MKM II GAME OVER

[AceMarksman]

vote: Empking

having two useless players is two too many. Lets cut them down.

[AceMarksman]

No, zwet is the other one.

[AceMarksman]

Shinnen is obvtown

[AceMarksman]

Unvote Vote: Zwetschenwasser

Because this game needs to go somewhere.

[AceMarksman]

zwet, every time you post, something inside of me dies.

I'm just kidding.

[AceMarksman]

Wow, that made me laugh so damn hard.

[AceMarksman]

What will that do, do you think?

[AceMarksman]

I totally missed that.

Unvote, Vote: populartajo

[AceMarksman]

massclaim is a bad idea, and based on MKMI, helps scum.

[AceMarksman]

I NEVER said it was a good idea. Im evaluating it right now and waiting for everybody's opinions on this.
Why do you think it helps scum?

1)I never said you said it was a good idea, I just said it was a bad one.
2)It did/would have in MKMI

[AceMarksman]

EBWOP, to be added to the end of 2):

...and I have no reason to doubt that law wouldn't make it help scum this time.

[AceMarksman]

I feel the suggestion of a massclaim a move that is most likely to come from a scum-aligned entity.

[AceMarksman]

Yes, but you seem to have a sufficient knowledge of the first mushroom kingdom mafia game, no? It would stand to reason, then, that you would know that a massclaim would more likely than not tip the scales in the scum's favor.

[AceMarksman]

I am not fixated in the idea that you are scum. Not by a longshot. No, you have only exhibited one thing that I would attribute to scum. Being so early in the game, that makes you the scummiest atm, but this is subject to change.


How do you know this game does not have a similar clause?

[AceMarksman]

No, I think we can have it. This is very much a bastard mod setup.

[AceMarksman]

I figured with the discussion at hand my vote didn't need all that much explanation as tajo himself said it was benifitial to scum in MKMI and that the rules said it was a bad idea. Aparently, I still needed to spell it out for tajo. Do you not see tajo's action as scummy?

[AceMarksman]

No, I think we can have it. This is very much a bastard mod setup.

lol what?

I PM'd law a buch of questions that would have been able to be answered in a non-bastard mod setup, and the majority of them were answered "maybe." Thus, I inferred a bastard mod setup.

[AceMarksman]

EBWOP add to the end: therefore, I see the potential for a clause (hidden or not) to prevent a massclaim.
`

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-populartajo (5): Cream147, Gorrad, AceMarksman, qwints, ortolan
-Empking (2): Shinnen_no_Me, zwetschenwasser
-zwetschenwasser (2): populartajo, pacman281292
-Shinnen_no_Me (2): Empking, Riceballtail
-Dubya (1): Shadow Knight
-AceMarksman (1): caf19

Not voting (4): killa seven, Surye, Moratorium, Dubya

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

I know what might help us: do you think claiming the number of votes your vote counts for is a bad idea?

[AceMarksman]

Massclaim proposition is scummy=WIFOM case and tunnel visioning by Ace

Unvote; Vote: AceMarksman

1) Massclaim? Have you checked your eyes recently? I've been thouroughly against that since page one.
2)Tunnel visioning? I have stated that the case against tajo is far from insurmountable, and I am fully open to finding other things that are scummy.

[AceMarksman]

Surye- I was just wondering about the town's feelings towards a vote claim, which is very different from a role-claim, right?

[AceMarksman]

tajo: because rule 13 is very specific warning us not to, and it was a bad idea in MKMI.

Surye: Oh yeah, I didn't think that number of votes would be indicative of role importance.

[AceMarksman]

Um, someone would claim mario because?

And to answer, no, I wouldn't.

[AceMarksman]

Shinnen, why is that?

[AceMarksman]

Yes, but why does that question make tajo look scummy? I agree that the question is a stupid one, but stupid=/=scummy all the time.

[AceMarksman]

Bowser's army isn't an informed minority.

Unvote, Vote:zwet

That looks like a MAJOR scumslip right there.

[AceMarksman]

1)look at the flavor, the mushroom kingdom is invading bowser's castle
2)bowsers army doesn't know who is who, therefore they are the uninformed majority.
3)I assume that the mushroom kingdom is the informed minority.

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-zwetschenwasser (5): populartajo, pacman281292, Empking, AceMarksman, Shinnen_no_Me
-populartajo (3): Gorrad, qwints, ortolan
-AceMarksman (2): caf19, zwetschenwasser
-Shinnen_no_Me (1): Riceballtail
-Dubya (1): Shadow Knight

Not voting (5): killa seven, Surye, Moratorium, Dubya, Cream147

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

^the above does not help you, by the way.

