Prozacs Basic Theme 3 - GAME OVER

[mykonian]

Thanks Prozac. Now, as to finding and lynching scum, I must apologize. At this moment in time, I don't have a clue who is alligned with the bad guys. I hope you'll understand this, and I'm going to do my very best to change this situation.

This leaves out of game effects. I'm aware that this game isn't isolated, and that the outside does have an influence. You might find this awkward, but I assure you, it's only natural. I'm mostly talking about meta then, because I'm sure we are all against alliances and vendetta's getting into this social game of sharp minds. I have another apology to make, since I won't be able to profit as much from experience in playing with you, simply because I haven't played with most of you. I'll hope I can get a read on the guys I don't know soon enough, but I promise nothing.

And this completes all I know about the game right now. I don't think it will help anyone, but it's a way to start the game. I hope everybody will have fun this game.

[mykonian]

mykonian's post, with this playerlist, makes me ask the following questions about meta, to all of the players.

1. How often do you feel you use meta as an argument in Mafia?

2. Do you prefer proactive (using as a reason to investigate a player's actions) or reactive (using to backup/contradict what a player did) meta?

3. How often are you to research meta on a player whose meta you don't know in the game?

4. Do you prefer to use meta to defend a player as being town, or attack them for being scum?

1. Never. Meta is a difficult subject to argue with.
2. I really have no idea what you mean here. I need to know what kind of person is on the other side of a post to understand why he's making that post. Without meta, reads on people are inaccurate.
3. Too little. Though as you can understand from the above, there is little benefit in rereading. I benefit more from talking outside of the game (before the game actually starts), so I know what kind of person is playing. The same can be done from games I played in, but if I'm rereading, I usually can't feel what that person thought making a post, or assess how the game went.
4. Both are ok. If I know more then the rest of the game about someone's allignment, I'll talk about it.

Nice questions, btw. Usually RQS's start with sillyer questions.

[mykonian]

2: He is asking Fate for a legit reason to vote Katsuki... what townie does this? Mafia lookin' for a reason to join the bandwagon.

QFT. Quite a bit on the passive side.

vote nocmen

I could also see this as buddying/supporting a buddy, btw. But unnatural it is in any case.

[mykonian]

Unvote:
Vote: Nocmen

This is exactly what I had in mind, we run up scum get their fakeclaims and all that jazz, and THEN we lynch Katsuki.

Yes yes exactly as planned.

Don't be a pussy Fate. Three more for the lynch. No time for your petty feud with Kat, we are lynching scum this game.

[mykonian]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: KATSUKI

YOU GUYS

THOUGHT

I

WAS

KIDDING

Wuss.

But ok, Noc's name seems to be the flavour millery thing a mod could give to a VT.

Sigh.

unvote vote Kat

It's late now, I'll investigate the wagon properly tomorrow. It was lightning quick, so I don't know what one can find from the placement. Reasons given etc might be a better start.

[mykonian]

that's odd. My reckdar is bleeping.

scum again?

unvote vote reck

Fate, we can get another scum to claim. And then we hammer. Because you know just as well as I do that Kat is really town.

[mykonian]

The fact that he after that (indeed) terrible post continues to argue for the point of arguing only makes it worse.

[mykonian]

lol fuck mykonian

he just calls me scum in literally EVERY GAME and happens to get lucky most of the time

well not this time

Anyone who's like RECK SO SCUMMEH FOR USING FLAVOR fuck you go read PBT 2

I'm "lucky" again, aren't I.

No reck, you are just quite obvious as scum. And we know using flavor isn't scummy. Which is why I'm not voting you for that In fact, only Fate tried to use that tell. Are you scared of Fate?

[mykonian]

Proof? You ask for proof?

I know an easy way. Let the mod tell us.

vote SC

(and no reck, you are still scum)

[mykonian]

Proof? You ask for proof?

I know an easy way. Let the mod tell us.

vote SC

(and no reck, you are still scum)

Why aren't you lynched yet?

Not enough votes, I guess. Further, you should be on Reck for scum.

[mykonian]

wagon hopping like a bitch, overly careful formulation intent to avoid provocation early on, trying to pressure Fate's vote (good luck on THAT one), deflection of his own attack onto Fate too.

He probably can't explain his own votes.

You assume too much.

Don't see how wagon hopping is actually a tell. (I can totally explain why the opposite is, which is why reck is scum btw), the first post was over the top and

wow did you catch that!

. I'm totally allowed to try to push fate around if that is any help to me, and I'm totally clueless what "deflection of his own attack onto fate" means.

so if dramonic would be so kind to shut up when he talks about things he doesn't understand, I'd be very pleased. (yes, this means you apparently don't have a clue why I'm voting, and this is your problem, not mine.)

[mykonian]

wagon hopping like a bitch, overly careful formulation intent to avoid provocation early on, trying to pressure Fate's vote (good luck on THAT one), deflection of his own attack onto Fate too.

He probably can't explain his own votes.

You assume too much.

Don't see how wagon hopping is actually a tell. (

I can totally explain why the opposite is, which is why reck is scum btw

), the first post was over the top and

wow did you catch that!

. I'm totally allowed to try to push fate around if that is any help to me, and I'm totally clueless what "deflection of his own attack onto fate" means.

so if dramonic would be so kind to shut up when he talks about things he doesn't understand, I'd be very pleased. (yes, this means you apparently don't have a clue why I'm voting, and this is your problem, not mine.)

Reading is tech. So, do you really want theory why someone leaving their vote is scum?

Strictly speaking, the thoughts behind your vote on Reck matter very little to me anyways because I already noticed what I attribute to scum motivations in most of your earlier posts.

Furthermore, if you feel so terribly assaulted because I think you're scum and it gives you an incontrollable need to devolve into personal attacks, you might want to consider replacing out.

1. Get it to the mod, and 2. You're a grownup, and a particulary stupid one. Don't blame me for telling you.

[mykonian]

Berry, stop rolefishing.

Oh... did somebody attack reck again? I seriously hope you don't do this conciously, but you are doing nothing but protecting reck. Even to the point of asking someone to replace out (which has never happened to me before in all those years). Play the game like it's supposed to be played and try to lynch scum Dram, or don't play at all.

I'm pretty sure you just claimed scum,

aka

LOL

CONFIRM VOTE: BOGRE

Yeah, no totally. I'm scum, guys. <----

Fate....do you read? I asked if your only reason for voting me was because YOU THOUGHT I'd confirm him on a flip, NOT saying I -would- confirm him, lol. Namely because I won't, because I won't flip scum.

DERP

VOTE: Bogre

Reck is looking like a good possible lynch today as well.

Unvote; Vote: TheJakalope

This is not a town post.

You didn't do OMGUS, did you?

[mykonian]

mykonian, saying dram is protecting me is a bit over the line and I'd appreciate you backing off of our personal life since it's not something I like brought up. Dram & I have no real association anymore, and insinuating we do is only going to create problems.

PS, you should fuck right off with your OMGUS bullshit because you've still yet to give a single reason for anything you've done.

I say what I see. From the moment I attack you dram hardcore tunnels and even asks me to replace out of the game. Nobody has ever done that. I don't care what your personal life is doing, dram isn't acting natural there.

[mykonian]

wagon hopping like a bitch, overly careful formulation intent to avoid provocation early on, trying to pressure Fate's vote (good luck on THAT one), deflection of his own attack onto Fate too.

He probably can't explain his own votes.

You assume too much.

