiter 2 recruits (M=W dies)
Night 3 - Both Recruit

I dont think we are in that bad a situation though. (see below) OR both tried to kill andi night 1 OR one tried to recruit Andi night 1.

This is unless the roleblockers actually effectively roleblocked someone. The fact that there was no NK at all is interesting, I can see (if there are 2 groups) that M=W's one wants to gain back what they lost with M=W's death and so recruited instead of killed. Could either of the roleblockers (assuming at least one of them is still town), have caught one? For Chrono, that would be BBM.

Now onto roles,

Andi and Robo to begin with. I think it's obvious that Andi is town, which would mean his results thus far are accurate as of when he got them. Robo, Im also going to except is town, up until N3. You have a cult doc protecting a cop and he isn't killed? (unless the rb'er got to the person first) Now Im not saying Robo is scum, but as of now I wouldnt be giving him a free pass as town. Which means as of tomorrow, Andi's results cant be trusted fully.

So this makes Lord Gurgi town, Im going to believe this for now and believe he hasn't been recruited yet either. I am however going to admit to "gut" on this one. Ooba was obviously a no result, but as he is now an effectively useless loose cannon, I am going to believe, for now at least, he is town also. Yos2, obv recruit.

Moving on to RC(Andi's N0 investigation), why did he claim? I'm struggling to work that out. His results are shoddy as well. A result on a claimed roleblocker, 2 questionable ones, 1 of whom was coincidentally investigated as well and someone who was investigated by someone else. Shoddy results + absolutely no need to claim makes him top of my list for another recruit (not recruiter as I believe Andi)

Chrono is the last one, Im confident he is an RBer but as Im getting frustrated with others about it, I think its worth noting that that doesn't mean anything in regards to alignment.

The rest of them, I think xvart should be looked into more deeply, I will be doing this next, obviously my focus for this post has been elsewhere. Erg0 has been, in my eyes the least active player, well, at least the one I can glean least knowledge from and I am uneasy about the fact he is playing directly against my meta of him. L.G. Ive already said is gut town, ooba is obv not recruiter, Im happy to believe his claim and am unsure as to why scum would recruit him. Katsuki, speak please? Your predecessor wasn't the most townie one out there. Singer obv not recruiter and yos is not recruit either. Gandalf I'm neutral, well I'm not in that I dont like his post style, but I don't have any beef with him so I guess Im leaning town.

xvart, bbm, erg0 and katsuki are the 4 I need to look into more. I would say Im leaning BBM town but with a high chance of a rb block, I can't rule him out. If you wanted me to choose now, I would choose Erg0 as recruiter.

[Porochaz]

lol cross-referencing the two lists above, I can clear Ooba of being a potential RB. Lord Gurgi is rather lower down the list of potential RBs. So I'll be 'checking' these players, in no particular order. Flavour similar to D3 start means success.

3. Erg0
5. gandalf5166
6. Katsuki
9. Porochaz
7. Lord Gurgi

Why are you looking for the RBer? Surely thats a fruitless exercise. 1. you are just going to succeed in outing them to the scum if they haven't been recruited yet and 2. regardless of alignment, surely it makes no difference and is just wasting time when you could be looking for the recruiter, although include xvart and you have the same list, why did you exclude xvart from a potential rbers list?

[Porochaz]

Apologies forgot Katsuki just replaced in.

[Porochaz]

[*]zwetschenwasser (

Gianni,

Unrecruited Loose Cannon

), was executed Night One.

[Porochaz]

lol cross-referencing the two lists above, I can clear Ooba of being a potential RB. Lord Gurgi is rather lower down the list of potential RBs. So I'll be 'checking' these players, in no particular order. Flavour similar to D3 start means success.

3. Erg0
5. gandalf5166
6. Katsuki
9. Porochaz
7. Lord Gurgi

Why are you looking for the RBer? Surely thats a fruitless exercise. 1. you are just going to succeed in outing them to the scum if they haven't been recruited yet and 2. regardless of alignment, surely it makes no difference and is just wasting time when you could be looking for the recruiter, although include xvart and you have the same list, why did you exclude xvart from a potential rbers list?

They had no cause to RB me, unless I was potentially targeting their recruiter or buddy, as I'd already claimed my RB target for that night. Therefore, there is an above average chance that they are recruited scum. Also, given that my declared targets were between M=W (recruited goon) and Erg0 (???), I'm thinking it's possible that Erg0 may be a recruiter.

I RB'd Xvart N1, and got masculine flavour, therefore Xvart is a male character, thus not the other roleblocker.

Reviewing the list of potential recruiters, and considering the point above...