[AceMarksman]

Um, no? Isn't it fairly obvious that bowser's army isn't the informed minority because [blank]

Mod, can we talk about our role PM?

I will fill in [blank] once the mod answers. I don't wanna be modkilled in such a fun game.

[AceMarksman]

Yes, and now I see why you would consider anyone who figured it out to be scum, you were preconditioned to think that we were traitors. I didn't have this experiance (and honestly, I forgot that my role name was associated with bowser's army ) so I just saw that I was not in an informed minority and assumed town.

[AceMarksman]

I wasn't using that as an excuse for a reason that I didn't know my role was bowsers army (as it says that in the PM), but I didn't realize it until after my initial glance at the PM where I was only trying to infer alignment (I usually skip flavor/pictures until afterwords, it helps with situations such as this).

[AceMarksman]

More clarification: the mario game I spend most of my time on is Galaxy, and my role has an older baddie in it which doesn't get much facetime in Galaxy I'm afraid.

[AceMarksman]

aparently, though, most townies did not misunderstand their role PM. Assumptions like this are known to the state of california to lead to mislynches, confusion, infertility and cancer.

[AceMarksman]

Empking, that's a horrible basis for a vote.

anywho, continuing this:

Um, no? Isn't it fairly obvious that bowser's army isn't the informed minority because [blank]

[blank]= there weren't any other player names in your role PM.

[AceMarksman]

OK, tajo has gotten his town points back, while Shaddow Knight has gained scum points.

Still, my vote stands on zwet, as his seemingly sincere shock seems likely to come from a thrid party.

[AceMarksman]

EBWOP: posted the above when I was at the bottom of page seven, which I thought was the last page, so it sounds rather non-sequitur Whups.

[AceMarksman]

Wait a second.
We have items that only Bowser's Army know how they work.
Can we massively confirm people with this?

No, because there are some roles, like mine, that aren't allowed to buy items.

[AceMarksman]

Item questioning seems like a good tactic currently, if we can think up enough questions to make it work. Even if we do end up with a few players claiming not to have been given knowledge of the items, we can just separate them off first and then question everyone else. It's probably not enough to nail scum on its own but it'll give us info.

It'll definately give us a good confirmed townies pool, and make catching scum easier.

[AceMarksman]

pacman, your b) is the only legit reason for not item claiming. Is there an item that won't ruin the game for us (and to answer caf, because I can't buy items, I don't know what they do either)

[AceMarksman]

Not characters that can't buy items.

[AceMarksman]

Oh, and why is that, empking?

[AceMarksman]

Do power roles have different items?

[AceMarksman]

How was that rolefishing? I honestly don't know because I CAN'T BUY ITEMS. I figured law might've told the people that can buy items *shrug*

[AceMarksman]

Oh yeah, didn't think about that.

[AceMarksman]

I would actually assume the opposite Shinnen because, and this delves heavily into WIFOM, that law would have given items to less powerful roles to even the playing field. I am guessing that every role is just as powerful as the next in this game.

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-zwetschenwasser (4): populartajo, pacman281292, AceMarksman, Shinnen_no_Me
-Shinnen_no_Me (2): Riceballtail, Surye
-Empking (1): zwetschenwasser
-populartajo (1): ortolan
-AceMarksman (1): Shadow Knight
-Gorrad (1): Empking
-killa seven (1): qwints

Not voting (6): killa seven, Moratorium, Dubya, Cream147, Gorrad, caf19

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

Wait, emp, didn't you claim?

[AceMarksman]

tajo, I'm not really feeling your case on ort, it doesn't feel all that strong. Maybe it's just that I have a hard time reading him?

Also, happy birthday Surye

[AceMarksman]

Hm, I just forgot something, what do you think the effect of the "ready to jump in" players will be? What can we assume about them? Has anyone played with a mechanic such as this before?

[AceMarksman]

Where in the world did that come from, zwet?

[AceMarksman]

Everybody seems to be active except for Dubya. I pmed the first person on the replacement list.

This answer your question?

[AceMarksman]

Wait, what?

[AceMarksman]

Haven't heard of Law or the first person on our list?

[AceMarksman]

Mod: what is your status on replacing Dubya

and if anyone cracks any Obama jokes, I will slap them

?

[AceMarksman]

Hello thar Weyouns and semioldguy.

[AceMarksman]

o.O I don't actually remember.

Unvote

let me go back and re-read.

[AceMarksman]

I've been reading through some of tajo's most recent games and I've noticed in War in Heaven II where tajo had some plan that involved a massclaim that got him lynched. He was town.

