Mini 1091 Mafia Mania -- Game Over
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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I agree the moose stuff isnt great. But I am prepared to give him a it of a chance, I think we should give him the wriggle room to hang himself if he is scum.For now.
Hiraki however,
Hiraki agrees someone looks scummy, moans at somebody elses play then votes for a third person (randomly presumably) with no reason provided. This and some strange stuff about town reads and activity he earns my vote.
vote hiraki-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Not really a chainsaw, I though moose was a fair bit scummy, I had nothing to add to it particularly and it seemed to have a bit of support or so.
Meanwhile I also thought it strange that Hiraki mentioned he was scummy, also mentioned someone else then voted for a random. Voting for someone you think is scummy for weak reasons is much better than random votes and it felt really off.
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I must be misunderstanding this, it sounds to me that you are admitting to being scum and damning atleast one of the other two as scum too. Surely I am reading this wrong?And this is scummy, why? Did you honestly believe that I could vote one of the people in my post based off of that information, fully knowing that they would most probably be scum?
Did I think it was scummy, yes. Because voting for those people would have been worth more than a vote for a random. Also you avoided creating a wagon with some real pressure in exchange for a random meaningless vote. Atleast when I avoided the wagon (rightly or wrongly) I exchanged it for a real case and a real point.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Because pressure on scummy players to determine their allignment is such a bad thing. /sarcasm
Not really good enough hiraki. A random vote is useless, you cant have an RVS just because you fancy it.
Not only that but despite accepting that a random vote was not appropriate you do not move your vote.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Hiraki, you go from moose being only slightly scummy and pressure being a bad thing. To shamelessly bandwagonning moose in a sentence or two.
Hiraki we never had an RVS, that is why I am scolding you for a random vote.
If you disagree with me (and most other people) over pressure atleast explain why. And the page we are on matters not.
For the record all, moose is always like this, so be careful I am not trying to slow the wagon just making sure people are aware of the meta.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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If I get you to help town it will have been constructive. I am doing you a favour here moose. Just try and find scum. PLease do it for yourself. Gain an IQ point or two and actually try and find scum. PLeas pleas please please.
Or you will get vigged in every game that has a vig from now until eternity. Do you want to be the fool who always gets lynched or vigged?
Go and find us scum.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Hiraki, please dont bold in my quotes, it is impossible to answer them in kind.
But in order:
"really" yes really, so now answer properly.
"Why should I care about your random vote" because you had two slight scum reads at the time, and the game was kicking into gear.
"pressure doesnt work" as I said if you insist on this discussion explain why rather than just asserting your belief on us.
"meta blah blah" so you agree with me on the meta but it is invalid because???
Guys read this and then tell me why we are not wagonning this guy, it is awful. You cannot give two scum reads, however small, then vote randomly. And proffes utter bemusement at being called out on it.miyaki wrote:I need to know why voting Mariyta was scummier than voting someone who I talked.
Lets be clear you didnt we all know that, whether it is scummy or not is a matter of opinion.You find me worthy of suspicion due to having Town-Tells?
Also miyaki stop trying to goad everyone into theory discussion, re pressure, RVS, FOS and no doubt others. It is really anti town.
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Beefster surely if anything I was overattacking? How can I be overdefensive in attacking someone?
Fail accusation.
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True.Moose200x, so far you have mostly been talking about yourself. Try to focus more on scumhunting and less on surviving.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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No he isnt, I am outward looking you are inward looking.moose200x wrote:
Why are you giving me such attention when boberz is doing the same stuff?AntB wrote:@Moose are you actually going to add something other than steaming piles of BS to this game?
My approach is different (in early day 1 stage) but I can justify and reason it. You have not despite us giving you time and chance to do it. Therefore my style is different from yours.
But you have to see that claiming scum, sarcastically or not deserves punishment. Surely.
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I have my last submission tomorrow, so I should post tomorrow.
Then VLA over the weekend. Sorry all.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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How so? is overattacking a scumtell for me now. In fact you have seen my meta so you know it is not.Beefster wrote:
Fail defense. You make a decent point, yet you kinda missed my point and ended up digging yourself into a hole.boberz wrote:Beefster surely if anything I was overattacking? How can I be overdefensive in attacking someone?
Fail accusation.
