Mini Normal 1187: Game Over

[hiplop]

VOTE: barry allen for being faster than me

[hiplop]

FoS on gilitah for possessing an idiot ball

[hiplop]

unvote

vote archaebob

for taking everything too seriously

[hiplop]

unvote, vote demonhybrid[/vote]

calling someone definite scum o n the second page, over a RV. Plus blindly following bobby

[hiplop]

i dont need to defend myself. i didnt do anything.

[hiplop]

how have i followed anyone? are you serious? im the onlyy one voting DH. Im thinking for myself

[hiplop]

yes i do giitah, hence my vote on him

no? its a vote post.

[hiplop]

i dont really have a meta tbh. I play differently depending on how im feeling. I think one thing that reigns supreme throughout all m games, is that i'm a terrible day one-r. Almost every game i attract some sort of attention on me day one. I am at least putting content forward, i apologize for the bad typing, im not feeling that great and not paying much attention.

Does anyone else notice how Demon is pretty much worshipping bob? no one finds that even a little suspicious? i think it warrants a wagon at least

[hiplop]

yeah my apologies for that pap! i messed up the bbcoding

[hiplop]

i am quite serious, just because im targetting you, doesnt mean im not doing anything. I think its fairly obvious that my archbob vote was a joke-vote.

[hiplop]

unvote

vote archaebob

for taking everything too seriously

This was a joke vote?

yea

[hiplop]

demon, settle the fuck down. Day only just started. No one took that vote seriously but you. Yeah, im suspicious of you, for fairly obvious reasons, too. Those being, you're going way too frontal, too soon. That tends to be a scum-tell. You're like falling beneath bobs feet, and trying to like get in his pants or something. You're sheeping him to no end. even he is realizing your charade. Im not going to necessarilly say that you're scum, but you're my top read atm

[hiplop]

Btw, you do realize RVS ends at different times, for different people, right? you seem to be very, very confused, or have very low reading comprehension skills. It was clearly a non-serious vote. Being too serious isnt a legit reason.

[hiplop]

The RVS can last as long as i want it to last, for me. I could vote 300 times in the RVS stage, its still the RVS. I said

definite

scum, not a suspicion.Theres a difference (: .

You're trying to play too hard, too early and its not working.

[hiplop]

The RVS can last as long as i want it to last, for me. I could vote 300 times in the RVS stage, its still the RVS. I said

definite

scum, not a suspicion.Theres a difference (: .

You're trying to play too hard, too early and its not working.

Well, what you call "playing too hard" is what I call "I want to find out who scum is so I can lynch them, and I'll be as aggressive as I want to get that information".

Also, thanks for clarifying the emphasis on definite. I retract what I said.

im all for being an angressive player, if you read some of my games you'd see, that i am rather aggressive myself, but its way too early for being THAT harsh. Nitpicking a little too much atm. Not enough has happened to like find hard evidence. Granted it is your playstyle so i shouldnt comment on it, just friendly advice i guess

[hiplop]

uh, he's posted 4 times, 2 of them RV's, other a vote for pressure and the 4th was a ask for a prod.

I don't see what you wanted from my answer. Hes hasnt really started playing yet..

bobby What are you thoughts on his play/ what did you want from my answer? Feels like a filler question to make you look useful at this point

Answer.

[hiplop]

glad to see Demon smartening up, never just assume someone is town, always look at everyone including townreads. Last post helped your case, so

UNVOTE:

[hiplop]

@ hiplop - I'll answer that later. For now just keep doing what you're doing with Demon Hybrid, I'm very interested in what you guys have to say about each other.

@ Demon Hybrid - You'll find out the reason for my fos soon enough. I'm just waiting on jil to answer my questions.

Pine is typical Pine. He's playing slightly more carefully, so that's something to keep an eye on, but I don't think he's done anything

crazy

scummy yet.

"Slightly more carefully" than when? Are you referring to a past game?

What does "keeping an eye on" something mean to you?

And what do you mean by the end of your last sentence? Do you think he's done anything

slightly

scummy yet?

yeah, no. Filler questions that have no real purpose, are a major scumtell. This reaks of one of these. Explain, now. You ask us questions, we can ask you questions.

[hiplop]

@ hiplop - It's counterproductive for me to explain what I'm doing right now. I recognize this is slightly hypocritical, and I don't expect you to trust me just yet. However, I do expect you to recognize that even if I'm scum, what I've done so far is pro-town, and that there are better things for you to do than fuck up my process right now. I'll explain before the day is over. Ok?

[@ jil -]

If it was joke, then why did you FoS instead of voting? You had no problem joke voting Barry Allen, Demon Hybrid, or Heliman. Is there some reason you gave hiplop the softer treatment?

Right now Jil needs to answer this, and tell me what she thinks of hiplop's play in general.

no not really. The thing is, i know you're not a newb. You're a pretty good player. You're really not doing anything productive, asking pointless questions doesnt benefit us at all. And i think you know that

[hiplop]

cool.

[hiplop]

UNVOTE: VOTE: bob

willing to go in on this

[hiplop]

giitah is scum; we can get her in a few minutes, though

[hiplop]

so i deserve a vote for pursueing a scum read of mine? yeah nice logic. Its day one, 8 pages in. Obviously we're not going to have huge walls yet

[hiplop]

TO THOSE OF YOU ON MY WAGON -

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 2#p2395182

Note that I was

town

in that game. And that we fucking

won

.