[AceMarksman]

The relatively small number of people objecting to the item claiming plan makes me wonder if it consists entirely of scum.

^this. I agree 100%

[AceMarksman]

actually, I agree 80%, because I don't know if an item claim will give scum too much information *shrug*

[AceMarksman]

Unvote, vote: zwet

you voted tajo based on surye's... defense of him?

[AceMarksman]

Oh, wait *facepalm*

unvote

I'm an idiot.

[AceMarksman]

He's mad.

pot...kettle.

[AceMarksman]

Vote: Zwet

Throwing dirt around hoping it will stick.

[AceMarksman]

aye sir, I do, I'm currently in a twelve step program.

Although 3, 4, and 5 were accidental/I didn't remember. I also remember why I voted zwet in the first place, so that's where my vote lies.

[AceMarksman]

This game is starting to suffer from a lack of activity . Cream, Rice, and WLC, come back and take part, will ya?

[AceMarksman]

zwet, stop being so opportunistic, it's scummy.

[AceMarksman]

I'd propose lynching one of the claimed no-buyers to see if they're all gambiting scum or real power roles. Empking would work nicely for this.

Unvote; Vote: Empking

This is very opportunistic.

[AceMarksman]

I actually like pop tajo's plan, but we need to make sure there isn't any scum hiding in the upper list. We need a way to quiz every single person on that list without revealing anything to the scum.

Law: would tajo's letter naming plan get a modkill?

I might have to say I think there are more scum in the "don't have item descriptions" list than in the "refusing to" list. So, I propose we
1)figure out a way (that won't get us modkilled or reveal information) to test the "have item description" people. Lynch those who fail unless law out thought us somehow.
2)lynch the scummiest player from the "does not have item descriptions" list.
3)lynch the scummiest player from the "refuses" list.

opinions?

[AceMarksman]

EBWOP: this plan is secondary to a lynch of a player who is likely or obvscum.

[AceMarksman]

But first we need to confirm if we can trust enough people in the "I have items description" list

This is why step 1 is there.

[AceMarksman]

Oh. Reading the mod's posts, I should be doing it. So, what could we do to confirm people on the have item description list? Are there some specifics in the item lists that we can tell scum without giving them information?

[AceMarksman]

I forgot while waiting for this dude to gather tons of information for the scum to make kill lists from because he had a great plan to

help

produce scum.

Telling if you have item descriptions in your role PM is not indicative of role power, it only tells us if your character has arms or not :/. I think it's fair to believe that all roles are equally powerful in this game, so this list isn't scummy. Your recent behavior, however, has been.

FoS: Shadow Knight

[AceMarksman]

I'd be ready to answer/ask the first question if i need to be.

You have no item descriptions, right? The questions should be asked between those with item descriptions, with everyone confirming the legitamacy of the answer before the next is asked.

[AceMarksman]

I do have item descriptions, why don't you think I do?

Ok, you are neutral.

because tajo said that. His neutral list is those who don't have item descriptions, so I just assumed you didn't.

I think each player who is in the has items list should submit a question to be answered, and each question is randomly assigned to a player. This will catch scum twice, once by submitting a stupid or unrelated question, and the second by them answering a question wrong. Thoughts?

[AceMarksman]

shadow knight, you're currently voting me, why?

[AceMarksman]

Because who does info in the open benefit? The scum.

That's why we're taking precautions to not give scum any information.

I'm gonna be bitter until you bag a scum. If your plan gets us ahead or wins us the game, I'll eat crow and sing your praises.

I don't like this sentance, it sounds like giving an excuse to bus.

[AceMarksman]

Wait, I thought poptajo put people with no item descriptions under the neutral banner? I'm so confused.

[AceMarksman]

I think everyone with item descriptions needs a question. Sorry, I'm just paranoid like that.

Should answer choice be random?

[AceMarksman]

EBWOP: "Should answer

order

be random?"

[AceMarksman]

But I find several of these people scummy regardless, so this group is, to me, collateral damage.

Please take Zwets off your list as well Tajo. I think he needs a question eventually. No, I don't think what he said so far necessarily confirms him at all. Mora should be taken off too I think.

After everyone else answers questions, I'd like Tajo to be asked and answer a question too. No one should float by. Him confirming/denying correct answers doesn't necessarily prove him because he could be the only scum on that list, if so and knowing that he is, he could deduce that everyone's answers were correct without actually knowing the answers himself.

I agree with this post.

[AceMarksman]

ort, that was way OMGUS. You get this regardless of whether or not I agree with SK's logic

FoS: ortolan

[AceMarksman]

I've noticed something about your play, ort. In all the other games i've seen you in, your posts are very long and post large and well thought-out cases. Here, you're lurking and not making an effort to make a case. I find this suspicious.