Don't see how wagon hopping is actually a tell. (

I can totally explain why the opposite is, which is why reck is scum btw

), the first post was over the top and

wow did you catch that!

. I'm totally allowed to try to push fate around if that is any help to me, and I'm totally clueless what "deflection of his own attack onto fate" means.

so if dramonic would be so kind to shut up when he talks about things he doesn't understand, I'd be very pleased. (yes, this means you apparently don't have a clue why I'm voting, and this is your problem, not mine.)

Reading is tech. So, do you really want theory why someone leaving their vote is scum?

[mykonian]

HOLY SHIT This new idea of "if I just state my views as an idea" i.e. "Elli is town, reck is scum" or whatever, then it's good enough, is fucking bullshit. Fate's doing it but he is functionally retarded, everyone else is doing it that has no fucking excuse. Everyone that is post their THEORIES on who is or isn't on what side at page EFFING TEN as fact is being lazy and pointless and more often than not gambling. Quit being lazy and post some goddamn facts and analysis or fuck right off.

Oman, be sensible. Meta changes, and apparently there has been a change here. You don't have to adapt, but at least you can accept it. Because I've seen it work, multiple times.

Fate has the benefit that people sheep him anyway, so sure, some people could do something about their end-day convincing (hi elli), but I think it works.

This does mean that you have to have to adapt your scumhunting a little. Now, if you weren't so lazy not to do this, you'd have a much more enjoyable game.

For example, the post below is still horridly bad. I know it's bad. And I can make a 3 sentence discription that still doesn't catch why I think it's bad. I much rather quote it and say that I think Bunny is scum, which catches my meaning a lot better (I read the post, and it felt really scummy). If you can't see it, either you ask me to try my best at explaining it, or you vote me because you really disagree with me. I really don't see the problem.

NO don't you buddy me

If I was to buddy anyone, that person would be Fate.
Your first post was what I thought, but like in every other game,I never have the confidence to start a wagon =/.

[mykonian]

wagon hopping like a bitch, overly careful formulation intent to avoid provocation early on, trying to pressure Fate's vote (good luck on THAT one), deflection of his own attack onto Fate too.

He probably can't explain his own votes.

You assume too much.

Don't see how wagon hopping is actually a tell. (

I can totally explain why the opposite is, which is why reck is scum btw

), the first post was over the top and

wow did you catch that!

. I'm totally allowed to try to push fate around if that is any help to me, and I'm totally clueless what "deflection of his own attack onto fate" means.

so if dramonic would be so kind to shut up when he talks about things he doesn't understand, I'd be very pleased. (yes, this means you apparently don't have a clue why I'm voting, and this is your problem, not mine.)

Reading is tech. So, do you really want theory why someone leaving their vote is scum?

Open your mind and put this post in it.

[mykonian]

So because I'm doing the opposite of wagon hopping, I'm scum.

Good to know you're functionally retarded, or scum. Or both.

Lynch away.

Am I really going to have to explain

voteparking

. You are really going to keep this "mykonian is retarded" bullshit up, aren't you?

So we got a big wagon. Everybody is on it. Even gets to L-1. Claim. General consensus is that it is probably a townie claim, and the wagon was insanely fast anyway, so people unvote.

And then? Something new has to be found. And that is hard, isn't it, scum? So you park on Noc, waiting for something to happen.

Jeez, that I have to explain this stuff.

[mykonian]

Hahahahahaha. I "voteparked" on Nocmen when the game had been open less than 24 hours.

Luckily, you made yourself incredibly obvious scum, so I don't have to "votepark" on Nocmen anymore.

24 hours was enough for you. Keep laughing scum. It isn't a joke.

Oh hi dram. Yes you thought my first post was scummy. You started tunneling right at the point where I voted reck. (quoted your next post hereunder)

BTW, why is/was reck town?

that's odd. My reckdar is bleeping.

scum again?

unvote vote reck

Fate, we can get another scum to claim. And then we hammer. Because you know just as well as I do that Kat is really town.

...
*cricket*
Yeah, my vote is staying there.

[mykonian]

24 hours was enough for me?

That's your rebuttal?

Oh my god.

Is the above supposed to argue for something or do the question marks imply you don't know?

anyway, we got a L-1 wagon in that time, so I have no clue why you would think that voteparking would be impossible in that timeframe (and you clearly kept it on noc simply because it was easier)

[mykonian]

nah, oman, more often then twice a day.

Don't be stubborn and try to hunt scum Oman. Because just arguing with fate gets us nowhere. You've still got to make any useful post.

[mykonian]

yeah, sure. BB made sense.

vote Bogre

[mykonian]

I esspecially liked quote 1 and 3. The L-1-on-page-4-but-I-suspect-other-people-too, and the "at least noc is making the effort", which feels like making up/buddying up and was pretty useless.

Futher, BB is my top town read and I trust him.

This quote: "Blackberry is highly unwilling to commit. To wagons, to voting other people, and lets other people lead. "

is really funny. How many wagons were lead till now? It's a 20 player game with just 11 players. The above is just OMGUS, you never cared about BB until he voted you.

[mykonian]

I thought my vote was on mykonian, WTF.

Unvote; Vote: mykonian

Jakalope is still a good lynch, but mykonian is scummier for his obvious attempt to easywagon me, then just scrambling to come up with reasons why I'm scum after getting called on it.

Maybe you are an easywagon because you are scum?

And you needed multiple times to read the answer I had posted earlier. Keep up the lies Reck.

[mykonian]

I thought my vote was on mykonian, WTF.

Unvote; Vote: mykonian

Jakalope is still a good lynch, but mykonian is scummier for his obvious attempt to easywagon me, then just scrambling to come up with reasons why I'm scum after getting called on it.

A second thought: since when are you an easy wagon?

[mykonian]

Easywagon because others had expressed suspicion of me.

Odd, that I was the one to start the wagon...

Seriously, are you trying to make yourself look a victim? Please don't cry... and stop your lying.

[mykonian]

Fate was the only one voicing suspicion. He didn't join the wagon.

I really fail to see your point why you are a victim here.

PS. I had to look up the word "ingrate". Ungrateful person, really? I don't think I need to thank you. You are crying caught scum, for the third time in a row. Call it luck again and cry all you want.

[mykonian]

WHOA IM LOOKIN AT DAT PLAYERLIST AND IM LIEK: U IZ HER?scoobyCSLOversoul

What does that mean? ._.

Also, Bogre is at L-1. Please claim now.

Why aren't Myo and BB scum?

A quick look at the votecount revealed, not only that Oversoul isn't voting either BB or me, he is on a wagon where we both are on.

So, our dear oversoul apparently doesn't have real problems with us, still he wants that Fate puts BB and me in the scummy catagory. Something isn't right here.

unvote vote Oversoul

No longer L-1, lets not get a claim.

[mykonian]

Less votes on Bogre, more on mykonian please.

zero reasons... you disappoint me reck. I thought you promised oman you were

oldschool

.

Oh and I know you've given reasons for voting me. It's a shame they change with every post. Last time I attacked you because you were an easy target (lol), and sheeped the general sentiment (apparently only formed by Fate).

What's your choice of argument this time?

[mykonian]

can someone just switch over to bogre so we can get claims etc.

Elli, I know you are serious etc, but can't such stuff wait? You aren't the only one needing such information.

[mykonian]

OH MAN LOOK HOW SCUMMY I AM

So you knew you were not supposed to be doing that. Can we have reasons why you did vote bogre?

[mykonian]

OH MAN LOOK HOW SCUMMY I AM

So you knew you were not supposed to be doing that. Can we have reasons why you did vote bogre?