This should make those of you who are voting me for my "chain questions" stop in their tracks for a moment. Like all meta defenses, it's wifom, but it still does mean that you don't really have a case.

again, i know you're a strong player. Meta wont cut it, sorry man.

that said, your reactions have seemed townie so

UNVOTE:

[hiplop]

shes obviously new, i FoS'd too, and iirc Barry allen did. I was slightly intoxicated admittedly, but RVS is just as much about starting conversations, as it is about applying pressure. Don't let my join date fool you, i've been playing mafia for years. Thats why meta wont cut it for me.

Also that reasoning is BS, fos =/= scumtell. Shes obviously young (account says 13 iirc), and won't fully understand mafia i suppose

[hiplop]

what?

[hiplop]

As a defense. He pulled up meta to excuse his play, i find meta useless, so it wont cut it for me

[hiplop]

how were they ANY different? because you want to target me specifically? Im not defending her at all, your logic just sucks

Unfortunately, you're town, VOTE: giitah

somethings not sitting right with you

[hiplop]

I wasn't speaking in absolutes, hes been acting town. Giitah, i mean other-game meta. Not personality meta.

[hiplop]

Yeah, i was explaining what meta i find useless. Bringing up other games is what i consider meta, i dont consider psycho-graphic characteristics to be meta.

i worded that wrong admittedly. I mean im getting a town-read from him

[hiplop]

Yeah, i was explaining what meta i find useless. Bringing up other games is what i consider meta, i dont consider psycho-graphic characteristics to be meta.

i worded that wrong admittedly. I mean im getting a town-read from him

So you consider claimed-and-'proveable' evidence from past games to be worthless, while you consider claimed evidence of their own personality to be in the clear?

@nintendo, yes that is definitely bad

its not good to use that as an offense nor defense, it just doesnt belong in mafia. Their age, mafia experience can be used, but nothing else really. like you couldnt vote me because im an aspiring actor, and they're good at pulling off roles. Get me?

[hiplop]

These were four consecutive posts on the first page. Giitah FoS's two people. Hiplop FoS's giitah. Quoted nintendoaddict just because it was in there. Jilynne FoS's hiplop. Get it? It was a chain of FoS's. One person FoS'd, so the next person FoS'd that person for whatever RVS reason, then the next person FoS'd that person for another RVS reason.

Did you even read the FoS in context or were you just looking at the ISO? This isn't a case of softer treatment or whatever you said the case was, it's a case of the flow during RVS. An FoS was more natural than a vote at this moment.

As for the other post of hers you quoted - this is a more valid point, however the fact that it was answering a question rather than a spontaneously made up case on hiplop dampens the argument. She may find hiplop scummy but not the scummiest player in the game, or simply not scummy enough to warrant a vote. Not voting for anyone isn't always a scumtell, despite what those with more aggressive playstyles may think.

Apologies if I spoiled your big plan to get more reactions out of Jil but honestly she's been at L-2 before, we got a reaction from that, and 8 pages later you are still going after her? I mean with that reasoning, seriously? At the beginning of your explanation post I figured you had some huge scumtell on Jil that we had all missed but honestly this is not a good case. Let's forget about it now shall we?

I thought there was stuff worth analyzing past there but on second glance I don't really see anything significant so meh. Re-reading the thread + properly reading pages 9-10 tomorrow, that'll do for now.

Thank you. thats exactly what i was trying to say. I take th beginning of RVS as a time for fun, randomvotes/fos's. Nothing is serious. After a while it becomes a great asset to the town, though

[hiplop]

V/LA, super busy atm, probably until friday

[hiplop]

gah i just got back from V/LA. Need to catch up on a BUNCH of games, ill re-read now

[hiplop]

Do you have anything else to say in your own defense on my case against you? If you haven't noticed, I posted again on the topic at posts #218 and #219.

Honestly, can we get over this?

1. After a couple of RVS votes, hiplop flipped to a vote on Bob for "taking everything too seriously" (which sounded to me as his first pressure vote...though later in response to DH, hiplop claims this was a joke-vote).
2. Afterward, hiplop switched to a vote on DemonHybrid, later claiming he was "the only one voting DH, I'm thinking for myself." (That was not true - hiplop was actually the third vote on DH, with all three votes still active at the time).
3. Later, he returns to vote Bob, without explaining the vote at the time (although there had been some back and forth with bob prior to the revote).
4. Later, hiplop states about bob, "unfortunately you're town" and votes giitah with the only case being "somethings not sitting right with you"

1. Yea, it was a joke vote. I guess there was some merit to it, but for the most part it wasnt serious at all
2. Only one voting him for a serious reason, others were RVS iirc (not 100% sure on this)
3. The back and forth was the explanation, really. You're grasping too hard for little details.
4. I don't like being wrong, i was pursuing Bob up to that point, and i realized i was wrong. Giitah is definitely still on my scum-list. Shes active-lurking/trying to appear useful, without actually doing anything.

As for your stand on hiplop, I disagree. I find hiplop's posting style somewhat suspicious, much in the way you suspect Jil of pretending to be 13. Please go back and look at how hiplop's typos and grammar seemed to get much better when getting defensive/angry, then later went back to the looser grammar and spelling of earlier posts. Again that's a bit meta, but I'm still waiting for hiplop to respond to my (and other's) earlier posts before making a judgment call there.

@grammar thing; that is lame logic. Idk if you're in my timezone, but those posts were made at like 12/1/2 am. I was very tired, plus i'm a busy person + lots of games, so i kind of have to either type perfectly, or catc h scum. And i'd rather do the latter Whats suspicious about my play,

exactly?

i know i defended Jillyiane kind of, but its because i didnt think she could defend herself. It was a bad move on my part, admittedly.