[AceMarksman]

How about if anyone comments about the correctness/incorrectness of an answer, we lynch their ass on the spot? That'll make sure no one talks.

[AceMarksman]

You should be commending me for voting a scumbag and joining the wagon, not bringing in a shallow and incorrect meta argument.

1) This is laden with AtE
2) Your vote was OMGUS.
3) The meta argument is valid.

unvote, Vote: ortolan

Vote above will remain until tajo's plan catches us some scum, which, I'm feeling, will probably include ortolan.

[AceMarksman]

Dude get with the times, my plan already

catched

caught

ortolan

Fixed for my sanity.

How did the plan catch ort?

[AceMarksman]

I think we should at least go through those with item descriptions today, then we can lynch at will.

[AceMarksman]

so, who's turn is it for answering a question now?

[AceMarksman]

I agree, number 1 gives too much information.

[AceMarksman]

semioldguy come on down! You're the next contestant on

the price is right

the chopping block!

The above does not imply that I am suspicious of semioldguy, just fyi

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-ortolan (3): populartajo, Shadow Knight, AceMarksman
-Shinnen_no_Me (2): Riceballtail, Surye
-Shadow Knight (2): Moratorium, ortolan
-Gorrad (1): Empking
-zwetschenwasser (1): Shinnen_no_Me
-Empking (1): zwetschenwasser
-killa seven (1): qwints
-Cream147 (1): semioldguy

Not voting (5): killa seven, WeyounsLastClone, Cream147, Gorrad, caf19

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

tajo, I think we just got another interesting reaction. Yeah, mhmm

FoS: semioldguy

[AceMarksman]

Actually,

unfos

I can see where semi is coming from this, though I don't know how to interpret it. I want to see the answer to semi's question before I reaply a fos or anything.

[AceMarksman]

unvote

waiting on Surye.

What's our next step?

I think our next step should be killing off the non-list player who has been drawing the most suspicion. If I'm not mistaken, that person is ortolan, right?

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-ortolan (3): populartajo, Shadow Knight, AceMarksman
-Shinnen_no_Me (2): Riceballtail, Surye
-Shadow Knight (2): Moratorium, ortolan
--populartajo (1): zwetschenwasser
-Gorrad (1): Empking
-zwetschenwasser (1): Shinnen_no_Me

Not voting (7): killa seven, WeyounsLastClone, Cream147, Gorrad, caf19, semioldguy, qwints

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

ZEEnon and looker, why are you stalking me?

[AceMarksman]

zwet and ort are both scum, with a side of either SK or semioldguy.

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-ortolan (4): populartajo, Shadow Knight, AceMarksman, zwetschenwasser
-Shinnen_no_Me (2): Riceballtail, ZEEnon
-Shadow Knight (3): Moratorium, ortolan, Looker
-Gorrad (1): Empking

Not voting (7): killa seven, WeyounsLastClone, Cream147, Gorrad, caf19, semioldguy, qwints

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch. Deadline: May 4th 2009.

[AceMarksman]

Because I think you're scum.

No, no.

Give me a reason.

Now.

^this

[AceMarksman]

zwet and ort are both scum, with a side of either SK or semioldguy.

Why you think oldugy is scum?

this.

The tone of his most recent posts, although, going back and reading him in isolation, he included information in his posts that I think only an army player would know. Gah, I wish I had items

[AceMarksman]

have we asked emp a question yet?

[AceMarksman]

You, for example.

This is why zwet as a policy lynch is a good idea.

[AceMarksman]

You are going to send me a letter tonight with the value of "x" where "x" is the times the bomb can be passed without triggering. Everyone agrees with this?

How

exactly

are you talking at night?

[AceMarksman]

I did, I don't get items at all, so it wasn't there. Reading the rules is tech, I guess.

[AceMarksman]

nope. I know what NONE of the items do, though I imagine that the ten coin block gives you ten coins? That's what it does in the game at least. I also guess that the letter allows you to talk to someone?

[AceMarksman]

SK- why do you ask? I think answering too much helps scum more than town.

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-Shadow Knight (5): Moratorium, ortolan, Looker, qwints, semioldguy
-ortolan (3): AceMarksman, zwetschenwasser, Gorrad
-Looker (2): caf19, populartajo

Not voting (7): killa seven, WeyounsLastClone, Cream147, ZEEnon, Riceballtail, Empking, Shadow Knight

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch. Deadline: May 4th 2009.

