Mafia 71: The Corsican Syndicate - Game over!

[WomensRights]

##vote: 50

Because I feel like it.

[WomensRights]

Too many votes for 50. That's just mean ya'll.

Protip: Ignore everything Alasdair says.

##unvote: 50

[WomensRights]

Waar, truth or dare?

50 so help me god don't start that shit.

[WomensRights]

Waar, truth or dare?

50 so help me god don't start that shit.

start what?...

Truth or dare. He knows better.

[WomensRights]

##vote womens rights

Only scum are afraid of truth or dare!

I'm not afraid of truth or dare, I just think it's really really stupid and game breaking. Don't make me come down there!

[WomensRights]

Hey guys, I want to join the Earth crew, what do you think? WR? is my idol. I guess I better get a litte more serious.

You picked a poor idol. But I'll forgive you this one time.

[WomensRights]

I make a good idol pick me as your idol

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

You're not in this game. Shoo.

Yeah, well, I'm new and not on IRC, so you don't have much to base off of, but I like being nice. I like WR?'s playstyle and I like earth so there.

Awwww. I wanna give you a big ol' hug. But seriously, go pester Khris Kruel or someone who's actually, you know, won a game once or twice. I am not that person. But <3 anyways.

[WomensRights]

Let's get this game hopping.

##vote: Tarhalindur

I don't know who you are so I'll make my introduction. Hello!

[WomensRights]

Waar that's just silliness right there. That would rely on the assumption that Alasdair isn't scum, and Alasdair is always scum. Lynching him on the first day (assuming Sandwolf or Harder isn't playing) is a move that can't go wrong. If he's not scum he's the cop, but since he hasn't claimed cop yet we can go ahead and assume he's scum safely. In fact....

##unvote: Whoever I was voting for
##vote: Alasdair

[WomensRights]

Women do not exist on the interwebs. Lynch all liars.

Vote: WomensRights

Yeah okay Mr. "I'll kill off a talkative player because I don't know her playstyle and let Wolves drag on and on and on."

[WomensRights]

May we have a vote count please?

[WomensRights]

I'm pretty sure that taking someone halfway to lynch on a dubious scumtell while not giving himself a chance to explain what's going on is far, far more scummy than CKD questioning the jokevote.

Serious vote!

##unvote: Alasdair
##vote: Lazy

You didn't even provide an explanation as to your vote. It looked like you just hopped on the first bandwagon picking up some steam. And I won't buy an excuse of "But I didn't know how many he had " because there's no way that you didn't notice waar and 50's votes directly above yours. Even if you missed Tar's, that would've put CKD at at least 3 votes with yours being the 4th which is, again, an awful lot to tack on to someone without even giving themselves a chance to explain what they meant or defend themselves against the accusations.

[WomensRights]

Just playing around.

We're hardly out of jokevoting and I've never done blatant bandwagoning yet, so now was a good time to try it out.

I fully expected to be called for it and now it happened.

Joking around or not bringing someone halfway to lynch is still quite scummy in my opinion. Also absolutely nothing in your post even hinted that you were joking about it because you didn't post anything at all.

[WomensRights]

Well, you're entitled to think so and that's probably what I'd do as well in your situation.

However, I would know better than that if I were scum. It's ever so easy to hide in a game where lurkers are a plenty, so why would I choose to do something as risky and obvious as bandwagoning without a reason?

WIFOM and "too scummy to be scum", I know, but I WAS only fooling around, you know

Are you seriously trying to make your only defense a WIFOM defense? Oh good lord. I wish I had two votes Mister.

[WomensRights]

While yes, several of us are from another site and play mafia together on a more or less frequent basis, I do have to say that I'm surprised that we would be accused of talking together outside of the thread. Just because we know each other from another site doesn't mean that we don't know the rules of mafia and we all know that talking outside the thread is clearly forbidden. I think it's rather silly to instantly assume that we're all cheating. And yes, we are used to faster paced games.

That being said though, I do think it's ridiculous to call out any lurkers at this point. The thread's been open for, what, 12 hours or so? Less than that? I know that you guys on MS are used to slower days so I doubt we can even think about calling out lurkers at this point.

[WomensRights]

Nah, town's pretty good. Depends on who's scum though.

Waar stop correcting people on their grammar and punctuation. It's a nitpicky thing, and as far as I'm concerned only scum nitpick. This place doesn't have rules on it, we're not on SA, so let it go.

Also, your unvote concerns me. You've been arguing with him back and forth for 2 pages now, but now you unvote? Why's that? You think he's the scummiest, you'd like him lynched right? So why would you unvote him because the bandwagon is picking up steam?