What do you think of all this?

I know this will sound stupid, unfortunately. I hate suspecting the people who are on my tail, but at the moment, itd be barry allen. Hes clinging way too hard to my wagon. The same could be said about demon hunter (not on me, though). Bob you worded it perfectly a few pages back, they've found some small details that they can keep mentioning and hope for a policy lynch. Its between DK and Barry. I definitely take back any suspicions i might have had on bob, dudes a machine.


@Everyone/specifically barry - I consider meta to be other-game stuff/ personality traits, not age. I guess my definition could be wrong to others but thats what i think of, and i think its kind of silly way to scumhunt.

sorry if i missed any questions, have a lot of catching up to do

[hiplop]

oh nintendo might be scum, hes definitely been rolefishing. The thing im scared of, is a lurker-scum-team in this game. Wich i think is entirely a possibility, thought bob seems to be able to realize this kind of stuff

[hiplop]

at the time of the vote, it wasnt serious. I got an iffy feeling, but not enough to merit a vote. IDC how you interpretted it.

People make mistakes, sorry. I usually dont count obvious-joke-votes. I probably should have said the only one pursuing dk.

Again, look at the post times. Here it is 5:50 and i just got off v/la. Im fresh etc. How does my voice change?

How is that OMGUS? I genuinely have a suspicion on you, if you were doing the same thing to Giitah, id be suspecting you. It just so happens that yure on my tail. Sorry, thought you were voting me, was a qucik check up and i kind of just assumed you voted me, nonetheless, you still are claiming the same things over-and-over. Thats clinging to a wagon

[hiplop]

OMGUS =/= mistake in thinking someones voting you? I think you're scum, at this point. Its not OMGUS, its just coincidental that you're going for me.

atm im fine with lynching;
Barry
DK
Grallie

Whats the vote count atm?

[hiplop]

nvm thought DK had more votes on him

VOTE: DK

[hiplop]

Yeah whoops! thought his name was demon killer. And i meant griitah

[hiplop]

OK, let's go through this latest group of posts...

OMGUS =/= mistake in thinking someones voting you? I think you're scum, at this point. Its not OMGUS, its just coincidental that you're going for me.

atm im fine with lynching;
Barry
DK
Grallie

Whats the vote count atm?

You wanted to go after me because you

thought

I was voting for you. It wasn't the mistake that was OMGUS, it was going after me because you thought I was voting for you. That's classic OMGUS.

nvm thought DK had more votes on him

VOTE: DK

This looks very LOL, very strange after making such a serious defense and going after me in a very serious tone. You are once again changing voices in thread as well as content.

Yeah whoops! thought his name was demon killer. And i meant griitah

More LOL again...only I'm not laughing.


hiplop posts with typos and grammatical errors until he is FoS'd, then turns to excellent typing and grammar along with a much more serious tone. Then, he goes back to LOL until the heat turns up again...and after getting serious with good typing and grammar goes back to LOL.

I don't buy that you can't even get the names of the players right, and I don't buy the flip-flopping in both content and posting style...I think it's time to...

VOTE: hiplop

Did you even read my post?

[hiplop]

Did you even read my post?

Yes, hiplop, I read all your posts. I find them not to be consistent in either content or posting style. The post I'm quoting from you is like a lot of your early posts, where you quote a longer post from someone else (in this case me) and make a very quick comment...making it look like you are contributing much more than you actually are. Your later posts swing back and forth in both content and style, depending on how much heat you are getting at the moment. Until I see something better from you I'll keep my vote where it is.

There is one other question that I did answer earlier...but that question seems to have come up again so I'd like to answer it again after quoting the most recent note on the subject:

Now,

@Barry

Post #4 you said you wanted to hear from jil because she was at L-2. I know this has been said before, but drawing attention to her absence seems almost opportunistic.

I don't think either of them are scum, though, but you can't be really sure on D1.

At the time of the post referenced above, Jil had actually been on thread multiple times without giving a defense, even though the votes were piling up. She had only been at L-2 for a few hours (hence my time zone reference), but this had been going on for much longer with her active posting...but no defense. That's what I was calling out...not her absence from the thread, but her absence of a defense.

get over it, you have no argument. I type walls when i have something to type about. When im just replying to a question, there is no need. If you look at my meta (since you guys seem to love it), i type like this in every game; Scum or Town. Which is why your logic sucks smurf.

As for bobs ask from us; My vote is on my most scummy, Barry has gone up a few points with his persistance with me. Yet demonhunter continues to try and pull a policy lynch on jilyanne. He was one of the ones leading the charge on her, and it wasted like 10 pages. Obvious scum-delay is obvious. Also, theres something just wrong with his posts, they come across very scummy, cant really explain it

just so the mod doesnt get confused;

UNVOTE:
VOTE: DemonHybrid

[hiplop]

sorry, i didnt even see the question second time, you asked for a claim at l-2

[hiplop]

DH is town, we are not voting him. I am 95% sure that DH-scum would have loved to tunnel a policy vote on me today for our disagreements from last game.

I want to see your case on him Bob. Also, yea Pine is V/LA, we don't want to vig him or even consider voting him til he gets back and can contribute. That is reckless play.

I have to agree with DH with regards to jilynne. If the point of voting someone for pressure is to actually elicit a response you don't just GIVE UP when they aren't responding. You continue to pressure them until they either respond or lynched as bad town/scum.