Aim: Erg0

this feels like the right move.

Still, a roleblocker isn't going to be a recruiter so what your doing just now is useless.

[Porochaz]

mod, is it possible we could get a clarification on the Loose Cannon role?

[Porochaz]

You haven't claimed as far as I can see. You can wait until yos2 has claimed but now you've revealed what your looking for, is there much point?

[Porochaz]

Just what it is beyond a killing role, I cant find it in the wiki. I didn't think it would be likely but seeing as we would know what roles cop/doc/rb'er etc are if you had put them down instead I was hoping for a brief role description.

[Porochaz]

Andrius essentially is and is a cop, from my look into the game, Id say he's still town just now based on the fact we have had a cult doc protecting him.
RC is confirmed as well through Andrius, but that was N0, what we can say is he's not a recruiter beyond that meh.
Chrono is a roleblocker. His alignment could really be either.

None of them are recruiter.

[Porochaz]

Katsuki, you fail. Don't replace in unless you're willing to catchup.

Moar Erg0 votes please.
And can we cut the crap on the setup speculation? Flay won't answer any questions, and ooba is only further scummifying himself by arguing for a mass-RBer.
SRSLY.

WE ARE HERE TO LYNCH SCUM RECRUITERS, NOT SETUP SPECULATE. ITS DAY 4 FOR CRYING OUT LOUD.

I initially thought this way too. However making sure we are good with the setup narrows down the suspects considerably.

[Porochaz]

I think I like the way RC is heading with his ooba/ss theory - it reminds me of the point I was meandering my way towards yesterday. Am I reading right that nobody besides ooba and ss mentioned the double vote ability for loose cannons? Might also explain why TheLonging's apparent belief that he had a daykill seemed inconsistent with the kind of PM I'd expect a double-voter/night vig to get.

SS's double vote is an interesting one, possibly a gamble, however I doubt it (thinking about the lynching wagon). The reason Im not voting you just now is that I think its worth going through a few others (particularly BBM/ani) first. However you haven't painted yourself in a very glamorous light this game so far.

[Porochaz]

I think we should be aware that we have no idea about the size of either of the cults beyond yosarians word and actually when it comes to this, I would actually prefer to disbeliever his word.

[Porochaz]

I think I like the way RC is heading with his ooba/ss theory - it reminds me of the point I was meandering my way towards yesterday. Am I reading right that nobody besides ooba and ss mentioned the double vote ability for loose cannons? Might also explain why TheLonging's apparent belief that he had a daykill seemed inconsistent with the kind of PM I'd expect a double-voter/night vig to get.

SS's double vote is an interesting one, possibly a gamble, however I doubt it (thinking about the lynching wagon). The reason Im not voting you just now is that I think its worth going through a few others (particularly BBM/ani) first. However you haven't painted yourself in a very glamorous light this game so far.

Not voting for me or Erg0? Are you actually voting anyone right now?

Not voting yet however I have stated my position more than once.

Also

mod

I have just started a new job and will be on LA for a wee while...

[Porochaz]

My flavor about

ooba on Night 1

(second night) was that I sneaked into his room somehow, knocked him out with my gun, rifled through all his stuff, and

could not find "

anything

to indicate where he stands or who he supports

. Then I heard a noise and slipped out of his room and back down the hallway. This leads me to believe that

HE IS ONE OF THE BROTHERS/RECRUITERS

with some kind of investigation immunity.

Excellent. This is good. This also clears up my suspicions of the three N1 RBers and leaves the other RB still unaccounted for.

Aim: ooba

Andy - I suggest you do a flavor recap of your investigation results, too.

xvart.

Hi xvart,

Let me start by saying that I think your one of the better newbie's on the circuit at the moment, I enjoy modding with you and I have enjoyed playing with you and I hope you hang around for a while. However...

Why are you being completely retarded at the moment?

I mean yes, ooba doesn't look good and for all intents and purposes has probably been recruited but put it this way, he's claimed a kill, (zwet), from what we have gathered the role is most likely a vig/double vote one shot role, singer showed us the double vote. So he isn't a recruiter. Your also taking the word of a "enforcer" who we have no evidence to suggest he hasn't been recruited. As I say Robo claimed Day 3, so it is likely his last post is bullshit and is now recruited. However Andy, will still be town, as up until then Robo has protected him. RC hasn't had this luxury, his targets have been somewhere between iffy and terrible, and you want me to suspect, as one of my top 3 candidates that you think ooba is the best place for your vote? I think you are either seriously not thinking or your giving away one of your cult buddies.

[Porochaz]

Also his suggestion about roleblockers doesnt fit the previous flavour.