And why did you unvote Bogre when he's on L-1 before a claim?

Because I did like the wagon, but it isn't my preferred lynch. So I see no reason to force a claim which might not help us at all.

[mykonian]

In the meanwhile

Vote: mykonian.

for the lamest reason ever to vote someone. (voteparking lolfail)

Well, I know for a fact your vote fails. Please explain to me why voteparking isn't a tell. (or what kind of definition you have when you use that word)

[mykonian]

OH MAN LOOK HOW SCUMMY I AM

So you knew you were not supposed to be doing that. Can we have reasons why you did vote bogre?

And why did you unvote Bogre when he's on L-1 before a claim?

Because I did like the wagon, but it isn't my preferred lynch. So I see no reason to force a claim which might not help us at all.

What is this? There are 10 people voting Bogre and somehow you don't think a clam might not help because he is not your "preferred" lynch?

Someone vig this clown.

You claimhappy people. You learn it in the newby games: don't claim when unnecessary, it will only help scum. Running one up who I don't want to lynch counts.

Reck and you just prove the point. Idiots who think that lots of people on a wagon means that there has to be an L-1 claim. It's stupid and pointless. You claim when there is somebody willing to hammer.

[mykonian]

Myko, do you like bread?

Not anymore. I used to, but I start without breakfast now. I've eaten too much bread in my earlier years.

In the meanwhile

Vote: mykonian.

for the lamest reason ever to vote someone. (voteparking lolfail)

Well, I know for a fact your vote fails. Please explain to me why voteparking isn't a tell. (or what kind of definition you have when you use that word)

I don't see the scum motivation. Maybe you can ellaborate why you think it's a tell?.

Let's assume Nocmen is town. Why would Reckscum insist on the wagon with a so-so case when it disintegrated and when there were like million other places to vote?

Because it's easier to stay on a wagon, then to find something new and maybe facing a lot of people disagreeing with you, the certainty that your new adversary will feel OMGUS feelings etc. Further, you have to give some believable reasons, and in the worst case, have to defend because people think you are wagonning someone. There are plenty of dangers for scum when they switch.

And you seriously never heard about the above?

You claimhappy people. You learn it in the newby games: don't claim when unnecessary, it will only help scum. Running one up who I don't want to lynch counts.

Reck and you just prove the point. Idiots who think that lots of people on a wagon means that there has to be an L-1 claim. It's stupid and pointless. You claim when there is somebody willing to hammer.

Wow, you are dumb.

The game is likely going to stall and get disorganized if Bogre doesn't claim. It took a lot of effort to get to this point and you think it's useless. A claim is exactly what we need right now to force Bogre make a decision. It either sucks or it's believable. If sucks, lynch. If it's believable, then analyse the wagon. Get another suspect, force people to make stances, etc.

There are so many things a claim can do.

Also I'm willing to hammer.

Try again?

new point? Anyway, who is dumb if you can't see that we won a very large wagon to analyse. At the start nobody knew where it was going, so all information is there. Who needs a claim? You make it a necessity.

[mykonian]

OH MAN LOOK HOW SCUMMY I AM

So you knew you were not supposed to be doing that. Can we have reasons why you did vote bogre?

And why did you unvote Bogre when he's on L-1 before a claim?

Because I did like the wagon, but it isn't my preferred lynch. So I see no reason to force a claim which might not help us at all.

What about if the hammer occured without a claim? You still said you liked the wagon, and now all of the sudden that it gets to L-1 you have cold feet.

Same thing. It went far enough, it was fun, and in one or two days we can pull some serious info from the above. Bogre never was my preferred lynch, there are a few I'd like better.

Hammering without a claim is retarded.

Whoever does it, gets my eternal RAGE.

Even if Bogre flips mafia? O.o

You almost say this like you know Bogre will flip town *contemplates*. Nahhh.

I don't mind a scumbuddy hammering Bogre for towncred now

[mykonian]

Buh-bye scummers.

I don't understand this post. What's going on?

I attempted to blow-up the forum.

Bombing-attempt thwarted.

Now I must continue playing these 'mafia' game.

GRRRRRRRRRR!

Joke or no joke, this is clearly an attempt to create a distraction from scumhunting.

Myko, do you like bread?

Stop asking pointless questions.

UNVOTE: xvart
VOTE: Blackberry

I didn't get the chance to react to this post last day, but with the flips it even gets more clear. While the rest of the game was busy examining a claim, and deciding to hammer, SC tunnels on BB for being BB, and doesn't comment on anything currently happening. This post did nothing, is a clear active lurking post and was a way to stay off the wagon without lurking too much.

vote SC

Vote: mykonian

for obvious reasons.

Oh good, tell me. Because I don't get them.

[mykonian]

Oh, Fate. You are quite funny to watch.

You aren't. http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... er_sort=Go

Be a little more fun.

[mykonian]

Though I have another vote in mind depending on what happens in the next page or two.

Well, you got a wagon now, I doubt you are going to change, right?

And you are totally wrong about Dram btw. No matter how personal you take it.

[mykonian]

Calling me scum myko?

Unnatural. Don't really care why. You've made two votes. One at the start of day 1, one at the start of day 2, both on me.

Oh, and I still have a question:

BTW, why is/was reck town?

that's odd. My reckdar is bleeping.

scum again?

unvote vote reck

Fate, we can get another scum to claim. And then we hammer. Because you know just as well as I do that Kat is really town.

...
*cricket*
Yeah, my vote is staying there.

Or was there something else I should know about Reck?

[mykonian]

I understand Dram and Reck votes on Mykonian, but what the hell is everyone else votes reason?

Just check CSL's, thejakalopes and Scooby's ISO. They aren't too hard to read. The first two haven't missed a wagon, scooby started at the end of day 1 and since then has seen only one target (and cried a little about people hammering before claims). The wagon is there because people like to wagon.

Oh, and reck is crying caught scum who is lucky other people don't see it.
Dram is bitter for some reason and has seen only one player in this game.

That leaves noc and Kat, and I hope they are geniunly mistaken.

[mykonian]

You don't think vote-hopping with bad reason is a scummy thing, so you won't understand why that vote of yours is scummy as fuck.

no please, explain. Why is it scummy here? Because this sounds a lot like avoiding giving reasons about that post.

[mykonian]

You don't think vote-hopping with bad reason is a scummy thing, so you won't understand why that vote of yours is scummy as fuck.

no please, explain. Why is it scummy here? Because this sounds a lot like avoiding giving reasons about that post.

And you've been avoiding giving good reasons for your votes. And that's my answer to why I have the vote on you. Because the only vote of yours that doesn't seem like hopping on a wagon or with a horrible reason is the one on Oversoul.

Fate: Why the hell do you think myko is suddenly not scum? Or do you just want Katsuki dead (again) so suddenly? The issue I have with that is that if it was anyone else, I'd be tempted to believe it more. But something just doesn't seem right to me.

Let's get rid of obv scum myko,then move on to obv scum Jackalope, then SC and scooby.

Just don't ISO. The only bandwagon vote without reasons was on Kat. Every other vote was given reasons (though I had to explain the vote on Reck later, for the people who didn't think it to be obvious)

Reck voteparked, SC (first vote) asked for proof (early game, mafia, SC is experienced. Asking for proof makes no sense, you know there is none). Bogre was on BB's case, most importantly quote 1 and 3 (as mentioned in a second post), SC second vote was for that terrible post which avoided any connection with the game and the lynch on Bogre at that time.