I'm more than willing to vote jilynne if she doesn't want to contribute.

vote jilynne1991

so because hes going after someone else, that makes him town?

I think we've found our scum team guys.. (dh and scumhunter)

[hiplop]

again, you have no case at all scumhunter. If you want to defend your buddy, at least provide some evidence

[hiplop]

Hey, uh, guys, in general, is it a better idea to post just your scum reads or post a read on everybody?

Definitely everyone.

[hiplop]

Scum reads alone don't really do anything

[hiplop]

Well, if you were to be scum; the only people who we would have connections between you, would be the people you mention as scum. That leaves a bunch of empty holes that arent helpful. I guess if you were town, itd be the same.

Just not enough Info/scum can continue to hide

[hiplop]

Here are my reads and my vote for day 1, as of now:

Hiplop

Noob scum/noob town. His reasoning and style of play is pretty offbeat and I can't really get an accurate read of him. I'll probably have to read his history to better understand but I think he might just be noob spelled all over; even so, I'll research what I can to glean something of his alignment.
While it seems like he wants to help, he has horrible reasoning and doesn't seem to have a great grasp of the game theory. No accurate read, really. He occassionally helps out in the questioning but just seems to just as often just get in the way.
Little other notes I can pick up is: he has horrible typing (meta) that improves when he defends/attacks well (could be a useful note to eyeball).
As of late, he reads pretty scummy giving me the impression of wanting to lynch immediately in post #341, where he stated
"atm im fine with lynching;
Barry
DK
Grallie".
See this as OMGUS from me, but the fact that he said it in that way looks kinda scummy to me.

Foilist

No accurate read as of yet. Not enough content.

archaebob

Strong town read. Like ace(?) mentioned earlier, there is a chance he could be playing a mindscrew WIFOM game with us and that he's actually a Mafia, but it's looking pretty low.

jilynne1991

Fucking terrible town player or a really noobie/good at lurking scum.
She strikes me as pretty scummy in it that she's really nervous, as seen in really trying to explain herself and why she was lurking and why nothing had happened in post 101; she gives us a really weak sort of response, her only really useful response in post 187; but that's it for content from Jily. Otherwise she has struck me as inattentive, lacking in any dedication and very nervous trying to keep her cool. She needs to post like HELL or be replaced.

Barry Allen

Personally, I don't have an accurate enough read of him but I'm getting a relatively townie vibe from him overall. He argued with Hiplop throughout page 14 (posts 325 to around 350), where he gave me a pretty passive and understanding tone rather than an offensive mafia. He didn't vote Hiplop until hiplop demonstrated some pretty funky logic. This deserves a read-over if he shows anymore mafia behavior but overall despite not giving off a strong townie vibe he DID give it off when he was arguing with Hiplop here. I'll leave him as a townie read leaning towards the null side.

NintendoAddict

He reads as a pretty noob town to me. He argues with Archaebob on the game theory a little bit but in general seems to grasp it enough to read decently. He posts some pretty faulty logic at times, in general his ability to reason appears to be somewhat limited to me, which COULD be read as a potential scumtell but it just reads noob to me. We can see some bad reasoning and also an example of his somewhat lacking game theory understanding in posts 239 and 250.
As for the cases against him, I've read them (hopefully) though I've forgot what they're about and he still seems newb town to me.

Heliman

He passes off to me as scummy because he's far too vocal. His play style is brash and rude and his case against Archaebob later in the game passes off as pretty scummy compared to what he said near the beginning if you view his posts in isolation. He's decisively null tell just because my gut reaction conflicts with his content, but with his intelligence I really don't think he'd be barking at Archaebob, especially after what he said to start with. I'm interested in this conflict, but there's no time to investigate this unfortunately.

Ace

Decisively town so far. He's done some good work so far but he also shot down the Jily case, which looks pretty bad on him. I think it was simply a mark of bad judgement rather than scumminess. The only odd thing I find is that he promised to give us an analysis of the Heliman vs. Archaebob argument, which never did pop up ever again if I'm not mistaken.

DemonHybrid

I get a town read from him. His content is good and he's helped the town. Not much more to say. His argument with Bob goes on theory but there's nothing from him to say he's scum, while there's a pretty strong read on him as town.
However, the fact that he's hesitant to join another wagon is of interest to me and should be noted.

Spadille

V/LA

Scumhunter

Null read. After being prodded to post he posted consistently and offered decent opinions but he's also proved he's relatively intelligent, meaning he could be either town or scum at this point. However, he does refuse to vote for someone he thinks is town, even if it's blatantly obvious it's not a lynch vote. Not sure what to make of this but that's all I can say.

Kay, that's my reads. long post...

lmao

[hiplop]

Graiie, explain where DH has ever been pro-town. Now. He hasnt done anything useful all game. Make sure to include evidence.

Where have i ever gotten in the way, too? I think my attack on archbob is townie enough, and it was pretty solid logic. I got him to pretty much confirm himself + a few others/get off the track. This town is really nit-picky and i get frustrated over that. (ie typing thing, get over it people)

you realize that me saying directly who i'm ok with lynching; is not scummy at all..right? If i were scum in this scenario it would limit my options to squirm around.

^^ Thats why your reads increased your scum-points, for me. You didn't decisively say

anything

, pretty much all of them except bob say "They could be scum or town". Paving an easy route for you to flip-flop your opinions

[hiplop]

i like to do these kind of things so; Early prediction for scum.
Graiee
Scumhunter
DH

Graiee, could you put a list of scum-town using just names? Just so we know who is more scum than others etc etc

[hiplop]

dh, graiie has the same faults as you just mentioned, explain in great detail your thoughts on her

[hiplop]

i know, i associate people with avatars/sigs, dont pay a lot of attention to names

[hiplop]

Did you just claim scum Dh?

