Mini 142: Guitarists Mafia- Game Over
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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After Assassin clarified that his vote wasMastermind of Sin wrote:
wrong. Mr. Flay posted in post 27 AND post 29, and you posted right after him in post 31, over two hours later, but didn't post your suspicion about Mr. Flay until post 35, and Mr. Flay had not posted anything since your last post to make you more suspicious of him...Talitha wrote:Mr Flay hadn't posted, but Assassin did, saying his vote was random.random, it made me suspicious of Mr Flay. Becausemyfirst impression of Assassin's vote was that he had some information. Mr Flay seemed toknow without being toldthat there was no information behind Assassin's vote.
It looked like a vote from someone who knew something to me. I didn't jump to the conclusion that it was a mindless vote. The fact that you did jump to that conclusion (and were right!), is why I am voting for you. If you know that Dour is innocent because you're scum, you'd know that Assassin's vote was weird and mindless.MrFlay wrote:Actually, at that point you knew more than I did, since Assasin had finally explained that his initial vote on Dourgrim was random (can you honestly read back on post 19 and tell me that didn't look weird?).-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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First it's mindless, then it's fishing? Fishing for what?Mr. Flay wrote:When he followed it up with a cute little "because I know he's evil" it made me pretty certain that it was a fishing expedition
What would you expect me to do when the person I am voting for gives me more justification for my vote? Remove it?Mr. Flay wrote:You voted for me long before Assasin told us his vote was random, now you say you're voting for me because I seemed to know something about his vote when none of us knew it was random.
IS always gets a free ride, otherwise we'd be lynching him on Day 1 every game.Mr. Flay wrote:Yet IS gets a free ride for saying Dourgrim is evil as well. How many investigative roles do you think there *are* in this game, Talitha?-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Your offer to give a name after only 2 votes was odd. So was your assertion that a random bandwagon on you was quite justified. I'm not sure how that adds up to me being inconsistent.
With regards to roleclaiming, I'm not sure how you giving us a guitarist name is going to help much. We don't have any information as to scum roles yet. If you were town, I'd expect that you would want to keep that kind of info to yourself for as long as possible, though..-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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What makes it odd? The fact that you were only 1/3 of the way to a lynch and were already talking about partial claims. I could understand that from a newbie, but from you it's odd.
And what's the difference between offering and actually giving the info if we'd asked for it? Your intent is the same in both cases.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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MOS: Could you tell me the good points Dourgrim has made against me, in your own words please, thanks.
Dourgrim, Why are you putting words in my mouth? When did I say I know precisely what you believe or what you were trying to do? Haven't I been asking questions to try and get you to clarify your intentions?
All I know is how it looks from here. I should have said that your actions were "odd for a pro-towner". They make a lot more sense if I put Dourgrim=scum into the equation. Hence my vote.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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sigh.. I explained this at the time.Mastermind of Sin wrote:let's see here...first, there was the incident with Mr. Flay, where you scrounged up evidence on him well after the incident, when you should've mentioned it before if it had mattered...sounds like you are trying to make up reasons to pin someone down...New evidence came to light when Assassin explained his vote.It's not my fault if you don't read and think about my posts.
Please give one example.now, there's the incident with dourgrim, where you are (apparently) misrepresenting his posts (i read them the same way he does)
He was quite clear when he offered to claim. I took it at face value and I still say it was an odd thing for him to do.andacting(you didn't just come right out and say it) like you know exactly what he was trying to say in his posts while calling his posts "odd" at the same time...those two don't correlate...
A fair point, and you're entitled to your opinion.also, I think his reasoning on the offer to name his role was sound, not that I agree with it necessarily, and you are taking it a bit too far for my liking...
It's one of the most suspicious things that I have seen so far. What would you like me to do, vote for someone who I'm not suspicious of?that one point seems to be your only reason for voting dourgrim, and since I think that point is false, you are voting him for no logic at all...hence, my vote...along with a general "scummy" feeling I'm getting from you...-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Why wouldn't you want me to change my story huh? If you really thought I was scum, you'd be looking to trip me up.MOS wrote:i did read your posts, and I guess I just didn't feel you explained yourself adequetely...so let's just agree to disagree, unless you have a different explanation for me...in which case you'd be changing your story, and I wouln't suggest that...
And if you really cared whether I am innocent, you'd be asking me for further explanation.
You've jumped to 3rd on my list. (Flay & Dour are tied for 1st place).