Seriously, the lack of reasons you name is because you don't care to read. Probably because other people have said I didn't gave them, but Reck has been proven to be a liar anyway.

[mykonian]

well, noc, if you don't get it yet, just check the wagon you are on. Just have a quick look at the iso of every player. You tell me that they are town and that that is a good wagon.

[mykonian]

well done town on this wagon. Just wagon away, get

claims

, because they are so goddamn important.

I just wish this wagon gets to claim range asap and myko can claim and depending of the claim we lynch or we get another wagon.

Fate should also stop wasting our time (

the wagon is sooner or later going to hit claim range

) and claim if myko should stay alive, etc.

There are a lot of scummy people alive (I'm basically paranoid about everyone). And I think 3-4 of them depend on wether myko is town or scum.

@Noc, you barely mentioned me in day 1. What happened today that made you consider voting for me over other options?

The bolded shows what a maniac you are. I said it before, and I'll tell you again: claims are antitown.

And Fate, nobody was going to hammer this wagon. It's a shitty wagon, by the book. I wished you hadn't claimed and would have left me the decision.

[mykonian]

well, noc, if you don't get it yet, just check the wagon you are on. Just have a quick look at the iso of every player. You tell me that they are town and that that is a good wagon.

Do I think it's a good wagon? Yes, I believe you are scum.

Do I think everyone is town on it? No. As I've said in my previous posts, I'm very highly suspicious of Jackalope, and to a lesser extent scooby.

Have you ever seen a game where scum bus right out of the doors of day 2? No thank you.

Oh, and since you are going to bring up 2 scumteams, lets be quicker. There is one with the kill flavor of a gun, one with a knife. I think Prozac to be traditional enough that means we are up against a serial killer.

Just think of what your (20 player game -> about 5 player scumteam?) top 5 scum is and check how many of them are on my wagon. No way you are on a good wagon

[mykonian]

Fate weren't you voting myk awhile yesterday

If myk had claimed masons with ANYBODY except Fate I'd believe it, but this is Fate

A quote. Now. I'm fucking sick of your bullshit Reck.

unvote vote Reck

[mykonian]

You have towncred? =P
Also Myko, if you think claims are so antitown bitch at your buddy for claiming when you had like, 2 votes on you <_<

He had six or seven votes on him you fuck.

WITHIN A DAY.

BUT NOO THAT DOESN'T GIVE YOU PAUSE

Dramonic has been happy to tunnel on me all game, without caring about

anyone

else in this game. I would almost suspect it was something personal between dram and me, but I barely know him.

[mykonian]

I do have opinions on other players. I just haven't voiced then.
I might once I'm out of class.

You've had more then a day for that. I think you are next on the list after Reck.


Oh, for the people not getting it, Reck has the same problem again. There was a large quick wagon, and when it is going to fall apart, he doesn't know where to go and wants to wait it out. With Noc, he stuck on the wagon. Here he unvotes without doing another thing. And my Reckdar wouldn't be working. lol.

[mykonian]

I'm aware Fate.
I'm aware

unvote
vote: scooby

Hey, wasn't that guy on my wagon?

Any reason why you stayed on that wagon, and perhaps a reason too why you are voting him now?

pedit: same goes for you Scooby.

[mykonian]

I'm aware Fate.
I'm aware

unvote
vote: scooby

Hey, wasn't that guy on my wagon?

Any reason why you stayed on that wagon, and perhaps a reason too why you are voting him now?

pedit: same goes for you Scooby.

You heard of bussing?

Day 2. Straight out of the gates. The wagon on me yesterday was extinct, so there would be no planning at all. Seriously, congrats to the person who expected this wagon, because I didn't.

what particular part?

I just wish this wagon gets to claim range asap and myko can claim and depending of the claim we lynch or we get another wagon.

Fate should also stop wasting our time (the wagon is sooner or later going to hit claim range) and claim if myko should stay alive, etc.

There are a lot of scummy people alive (I'm basically paranoid about everyone). And I think 3-4 of them depend on wether myko is town or scum.

@Noc, you barely mentioned me in day 1. What happened today that made you consider voting for me over other options?

[mykonian]

That was to dramonic.

I do have opinions on other players. I just haven't voiced then.
I might once I'm out of class.

So let me get things clear. Before my 420 you had another suspects, yeah?

Oh don't be joking. Dramonic has probably not even read the whole game.

You at least made a

list

.

[mykonian]

Unvote; Vote: Katsuki

I don't think Fate is bullshitting us.

Nah, CSL. You need to do a little more work for us.

[mykonian]

I was going to ask what's up with the sudden mykonian wagon

, but he is responding poorly to it.

Just because there was no wagon on you on Day 1 doesn't mean you won't get a wagon on Day 2

, and if you're scummy enough to warrant it you need a defense prepared. I don't see one. In addition, his votes on xRECKONERx and me are laughable.

While I suspect some of the people early in the mykonian wagon are bussing, I feel my vote justified on flailing scum.

VOTE: mykonian

Day 2. Straight out of the gates. The wagon on me yesterday was extinct, so there would be no planning at all. Seriously, congrats to the person who expected this wagon, because I didn't.

Lets not dance here SC. You didn't expect it, I didn't expect it. Don't make it more then it is. It's pretty sad that you base a vote on that though, while clearly not reading the thread further.



Just please, please, to all you townies: make some effort.

[mykonian]

Fucking quotes.

You're trying to pull claims out of players and jump to the next wagon. Getting many claims a day is not good and helps scum, yet that's what you seem to be going for.

How can I be scum and help scum at the same time? Are you even reading what you post?
Claiming is the ultimate weapon to catch scum since it force scum to take a critical stance that extends through the whole game. I CAN'T BELIEVE you are trying to paint normal mafia play as scum play.

Claiming is the ultimate weapon against powerroles. Scum know who fakeclaimed, and picks the others off at night. Multiple unnecessary claiming is the best way to make a town vanilla very quickly.

So seriously, shut up. You don't have a clue what normal mafia play is. So please, play a newby game before you play with the big boys and try to tell them what's normal mafia play.

[mykonian]

What is normal play, then, mykonian?

Lynch without claims?

PS: How does scum know who fakeclaimed?

No, you didn't talk about lynching in the one below. I think that counts as a strawman, young man. I mean an intentional one.

Claiming is the ultimate weapon to catch scum since it force scum to take a critical stance that extends through the whole game.

You just want claims, and you are an idiot for that. You are even more idiotic to keep pushing it as right. Apart from the mastin style quote answers, I think this fits your meta though:

vote scooby

PS. Town doesn't fakeclaim.

[mykonian]

wait a second...

Elli made you think it was normal, didn't he? Oh that would just be brilliant. And now, convinced that you aren't allowed to be wrong, you play the experienced player who knows what "normal" play is, don't you.

Just, if this is true, please admit it in endgame. The story would be just too amazing. I bet it could net you a title.

[mykonian]

I don't see how a disagreement on theory makes me scummier than dram but ohwell. (Am I an idiot or am I scum? )

Also what meta are you talking about?

Tell me, what the hell do you do when someone is scummy as fuck and gets to claim range? Well, that's right, CLAIM. When I suspect people and I push them to claim range, the ONLY THING that can avoid a lynch is a provable claim. THAT'S WHY ASKING FOR A CLAIM IS NOT SCUMMY, IS NORMAL PLAY.

I don't get what's the scummy thing of my position when it's been standard play in the games I've played and read.

Oh come on. You've pushed people to get a claim. You haven't pushed for a single lynch.