[AceMarksman]

unvote, vote: SK

Players without item descriptions can't use items either.

[AceMarksman]

SK isn't town. Bowser's Castle players w/o item description can't use items, even if they are given to them.

[AceMarksman]

My role stresses that I become a normal goomba once my bubble is broken. I assume that means I gain the ability to buy items.

What is the reason your role gives specifically for not being able to buy items?

[AceMarksman]

Through my communicating with Law, I know that I *may* get a new PM when I become a normal goomba but he didn't guarantee it. I *may* be able to spend my coin on something at that point. I *may* have more coins at that point. It *may* have something to do with floating around in a bubble. Are you catching a theme here?

Yeah, I asked him a bunch of questions too, and I got maybe's for almost every one of them.

Law is a bastard mod

[AceMarksman]

Kay, Ive decided that ShadowKnight shouldnt be lynched today.

Please more Looker votes.

We can do it.

I completely disagree. SK should by lynched today

[AceMarksman]

I don't like this steadfast defense of SK by tajo.

FoS: populartajo

Seems like scum buddying to me.

[AceMarksman]

yes, but with all the information circulating about the non-item roles, a fakeclaim would be possible. Besides, his fakeclaim is

wrong

.

[AceMarksman]

That's L-2 in visible votes.

[AceMarksman]

Mod: prod Riceballtail

[AceMarksman]

My role stresses that I become a normal goomba once my bubble is broken. I assume that means I gain the ability to buy items.

What is the reason your role gives specifically for not being able to buy items?

This needs to be answered. If ANYONE other than SK answers it, they are obvscum.

[AceMarksman]

You just unvoted the most suspicious person here.

[AceMarksman]

My role stresses that I become a normal goomba once my bubble is broken. I assume that means I gain the ability to buy items.

What is the reason your role gives specifically for not being able to buy items?

This needs to be answered. If ANYONE other than SK answers it, they are obvscum.

Also I don't see why a role which can't buy items would need to be having coins. Goombas don't have hands/arms as far as I've ever known, so whether he is in a bubble or not I don't see how he is holding on to that coin from a flavor standpoint.

TOLD YOU

NOT

TO ADDRESS THIS QUESTION UNLESS YOU ARE

SK. YOU JUST JUMPED UP

SEVERELY

ON MY SCUM METER. You do realize that my question COULD HAVE CONFIRMED SK AS SCUM, but you RUINED IT. *fume* way to go, ZEEnon.

[AceMarksman]

Sorry, I was a little pissed that ZEEnon ruined a perfectly good chance to catch scum.

[AceMarksman]

I meant semioldguy, I'm

really

sorry ZEEnon for blowing up at you when you didn't even write that post.

So: DAMMIT SEMIOLDGUY *twitch*

[AceMarksman]

why can't you?

[AceMarksman]

I wouldn't doubt it.

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-Shadow Knight (6): Moratorium, ortolan, qwints, semioldguy, WeyounsLastClone, zwetschenwasser
-ortolan (2): AceMarksman, Gorrad
-Looker (2): caf19, populartajo

Not voting (7): killa seven, Cream147, ZEEnon, Riceballtail, Empking, Shadow Knight, Looker

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch. Deadline: May 4th 2009.

[AceMarksman]

Ace, your PM sayd that you cant use items or that you cant buy item, or both?

Ace, please answer this.

Sorry, didn't see it. My PM says that I can't buy items, but I can be given them and I can give them to other players. It says nothing about usage.

[AceMarksman]

But qwint's "Bah, go mushroom kingdom" suggests he was, infact, a part of the mushroom kingdom. This is all very odd. I would also like to point your attention to this:

-mnowax, Toad (

Mushroom Kingdom

), killed Night 4 (page 107), won the game
-Natirasha, Toad (

Mushroom Kingdom

), killed Night 4 (page 107), won the game
-skitzer, Parakoopa (

Bowser's Army

), killed Night 4 (page 107), won the game

how did this happen?

[AceMarksman]

Oh. lol, that would make sense.

[AceMarksman]

FoS: gorrad

While normally discussing NKs is scummy, here it's helping the town understand this game. I don't know why you're trying to dissuade us from this.

[AceMarksman]

Vote: Gorrad

I think that's a fine place to have my vote at the moment.

[AceMarksman]

zwet, all your posts today (ESPECIALLY 935) are stupid and baseless. Think before posting, please.

[AceMarksman]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... highlight=
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... highlight=

The first one had Seraphim-scum lynched, the second had UROE-scum lynched. Both cases started with nightkill commentary, and in both games the scumminess of nightkill-commentary was brought up by yours truely. What does speculation gain? Nothing. What can it lose? An outted doctor.