[WomensRights]

It's true I think it's the scummiest. I would still have my vote on him if he wasn't so close to getting lynched though. Just because I think he's the scummiest doesn't mean I'm 100% sure he is scum. Nobody is ever 100% sure somebody is scum, not even cops. That's why I want more discussion before a lynch occurs so that on the chance that curiouskarmadog flips town this day wouldn't have been a waste.

Frankly I'm surprised I had to explain this to you.

It just seems awfully interesting that you unvoted after griping at him and watching the bandwagon pick up steam. But okay.

I still think Lazy is the scummiest. I'm watching you though. Always watching you...

[WomensRights]

Dammit, I screwed up snipping the quotes. Pretend that it says

Waar wrote:

[WomensRights]

You were also way too defensive of the non-accusation by Cicero. He never said anyone was talking about the game outside of the thread; to paraphrase, he was simply suggesting that you all who know each other from SA have advanced meta knowledge of each other, just like those of us who play here do of CKD. You'll notice the CKD bandwagon is primarily composed of the newer players and probably others who don't know his playstyle.

To be fair I have good reason to be defensive. The last thing I want is for you guys to think that we're invading your board just to fuck with your game and not play this thing through properly. We came here on a field trip to see how it's done on your end and I promise you no one (except maybe Alasdair because god knows what goes through his head) is here to mess with the rules.

But let's look at who voted for CKD: Battle Mage, Tarhalindur, Lazy, 50 pounds of bread, Waar, Saint Freak, mcpoddjfojfdl

4 of those are from SA. 3 are from this board. Now, I know that the SA players aren't new, not sure about the folks from your team. Although I do freely admit that probably none of us know anyone's playstyle from here.

I sense distancing. I think starting a BW on Wmnrts is the right move; Waar, in addition to being scummy, is demonstrating that he will be the Village Pompous Idiot so he can be counted on to expose himself further, later.

You're silly. How can there be "distancing" when it's not like waar and I were "Yeah buddy let's get him!" and then we started pulling apart with the so called "forced" arguing. I thought he was nitpicking. I thought his unvote looked weird. I called him out on both.

[WomensRights]

Do you know how the term distancing is used (here)? Its when 2 scum fight in the thread to look like they couldn't possibly be allies.

This wagon on CKD looks like it was prearranged, not necessarily on CKD but on 1st available target. Waar job is to push the wagon and pick on the wagonee. WR's job is to pick out someone else who then piles into the appealing wagon (Lazy) and call him out. Later fight ensues between the schemers Waar and WR.

You really are being silly right here. A) We're not allowed to talk during the day, at all, so waar and I would have to be pretty damn organized to start something like that. B) I maintain that Lazy's vote on CKD was an excuse to take advantage of a bandwagon and send the first person he could sailing. C) I felt that waar's unvoting looked scummy because it seemed to me like he was bailing on a bandwagon that he knew might turn up as town.

[WomensRights]

@ WR: How do you feel about the following:

(1) Everyone who has piled on the CKD wagon since Lazy's vote?

It's very concerning to me, though now I feel that the tide is turning to someone who has actually been acting suspicious. I personally never found CKD to be all that scummy...he did overreact slightly but it wasn't really worth 5 votes, let alone the, what, 6 he got up to? 7? More?

Although to be fair, the people who piled on after Lazy's vote came while CKD and waar were arguing over the semantics behing the word "over-react" and the two of them going back and forth on the same issues again and again. It seems to me that whenever that happens people seem to vote on one or the other party due to wanting the argument to just be over with.

(2) Battle mage's unvote?

I don't think BM intended his vote to be piled on to like that and I think he unvoted to try to put a stop to the bandwagon. Seems to have worked. We'll see what happens.

And Aimee...hell yeah let's show these stinky boys how it's done.

[WomensRights]

Hmm, WR, that's one explanation about the unvote. The other is that she didn't want to be on the lynch.

Entirely possible. I just saw the play between CKD and BM as more of a revenge vote for a previous game or something like that, not as anything seriously intended to get a bandwagon going on an actual vote.

Of course I could be terribly wrong and BM is trying to bail from what she suspects to be a townie lynch so as not to incriminate herself. I have the worst scumdar known to mankind. But I'm just not getting much of a vibe from either CKD or BM.

[WomensRights]

I enjoy the faster pace; I got started in Mafia in 48-hour-deadline games, so the speed isn't that new to me. I think it'll be much better for us once we get out of the random phase of things.