[hiplop]

I had to double take at that statement. You should try reading sometime.

I'm proving that scum can active lurk while being pressured. It's what I think Jil is doing and it's why ace's case is bullshit.

hiplop, do you believe that I'm active lurking this game? Because I want to make sure that I'm hearing your bullshit correctly.

Yes, you have lots of posts, sure, yet none of them have content besides "JIL IS SCUMZROS, ILL KEEP SAYING THE SAME HNG OVER AND OVERZ". In the beginning you were going for the active player, but slowly you just turned into an active lurker.

[hiplop]

Hiplop, make a case against DemonHybrid before I say why the fucking hell he's town because you haven't even got a goddamn case against him, for god's sake. You're just voting him from what I see.

settle the fuck down. Ive explained why hes scum, you just ignore it

[hiplop]

alright,ill explain it to you. Look at the clear connection between scumhunter and demonhybrid. They're distantly defending eachother, and scumhunter is using some LOL defense about a policy lynch. Giitah, he hasnt handled pressure well at ALL, he continues to tunnel Jil, with no real case; all hes saying is that shes a lurker, and we all know that. Hes clinging to one person so that he doesnt have to squirm around as scum. Also, his blatant overexaggerations/practically worshipping Bob in earlygame is incresibly scummy.

[hiplop]

that claim is awful.

[hiplop]

no scum would ever fake claim to be your partner, that would be awful

[hiplop]

bob, what about Barry allens latest posts made you unvote?

[hiplop]

not at all, i never OMGUS'd him, nor did i do that to prove my independance. I voted DH because he wasnt playing right, acting as scum

[hiplop]

i'm so happy that you're ON the PLANE

[hiplop]

Pine, post your defense, now.

We're waiting on him, and he knows it. Which sucks ass

[hiplop]

id say that if he doesnt post it by tomorrow at noon, we lynch him

[hiplop]

he could be mafia RBer quite easily...

[hiplop]

he could be mafia RBer quite easily...

Here's a recently completed game I was in where there was a mafia RB and they claimed town RB.

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p3106933

Reply 814 he claims.

its quite common...

[hiplop]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: barry allen
I told you guys..

[hiplop]

Ace, whos the third? you missed a quote tag or something

[hiplop]

v/la tomorrow and maybe sunday, going camping

[hiplop]

VOTE: Barry Allen

[hiplop]

gonna assume mafias kill got blocked, and a vig of some sort killed DH.

[hiplop]

DH was rather suspect, and archaebob didnt die..

[hiplop]

Vig suspects DH -> DH dies... i dont understand your question i dont think

[hiplop]

^^ Flavour means nothing, ever

[hiplop]

Barry, so you visited arch, and only one person appeared?

That means either: scum Didn't target archbob or
We have a jailkeeper

[hiplop]

also possibility that you're not actually tracker.

[hiplop]

UNVOTE:

[hiplop]

VOTE: Nin

[hiplop]

Barry allen is the scum, Can't believe i didnt realize this.

I think you are confusing Tracker with Watcher.

A Tracker follows one person, seeing who they target, a Watcher stays with one person, seeing who targets them.[/vote]

Given the description of the night kill (saying the player was shot), I would also guess we either have a vig or a serial killer out there. That means we have a doc who protected us from a maf kill - and I do not want to risk outing a doc by revealing the full report. Here's what I will say:

The player I tracked last night visited Archebob.

We no longer have a roleblocker, and Archebob is still alive after being visited. That means that the player who targeted him is likely our Doc. The only other alternative I can think of is mafia roleblocker (if one is even in the game), but that would make no sense. A maf RB would have wanted to keep me from getting a report. That means I likely tracked the doc.

Tracker sees who someone targets, this post hes saying someone visited archaebob.

Scumslip costs you the game

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Barry


Archae, Sensor is VERY common fakeclaim offsite. Pretty much every community ive seen uses it a lot, that said i believe him

[hiplop]

Completely read that as "the person i tracked was archaebob"

[hiplop]

Bobby, do you think Barry should reveal who he tracked? Also, do you believe that there is ALSO a doctor in this game (which is what hes saying?) i think its bullshit. No way do we have a tracker and a doc plus all those other PR's. Like you said, it was already in our favour

[hiplop]

UNVOTE:

So its Giitah, Scumhunter or Heliman eh? I have been getting a scumread from the beginning on Giitah..

[hiplop]

Hmmm... Bob just might be scum

[hiplop]

with Barry Allen

[hiplop]

Warning: unrelated.


I just noticed, hiplop... you live about 60km away from me.

lmao where abouts do you live?

Yeah, Bob and Barry are scum together: case coming tomorrow

[hiplop]

Would be willing to bet Nintendoaddict is their 3rd one, not too sure on that tho

[hiplop]

lmao i just drove through there last saturday. Thats cool.

Well i sleep, i urge everyone to think about what i just said last post, Bob/Barry allen

[hiplop]

lmao i just drove through there last saturday. Thats cool.

Well i sleep, i urge everyone to think about what i just said last post, Bob/Barry allen

And you didn't stop for tea? Shame on you. =P

Tea isnt really my cup'o'tea

I'm almost wanting Barry to reveal who it is, bob really doesnt want him to.. odd

[hiplop]

I see your point. I had a situation drawn up in my mind, but yeah getting a little too tired to be posting in mafia probaly.