As I've said before, NK discussion in this game is HELPFUL.

[AceMarksman]

We're using it to learn about the setup and to help confirm some townies/refute some confirmed townies from tajo's plan.

[AceMarksman]

You do realize that every player in this game that has spoken today has talked about the NK, right? I find it hard to fathom that there are that many scum in one game. Your trend, it fails.

[AceMarksman]

I was about to mention it had he not.

Also, what tajo said. This game doesn't use standard roles.

[AceMarksman]

looker yes, ort maybe, gorrad maybe. I forgot about this:

This is the same fallacy Looker used to vote for Shadow Knight

Thanks for reminding me. I knew there was a reason I thought of for why looker should die.

Unvote: Gorrad.
Vote: looker
FoS: Gorrad

[AceMarksman]

Actually,

Unvote

. I've got to remember, that's just looker's playstyle. I'm going to go back and re-read ort.

[AceMarksman]

_________________________

1. Anti-Bowser player died.
2. The player qwints died.
_________________________

I would have commented on the night events
regardless of whether or not that other guy did or not.

I mean seriously, I didn't even know qwints was in the game.
Who would choose to kill him is the question . .
_________________________

Maybe someone just decided to vidge the lurker?

[AceMarksman]

either he's scum and yay 1 less scum, or he's town and yay 1 less zwetschenwasser.

This is so going in my signature. QFT, btw.

[AceMarksman]

don't have long to post today, I'm just going to pop in and say kast's suggestion that there was no night 0 and therefore no conversation between scum is rubbing me the wrong way. There is normally pre-game chatter between scum, regardless of whether or not there is a Night 0.

[AceMarksman]

Kast: I have no idea :/. It's really perplexing.

[AceMarksman]

-Do you have any other suggestions to explain Yoshi knowing the BA items but Toad not knowing them?

Kast: I have no idea :/. It's really perplexing.

Since Ace has no idea I'll chip in my thought on it. My thought was that it might not be that Toad didn't know anything about the items, that in actuality he did know, but that all the scum wouldn't all want to jump onto the same list.

The thing about this is that how would the scum have forseen tajo's plan with enough accuracy to say "don't all of us claim that we know what the BA items do." Is there an explanation you can see for this? I can think of one, but I'm holding off for now.

[AceMarksman]

I think it's safe to say that your plan tajo, while sound D1, is fairly out the window at this point.

The problems with us at the moment:
1) lurkers, lurkers, lurkers, and lurkers
2) Last night was screwy and blew tajo's plan out of the water
3) the jump in mechanic is an unknown.

While we can't do much about 2 and 3 at the moment (unles sir gets back *coughcomebacknoworI'llvoteyoucough*), we can resolve one.

[AceMarksman]

He was very eager to describe the previous Wario role to me. It seemed too eager, in fact.

Unvote, vote: zwet

Even in your normal play your cases aren't

that

contrived.

[AceMarksman]

I'm not liking sirdanilot at all right now.

[AceMarksman]

Thank you, mora.
@sir: It doesn't seem like you're reading as fast as you can, and you're drawing conclusions from the first 1/4 of the game.

[AceMarksman]

Mod, note my sig. I'll try to post some, but I'll be rather inundated

[AceMarksman]

If I weren't already voting for zwet, I would now. He pretty much copied and pasted that from the supermario wiki page on buzzy beetles here. If you look at your PM, you will see the stark differences. Also, note where he says that he "thinks" that protects him from nightkills. I know at least that in my role PM, it specifically outlines what immunities I do and do not have.

[AceMarksman]

FoS: riceballtail

Actual contributions please (like responding to the post directly previous to yours).

[AceMarksman]

@ everyone with fish on the brain: There aren't

traditional

power roles in this game, therefore the "fishing" questions that tajo have been asking don't give scum squat. Also, did anyone even bother looking at the link I posted to the buzzy beetle page of mario wiki? Notice anything (i.e, how zwet pretty much paraphrased the entire first paragraph as his role claim). Now, go to the page that holds your role. Notice anything different? Those of you who have immunities will, not all of them are there. Law seemed to make some immunities up for his characters.

[AceMarksman]

what are your thoughts?

[AceMarksman]

According to the most recent vote count, you're not voting him. Why not?

[AceMarksman]

where did he claim to not have hands?

And I don't think he would have done that, are PM's are confusing enough (what with BA being town)

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-zwetschenwasser (5): AceMarksman, caf19, Moratorium, populartajo, Gorrad
-populartajo (2): zwetschenwasser, ortolan
-Moratorium (1): Empking
-Looker (1): Kast
-Gorrad (1): WeyounsLastClone

Not voting (6): killa seven, ZEEnon, Riceballtail, Looker, sirdanilot, semioldguy

With 16 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

Perhaps qwints attacked a character like a spiny buzzy or something.