Ergo, ooba is a recruiter.

Bit of a jump 1 + 1 doesn't = 427

Also I don't really know why your ruling out option 3 totally.

[Porochaz]

Your splaffing. Noone mentioned mass roleblocks.

[Porochaz]

Never mind my last comment I wasnt paying attention, your still splaffing though, your opinion at the most comes next to Robert Mugabe's opinion on banana's in terms of usefulness at this point in time.

[Porochaz]

No but Im glad your like the only person listening.

[Porochaz]

I am so drunk right now, as in like wow, thats a big giant chicken, I wonder if I could put a saddle on it and ride it kind of drunk but why do I want to put xvart through a glass table right now for being so uncharacteristic of herself right now. Her response to me was what I expected of her. A response I can probably only get serious about when I have my serious face on. Anything else she writed just now though could be combined with the bodily fluids RC puts down with every post to make this game dumber than it already is.

Yes I know the irony of me being so drunk that I am typng on auto pilot and complaining about their posts, but they don't half a fucking bar in them.

[Porochaz]

Tip: Day 1 is pretty much a waste, start at day 2.

[Porochaz]

Ah yes, have contributed nothing because I don't agree with your stupid splaffing and I wasn't going to but I saw 2 out of your first 4 points are fundamentally flawed so lets go through the whole goddamn useless post.

Darox, here might be a good place to start reading. That said, don't hesitate to re-read AFTER you read this. In fact, I'd be upset if you didn't.

What we Know

General

1. There are two recruiting factions with one recruiter each. This is splained in the modposting.

WRONG! Multiple recruiters is what it says. There could only be one cult, you have just arbitrarily decided otherwise.

2. Current speculation is that cultscum factions can either recruit or kill, once per night.

CORRECT. However it is speculation.

3. All players who started as town have role PM flavor about what they want to do when this is over.

When was this stated?

4. It's pretty much LyLo. Unless you're in the big cult. See "Yosarian2" below for more info.

WRONG!(possibly) You have once again assumed we have 2 cults, and even a bigger/smaller cult. Yet you have absolutely no evidence for that unless you are a cult member and even then, you would still not know fully if there are in fact 2 cults.

Next bit is summarising all the info so cult can look at it easy and pick off people/recruit people a lot more easier than normal...

Role Info

1. There are cop-like roles called Enforcers. This is confirmed by flips and claims.

----

- Claimed Enforcers are: Andrius, ReaperCharlie

----

- Flipped Enforcers are: Furcolow

----

- Flavor includes them knocking people out and determining their alignment at night. This is confirmed.

For Andrius only. You could (and Im getting the horrible feeling that you are) just be copying Andi.

2. There are one-shot-vig roles called Loose Cannons. This is confirmed by flips and claims.

----

- Claimed Loose Cannons are: ooba, singersigner

----

- Flipped Loose Cannons are: zwetschenastyface

----

- One of the claimed Loose Cannons has claimed that you can forfeit your vig shot for a double-vote. This is unsubstantiated.

That's pretty much true. Also the reason we probably should ignore ooba as a candidate today, which you aren't.

4. There are roles called Bodyguards. This is confirmed by flips.

----

- Flipped Bodyguards are: dramonic

----

- Unclaimed bodyguard(s) probably exist(s).

Says who? You have added another bodyguard with no concievable proof.

5. There is one claimed "Cult Doctor" role. This is unsubstantiated.

----

- Claimed "Cult Doctor" is Robocopter87. There are no further claims or flips regarding this role.

----

- This role is claimed to protect its target from being recruited by either cult on the night they are protected.

Its fairly substantiated in that Andi who Robo has been protecting has recieved original results, (collaborated by you) and surely since he has been a substantial asset and threat to the town he would be culted or killed by now. I think we can safely assume Robo is a cult doc, if not town anymore. (which is likely but debatable)

Again, just even more easier for cult... Im not going to bother quoting the majority of this... just the additional info you missed out.

Player Info (Living)

1. Andrius

----

- Claimed Enforcer.

----

- Claimed Targets:

--------

- ReaperCharlie N0 (town)

--------

- ooba N1 (no-result)

--------

- Lord Gurgi N2 (town)

--------

- Yosarian2 N4 (cultscum)

Claimed Day 1

2. Chronopie

----

- Confirmed roleblocker.

----

- Targets: _____ N0, _____ N1, was blocked himself on N3, Flameaxe N4.

I have M=W written down...

5. Flameaxe

----

- We know nothing about Flameaxe except that he was blocked by Chronopie on Night 3. This is confirmed.

By two people who could be scum together.