Oh, and no. But you are much more fun at the moment, and deflecting is fun too, and there is apparently not a way I can get a wagon on Reck.

[mykonian]

wait a second...

Elli made you think it was normal, didn't he? Oh that would just be brilliant. And now, convinced that you aren't allowed to be wrong, you play the experienced player who knows what "normal" play is, don't you.

Just, if this is true, please admit it in endgame. The story would be just too amazing. I bet it could net you a title.

Who the FUCK is Elli?

Playerlist. It's not that hard.

The fuck could have been left out. And the capitals too.

[mykonian]

Seriously? That's a stupid semantics argument. Of course if I push people to claim, is because I want them lynched. Do you read what you post?

Deflecting is not a scumtell.

Do you think dramonic is town?

*blinks* so the excuse worked with your mother? "but he did it too!". Mothers are damned good scumhunters on their children.

and no, it isn't a semantics argument. There is a huge difference between wanting claims and wanting a lynch.

[mykonian]

I just wish this wagon gets to claim range asap and myko can claim and depending of the claim we lynch or we get another wagon.

Why are you talking about another wagon here already? And why were there never reasons for that vote on me?

Why do I see 3 parts of this sentence going about claims and only one about the lynch?

[mykonian]

Seriously? That's a stupid semantics argument. Of course if I push people to claim, is because I want them lynched. Do you read what you post?

Deflecting is not a scumtell.

Do you think dramonic is town?

*blinks* so the excuse worked with your mother? "but he did it too!". Mothers are damned good scumhunters on their children.

and no, it isn't a semantics argument. There is a huge difference between wanting claims and wanting a lynch.

You are implying I wanted claims of people that I didn't suspect and want them lynched. Please point me to where I wanted claims of people I didn't suspect and want them lynched.

Deflecting is not a scumtell. I've seen town do it. Man, I've done it regardless of alignment. Please update your theoretical scumtells.

Uhm, can I have a link to a post where you did that? I would really like to see a town deflection. (still, did that really work with your mother?)

[mykonian]

I just wish this wagon gets to claim range asap and myko can claim and depending of the claim we lynch or we get another wagon.

Why are you talking about another wagon here already? And why were there never reasons for that vote on me?

Why do I see 3 parts of this sentence going about claims and only one about the lynch?

Reading is tech;

Myk: the reason why I was on your wagon was because

I thought you were scum.

Your attack against reck

didn't look sincere to me and looked elaborated.

(we discussed this on day 1; re: voteparking, which I still don't think is a scumtell)

I think only one of reck and dramonic is scum.

They are basically too conected to be a scumteam. And I think dram is scummier than reck, so yeah the owl should die.

Yeah, well, the bolded are hardly explanations, are they?

[mykonian]

I still don't get how a disagreement on mafia theory and a semmantics argument make me scummier than the people that were viciously asking for your lynch yesterday and doing nothing else than that.

Also what meta were you talking about?

Why are you avoiding questions? I'd like that link to a post where you deflect as town.

And eh, the random first completed game I could find.

[mykonian]

Fate: outing power roles is not a consequence of people joining the wagon and asking for claims. It's a consequence of mykonian acting scummy as fuck . You fucking know it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTDeEJyCmNA&t=0m40s

You still owe me a link to a town deflection of yours.

[mykonian]

and btw, that`s not deflection =_=

Ah damn.

Well, the "he did it too" should make clear what I mean. How's that called?

[mykonian]

You still owe me a link to a town deflection of yours.

I don't plan to out my alt.

I already showed that recktown deflected to maruchan when he started to be suspected.

Well, that turned out to be a useless claim then, I guess?

He gave reasons why maru was scum. You ask "why not reck or dram" knowing they are my top scumreads. I can see the difference.

[mykonian]

....why is my play from Paris Mafia III being brought up?

Reck you're fucking scum aren't you.

WHY
THE
FUCK

ARENT

YOU

VOTING

KATSUKI

HES VOTING YOU

WHAT AREY OU DOING

"just sitting and waiting"

[mykonian]

That's thinking progression. If new information is brought to the table, then you reevaluate stuff. If your scum suspect somehow becomes likely town,

then IT'S OBVIOUS people that were viciously pushing for his lynch are likely scum.

Fucking lynch me if you wish. I'm sick of this herpderp arguments.

THEY WERE ON YOUR SCUMLIST, FOR GODS SAKE.

seriously, why the hell were you on that rocketwagon, straight out of the gates, when two of your top scumreads are on it and there is really no chance that scum are going to bus.

[mykonian]

I've given reasons why dram is scum. Iso me, it's not that hard.

It just seems illogical to me that you vote me for a pointless debate while discarding all the things that you said day 1 about dram and reck.

"why not reck or dram in stead of me" doesn't have anything to do with reck or dram in such a situation. It's the instead of me part that is important.

[mykonian]

tl;dr
>myko thinks dram is scum
>scooby thinks dram is scum because he has spent all day 1 attacking him and defending reck
>myko think scooby is scum because of "theory debate" and pushing something he thinks is antitown.
>scooby wonders: why am I scummier than him?
>myko: OMG deflecting.

EXACTLY. You get it.

[mykonian]

Well fate, my thoughts have been confirmed. I'm sorry bro, but I'm really not seeing this, and seen that Kat is agreeing on reads in this situation with a lot of what I've got, even though he excuses for others then I would, I'm really not going to hammer. Regardless of how his claim can be interpreted, I think Kat must be town here.

[mykonian]

Re: myko case pre-mason claim.
- His first post is terrible and feels fake as fuck. If that was a smug intent to look cool, it didn't work.
- Post 122:

that's odd. My reckdar is bleeping.
scum again?

unvote vote reck

Fate, we can get another scum to claim. And then we hammer. Because you know just as well as I do that Kat is really town.

Voting reck for "reckdar bleeping".

(Now that I think about it, mykonian is a fucking hypocrite for calling me scum for getting claims of people).

What caught my attention is that he never explained his vote until dram asked. Even there, he went lolmysterious:

You assume too much. Don't see how wagon hopping is actually a tell. (I can totally explain why the opposite is, which is why reck is scum btw),

I agree that wagon hopping is not a tell. In the same vein, why would vote parking be a tell? (He actually explained that he voted reck for voteparking aprox.150 posts later and only when he was starting to get shit for the lame attack). In fact, theoretical scumtells suck to the bones and are a refuge for experienced scumbags trying to lynch people.

So yeah, that was basically it.

So this was the reason why I HAD TO DIE EVEN IF THERE WERE OTHER SCUMMY PEOPLE ON THE WAGON.

well, that first post argument is clearly stolen from Dram. He has been the only one who did something with it. But seriously, what do you expect? It's the first post of the game. You put up a show and hope someone reacts. Of course that post was as fake as it could get. That was the point.

"reckdar" is my scumdar I keep for reckoner. It has been rather accurate in games with Reck, and he has been scum quite often.

The bolded shows that you iso'ed me.

I reacted to Fate who liked wagons (we got the nocclaim then) but wanted to have Kat at the end of the day. I want to get reck to claim if he needs to, and then hammer.

I'm not going to sig "theoretical scumtells". First I use a tell that works for me. You don't understand it. You ask for an explanation. The words are too complicated for you and you call it theoretical. Well, you go find people who OMGUS, then I'm going to find scum, k?

TL;DR Around the part made red I show how scooby iso'ed me to make this case. He really had no clue why he was voting me.