Anyhting else to add beefster, your points have been a little shallow so far. (It neednt have to be about me I just mean in general.)-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Is a valid argument anyway. And if you remember correctly I wasnt a newbie in that game. But I am not trying to make a massive meta defence, just accusation is utter bollocks defece.Not really a valid argument. (not to mention it was a newbie game, and stuff could've changed since then)
He was, but why would town (however idiotic) ever make that joke. especially when he is feeling so victimised and such already. That was rather my point. (I know you werent talking to me but I am replying anyway.Also, I felt that moose was fairly clearly being sarcastic when he made the "I am scum" comment.
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@Beefster, why is information "nervewracking"? Seems a strange word to pick.
No town reads for more reasons than the shopping list that is just one. We are looking for scum not town. We influence other people's town reads undermining town working together by majority rather than power. And the shopping list is relevant because PRs will not want to look too town which is a stupid situation town should not be creating. (any more on this take it to MD. But do not post town reads here)
I genuinely dont understand this. I have the game to lose, but so does everyone of every allignment. I am confused. The way I reacted to votes was a dismissive but angry. As always. The thicker the accusation the more I kick off. Hence my fuse getting ever shorter with your senselessness.beefster wrote:You have something to lose, don't you?
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Substrike, why are you calling for moose to be lynched now when you werent earlier. I am fairly certain you have said it but I missed it.
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Is anyone buying this bollocks. How can he have accused me of being over defensive to an attack he made when he attacked me for overdefensiveness before I (alledgedly) overdefended myself to his attack? (I should be on Yes Minister)You were overdefensive in claiming that you were overattacking rather than overdefending.
On a serious note the site needs to lose this 'over-defensiveness' stuff. There is no such thing.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Nobody can hide, and if you think I tunnelled you are so mistaken. Have you actually read the thread?moose200x wrote:Boberz- I am not mad your tunneling me becuase i feel like a victim. I am mad because you are allowing scum to bandwagon and hide on an easy mislynch. Scum will just say "lol he acted scummy lol" and that's that. You are letting scum off easy by tunneling me.
In other news... why are you still talking about yourself?-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Hiraki's still scum, too tired to explain.
Your iso post 3 and 4.hiraki(if only it had been like this wrote:where did I do this bolding stuff inside boberz' quote ocmpletely confusing people so they wrongly think boberz is contradicting himself..
You are also clearly no reading as I said this earlier
---boberz wrote:Hiraki, please dont bold in my quotes, it is impossible to answer them in kind.
Work with this for a sec. Explain why trying to look protown is scummy.boberz seems to be trying to look pro-town instead of being protown.
The fact you dont understand how trying to look protown is necessary for protown players explains why you always get wagonned.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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reread it, it say what it was meant to say I missed one close bracket admittedly, and forgot to accredit the final quote to moose but apart from that the stuff at you is still at you.Boberz, I have absolutely no clue what you're saying.
Ie you caused massive confusion by bolding your own words in my posts. I asked you not to do it. You then claim no knowledge of having done it, and apparently have no knowledge of my response to it. So I concluded that you had not been reading.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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I can completely believe you do normally bold inside quotes, but I am suggesting you should never do it. Because it causes confusion such like it did in this game, even after you had stopped doing it. But tbh I dont really care any more, it is not in any way scummy. I am nearly done my essay then I can go to bed. I cant wait.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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This is reffering to moose. Why is this so, surely at most you know he is capable of doing this as town. Have you seen him failing to do similar things as scum?Ant wrote:After I looked at his past games, I don't think he is scum.
(Who else has played with moose? I have.)
For the record, I am neither convinced Hiraki's answers regarding the random vote he made after giving suspicions are suitable, nor do I believe he believes them either.
Mistake rather than misrep. However you did rather avoid the point. You failed to adequately respond to my attack.hiraki wrote:Considering there was no question, and it was a bland statement on my play, that is quite the misrepresentation...
But it is and was from the very moment several picked up on it.hiraki wrote:But that's not the point.
I did no such thing. I didnt even stop attacking him.hiraki wrote:It is invalid because clearing someone of being town by meta is horrible.
hiraki wrote:is absolutely nothing about FoS in this thread that I have said.
THis was the theory element of what you said. Hiraki made more than one reference to FOSs in iso post 4.hiraki wrote:FoS' are worthless in any case
Exactly, that is not theory. Going into when RVS should end in a broad way as you did is not game relevant.hiraki wrote:You're the one who disputed my random vote to be scummy.
The thread has proved that to be absolute crap. It is evident that both of you have felt pressured, admittedly you dealt with it infinitely better than moose.hirakir wrote:It doesn't really work that well.
I found it hilarious. You cant afford to get annoyed with people so if you feel they are losing control, acting off emotion or trolling then you know you are winning the argument.hiraki wrote:I doubt that was Bob's reaction though.