Erg0, Darox and him are 3 people who could still technically be recruiter. Flameaxe especially so considering the no kill last night along with roleblocks.

6. gandalf5166

----

- We know nothing about gandalf5166. Has been disproportionately (and uncharacteristically) lurky.

Still could be recruitor.

9. Porochaz

----

- We know nothing about Porochaz. Has been acting like a buzzkill since D1, and has contributed nothing.

I love this, and its done to get a reaction out of me as I feel today, day 1 and for part of yesterday I was contributing, but I also won't put up with shit. Like the stuff that was spewing out of almost everyones mouths day 1. Or like now, where you seem to be heavily after ooba when it's fairly clear he is what he says he is and out of all of you only xvart is coming up with arguments worth listening to at all. You speak loads but in the end you are saying nothing, god even your claim was totally void of content!

Oh and I guess I could be recruiter.

10. ReaperCharlie

----

- Was investigated by Andrius on N0, with a town result.

----

- Claimed Enforcer.

----

- Claimed Targets:

--------

- Faraday N0 (flavor indicated that Faraday had been bodyguarded, effectively blocking the investigation)

--------

- ooba N1 (no-result)

--------

- Lord Gurgi N2 (town)

--------

- Chronopie N3 (town)

Really... what I said above. The fact Im putting a lot of credit into Andi's claim makes this result annoying. It makes certain your not a recruiter... but it seems like you have tried your hardest to be as unhelpful as possible.

11. Robocopter87

----

- Claimed "Cult Doctor" (still unsubstantiated as a role).

----

- Claimed Targets: _____ N0, Andrius N1, Andrius N2, Andrius N3, Andrius N4.

----

- Could have been blocked, does not know.

How is it unsubstantiated at all? and how could he be blocked and not know!?

12. singersigner

----

- Claimed Loose Cannon.

----

- Was the one who claimed that Loose Cannons had the ability to trade their 1s-vig for a double-vote.

----

- Claimed to have actually made the trade, and a vote labeled "?????" appeared on the vote-count in addition to hers.

----

- There is no way of knowing if that was actually HER vote, or if it was linked either directly or indirectly to her role.

No but its a bit of a stretch... however whether singer is a loose cannon is questionable... but suffice to say not a recruiter.

13. xvart

----

- We know nothing about xvart. Has been on crack for the latter half of the game. ;P

Could still be recruiter

14. Yosarian2

----

- Was investigated by Andrius on N3 to be recruited cultscum.

----

- Has claimed that his cult is small and that the other is much larger.

The latter sentence should be disregarded. Putting too much into that line is fundamentally flawed.

Disclaimer:

The above is from my memory, and is very likely missing quite a few things. I would appreciate it if you'd all volunteer information (already known or not) so we can get all this sh*t taken care of. Because this game is stretching too long and I'm getting rather sick of it. Either way, if you see anything that is WRONG, or MISSING, please let me know, and provide the correct information.

Then replace out. Please. You keep collating this data and all it's doing is hurting the town by making sure cult have a one stop shop to all the valuable info. Its ridiculous and despite calling you out on it a number of times, you keep doing it. I know Ive been a dick and hypocrite in one respect most of the game, but when I say, "what you are doing is completely anti town" and then give reasons why most people regardless of alignment would take that as a hint...

[Porochaz]

I made a bit of a mess with the quotes as Im prone to do, but its easily readable still.

[Porochaz]

1. There are two recruiting factions with one recruiter each. This is splained in the modposting.

WRONG! Multiple recruiters is what it says. There could only be one cult, you have just arbitrarily decided otherwise.

May I direct your attention to Post #1800? Or perhaps Yos2's claim? Or any of the other THOUSANDS of posts made with the supposition that there are UNDENIABLY two cults?

Or have you not been reading the topic at all? OH YEAH THATS IT.

Post 1800 is yours, it is speculation!!!

but even worse, you are taking yos2's word for fact! He was found out fair and square by Andi! Do you think he'd be going "Im cult and Im so VERY VERY honest!" right now if he wasn't caught? The fact that people are taking it for fact does not make it so!

snip

That's why I said it was speculation, Dunce Cap.

I was reiterated that it was speculation, something which seems to be a hard concept to get through to you.

When was this stated?

Again, not reading the thread.

I honestly dont remember because Im sure I would have said something.

So you're saying that as a townie, it's better to try to remember everything and hope everyone else remembers everything, than to try to post it in one centralized location so that we can make better choices as a whole? LOL

I realize by this point you're probably not scum, but you are either an idiot or a terrible player. *begins to ignore Porochaz*

I have this thing, it was invented a few thousand years ago, before computers, so it might be a bit old fashioned... its called paper. I have a pad of it. I have all the information collated that I need on that, now with the exception of Shanba who lives a couple of miles away from me, its extremely unlikely anyone is going to get there hands on it and effect.