[hiplop]

@ Bob - OK, I won't start this post the way I've started my other ones. You are an idiot. If you succeed in getting me lynched, you will have to realize that you are certainly an idiot. You cannot "imagine a scenario" where I'm actually what I say I am? That simply means you won't let anything get past your preconceived notion and your tendency to jump first and ask questions

later

never. Your posts, as I said earlier, are becoming anti-town in their impact - you aren't even noticing hiplop's attempts to make you seem scum because you are too busy trying to lynch the tracker.

@ hiplop - you've jumped back and forth on me, and now you want to claim a bob/barry scumteam? I've very clearly stated my concerns about you already, and frankly I'm tired of dealing with you. I've stated my case during D1, and now you've added the back and forth jumps on me already this day phase without explaining your votes or your changes of mind. Now, you want to plant seeds of bob also being scum. I'm done with you.

UNVOTE

VOTE: hiplop

Did you even read my post? I said im going to type up a case in the morning.. going to start it now

[hiplop]

Pine - 7 (ace5993, Giitah, Scumhunter,

archaebob, Barry Allen

, Heliman, foilist13)

I believe Nintendo, which means there are two scum on this wagon. At this point in time im going to focus on the two right in the middle, Bob and Barry. Just note: Barry is super obv scum, im just trying to consider all scenarios for a buddy. Barry has essentially claimed scum by not going after Nintendo. Its true, its damn true.


Ok, so in the beginning of the day, I mention how weird it is that Bob is still alive, so I assumed the Mafia kill got blocked when attempting to kill Bob, and some sort of Vig killed DH. With Barry Allens tracker claim, this implies that there is a roleblocker, tracker, sensor, a mason team, and another PR (likely doctor, vig, cop etc) on the town’s side.

There’s no way we have THAT many power roles, and it sounds to me like Barry is covering Bob’s ass. Mafia would have tried to kill bob no matter what, he’s too strong of a player/pretty much everyone agrees that he is town. Much more dangerous than a Mason. That's why i thought a vig killed DH, because of how strong Bob is.

But since the Mafia killed DH, that makes it seem like Bob is mafia.

I highly doubt we have a killing role on our side, plus all of the others. The tracker result, even if Barry is town: DOESN'T PROVE ANYTHING, it just means that someone visited bob, That guy could have been the mafia godfather, easily....

Bob, I do believe you're town, because you were visited last night and somehow you are still alive. That says you were likely doc'd. That being said, I believe you should check the springs in your shoes, as they must be worn out from jumping to conclusions. We've lost too many roles at this point, and if you want to lynch me and watch another PR for the town go down you will only be entertaining the mafia. "There's no scenario that makes sense in which he isn't a scum tracker?" Are you kidding me? How about the scenario where I'm the tracker for the town? I do believe you are town, and in fact I have really good evidence of that fact, but the impact of your out-there posts is anti-town. Please take a chill pill and stop it.

Why do you keep bringing up how town bob is? It doesn’t sound natural at all, and sounds like you’re trying to give him town cred after your inevitable flip. Explain your “evidence” that makes bob town, now. Again, it sounds like you’re trying to protect bob by continuously bringing up how townie he is due to some unknown evidence

Barry shouldn't reveal who he tracked, because it won't help us

. He isn't lying about the fact that someone targeted me

, it's just definitely not scum, because he's a scum tracker himself.

That's why he's confirmed scum. There's no way he's faking this result, and that means he can't possibly be town. We do not have a roleblocker, a tracker, a sensor, a doctor, AND a mason team. Get the hell out of here.

What is much more likely is that we have a roleblocker, a sensor, a doctor, and a mason team, and that scum has a tracker to counterbalance that. Even that is a little unbalanced towards town, as you can see. It's obvious that Barry tracked whoever tried to protect me, and revealed his result today in a townish seeming way in order to keep playing to his fakeclaim. If you think about it, there's really no scenario that makes sense in which he isn't a scum tracker. Even if you don't believe the sensor claim, there is no way that Barry Allen is a town tracker.If you want to keep pretending to be town, you need to NOT reveal who tracked me today. I have no doubt you will find some excuse though.

This smells like a bus, Barry Allen could have easily “Tracked” the mafia. He only knows who that

one

person visited.

3) Barry Allen is a scum tracker - In this event, he probably tracked the doctor or something along those lines. He should NOT reveal who he tracked.

Then the only people who know who the lone power role is, would be scum. How is that helpful to the town in any way? You’re trying way too hard to hide this. I wouldn’t necessarily say that Barry should tell who it is, but your logic is very one sided towards the mafia. If he is scum, they already know the PR, but we don’t. That gives scum an advantage, and since that is what you think he is, why are you opposing him revealing his result? Sounds like you're wanting to keep that edge.

How do you know, that he isn't lying?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Barry Allen

Read list (from town -> Scum)
Hiplop
Ace
Foilist
Scumhunter
Nintendo
Heliman
Bob
Valern
Giitah
Little Grey


Barry Allen

As you can see, bob isn't a huge sus of mine, but no one else was willing to consider it, there is a high chance hes scum, but he feels too townie to be scum i guess.

Anyone else have any thoughts? i didnt go far back for quotes as i am busy, bu if you have anything to add, feel free to share

Hm, if there is a vig. I think they should out themselves, but only if they're a vig.

[hiplop]

@ hiplop -

Unless scum has daytalk, I don't see why the other scum players would know Barry's tracker result. Right now he's probably the only one with that information.