Not really he could call it a lynch without adding mislynch to it. Considering how loose moose has been with claiming scum elsewhere I see little reason why he should feel the need to be allignment specific here. It just felt awkward I think.hiraki wrote:Moose would need to call it a mislynch if he knew he was town, no?
I love how this was the first thing you picked up upon.lateralus wrote:Post #22 (Hiraki): What??? If you believe in that why would you vote for some random person instead? Why would you vote in all when in our last game you were so adamant against doing so early on?
Just found this thanks to lateralus. lolmariyta wrote:boberz is overreacting
As I said in the post I genuinely thought the place my vote was at was the right place for me to be applying pressure as well. I felt the moose wagon was getting credit (rigthly so) only later did I join it myself.lateralus wrote:If you think moose should have more votes why aren't you voting him?
I agree, I like your entry later.later wrote:Who does {LordChronos; Mariyta; LordChronos; Dekes} think is scum and why. Seriously… who the hell are you guys.
Why? What was it about the hiraki case that didnt take off, I have been pushing it hard but nobody seemed to like the look of it. The lack of wagon here makes me even moire suspicious of hiraki.Hiraki feels weird but gonna hold off for now
Nothing wrong, but it is becomming the sole focus. we need more than one line of enquiry at a time. This will allow us to involve more people and havea more broad undertanding of people's positions on a variety of people. I am more talking to people not actively pushing moose atm.mr wright wrote:Boberz, can you explain why we would need a 'distraction'? What's wrong with discussing Moose200x's behaviour?
I dont really accept the idea of 'tells' in the traditional sense but this in context I saw as very scummy. I saw no town motivation and it felt out of place and wrong.Mr Wright wrote:Boberz, can you explain why we would need a 'distraction'? What's wrong with discussing Moose200x's behaviour?
What was scummy about it, I dont like people who adopt popular views without justifying them. IGMEOYLord Chronos wrote:for his response to boberz answer to Beefster's vote.
I am not an avid user of meta. But this is a fallacy; the whole point of meta is that it helps you find what they do unconciously. A player breaking meta is affecting all his other games both now and in future, they are unlikely to do this for the sake of confusing you on one issue in one game. How many times have you done something in one game purely to shape your meta, not many is my bet.substrike wrote:People can manipulate their playstyles knowing their meta will be looked at.
What is the point in this statement? I asked you for something to add, not a sob story about some bastard mod.beefster wrote:I'm working on getting focus. I'm in theme and bastard games right now, so I'm trying to get back into the serious mafia mood. It's also a bit nervewracking when 2+ pages appear overnight- as an argument between 3 players. (Although I've seen much worse...)
Your talking about yourself again moose! Naughty boy.moose wrote:So substrike- Just to clarify right now. Do you think I am scum or do you think I am just anti-town?
I am not tunnelling you, that is abundantly clear to everybody. And you are still talking about yourself. Are you that selfobsessed.moose wrote:Boberz- I am not mad your tunneling me becuase i feel like a victim. I am mad because you are allowing scum to bandwagon and hide on an easy mislynch. Scum will just say "lol he acted scummy lol" and that's that. You are letting scum off easy by tunneling me.
We hear you, we just think it is scummy and bollocks. Because it implies random votes are better than reasoned votes. It implies random wagons have more value than real wagons. It implies you are scared to be held to account for your views. We understand your point we just think it is bollocks.hiraki wrote:First off, I explained it quite clearly in the post. Call it it an FoS if you want. I was not ready to vote either of the two suspects, therefore, I voted randomly.
At this point you expose severe newbishness. Atleast we know your town reads were crap and sharing them is fine by me.Hiraki wrote:First off, I explained it quite clearly in the post. Call it it an FoS if you want. I was not ready to vote either of the two suspects, therefore, I voted randomly.
This feels weak. Explain what has changed between calling for him to be wagonned and calling for him to be lynched.substrike wrote:2. I'm calling for his lynch now, because before I just wanted pressure. Now he's in lynch territory. In terms of what turned me, I wasn't 100% sure with that first /confirm post. He's assumed an extremely poor position since then and it's time to get some rope.