Oh and if we were making "better choices" ooba wouldn't be in the firing line!!!

Your last line is amusing, and its probably why I haven't heard some of the things you are taking for fact that is just you posting randomly, I ignored you the best I could for the majority of this game as I had you down as both pretty early on.

As for the role info. Whether your a cop or not is neither here nor there, in fact I believe you are a cop or believe me I'd be voting for you but it's the same principle as ooba. You have had a cop with a much more solid grounding get an innocent on you, now Im sure you have been recruited since then and your results mean absolutely nothing and even if they didn't getting a null result rather than a scum result on ooba is just that, a null tell. Now it could be it was a night they changed and the bodyguard you think you saw could be a cult member, it could be your lying through your teeth or even I could be wrong and you could still be a town cop. Either way though, Im not lynching ooba, because his claim still pretty stands.

Well, there are at least three claimed enforcers, at least three claimed loose cannons. 2+2=? Oh wait, I forgot you were an idiot.

Lulz at the purely random set up speculation. I'm glad you have proper evidence to back this up.

Or hey! Lets all mass claim, you know why? Because according to RC we have 3 of each role, and I'm sure Flay would make it that easy to break his game years in the making.

As for Robo/Andi, yeah in fact I believe Robo is cult now and Ive taken your scenario into account but as Robo only claimed yesterday, it makes it quite unlikely. The fact that Andi has given us a guilty is also testiment. So unlike you and your no results and repeat results, I am going to maintain my line of thinking. Also what does the cult doc do when he gets recruited?

I haven't stopped thinking about every possibility I have just disregarded all the unlikely ones, something you seem to be incapable of doing. We have a list which includes BBM, Erg0, myself, gandalf etc. etc. who are on the list of potential recruiters, ooba doesn't feature on that list, neither does Andi or Robo. Hence theories about them should be dropped!

I am enjoying your liberal use of the word idiot though, it makes me smile whenever you use the word. Partly because I think your posts are causing my brain to slowly ooze out of my ear, the fact that out of respect for Flay's rules, I am trying my upmost hardest to keep civil and the fact that I haven't read a town motivated thing from you all game.

I'm not sure what good it will do but...

Why did you claim when you did?
Did you not feel at the time your credibility might be low having similar results to Andi?
Do you not see the logic or the opposing view in keeping ooba alive?

What do I think of the no result?

I think it's exactly that. I think whether its the wording in your role pm or the night they turned and so they were like schrodingers cat at that point or something else. Im treating ooba's no result as just that. Faraday got a no result as well, didn't he? and he flipped? I am treating a no result as that. It doesn't give him a free pass but with a claim of loose cannon

(which by the way adding it up zwet+singer+ooba = 3)

etc. Im going to say he isn't a recruiter. Alignment, I don't care atm.

5. Flameaxe
----- We know nothing about Flameaxe except that he was blocked by Chronopie on Night 3. This is confirmed.

By two people who could be scum together.

I JUST investigated Chrono last night and he's town. He claimed blocking Flameaxe, and Flameaxe confirmed the flavor. So who are you saying is scum together?

Now who isn't considering any possibility. Why would you investigate someone who is clearly not the recruiter? It makes no sense. Flameaxe here has nothing to do with it. You both could be scum together. As Ive stated I believe you to be scum, and I have no reason to believe whether Chrono is scum/town. Besides you were writing an analysis post for Darox. You need to make sure your facts are straight.

Lulz at the bit against me.

In regards to what you said about you, I think you are a cop. I don't think initially you were misleading the town. I think you were just useless-scum. Now I believe you are trying to mislead the town. Why else go for ooba?

Also confirming what Andi has said gives you credence and makes for easy results for you. Don't make your repetitious nature and the pure randomness of your claim try to work for you. It doesn't.

You seriously buying into the andi/robo cult team? Why would robo claim yesterday then? Again no sense.

And actually I do believe that there is a strong possibility of 2 cults, but there is a possibility of 1 and even if there is 2, where yos is in relation and the size of the teams is still totally up in the air.

As for your theory, I get it, but she has proved at the least she is not recruiter. Also with people without any proof whatsoever out there, they should be the focus of our attention and we should go up random garden paths with you on theories that are about as likely as aliens landing in my garden tomorrow.

Yos - well he could be part of a larger cult and by lynching someone else, he wins. Trying to confuse town and cause I dunno "this"

Now after having to read and reply to a post civilly, I'm away to punch a swan. Or something.