I'm pretty sure we ARE out of the random phase of things.

[WomensRights]

Quick question for you guys, as I'm sure that this will be helpful come end game and will prevent us from having to go "On post 348 on page blah blah," how do you link to an individual's post? It will help with quick reference if this game goes up to like a billion pages and will keep us from having to go dig and dig and dig.

[WomensRights]

Unvote: CKD

The joke's overdue, I was just too scared to take the vote away right after the pressure from Womensrights.

Wait a second.

My pressure was on you because of the vote. So you decided to keep the vote on because of the pressure? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

[WomensRights]

Taking the vote off right after you brought it up would've just made it look like the vote was actually made with scummy intentions in the first place.

But the sole reason I was suspicious of you was because of the vote. If you would have taken it off right away it would've knocked a lot of the wind out of my sails.

Good lord. Now I'm definitely not unvoting you.

[WomensRights]

You going all emo on us isn't going to make us feel sorry for you Lazy. The fact is that you unvoting immediately after I unvoted you would not have looked scummy. In fact, if your vote really had been a joke and not an opportunistic bandwagon latch on, I can't fathom a reason why you wouldn't have immediately unvoted after I called you on it.

If you can explain to me why unvoting after you got called on it would have looked scummier than waiting an entire day to unvote, I'm willing to listen.

[WomensRights]

Lazy you're Armco right? You've got the same avatar at least.

I've got no experience with him in games really, except for one that we're both in on SA, so I can't say whether or not he's one of the players that seems perpetually scummy. Haven't played enough to get a bead on him.

[WomensRights]

Yeah, seriously SF. We're out of the joke vote stage, he made some legitimate points, and your only defense is "lol vote 4 u 2!" If I was so sure that Lazy was scum I'd slap a vote on you so faaaast....

[WomensRights]

CKD, I'll explain to you why people keep on thinking that you over-reacted.

No, your first post here:

now that just hurts BM...

I placed a second vote on Lazy...you place the second vote on me...you say I am bandwagoning...

I say you are (fill in the blank), the circle begins a new?

are we going to start bumping heads again?

wasn't an over-reaction. However, your subsequent posts are a litany of "Why am I over reacting? Explain it to me. Why why why why why?" It's all you've been doing this entire thread. Sort the thread to only show your posts, hit "ctrl+F," and do a hunt for the words "over react." It's coming across to me as less you wanting to know what caused it and more of you desperate to know what your scum tell was so you can argue with it ad nauseum. When fully half of this thread has accused you of an over reaction and your only defense is "Why," that says that it's less something that you said right and everyone mis-interpreted and more of you jumping up and down with your hands in the air saying "Look at how little I"m reacting I'm totally not over reacting TELL ME WHAT I DID" while everyone is picking up on it.

There is but a handful of posts in your whole history this game that are actually commenting on the game, all of the others are you leaping down the throat of anyone who mentions your name. I find that scummy, personally, because I find that scum generally sit back on their laurels and wait for either a) an opportune chance to vote ala Lazy or b) someone to call out their name. They don't want people to tie them to a theory or comment, they don't want someone to tie them to anything at all, so they just sit back until they're called on.

That is why people are accusing you of over reacting. Not because of what you originally said. But because of how you've acted this entire thread.

[WomensRights]

Before this day is totally lost in shit flinging by Wind and CKD, I would still like Saint Freak to come back and explain why his only response to whoever voted for him (I'm too lazy to look up who it was okay? <:x> ) was a simple OMGUS vote.

[WomensRights]

Charges, charges. I can't be bothered to navigate back through this thread. Sum them up for me, unless they equate to "omg he's having fun guys get him', which I suspect they still do.

Well, basically, ChronX said this, and I"m quoting it for you because you're a massive lazy ass:

OK, the pressure on lazy has gotten us some feedback from him, and at this point in the early going I don't want to keep the spotlight on someone for too long; this should be a target rich environment and we will all remember Lazy's play if he messes up again. If he's scum, he probably will do something else worthy of our attention.

Meanwhile, :

UNVOTE

Aimee has posted once, and did a poor job of making use of facts.

reFoS Aimee

for following up a bad post with lurking

There are a number of people who haven't posted since Thursday or early Friday, but I don't want to slap a lurker tag there since I will have weekends where I can't post much or at all myself (see sig). However, Saint Freak's absence since Thursday is remarkable because:

Someone sum up the case against CKD in like, 4 bullet points. I don't have time to read all of this.

Wanting someone else to make the case, often a scum tell.

Eh, a two bullet pointer is hardly worth my vote, but waar must be town as per T/D so I suppose I should follow him.