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I am beginning to sense this moose stuff is all a bit too easy.
unvote
vote hirakiI am not happy that the wagon picked up nobody without many real dissentors. Too few people were delaying a decision on it and stuff. (watch them delay again or suddenly get town reads now scared I caught connections)-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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- Posts: 1858
- Joined: November 15, 2009
- Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, England
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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What? Not the post directly above the one that yo wrote?. Beefster, you fail.Beefster wrote:
Actually it was in regards to his vote on Hiraki on the first page. To be honest, I haven't really read pages 2 and 3.Ant_to_the_max wrote:Wait! Just quickly checking in right now, but Beefster, are you saying Boberz was overdefensive due to his chainsaw defense on Moose's wagon?-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Misrep! I asked him what he meant for clarification saying that how it read to me couldnt be right!! I gave him the benefit of the doubt.Boberz totally overreacted to Hiraki's initial post. "It sounds to me that you are admitting to being scum and damning at least one of the other two as scum too" from #29 is a massive stretch and one of the scummiest comments I've seen so far. However, the entire boberz/Hiraki argument is meh. I don't really see either as very scummy and the volleying wall posts are irritating.
Learn to love wall posts. But one of mine was a catchup post.
Also Hiraki is scum. When/if I am dead remember this please.
Also-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Can I ask you to sum up your main bif of case (contradictions particularly) with a couple of quotes and such like please.
I am not a massive fan of PBPAs without exlanation afterwards.
But I like your entry. Of course you are scum unfortuanately. (I am going to post tonight or tomorrow morning, my time)-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Hiraki's beginning of day1 stuff is absolutely ludicrous. And I would turn to mariyta next for that original madness.
Calling this partnership even more when for no reason maryita turns on me.
Hiraki was also a clear newb incase anyone did not notice this I should point out.
Hiraki didnt believe his own theories. (If he did, I am not playing mafia with him again, but he didnt)
He was also goading theory discussion, but I have now moved this to more of a null tell.
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Beefster has still not adequately answered why he felt information was nervewracking?
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Moose is a selfish self centred self serving bugger, who I shall never play with again and imo should be replaced. Let's not lynch him today.
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AntB "perform a scumhunt". Scumpoints. Major ones.
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Maryita pops in now and again talks about some very old stuff then goes away again. Not happy at all.
And the misrep (as yet unanswered) of course.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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In conclusion. Town this game have been utter crap.
It is obvious from how the wagons sped up that moose is not scum. Too many people wanted him off for policy or near policy reasons. I still think a vig should hit him if only to teach him a lesson.
Hiraki is obv scum. He was one of only two valid wagons at one point and nobody joined the wagon. Obv scum. Whether or not you liked the case, it really is obvious.
Maryta is probably hiraki's partner. He is also a terribad player. Need to see a hiraki flip first.
Beefster could be third, if not AntB.
unvote vote hiraki's replacement
Guys you really need to run with this.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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The case was one of only two competing ones for a sizeable amount of time. If town were not moving in atleast one scum would have. If all scum were on Moose then it means the whole of town was paralysed and somehow prepared to keep random votes on.
Loads of people sat on the fence on hiraki. People refused to show reads on him. Nobody defended him (other than miyrita which I have already gone into) nobody offered anything.
Aside all the scummy stuff he has done the fact this wagon had nothing, when several people found various things bad is in itself bad.
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If moose is a townalligned killing role and he kills me because of some kind of vendetta (even though I am actively pushing against his lynch) then he is playing against wincon and will be punished by the mod I imagine.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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Somehow Mariyta thinks I have tunnelvision when I just made a post criticising atleast four people. Did I call you a guy again, apologies if so. My point is that when you do pop in you comment on old things, if you have limited access then atleast be useful when you do turn up.
Well there was a question mark, and when it wasnt answered I didnt follow through. IN fact it took three seperate questions from atleast two different people before an answer was found. So you are wrong.It came across as a veiled accusation.
Moos is just a fool and should replace out.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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We cannot confirm moose's vigness.
He could be third party.
He could be scum and kill that person (me).
Scum could kill that person/nokill to do that.
He could be just a townie chatting crap forcing us to nolynch.
We should take advantage of our numbers towards the end of the game when we can take advantage of that with more information.
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Do not leave moose alive for this reason, we are lynching today. I think werewolf, but if not it should be moose.
Wake up and use your heads. If nolynching day 1 was the thing to do with even numbers then the whole site would be doing it, they are not.
If we do this I replace out.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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boberz Mafia Scum
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This moose alive to test him idea, wont work. He could be an anti town killing role, he could be a pro town killing role who breaks his promises (i have seen this before), he could be anything testing him will get us nowhere. I will prbably now move to a mosse lynch rather than a beefy lynch, just no quite getting the beefy stuff.-
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boberz Mafia Scum
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