[Porochaz]

Time to put my money where my mouth is.

vote Erg0

subject to change to one of Flameaxe or xvart if I have more time to do more research. For now, lurky lurkerson gets my vote.

[Porochaz]

Without saying the words "cause he said so" can everyone tell me why they believe yos to be part of the smaller cult?

[Porochaz]

Which is entirely my point, Im glad you are being sensible.

[Porochaz]

I also want the first post of page 100

[Porochaz]

NO NO NO!!! NO RC LYNCH! NO OOBA LYNCH! STOP BEING STUPID!!!

[Porochaz]

Quag, I advise leaving Day 1 till last. Read day 2 onwards and then if your not killing yourself read day 1.

[Porochaz]

Quag, I know your effectively Erg0 but don't join the ooba wagon.

[Porochaz]

It makes me undecided.

But if it'll help you sleep at night, I'll vote RC because I still think he is a legitimate lynch choice today.

Aim: ReaperCharlie

With Andrus's innocent on him? Unfortunately not.

[Porochaz]

Andrius has an innocent on him. That is enough for me.

[Porochaz]

Having now looked through your posts, you have not changed my opinion one iota.

[Porochaz]

Quag to try and fill out the answers a bit,

singer was under a bit of pressure, so he claimed loose cannon which has been described above, to prove it he used his "double vote" to hammer. When it went to night, the wagon showed singer as the second last vote and ???? as the last vote, this implies that he used it, but that might not be totally 100%. My personal view is to take it as is. This answers 3 to an extent beyond ooba claiming loose cannon before her and also claiming he used his one shot vig kill on zwet. It does tie them together, but I would totally believe ooba killed zwet straight away and that even if there wasn't a better option like voting someone who is an "unknown", ooba shouldn't be lynched because there is significant evidence against lynching him. Singer less so but still...

As for the "WHAT WE KNOW", its filled with innaccuracies. 4 for instance, assumes yos2 is telling the complete truth despite him being a recruiter, and doesn't take some of the more "out there" theories into consideration, like there only being one cult and its total speculation. 2 we have no evidence at all to suggest it, neither do we have conclusive evidence that 1 is correct either. Still haven't found out where he got 3 from either...

Ninja Edit: Singer, you realise that that will most likely be a choice of himself or ooba?

Also I want it totally clear, I wont be voting ooba at deadline.

[Porochaz]

Erg0 is a prime lynch candidate as he still could be a possible recruiter. Which could be said about BBM, xvart, gandalf, myself and one or two others. The reason why he has been elevated above the rest of us is that he hasn't been able to form an opinion and that was only when he did post. The increased pressure on him he basically ignored.

In the category below (unlikely recruiter) is ooba and singer (Im also going to throw yos in this group) in that they have claimed a power role, they have evidence evidence against them, but at the same time there is evidence for them as well.

Lastly there are the people who are confirmed not to be a recruiter, Andi and Chrono are the only 2, I think. Chrono's confirmed with the flavour he gives people when he blocks them and Andi is pretty much confirmed with his guilty on yos.

Then we have Andi's results which gives an innocent to Lord Gurgi and RC.

[Porochaz]

Gandalf is a 10x better lynch than ooba. Which I might headbutt a wall if it goes through. Id be willing to vote anyone who doesn't have any reasoning behind them, this means no RC, no singer, no andrius and most of all no ooba.

[Porochaz]

Flay, looking at the rules, can we have a short extension, possibly 3-4 days worth? Thanks

[Porochaz]

Right, we have some time here to sort this out, please can we change this terrible terrible lynch.

[Porochaz]

It's pretty obvious that the large cult wants Ooba eliminated, but it's not enough for them to win, or they would have hammered already. That's good. I'm more inclined to lynch Gandalf since he's third in popularity and I don't think Quag is particularly a better lynch.

I actually would think the opposite: that the large cult doesn't want ooba dead and has the numbers to practically necessitate everyone that is not in their cult to coordinate against them. Anyone town and everyone not in ooba's cult that has not voted needs to put a vote on ooba now.

The fact of the matter is that ooba has evidence against him (whether or not you think that is good evidence is beside the point now). The other suggested people that might be recruiter are Erg0, Prozac, Gandalf, and for pretty much the same reason: lurking, flying under the radar, etc. So... with three options there, you want to take a chance that one of them is more likely the recruiter based on what? Where is the distinction? Why vote gandalf over Erg0 or Prozac and vice versa?

ooba has more evidence against him than the three that are all guilty of possibly being a recruiter based on similar playstyle.

xvart.