[mykonian]

I still believe that either Reck or David is scum. But I'll support an xvart lynch as well.

VOTE: xvart

Top of page: reck votes xvart. 11 posts later, you say you think reck scum, and you vote xvart.

I'm saying we have a Reck/TheJakalope team here.

vote Reck

[mykonian]

TL;DR Around the part made red I show how scooby iso'ed me to make this case. He really had no clue why he was voting me.

Are you like serious here?

OF COURSE I'm going to have to iso to make that case. Do you seriously think I can quote you from the top of my mind?

Yes, I kinda hoped you had a clue why you thought I was scum. The part made red was evidently a product of sniffing out my iso to find ammunition for your case.

[mykonian]

Can you stop being RETARDED?

Don't cry scooby. Try to finally add something to the game. You're just filling up the thread now.

[mykonian]

OK, I'm done here. scooby is clearly making no effort to scumhunt.

I AM scumhunting. I AM defending myself from stupid attacks, like the ones you conveniently missed.

This attack is BY FAR is the worse, taking into account that half of the playerlist is posting one liners and DERPWAGONDERP.

Vote: StrangerCoug.

And FUCK OMGUS. Fuck it.

Piecing together "incriminating evidence", or rather fabricating it, from iso's isn't scumhunting.

[mykonian]

Dram is Dram is Dram.

He plays like this every time?

and he isn't on a public blacklist of some sort?

Don't like your wagon fate. Lets do

vote thejakalope

[mykonian]

I dont play "like this" every time, actually.
And there's nothing about my play that would justify blacklisting <_<
You're being offensive again.

Zwet at least read the last few posts in a game. You haven't done anything alike until Fate claimed for us. Regardless why, you made it some personal thing to get me lynched.

Last time you asked me to SHEEP Katsuki and you see how that ended, even though I TOLD you he was more likely a derpgambitter than a scumbag trying to discredit you.

I MEAN, with all the CAPS, I really have no IDEA why you are SHEEPING fate right NOW.

a

[mykonian]

I dont play "like this" every time, actually.
And there's nothing about my play that would justify blacklisting <_<
You're being offensive again.

Zwet at least read the last few posts in a game. You haven't done anything alike until Fate claimed for us. Regardless why, you made it some personal thing to get me lynched.

Last time you asked me to SHEEP Katsuki and you see how that ended, even though I TOLD you he was more likely a derpgambitter than a scumbag trying to discredit you.

I MEAN, with all the CAPS, I really have no IDEA why you are SHEEPING fate right NOW.

and I would be the one who was "retarded" (and you really have no clue who you are saying that to)

[mykonian]

sorry for the doublepost.

[mykonian]

Can someone explain why DRAM IS TOWN?

Because he's not on your side. And is town?

HOLY SHIT This new idea of "if I just state my views as an idea" i.e. "Elli is town, reck is scum" or whatever, then it's good enough, is fucking bullshit. Fate's doing it but he is functionally retarded, everyone else is doing it that has no fucking excuse. Everyone that is post their THEORIES on who is or isn't on what side at page EFFING TEN as fact is being lazy and pointless and more often than not gambling. Quit being lazy and post some goddamn facts and analysis or fuck right off.

scooby is distancing/bussing btw. He's arguing from the point where he is already right.

[mykonian]

How THE FUCK am I xvart's buddy?

Nocmen, you better start making sense because I'm not liking anything recent from you.

Dramonic OTOH just become CONFIRMED SCUM.

dramonic, why did you kill him?

Lol at scum thinking trekker had information regarding dramonic.

VOTE: DRAMONIC

the one that the mafia killed. i'm implying he's mafia.

Now then, once we've established there is a logical fail in that little shit attempt of Scooby, can we get back to lynching him.

So dram is seriously defending himself by claiming

"no that one wasn't the mafias kill"

?

Don't care how you did it, Trekkers dead is odd, and scooby found out why.

vote dram

Can we lynch this scum, fate? Please?

[mykonian]

The next day, Trekker is dead and his orange was stolen.

and scooby saw you with an orange...

[mykonian]

And everybody is gone.

Bunny over nocmen for me.

vote bunny

[mykonian]

Banshee, if you want iso's, there are a few other interesting ones.

And iso's hardly work if you want to see bunnies passivity.

[mykonian]

btw, before anyone mentions it, I'm totally disappointed you let Dramonic go with his horrible play because scooby's reasoning apparently doesn't follow. I mean, dram has been defensive this entire day, has tunneled and added nothing the whole of day 1 and reacted heavily on scooby day 2 and did little otherwise.

He's reactionary, by the book.

[mykonian]

Banshee, if you want iso's, there are a few other interesting ones.

And iso's hardly work if you want to see bunnies passivity.

I think Dramonic is likely the SK. If you wanna go ahead and lynch him based on that analysis it's okay, but I think he's just as likely to hit scum as town and maybe would even try to if we asked him nicely.

mmm, could be. He had little interaction with anyone, which reads more like mafia to me (avoiding his buddies). If you think he's an SK, you would lynch on the spot. That would mean less kills at night, which gives us instantly more mislynches.

[mykonian]

That would mean less kills at night, which gives us instantly more

mislynches

.

Mmmmm.

Oh you noob. And I say this never in a insulting way, but I definately mean it this time.

The less shots there are at night, the more opportunities town has at day to lynch scum. Usually this is counted in the amount of times you can be wrong from then on. The amount of mislynches you have left. Docs have the opportunity to increase that number, just as lynching an entire antitown faction will do.

Plus that you are manipulating this stuff by for once not posting anything but just bolding one word.

vote scooby

[mykonian]

no we don't.

[mykonian]

That would mean less kills at night, which gives us instantly more

mislynches

.

Mmmmm.

Oh you noob. And I say this never in a insulting way, but I definately mean it this time.

The less shots there are at night, the more opportunities town has at day to lynch scum. Usually this is counted in the amount of times you can be wrong from then on. The amount of mislynches you have left. Docs have the opportunity to increase that number, just as lynching an entire antitown faction will do.

Plus that you are manipulating this stuff by for once not posting anything but just bolding one word.

vote scooby

lol u mad

Yep. Being stupid is no offence. Manipulation is.

Seriously, you thought you could sell that I wanted to mislynch people?

[mykonian]

@Mykonian

: I notice that you and Fate apparently disagree on some scum suspects, which makes sense if you don't have daytalk imo. Who are your top few scum suspects in rough order? (I don't need town reads right now, but whatever you want to give would be appreciated.)

I'm having trouble on the interactions, because they can never be together in a scumteam, but scooby, dram, bunny, thejakalope are all at the top of the list. SC apparently plays more often like this, I have little experience with that, and for CSL goes the same. He used to be more active, but I think he no longer actually likes to play games and is just filling them up. That leaves out Oman, who I think gave up on the game already. This is nothing like him. Doubt he is scum, but he is an outsider.

[mykonian]

Do you think that the interactions between Dramonic and Scooby were distancing? How about between Nocmen and Scooby before Nocmen started sheeping him?

Is Bunny usually this lurky and non-contributory?

These questions are really for anyone, actually.

I do have one game of town-meta for TheJakalope (and he has scum-meta on me) so I do want to look at him more closely. At first read this looks like similar play from him though.

Nah, I'd say the way Dram went into scooby was too much of an escape from the game to make it on his buddy. The other way around I have to assume dram always plays like this, but it's the same reasoning. It took too much of their time to make it scum-scum. It was abused to make them look active.

I honestly don't have a clue on the second, would have to reread that.