Unvote: WomensRights
Vote: CKD

Then piles into the CKD wagon with this post, despite saying its hardly worth his vote.

Then "lurks in the open" with three "silly" posts, one of which is a misquote of CKD inside a quote box (uncool), a silly metagame observation, and the truth or dare nonsense (uncool).

Enough to see some votes accumulate on him and get his attention.

VOTE: Saint Freak

And your response was "OMGUS" and then you voted for him while not, you know, saying anything

[WomensRights]

SF is new to this site but not new to mafia. We play it all the time on something awful, where wind, myself, SF, and a good many others in this thread come from...we're on a field trip .

Also FoS is really silly at this point in the game because (unless you're voting for SF or Lazy or CKD or someone else who's near lynch at this point which I don't know because we haven't had a vote count HEM HEM MOD) one vote is not going to make a difference on Day 1. Or Day 2. Or any day that isn't LYLO.

[WomensRights]

Far be it from me to defend Skitzer who I've certainly had sharp words with in the recent past in another game... but I barely understood your logic there. FOS isn't silly here, at least not in my somewhat limited experience (I'm no guru, just a reasonably quick study). It's just a good shorthand way of pointing out who people suspect and is used at all sorts of stages. Maybe you do it differently over at SA but it isn't "silly" here. That having been said Skitzer is pretty new to the game and, by his own admission, has a lot to learn and I anticipate may get admonished for lots of things. But that particular criticism was not necessary I don't think.

I think you mean "just vote someone". But I don't think it's your place to demand that. Peroonally I'll be voting when I'm good and ready and I don't like people trying to control the town's play that way.

I've gotten in to this argument on SA with people before, but at this stage in the game I do find the FoS to be silly. It's 1 vote. It's not going to hurt anyone. If you find someone suspicious, put a vote on them to put some pressure on them so that they take you seriously. An FoS is basically useless right now.

It's also a way for scum to say "Oh yeah I kind of suspect this person" without leaving a vote trail that leads back to them. Townies shouldn't be afraid of their votes. Scum hold on to theirs like precious jewels and dole them out after careful consideration because they don't want anything coming back to them.

[WomensRights]

Great - your opinion is noted. And I understand your point. But I'm going to ignore it now though. Mostly because of your unnecessary use of the inflammatory word "silly". We usually bold our FOS's here. You can track em just fine with the drop down menu below. If you think such FOS's in and of themselves offer a scum trail then you should positive this theory of yours later on when you can trap someone with it. Not early on so you can warn your scumbuddies. so a minor

FOS: Women's Rights [/b} to you. See how that works?

How is the word "silly" inflammatory?

[WomensRights]

I don't know what to make of that last post by SF. It's like he decided to heft the mantle of Alasdair on to his shoulders and wear it proudly...why a game needs an Alasdair in the first place I don't know.

I refuse to continue discussing the silly comment. Let's everyone unbunch their panties and get back to the game.

I still feel that Lazy is the scummiest player so far and will keep my vote where it is.

[WomensRights]

As probably the most qualified psychologist in this thread (not certified or licensed but dammit I do have a degree!) I can safely say that we will all lead unfulfilled lives.

And back to the game!

[WomensRights]

Well hello KilGrey.

Your previous player was indeed so scummy that I'm going to keep my vote on you as well.

[WomensRights]

Et tu, WR?

Don't think I've forgiven you for Harry Potter yet Missy!

[WomensRights]

Wow. Well, I know who I'm voting for in day two...

Any special reason why or is it just OMGUS?

[WomensRights]

There's a difference between "I don't think you'll do anything useful" and "I think you'll actively try to hurt the town". He's making his judgement based on how useful I am, not on how dangerous I am, and that sort of thinking only helps the scum who appear to be helpful but are working against the town.

Although given the responses, perhaps I should have said "I haven't found anything worth talking about since I cast my vote; everything important happened before that, everything since seems to have been childish banter about how boards are different and if suggesting a jester is scummy or not."

I don't think that was his post at all. He said:

There are 18 pages of this game, which is a lot of a day one, and you can't find ANYTHING? This sticks me as a different version of "I'm so confused right now." It's a n excuse for not posting anything, and not encouraging for anything coming from you in the near future. Thanks for checking in.

Now I'm not seeing anything in there that says you're useless. What it says, really, is that you've been sitting back and sitting back and not saying anything and between your last post way back on Monday and your post today you can't find a single thing that stands out to you? Really? To me that says that either a) You've found your scumbuddies under suspicion and don't want to add to it or b) You don't want to be tied to anyone. And you know who doesn't want to be tied to anyone? Scum.