And STOP asking PRs to out themselves. There isn't a fucking vig, and if there was, he should be keeping his damn mouth shut.

scum would have daytalk in this game, i'd think. To balance out all the PRs.

[hiplop]

@foilist, i guess you're right, but I'm still guessing they have it, IDK

IF NOT!

@ hiplop -

Unless scum has daytalk, I don't see why the other scum players would know Barry's tracker result. Right now he's probably the only one with that information.

And STOP asking PRs to out themselves. There isn't a fucking vig, and if there was, he should be keeping his damn mouth shut.

They would know his result anyway, at night he probably would have said who he was tracking, and he revealed in thread who they visited.

If hes scumtracker, they know who the PR is, again

[hiplop]

I'm all for a massclaim.

[hiplop]

It depends if you're town or Scum, giitah.

[hiplop]

gah that blue text hurts my eyes. Going to read that wall now

[hiplop]

k, i read it. Barry, would you be willing to start a Bob wagon with me? I've pointed out why i think hes scum: and you/ace are just re-affirming that for me.

[hiplop]

ok this is getting difficult..

[hiplop]

@ Hiplop -

Just read my iso next to Barry Allen's wall.

1) Does your interpretation of my posts line up with his?
2) Do his interpretations make sense coming from someone who seemed pretty fucking convinced that I was town not too long ago?
3) Would town-BA be quoting all this random stuff from my iso that has nothing to do with my arguments against him?

If you answer no to all of these, then leave your vote where it is. I don't give a shit if you want to wagon me later, but right now the pressure needs to stick.

Ok, i see your point.

[hiplop]

(i did as you asked, i agree with you. keeping vote where it is)

[hiplop]

great job bob <3

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ace

[hiplop]

lmao, dont vote until you've read the entire thread, last 4 pages are the most important in the game

DH's death makes so much sense now. Them killing him to "confirm them"

[hiplop]

^^ no you're not. As you 'could' be lying. Quoting QT's are never allowed iirc

[hiplop]

how am i scum? please actually say why.

[hiplop]

was that a hammer?

[hiplop]

ya you have it right

[hiplop]

I dont like how scumhunter has vanished. Hes posting in other threads..

[hiplop]

ill hammer sometime tomorrow. Just letting you guys know.

[hiplop]

which means ace is the last one. hell yeah gg boys

VOTE: xvart

[hiplop]

EBWOP, actually it means Scumhunter or Ace is the last one. But due to yesterdays events, its ace

[hiplop]

Pine - 7 (ace5993, Giitah, Scumhunter,

archaebob

, Barry Allen, Heliman,

foilist13

) 2 scum
foil - 6 (ace5993,

archaebob

, xvart, Scumhunter, Barry Allen,

nintendoaddict1

) 2 scum
Never voted on a lynch: Valern, Hiplop

Nintendo, can you quickly explain to me how xvart is most definitely scum?

2 scum on pine. One of them is confirmed (foilist)
2 scum on Foil. But foil isn't on this obviously, which means the person to join the foil wagon is scum

Only one new person on the wagon from Pine -> foil, and thats xvart

[hiplop]

aka confirmed scum

[hiplop]

Okay, that was stretching it a lot in the wrong way. More like I didn't know what to say. >_> Perhaps I ought to read over what kind of bullshit my brain forms when it tries to reword nasty topics.

giitah be a good girl and vote the confirmed scum

[hiplop]

Nah, no way is there a doctor. Scum just went after arch probably underestimated tracker role

[hiplop]

+1 barry. Great post

Xvart, no need to even try. YOU'RE SCUM

[hiplop]

I doubt theres a 4 man mafia...

[hiplop]

VOTE: nintendo

Obvious scum.

[hiplop]

its gotta be ace/foilist/nintendo..

[hiplop]

hiplop
ace5993
Valern
Scumhunter
Giitah

I'm thinking valern or ace are the scum. I have been thinking badly of giitah all game tho. At this point; scumhunter isn't on my scumdar, and im not either obviously.

[hiplop]

we're doing it popcorn style, scumhunter pick someone to claim next.

[hiplop]

^ scummy post is scummy.

[hiplop]

Not something town would say. Worded in an odd way

[hiplop]

vt too

ace?

[hiplop]

Music camp would be fun

[hiplop]

there was only scum-foilist

[hiplop]

giitah is scum mebe

[hiplop]

do we have a mislynch or is this our last shot
?

[hiplop]

Giitah is my #1 suspect atm..

[hiplop]

I'm going to ISO her after i get off work. Somethings not sitting right.

[hiplop]

its gotta be ace/foilist/nintendo..

Post 961, why did you think Ace was so scummy?

A final thought on Ace, Ace could be scum if Foilist and Nintendo are intelligent enough to fuck with our heads, but I wouldn't think they'd be intelligent enough to plant that much information ahead of time unless... well, if Ace was scum that'd be some dangerous mindscrew so I guess it'd be a possibility.

Scumhunter still reads town to me after the reread.

Hiplop was too suspiciously certain of the xvart and an Ace lynches earlier for me to trust him. I don't sense a malicious intent but his disregard for the possibility that Nintendo was lying is suspicious to me.

Valern is a null-read, probably due to apathy rather than anything else.

Having said that, I want to cast my vote on Valern simply because to me at the moment he's the most expendable mislynch. While Hiplop is the worst player of the lot, his intentions read much more honestly than Valern and thus I'd rather kill him than anyone else.