Bunny, as I remember, has always been mislynch food. It has been some time that I played with bunny, probably pre-break. I'd bet it lurking was a part of it, but I couldn't tell for sure. Lurking is something different from passivity though.

[mykonian]

/prodded. I'm not going to be too active for a bit.

uhm, couldn't you just get replaced then?

[mykonian]

You should check thejakalopes iso too. Dram's isn't as funny anymore because he filled it with a lot of arguing with scooby, but still that one is quite obvious too.

That leaves out Oman, who I think gave up on the game already.

Nope, I'm just on this "X is town, Y is scum" wagon. It's a blast.

nah, you are wagonning Oman. You gave up.

[mykonian]

You gave up.

No.

Show me you didn't.

[mykonian]

LOL SCOOBY VOTES ON ME

LOL

" NO REASON AT ALL ERGO MASONS ARE SCUM"

So

NO reason at all

Cept to get fucks like you to go LOLMASONS ARE STILL ALIVE?

KA-LYNCH

You're fucking terribly scooby.

I hope you're scum

I told you so.

[mykonian]

You gave up.

No.

Show me you didn't.

I owe you nothing.

You are very right. I would still like to see it, because I've seen that you can do much better.

[mykonian]

I could care less.

You are a lazy ass mod that can't even update page 1.

50% of people posting, either post one lines or keep posting antiprods. and you, Prozac, of all things, are the principal guilty of it.

vote: abandonment.

Fixed

And no. Seriously, you are an ass, and you are a bigger ass for blaming the mod. You are here giving the mod trouble, first with a question for replacement because you suck too much.

Second with the insult, and it's that and no more. We aren't going to abandon because you need to cry, and all that post was meant to do was to blame Porochaz for all your problems.

[mykonian]

To mykonian

First, not only i had to tolerate your insults. I had to deal with your condescending ways. So you're being an asshole and a hypocrite here.

I actually care about winning this game. And I'm not only blaming prozac. I can tolerate games where there is 1 or 2 people posting one lines. But practically everyone here has joined the derp one line derp let's lynch thing. And the people who don't do that are either lurking or posting lol i'll post later. And it annoys me.

I told you you were a noob for not knowing (or pretending not to know) the concept of mislynches.

You are telling the mod he and his game sucks and everything is his fault and we better stop with the game. While you are the only one having problems here.

No way that even comes close to each other. Added to that, the mod is there providing a service for you. A bit of respect is in order, I would think.

[mykonian]

Lets hope it was just scooby being an idiot. Make us proud MoS.

vote Bunny

Say what you believe fate. You didn't think she was town, and you still don't if I read your posts. And the way bunny focusses only on our masonhood, with no other consideration for the rest of the game, makes this a perfect lynch.

[mykonian]

I'm missing the "uneven" with Oman, Bunny.

vote Bunny

Oh, and think like there is a rather large piece of text how the governer is by definition an antitown role, and that it should never ever be used, since the majority of the town apparently thought that lynch was a good idea.

And don't claim either, because A. I don't want to know you and B. You might actually do something positive for once if you manage to stay alive until we need to claim.

[mykonian]

NO IM NOT SORRY

AND YOU"LL SEE WHY POSTGAME

HINT:
IM FUCKING SCUM

Going to utterly ignore this, Mykonian? Not even a comment spared?

Interesting.

VOTE: Fate

Someone claims scum in thread. The person isn't a

complete

idiot. And eh, wait. Wasn't that the same guy that... yeah, that was him right? Isn't he the guy who talks to me at night?

"Interesting". I'd say buddy found. Bus as quick as you can, my friend. Run and you might not get caught.

[mykonian]

Yeah, lynch away. I'm town and it will give you TONS of town cred to lynch me.

I have no meta read on Fate but anyone who claims scum in thread as town is an idiot. There is literally NO pro-town reason to do that. none. So deflect more, scum.

Neither is there a pro scum reason to do that. So eh, you are honestly going to be mad at fate while scum is getting lynched. Because he claimed scum? And you are going to expect his masonbuddy to make a comment on that post (or even vote him).

Get real dude. You imagined a great start for this day I assume, but you are really not making sense.

[mykonian]

And as a note, if I am lynched or NKed, I'll flip town and I want someone to remember this moment when Mykonian chose to attack someone for noticing his buddy claimed scum (I assume in a drunk post) rather than actually answering as to why Fate might have done that. After all, as Mykonian so helpfully points out, he does talk to Fate at night. So he should know why he said it, right?

Just remember this when I flip.

Thanks, I don't drink. Are you always insulting people who are right about you? Seriously, you are arguing to make it even somewhat right what you posted and it wasn't. You live in a fantasy.

I have better things to do then to ask fate why he's fate.

[mykonian]

Why wouldn't you make a comment on that post? What is your pro-town motivation to say nothing, if you are a mason and Fate is your buddy? In your shoes, if I were a pro-town mason I'd be saying something and I'd have said something last night in mason-chat too, believe me. But you're all sunshine and roses and innocence like he didn't say a thing wrong.

Is that normal town behaviour after something like that? I don't think so.

I don't have to analyse Fate. I discuss reads. I don't care how he plays if it works for him and apparently it does. You are still arguing you are right in the fact that I have to criticise my masonbuddy. You live in a fantasy. It's not how this works. Keep arguing, it won't become the truth.

Wait, bunny told you fate fakeclaims mason, didn't he! God, who is again being lynched for the second time? Thanks Banshee, for taking over bunnies job and focussing completely at the evil Fate fooling you.

[mykonian]

2. I just completed a game where town claimed scum AND SK in some strange attempts to make points about ... something. It cost them the game.

and? you saw town do it, I tell you Fate is town. You believe bunny who tunneled completely on fate fakeclaiming mason as scum, the same bunny who is getting lynched now too.

And while you damn well know town claims scum apparently, you still want to lynch fate who practically lead the xvart and bunny lynches.


Try to talk this straight. I bet you can't give an answer in less words then me. Which means you need a damn elaborate lie here.

[mykonian]

and? you saw town do it, I tell you Fate is town. You believe bunny who tunneled completely on fate fakeclaiming mason as scum, the same bunny who is getting lynched now too.

And while you damn well know town claims scum apparently, you still want to lynch fate who practically lead the xvart and bunny lynches.


Try to talk this straight. I bet you can't give an answer in less words then me. Which means you need a damn elaborate lie here.

Fate claimed scum. Fate now doesn't want to lynch Bunny. Explain that, mason buddy.
Do you talk at night AT ALL?
Your anti-Bunny argument looks dumb now.
Fewer words, cool beans!

and then oman became a full cop. But 2 scum are just as good as one.

Xvart lynch lead wasn't good enough for you?

[mykonian]

I think he's going to frame you as guilty with that Fate.

On a more serious note: nah, poro isn't that kind of a mod. He's not a meta-breaker, he prefers a straight game.

[mykonian]

Ok, I give you they are bad votes. I don't think that tells anything about bunnies allignment in this case.

Still, that wagon gives more when it's slow. Everybody is there is equal now.

vote banshee

[mykonian]

You can't even convince your buddy Mykonian to vote me, so I'm not sure how you think things are going to work out for you here.

Good luck with that, though.

meh, nice ninja.

I think this was the "you aren't going to get me lynched card".

So you are actually worried

[mykonian]

So you are actually keeping the "claim scum = lynch" thing going.

Next time, and I know I'm not supposed to give scum advise, you should accept early that you were wrong or drop a point when it's starting to work against you. Arguing for something that is obviously wrong over multiple posts is only going to get you lynched.