I assume then, that you have first hand experience of Dourgrim's mafia style? How many games have you played with him?MOS wrote:i see his post differently than you, apparently, because it doesn't seem all that odd to me...-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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No, that's not the rule at all. But I'm not going to let someone who I think is scum (that's you, Dour) jump in and distract from the issue at hand.Dourgrim wrote:Yes, yes, sorry, I completely forgot the Cardinal Rule of Mafia: no one should comment on Talitha (or anything she says or asks) until Talitha's gotten her answers...
I never said that I am an expert on your style. Read my post again. I could and would go into details of the games I have been in with you, but I don't see any point in getting into a back-and-forth with you over how well I know your style, when it isn't really even an issue. The fact is that I'm more familiar with your play than MOS is, but even that's not a big issue.
And i still want MOS to answer my question.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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That's fine, but it makes me wonder why you don't give any consideration to the opinion of a player who has played with Dourgrim before. (Before Dour blows up at me again, I'm not saying that I know him inside out or anything). But I do have some experience that I'm basing my judgements from, whereas you have none.MOS wrote:I've haven't played a lot of games with Dourgrim either, but that doesn't mean I can't read his posts differently than you do...
I'm not saying that I'm definitely right, and MOS is definitely wrong, just interested in the situation. Maybe Dour is innocent and MOS is the scum *shrug*.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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When I saw the way Assasin voted for Dourgrim, and then his assertion that he didn't need IS to tell him anything, the first thing that popped into my head was, "Wow, Assasin could be a cop".Maverick wrote:Talitha, quick quesiton, why do you find Mr. Flay suspicious again?
Then Mr Flay FOSed Assasin and then voted for him after Dourgrim did, saying that Assasin 'mindlessly' fingered Dour.
THEN Assasin comes along and says that his Dourgrim vote was just a random vote.
So Mr Flay was RIGHT about Assasin's vote being mindless. But my question is, how did he know this?-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Mr Flay wrote:What exactly are you wanting by way of explanation?I just want to know why it never entered your head at any point that Assasin could be a cop.
You're right that we've got some good info already this day Mr Flay, but I don't want to lynch myself or Dourgrim at this point.
I've just realised we've got some major lurking going on, not the least is from the person who started all of this.
unvote: Dourgrim vote: Assasin-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Maverick - check out any of my other day 1s. I'm somewhat of a flip flopper and I change who I am suspicious of nearly as often as I change my undies. I often also get into heated debates with people and then back down. None of this is out of the ordinary for me.
I'm now on 4 votes out of 6, so if anyone else is intending on voting for me, I'd appreciate if you'd give me fair warning before doing so.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Because it's a good strategy for the town to lynch someone who claims townie on Day 1 (unless there is good evidence for their town-ness). The alternative is to go and bandwagon someone else to a claim, and expose our useful roles. Besides, I think he's scum.Why would we lynch Dourgrim after his claim?
And Mav, how can you be 90% sure that Dourgrim is town and 0% sure that I am town? C'mon. Both of those statements are ridiculous.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Yeah - that exactly. How did you know it was bogus yesterday? It looks like inside knowledge to me.Mr.Flay wrote:...Assasin's bogus claims of "knowing he's evil"..
And I appreciate the fact that you're voting for me because I am such a brilliant player. How could I possibly be wrong if I'm not scum? I should've had this whole game wrapped up and the scumbags all lynched by now huh? Whatever.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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It was nothing to do with you disagreeing with me at all. It was your reaction to Assasin's vote for Dourgrim on PageMrFlay wrote:It's inside knowledge that I don't think a player looks suspicious when you do? I'm with Dourgrim on this one, you're awfully high-and-mighty here. Especially for someone who led a bad lynch yesterday (you and IS, technically, but he at least didn't try to give it any pretext).1. You said it wasmindless. It was Assasin's first post. How did you know it was mindless and not a result of some information he might have? (I have said this several times before and have yet to get a satisfactory answer).
So why am I more suspicious than IS? Or anyone else who voted for Dour? Because I tried to engage the person I was voting for?
And calling me high-and-mighty just makes me want to throw things. Last I checked my vote only counted for one. I didn't lynch Dour all by myself. And it's not like I bullied everyone into voting for Dourgrim. Nor am I trying to bully anyone into voting for you. They can all freaking vote for me, for all I care right now.