VOTE:

Vote: Valern

I believed nintendo, but i also knew that if he was lying; we could easily gnab him the following day. I didnt need to say it, twas implied. Also iirc i was talking to barry allen about

[hiplop]

the whole bob/foilistmason thing, really had me suspicious of ACE, now i see it probably was a gambit, but the suspicion still stands in the back of my mind.

Not liking your quickvote. You had more to say about me in a poor light than Valern, yet you voted him, why?

[hiplop]

So you admit you know I'm a mislynch? Nice.

VOTE: Giitah

thats actually what i got from that post too.

Not ready to vote just yet, but pretty sure giitah is our scum

[hiplop]

the whole bob/foilistmason thing, really had me suspicious of ACE, now i see it probably was a gambit, but the suspicion still stands in the back of my mind.

Not liking your quickvote. You had more to say about me in a poor light than Valern, yet you voted him, why?

You're a bad player but I've only sensed town motivation from you. Valern, on the other hand, is much less focused and hasn't managed to convince me that he's Town, making him a much more viable mislynch than you.

And you call it a quickvote, but this is the final day of day 5, am I not right?

Also would like to say; im much better than you, and am generally accepted to be one of the better 11'ers. So you cant really pull the bad player card.

[hiplop]

why are you willing to lose a town player?

[hiplop]

imo we lynmch giitah today and if we're wrong; decide in Lylo

[hiplop]

Hiplop, we could go on with twisting my words all you like, this could take a while and it's only serving to irritate me.

I already said I'd rather lynch Valern than anyone else because he's the one who gives me the weakest vibes at this point and I don't trust him.

when have a ever twisted your words?

[hiplop]

making him a much more viable mislynch than you.

Strangely enough what bothered me about this wasn't you using the word "mislynch" as much as using the word "viable". At this stage, its more important to find scum then worry about what lynch is "viable". Scum are the ones thinking about what lynches they could and could not have possibly happen. If you are town, you only have to convince 2 other people to vote with you so its more important to question people and form solid opinions than to worry about gathering support necessarily

Stealing scumhunters post as its exactly what i would have typed just now.

[hiplop]

you're not even in this game...

[hiplop]

Welcome back, Ace, even though what you have to say isn't helpful to me in the slightest.

@Day 1 arguments
I found Pine to be scummy because he had a tendency to point his finger at anyone who so much as looked at him. I didn't have any legitimate argument against him, all I found was that what he said reeked of scum to me.

@#73
I was questioning Nintendo here because I felt there was definitely something off about how he said Foil ought to be vigged. I didn't find anything in his responses, so I dropped it after that.

@#85
My main suspect at that time was BA, and I focused on him instead of targeting Nintendo.

On what you have to say about page 40: I don't see how two fake power roles make another claim any more believable. In any case, I don't agree with your logic here.

Page 41 is me remembering that there was a scum motivation to keep BA alive + something else up with Foil's gambit that blew away my argument that BA had to be the last scum.

@#124
What?

@#126
My opnion on hiplop was stated a while ago, I don't agree with a lot of his actions but I find his motivations to be pro-town.

tl;dr, post by post analysis SUCKS for the reason that you're only going to find incriminating evidence because your finds will be influenced by outside opinions and your own feelings towards said persons' alignment. I'm town, not the last scum.

not a good post. Everyone has been online; which means Ace or giitah are scum, possibly both.

[hiplop]

hiplop, there is no way there would be 4 scum in this game given our power role set. There is 1 scum left almost for sure. Do you think valern is town then?

by POE. yeah valern is town for now

[hiplop]

hiplop, there is no way there would be 4 scum in this game given our power role set. There is 1 scum left almost for sure. Do you think valern is town then?

by POE. yeah valern is town for now

Doesn't work. There's one conclusion Valern missed, that would be that he's scum/I'm scum and that our partner is waiting for someone else to put a vote down so we can quicklynch.

Hiplop, what's so bad about it?

@Valern
You gotta be kidding me, right?

it was me that posted that, not valern.

You have no partner; thats the thing.

Just wasnt a townie post, read it as not sincere.

[hiplop]

VOTE: Valern

best lynch for today probably, will hammer giitah before deadline if needed, though.

[hiplop]

quickhammering again sh Tisk tisk!!

eh its fine; both are prime candidates for lynching anyway

[hiplop]

no idea why im alive in all honesty, probably set up of some sort.

Pretty sure its giitah still...

[hiplop]

ace was pretty much unani town too, and so was scumhunter; why did you pick me out of the bunch giitah?

[hiplop]

ace was pretty much unani town too, and so was scumhunter; why did you pick me out of the bunch giitah?

There was still a shred of doubt, of the two, you were the one who was considered unanimously by the town to be town.
Going to analyze voting patterns and see what I can find.

not really, SH had just as much town defense on him; scum only have one kill, they chose to kill SH over me i guess

Looking back at ace; the only scummy thing i see is the foilist thing; and i dont think that warrants scum tbh

[hiplop]

@hiplop - During the entire foilist debacle why were you voting me instead of foilist?

i misunderstood it, i think. It seemed like you were the one at fault, instead of foilist. Also i thnik i thought you both were scum, and you were just more likely. Still gives me a bad feeling tbh

[hiplop]

Guys???

[hiplop]

ok, yeah its giitah. Latest post was your last strike; if ace is scum; he deserves the victory for a game well played, but i dont think thats the case.

VOTE: giitah

[hiplop]

DAMN.

[hiplop]

feel stupid ha

[hiplop]

@Hiplop
What was it that was so scummy about me? S:

pretty much every post by you read as having scummy intentions to me