[AceMarksman]

I can vouch for gorrad that his PM matches mine. The hold and pass items thing is probably so we can get letters.

[AceMarksman]

RBT, that was absolute fail at content. Try again.

[AceMarksman]

sir: What SPECIFIC reasons (with quotes) do you have for finding me scum? I think that it's pretty obvious that I'm BA when I caught SK in his role claim.

[AceMarksman]

I'm not seeing it either, but I'm not seeing a way that zwet is NOT scum at the moment, so he has my vote.

[AceMarksman]

I think TheAdmiral should paraphrase his win condition before he reads as well.

[AceMarksman]

-In my books, Ace is 95% non-MK. If you still suspect him despite admitting his critical role in nailing SK, then present that case.

^this. Seriously doubting that sir is BA at the moment.

[AceMarksman]

due to the request my win con is that I win when there is only mushroom kingdom left.

You win with the Mushroom Kingdom, eh?

Unvote, Vote:ThAdmiral

Scum: caught.

[AceMarksman]

whoops - i mean I win when there is NO mushroom kingdom left.

Nope. Wrong again, scum.

[AceMarksman]

Catching two scum with role PM info. *inflated ego*

[AceMarksman]

No, sorry. Your 1352 disagrees with you. See, if you actually did lie, you would have gone back and re-read your role PM and posted your real condition then. Instead, you failed to produce the true BA win condition even after called out on it. I'm calling BS on your 1357.

[AceMarksman]

Ok, its official.

LYNCH THIS SCUMBAG NOW.

This

[AceMarksman]

FoS: RBT

Even though the vote is good, that was too opportunistic not to be taken into consideration. RBT, you have lurked the entire game yet when tajo and I catch scum, you instantly jump on the wagon. Where are your cases against other players? Where are your suspicions. I think RBT will get my vote tomorrow after we lynch Admiral!scum.

[AceMarksman]

Great minds think alike.

[AceMarksman]

1) killjoy
2) You forget the context in which RBT voted ThAdmiral. RBT has lurked the entire game. Her post count ITT is almost non-existant and her content level is even lower. She has made no cases and voiced no suspicions, yet votes ThAdmiral within an hour of his initial win condition paraphrase.

That's

why RBT's vote is opportunistic.

[AceMarksman]

negativity =/= scum. For proof, see jayfin3 in Newbie 733 (my first game). He was a douche, but he was town.

[AceMarksman]

before re-reading, how scummy would you consider ort to be? More or less than RBT? Zwet?

[AceMarksman]

Really? Is there anyone besides ThAdmiral that you would consider more scummy than ort?

Also, why are you not voting ThAdmiral (or are you and I just missed it)?

Mod edit
Visible Votecount

-ThAdmiral (4): Kast, populartajo, AceMarksman, Riceballtail
-zwetschenwasser (4): caf19, Moratorium, Gorrad, Empking
-populartajo (2): zwetschenwasser, ortolan
-Gorrad (1): WeyounsLastClone
-caf19 (1): sirdanilot

Not voting (5): killa seven, ZEEnon, ThAdmiral, semioldguy, millar13

With 17 alive it takes 9 real votes to lynch.

[AceMarksman]

EBWOP: nevermind. You were voting ThAdmiral before he was replaced. *facedesk*

[AceMarksman]

That implies that you think your own wagon/case against tajo is devoid of logic.

[AceMarksman]

I think 1378 has a typo then.

[AceMarksman]

Oh wait. By "you", were you not referring to tajo, but players as a whole?

[AceMarksman]

Yes, I tend to lurk more and have less content in the beginning stages of large games.

I would hardly call page 56 in the "beginning stages" of this game.

[AceMarksman]

Day two, two scum dead. This is far from the beginning.

[AceMarksman]

Funny how you think Ace is town and Im scum. Why?

This, except swapping "Tajo" for "Ace" and switching "town" with "scum", and vice versa.

Ok, I made that much more complicated than it needed to be.

[AceMarksman]

tajo even when/if ThAdmiral flips town that's at best one all for us plus I voted him as soon as he displayed scummy behaviour (your case on him was still crap)- you continued to try to derail the SK wagon despite his obv-scumminess.

whoever vidged qwints night one I urge you to consider tajo as a target- that way you're 2/2 and well on your way to a third and an MVP award

If there is a vidge, DO NOT USE IT ON TAJO that's the WORST Idea ever.