Incorrect. I'm jumping on your case because I think you're scum. And you're sounding like an "I-told-you-so" guy.Way to put words in my mouth. We've only had one night and with 3-4 scum in a mini, we had a less than 50% chance of lynching correctly yesterday. Yet you want to jump my case because I didn't believe you?
I am simply voting for who I think is scum. The others can and will do what they want. You really sound like you're afraid people will listen to me.I'd have thought you'd want to re-evaluate your strategy after lynching Dourgrim, but you're intent to continue steering the boat.
You don't sound very confident here, about me being scum....I'm willing to gamble on you being it, just like you were willing to gamble on Dourgrim yesterday. Are you game, Talitha?
And if Dourgrim had been scum, I'd be sweet at 100% right? Uhh, you need a decent sample before you start throwing statistics around as evidence.Nobody expects you to have fingered all of the scum by now, but you're batting .000 so far.
I'm actually completely incredulous that you seem to think I'm single-handedly to blame for us lynching town yesterday.
Umm, when/if I stop being pissed off at Flay, I might vote Maverick or Assasin. Where are they? (And King Enigma & nonny too)-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Mr Flay. I'm not trying to sound condescending here, but as a veteran of only 5 games, you might not be aware that very often a townie gets lynched on Day 1.
Furthermore, just about always, whenever anyone claims plain townie, I will try and lynch them.Especiallyon day 1. You can check out my other games if you don't believe me. It is the best strategy for the town. Please bear this in mind.
I'll most probably respond to the rest of your post after some sleep.-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Why would it be suicide?MrFlay wrote:A cop with a lucky investigation MIGHT have come out on Day One, even though it was probably suicide.
Could you please explain this further. Who was I defending? Assasin?MrFlay wrote:In the words of people who've played a lot longer than me, "It's a little early to be defending people, isn't it?
I wasn't taking him at his word, but what he said confirmed to me that he was NOT a cop coming forward with info. At that point my suspicion of you (and him, incidentally) rose significantly (because you already seemed to know he wasn't a cop). I'm still not entirely sure whether this was a scummy slip on your part, or whether you just saw it different to me.MrFlay wrote:Why are you taking him (Assasin) at his word? "random votes" are the easiest way to get on a bandwagon and defer suspicion, so one might suspect that the belated explanation was crafted after he drew some heat (not much, I admit, but he's been keeping his head down ever since).
You need to take this a step further and demonstrate how this makes me scummy. In my experience the people pushing hard and vocally against someone on Day 1 are most often town.MrFlay wrote:You had the strongest claims against Dourgrim yesterday (....) you were the strongest proponent of the erroneous lynch yesterday.
I didn't ascribe anyone an innocent badge. Far from it. IIRC I even voted for Assasin yesterday. I am extremely suspicious of him. But still I'd feel bad to lynch him Day 1. Day 2 is a different story and at this point I'd be quite happy to give him a severe bandwagoning. (Pity I'm so attached to my vote on you right now).MrFlay wrote:why would you automatically ascribe to newbies an 'innocent' badge that they haven't earned?
I'm not going to apologise for any of it - spats are a good way to learn stuff about the other players.MrFlay wrote:you seem to be engaged in the same "spat" with me today that you were in with Dourgrim yesterday.
First, I don't believe I made a bad choice yesterday. Could've ended better but I believe it was the best decision at the time. Secondly, that statement should equally apply toMrFlay wrote:You made a bad choice yesterday and you're trying to weasel out of ANY responsibility for it.you. I have not tried to weasel out of responsibility for anything. But you're suggesting that because I argued with Dour yesterday, rather than acting like I wasn't sure or just casually slipping my vote on him, that I am somehow the most scummy on the lynch. Nuh uh. Take responsibility for your own vote Flay. At least *I* thought Dour was scummy. If you didn't want him to be lynched you could've voted for me and tried to get others to do the same, or petitioned the mod for more time.
Damn I wish I could vote for more than 1 person.
unvote Flay, vote: Assasin-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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I don't recall saying anything like this. I don't agree with it anyway.Maverick wrote:Talitha might be right about the town possably being less known guitarists, than that of the scum being more known guitarists, but I'm not going to go by that, because I'm not sure about it.
If I were modding this game, the townies would be famous guitarists and the scum would be famous classical musicians or drummers or something.
unvote: Assasin, vote: nonny
Too damn quiet-
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Talitha Dr. Dead
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