Why are you totally discounting evidence for him? I really dont understand this at all.

[Porochaz]

holster, Aim Gandalf

Looks like Gandalf is the better option just now.

[Porochaz]

Its clearly sample only, as said at the start. We've caught a liar here. Lynch please.

[Porochaz]

No, that's the vanilla townie role PM, word for word. Did you notice that Friend was also opening a pizzeria?

Prove it.

[Porochaz]

Actually you don't have to, your claiming a role which can't be confirmed by another player therefore your still in the "easily could be a recruiter" category. A lynch on you at this stage in the game is the best option at the moment.

[Porochaz]

I didnt say that at all, what I am saying is that if you were something another role could corroborate then you would be in the clear, whether its a cop/roleblocker etc. or a cop had an innocent on you, however that is not the case.

[Porochaz]

Yay lets play "pointing out things we shouldn't"

[Porochaz]

No fishing.

[Porochaz]

UNOFFICIAL Situation Report of Day Four

[7]

gandalf5166 (Darox, Lord Gurgi, ooba, ReaperCharlie, Flameaxe, singersigner, Porochaz)

[3]

ooba (xvart, Robocopter87, Quagmire)

[3]

Quagmire (Andrius, Chronopie, gandalf5166)

Holstered: Yosarian2

With fourteen alive, it will take eight drawn weapons to kill someone. Day Four may last as long as 3:00 AM due to the late replacement, though it will shorten Day Five.

[Porochaz]

Of course you are...

[Porochaz]

Because ooba was a terrible lynch?

[Porochaz]

and whatever yos would have done would have just added a crapload more WIFOM on our WIFOM boat the S.S. WIFOM?

[Porochaz]

I am sick of this.

Aim: Andrius

The worst thing you have done all game by a country mile.

Chrono, Can you go more in depth with your flavour please?

[Porochaz]

Sorry I didnt see 2751. I think it important I claim soon/now and I think from the convo yesterday its obvious, to reduce the pool of players, Im Ysabel, the other roleblocker. My blocks are mostly obvious. I didn't block N0 as I didnt see the point of a random block. The rest I think have been worked out. xvart was N3, I blocked Quag N4, the reason I bring this up now is that in my flavour is that there is no mention of a threesome and from the length of time and his excitedness of the "situation" suggests I was with him a while. Are you sure you blocked Quagmire, sir?

[Porochaz]

My flavour only indicates me and quag within his room at any time. Outwith the room wasn't mentioned.

[Porochaz]

Prozac - did you RB chrono N2?

xvart.

Yes, that was me partially not paying attention and partially going after someone who really annoyed me the previous day who I thought would harm town more than help it.

[Porochaz]

Sorry I didnt see 2751. I think it important I claim soon/now and I think from the convo yesterday its obvious, to reduce the pool of players, Im Ysabel, the other roleblocker. My blocks are mostly obvious. I didn't block N0 as I didnt see the point of a random block. The rest I think have been worked out. xvart was N3, I blocked Quag N4, the reason I bring this up now is that in my flavour is that there is no mention of a threesome and from the length of time and his excitedness of the "situation" suggests I was with him a while. Are you sure you blocked Quagmire, sir?

I am 100% sure I blocked Quagmire.

there's a reference to 'many hours' and leaving 'sore but satisfied'...

Regardless of who you blocked, you are confirmed to me at least not to be a recruiter. However at the same time, I am currently trying to work out whether you are lying about this. Id also point out that I wouldn't take anything Andi says at face value anymore. I didn't leave quag sore though, maybe Im a more gentle lover.

[Porochaz]

Mobsters still in the building:

1. 
   
2. inHimshallibe

   Katsuki
   Darox
   - Investigated Town (RC #4)
   
3. Erg0
   Quagmire*
   - Scum? (A #4)
   
4. animorpherv1
   Flameaxe*
   
5. vezokpiraka
   Robocopter87
   - Claimed Consigliere (Supported by Yosarian)
   
6. xvart*
   
7. Yosarian2*
   - Investigated Cultist (A#3)

Actually the list of people who could be cult recruiter is a little larger. We should be lynching someone in this list today as they have no support along with there claim. The rest do to varying extents. Totally trusting RC and Andi in the latter days would not be smart.

[Porochaz]

Mobsters still in the building:

1. 
   
2. inHimshallibe

   Katsuki
   Darox
   - Investigated Town (RC #4)
   
3. Erg0
   Quagmire*
   - Scum? (A #4)
   
4. animorpherv1
   Flameaxe*
   
5. vezokpiraka
   Robocopter87
   - Claimed Consigliere (Supported by Yosarian)
   
6. xvart*
   
7. Yosarian2*
   - Investigated Cultist (A#3)

Actually the list of people who could be cult recruiter is a little larger. We should be lynching someone in this list today as they have no support along with there claim. The rest do to varying extents. Totally trusting RC and Andi in the latter days would not be smart.