1) Tajo had a key role in catching both scum.
2) Tajo has not done anything particularly scummy as it pertains to this setup. (i.e getting everyone to claim isn't helpful to scum because there are no traditional roles)
3) If you vidge Tajo, Hannibal Lector will find you.

[AceMarksman]

also, some of us now have zero votes? There must be vote-reducing roles.

[AceMarksman]

That link is broken

[AceMarksman]

The first link was broken, the second one works fine. I got ninja'd

Anywho, more ThAdmiral votes plz kthx.

[AceMarksman]

sirdan, are you a member of the mushroom kingdom?

[AceMarksman]

Yey, two scum in one day. Prevote: millar

Isn't abusing replacements/jump-ins fun?

[AceMarksman]

Two self-confirmed scum! Which will we kill first?

ThAdmrial, he has more votes.

[AceMarksman]

No you're not, sorry scumbag. It's good that law didn't foresee us breaking the game like this.

[AceMarksman]

No, don't do that, as we're about to lynch ThAdmiral. If we weren't sure about another scumbag, then we would get you to be modkilled.

[AceMarksman]

FoS: WLC

We've caught scum and have an 11 person bandwagon on him, yet you choose not to join it? Is yours and ThAdmrial's win condition the same?

[AceMarksman]

millar, we already know you are scum, you confirmed it yourself. Why not vote ThAdmiral and get it over with?

[AceMarksman]

actually don't, we want info on how many votes are counted, so if we can attain a lynch but nothing more, it will give us information.

[AceMarksman]

No, tajo, don't do that. Let's not jeopardize the lynch.

[AceMarksman]

So, we now know there are at least three killing roles and probably that many protective or roleblocking roles. That's good to know.

Vote: millar

diescumdie.

[AceMarksman]

fuck you scum

we're killing millar for you.

[AceMarksman]

why did you kill WLC?

I don't like all the powers you have, that seems way overpowered and rather SK-like to me.

[AceMarksman]

that fast? Ffs this game is gonna spend more time in night than in day.

[AceMarksman]

Sir, go die in a corner. I'm serious, do it.

[AceMarksman]

I think gorrad may be independent third party.

[AceMarksman]

@gorrad: IIRC, wario can use fire. Or, you could be making your kill flavor up.

[AceMarksman]

I'm liking both gorrad and sirdan as scum right now. I'll put my thoughts together tomorrow.

[AceMarksman]

@RBT: did you seriously miss the part where I caught scum early? You're still voting me? What is your win condition?

[AceMarksman]

V/LA until monday

[AceMarksman]

I'm baaaaaaaaack!

re-reading now, but if there's anything important you guys want me to see now, then tell me and I'll zero in on it first.

[AceMarksman]

hey, I was away for the weekend. I'm reading now

[AceMarksman]

Vote:K7

I am a paragoomba (a goomba with wings that flies. Ya know, the ones that pissed you off in all of the mario games?). Every night, I can drop microgoombas on a player that prevents them from jumping on someone and reduces their vote count for the next day. Considering this is the mario kingdom's main way to kill something, I am effectively a roleblocker. Last night I targeted k7 and there was no kill, so I'm pretty sure he's scum.

[AceMarksman]

hey guys, sorry for the dissapearance, I've been packing/planning for going to the beach next week :/. If you wish to replace me, that's fine, but if not, I'll be back next week to answer your questions and such. Sorry.

[AceMarksman]

also, my thoughts up till this point: we have 6 players remaining, meaning we have at most 2 antitown roles left. If I recall correctly, we have had no 3rd party roles as of yet, and they would likely come in pairs. Sirdan claims to be paired with RBT, correct? I think that is where we will find our next scum.

[AceMarksman]

I don't see why you would assume that. I think it is more likely that there are 3-4 anti-town roles left, probably 1 from each faction (DK/MK/WW).

Oh, that's true :/ I've gotten myself into the newbie game mindset again (there is only one scum faction and if that scum faction outnumbers the town then the town loses), however:

If RBT and Sirdanilot are on a team, I would assume that team would be MK

I think it's ridiculous that ortolan is still alive, while he says crap such as 'I intend to vote for RBT today' while I haven't even claimed yet while

it is obvious our claims are tied.

this, especially the bolded part, points to a team link b/t RBT and sirdan. Note that sirdan was a jump in player, so why would he only be linked to one player and not the rest? I'm thinking a third party link here.

Also, have fun at the beach.

Gracias.

[AceMarksman]

yeah I did target someone and that someone was semioldguy . I was either drunk or really sleepy when I sent that one in.