So you know what?

##unvote: Lazy/KilGrey
##vote: Peers

You trying to strawman his argument in to saying that he wanted to claim that you were useless to the town and that's why you were going to vote for him tomorrow is ridiculous. And you were called on it so you had to scramble for some crap reasoning.

Joking around and having fun is fine and good and all that, but when it comes to calling someone scummy or saying you're going to vote for them it's best to have some reasons behind it.

[WomensRights]

There's a difference between "I don't think you'll do anything useful" and "I think you'll actively try to hurt the town". He's making his judgement based on how useful I am, not on how dangerous I am, and that sort of thinking only helps the scum who appear to be helpful but are working against the town.

Although given the responses, perhaps I should have said "I haven't found anything worth talking about since I cast my vote; everything important happened before that, everything since seems to have been childish banter about how boards are different and if suggesting a jester is scummy or not."

I don't think that was his post at all. He said:

There are 18 pages of this game, which is a lot of a day one, and you can't find ANYTHING? This sticks me as a different version of "I'm so confused right now." It's a n excuse for not posting anything, and not encouraging for anything coming from you in the near future. Thanks for checking in.

That's how the top part SHOULD read. Pretend it does that. Also pretend that I'm not retarded with the tags here on this board if you don't mind.

[WomensRights]

KilGrey after reading through your case on Tar I have to say that he had completely slipped under my radar until you said something about it. But when you lay out all of his posts like that, it does look pretty damning.

I'd like to hear his defense on the accusations before I make a decision on it though.

[WomensRights]

Well...Garnasha...and I'll explain this slowly for you...but because this game is closed set up a mass role claim does absolutely no good. There might be 5 scum and 14 town. There might be 4 scum and 15 town. There might be 2 cops. THere might be no cops. There might be 8 doctors and 5 vigs and 3 SKs but guess what? We don't know. There is absolutely no way for us to tell if someone is lying or not. The scum could all claim vanilla townies - are you going to know the difference between an actual vanilla and a fake one?

So basically:
Pros for mass roleclaim: Nothing
Cons against mass roleclaim: Everything

Why would you even suggest that? Why? What possible pro-town motivation could you have?

[WomensRights]

Keep up with that awesome defense dude.

[WomensRights]

no offence, but this post is the biggest heap of faeces EVA!

Really? Ever? Out of anything that's ever been posted, this is the biggest heap of shit huh? Wow, rah me!

So Peers, if you're not going to really mount a defense against yourself for your utter lack of content and odd voting choices, can you at least tell us who you personally consider to be scummy and why?

[WomensRights]

Excellent write up there Peers. WIth that, I will cheerfully

##unvote: Peers

. My main point against you was the absolute lack of content you'd posted. That has clearly been remedied.

And now Tar's here. And his defense is...nothing? Seriously, you're not even going to try? Okay dude.

##vote: Tarhilindur

[WomensRights]

ABR's desperate attempts to deflect conversation away from Tar only makes me want to lynch tar even more.

[WomensRights]

ABR's desperate attempts to deflect conversation away from Tar only makes me want to lynch tar even more.

Refusal to defend yourself is

not a scum-tell

within this context. Tarhalindur is the towniest person of the game, if anything.

And what's the context?

KilGrey: Tar, why haven't you posted any real content, why are you hopping on bandwagons?
Tar: I refuse to defend myself and only want to help the town.

I'm sorry that's pretty god damn scummy to me.

[WomensRights]

I know that. But why shouldn't they? You just misread.

Because a lack of defense is totally a town move

[WomensRights]

Is there, say, anything that they've done to make you particularly suspicious skitzer, or are you just posting random names?

[WomensRights]

Why are you so scared to put down a vote Skitzer?

[WomensRights]

Maybe with how this group tends to jump all over people for barely-scummy behavior, he's worried about guessing wrong and voting for someone that makes everyone else jump on him?

Boy it's a good thing that we're not playing a game where every thing we type out is heavily analyzed.









Oh wait...

[WomensRights]

Albert...I must say...you're being exceptionally

silly

.

Can we just lynch Tar now so we can get on with day 2?

[WomensRights]

Well at least he made you look stupid before he dies.

[WomensRights]

Well at least he made you look stupid before he dies.

I can look stupider than that, do you want to die for me too ?

Oh I really don't think it's possible for you to look any stupider honey.

[WomensRights]

Chron I can honestly tell you that everyone from SA has acted the exact same on mafiascum as they do on SA.