Why am I on this list yet Gurgi isn't?
Pretty inconsistent.

@RC: Yes, I did, and I also note that Ooba was town despite two apparently damning cop results on him. Quicklynching Quagmire because of what Andrius said he got as an investigative result is a retarded move.

Because Gurgi got an innocent before someone claimed, two claimed cops investigated him, it was early enough that both could still have been town...

In comparison to yours where both cops have likely been recruited by now, there is no cross examination and it was only last night. Not inconsistent at all.

[Porochaz]

Yeah yos, as a confirmed cult recruit, what do you think of claiming?

[Porochaz]

Im sorry, I forgot this was the game where everyone tells the truth and we should take everything at face value. What makes you think yos is even remotely interested even in this game anymore?

[Porochaz]

I dont care what you ask Gurgi but as Im sure you have noticed, we have 112 pages here, the first 40 of which were useless and interspersed with usefulness probably overall another 40 are just as useless. I think its time to cut the crap and realise that asking yos anything is a bit of a retarded idea. Regardless, you will never get anything intelligent out of him because you can never tell if he is telling the truth. The harm in asking is that we go down a road of WIFOM buckets and still get nowhere.

[Porochaz]

When I blocked him, I totally forgot he was a roleblocker. I sent my block in really late and just chose without thinking.

[Porochaz]

And whilst I see sense in not prolonging the day, I think we can hold off lynching for a couple of hours.

[Porochaz]

k

vote quag

[Porochaz]

Wanted to quickly point out that between my last two posts the standard dropped lower than its ever been, showing me that there wasn't going to be much more constructiveness today hence the vote.

[Porochaz]

Confirm on xvart. Chrono did as well.

[Porochaz]

I read page 120, saw it was quite retarded and went and built a snowman instead.

[Porochaz]

I read page 120, saw it was quite retarded and went and built a snowman instead.

And you're no better than Gurgi. Go take a long walk off a short dock, unless you're gonna lay a vote down on someone.

Why because your spamming the thread with absolutely useless rubbish and the majority of people speaking are working on assumptions which when you look back are plucked essentially from nowhere/unreliable sources. I know who Im going to vote for, but I wont be voting till Ive waded through the crap.

Also xvart if I have a jailkeep ability, I don't know about it.

[Porochaz]

I also agree with Gurgi. I have been quite elitist and then hypocritical in this game, you are totally free to complain about my flaws because I have spoke my mind the entire game then doubled back a bit when I started to lurk. We are taking assumptions off of yos and (as gurgi said) cops who have alignments which have possibly changed. Im inclined to believe Andi up to the day he caught yos. RC I couldnt care about, only because there hasnt been a useful result there. I believe we proved (me and chrono) that we are both rbers and the first person to claim unique power roles are clear as well. Beyond that... Andi, I have liked soundbites of what he has said and hated others. Im not voting till I work out this jk thing either and what it means when Ive targetted who I have.

Oh and larger cult/smaller cult? Im glad we all know because we got that information from the ideal source... shall we structure our game round that now...

[Porochaz]

spamming the thread with absolutely useless rubbish and the majority of people speaking are working on assumptions which when you look back are plucked essentially from nowhere/unreliable sources.

So your answer to this is to do.... what? Sit back and do nothing? Wait until the deadline to begin discussing things? Forget about everything we THINK we know, and start from scratch?

I'm dying to know what you want to do, if you don't want to do what we've BEEN doing the last ten pages.

Really. Please tell me.

Well youve ignored my next post. I addressed that I have been hypocritical and I stated my next steps. I tried pointing out before I dont think the route we have gone down and the insinuations about the cults is a wise idea but again that got ignored. I don't particularly have any want to contribute anymore especially if my posts are "boring" (see Darox) and now failing anything stupid jumping out at me when I read, I will be voting one of the few people that have made this game semi interesting over the past 100 pages.

And yes, I am throwing an almighty sulk.

[Porochaz]

I might have just forgot, but Poro, can you tell me why you RB'd Chrono N2?
Thanks.

I was sure I replied to this but I cant find it so meh, simply put, I was suspicious of him before the claim and when I went into night I didnt do anything until I was prodded by Flay and I went and blocked him without thinking.

Also am looking through the last 12 pages (Im up to this post), there is a list of about 5 people who are in my shortlist right now.