[mykonian]

But you're right, you've tied yourself to Bunny now in a situation where TOWN cannot know her alignment. Therefore, you must either 1) be scum gambiting ever more wildly in an attempt to amuse yourself and take risks you haven't before, which is weird, or 2) be foolish enough to believe that just because a claimed cop clears you that somehow that confirms the cop. I don't think you're that foolish. Therefore, I think you're scum desperate to amuse yourself and I think your claim has to be tested at some point. Now, or after I'm lynched, it makes no difference to me.

I hope you don't mind if I quote selectively from that.

2) isn't to be taken serious. Which leaves 1). Which assumes that Fate has the intelligence of a chimp. And you leave out the easiest explanation. Fate didn't consider a cop result that was messed with. As long as you forget that a GF is possible, bunny would have to lie if fate was scum, making him scum too. Ergo, bunny would be tied to us too. Naturally, this doesn't work if Fate is a GF. Which would add another assumption to your "fate is stupid scum who fakeclaims himself into a certain loss for his own fun".

And you left the "but he claimed scum!" away completely. You are adding to your case along the way, always nitpicking on the last post. It's not the way town would ever make a case. You are convinced beforehand, and then make the case. Town would doubt along the way and fall back on earlier tells which convinced them initially. You are playing the fake scumhunting scum perfectly.

[mykonian]

Which leaves 1). Which assumes that Fate has the intelligence of a chimp. And you leave out the easiest explanation. Fate didn't consider a cop result that was messed with. As long as you forget that a GF is possible, bunny would have to lie if fate was scum, making him scum too. Ergo, bunny would be tied to us too. Naturally, this doesn't work if Fate is a GF. Which would add another assumption to your "fate is stupid scum who fakeclaims himself into a certain loss for his own fun".

I have no idea what you're on about here. If Fate and you are scum, you know you're scum. Fate wouldn't have to "consider a cop result" to know his own alignment. I don't know that Fate is scum, but Bunny giving a result on Fate and all three of you being around for the next day is pretty suspicious on someone's part. And Fate jumping right on the "Bunny is conftown no one dare accuse the Bunny!" after hammering her yesterday is scummy. You know it, I know it, and once I'm lynched maybe someone in the town will notice it too. Does it make Fate scum? Maybe. I don't know. But Fate was pushing a policy lynch on Bunny (by his own words) for being useless and lurky and god knows what all, so it's the height of hypocrisy to whine and OMGUS when the same treatment is turned back on him. And if you two ARE town and you're wrong about Bunny, you could lose us the game. If you're scum, I realise you don't care.

It's the other way around. You accuse Fate. For fate to be scum, I, and bunny would have to lie => making bunny scum too. What you try to argue for is a fatescum who locked his fate with two of his scumbuds for his own entertainment.

You are playing the fake scumhunting scum perfectly.

Really? I made myself a target and people jumped right on. I failed to fall into line with Fate and Fate's stupid gambits and now I'll be lynched for it. That's perfect fake scumhunting scum? Meh, I think you're afraid to see my flip and you're trying to make apologies for your attacks now (But she was playing the perfect scumhunting scum!? Omg how could I have known?) But no one is going to buy it. You went for the first person to question Fate, just like yesterday. Apparently you now think you were wrong yesterday, too, so my flip shouldn't be too much of a surprise

You didn't even read what the fake scumhunting was, did you. Because you are defending against the accusation.

And correction, Fate thinks he's wrong. You didn't read the post where I switched my vote, or you didn't understand it.

[mykonian]

*blinks*

Claimed cop. Claims inno on Fate. Fate lead onto xvart. Who was scum.

I think you have 5 minutes to realize you didn't read bunnies post and you really don't have a clue what you are doing.

[mykonian]

Oh never mind, check his iso. He's going to lurk till people forgot about him again. That was his proddodge, I guess.

scumhunting has never been so easy.

[mykonian]

Better idea.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Bunny

If it's anything but an odd-night cop flip, Masons are shite, lynch them.

Lol so you ARE scum this game.

LOL

Lynch the cop to confirm the masons HURRR

Even worse: lynch the masons to confirm them. wait, was there a cop result? Oh, lynch the cop then, I guess.

[mykonian]

Unvote:

Ok here's the deal. Banshee is town, as much as ID LIKE to mislynch her today like I tried to mislynched Bunny yesterday, she HAS to come around eventually. Aka after massclaim or after enough scum are dead or SOMETHING.

Banshee, you ARE playing against your win con. You are REFUSING to take information into account and

just putting your fingers in your ears

, and you are SAYING that "well Fate claimed scum which [you THINK] is anti-town so I dont have to provide content." Do you even have thoughts on any other players in the game? Nocmen, DX, etc? Plenty of scummy people out there.

No Fate. Bolded tells you why. He's arguing because it looks good and he convinced himself he isn't actually pushing a real mislynch. It's a classic.

And just see Banshee's first post. Oman's role is the first thing one would think of. He had his first attack planned.

[mykonian]

Annoying people are scum. It works. I can even explain why I think it works, but who cares.

[mykonian]

I don't want them turning to mislynch someone else.

I had never played with Fate before and basically I don't see a point to my existence in this game.

Town is following Fate fairly blindly in my view, any attempt to question this is met with an OMGUS attack times two, and there's no real sense of logic or argument.

I'm pretty sure town will either win or lose more efficiently without my help on this, and my playstyle in no way is compatible with this shrieking cursing attack that follows anything Fate doesn't like.

In short, I'm not the sort of player who enjoys this kind of constant abuse and I prefer to just be lynched in preference to whatever power-role townie Fate decides is the scum du jour next.

Well, duh...

Masons. Confirmed by a (ok, questionable) cop. And you keep arguing fate's scum. And when that backfires (surprise surprise) you go into give up mode and ask for the lynch.

And now you blame (hey surprise again) fate again for everything bad in this game. Boohoo.

[mykonian]

Masons. Confirmed by a (ok, questionable) cop. And you keep arguing fate's scum. And when that backfires (surprise surprise) you go into give up mode and ask for the lynch.

And now you blame (hey surprise again) fate again for everything bad in this game. Boohoo.

No, you've misread completely, I think.

I don't know if Fate is scum. I hate when people claim scum in thread, much as Fate hated Bunny's playstyle and pursued a policy lynch on her and didn't care whether or not she was scum. You do remember that, right? It was just yesterday. So even though I really haven't ever had policy lynches as such, I decided that it was time to make a stand against this particular thing. There's no way I can get Fate lynched in this game, and I'm pretty sure everyone knows this. Apparently claiming scum in thread is considered an acceptable town gambit now, even though I've just been through a game where it cost town the game pretty comprehensively.

You argued for his lynch. And then masons, cop etc.

Mykonian, why is it okay for Fate to curse at everyone but if I suggest he might have been drinking, suddenly I've made a horrible personal attack? I am just curious on that one.

fate has the decency not to curse at me, and I misread that sentence (you corrected that later) where I though you discarded

my

post as being a drunkpost. You'd be annoyed too when somebody just discarded your nice argument as a drunkpost.

[mykonian]

Note: Noone claimed Town Governor.

Therefore, it can be assumed to be anti-town.

Therefore, it can be assumed Bunny is anti-town too.

I'd love it if people read my posts. Would be really nice.

[mykonian]

See the second part.

I doubt the Mason claim, and I doubt the Cop claim. A Town-Governor would have no problem revealing to show themselves as saving the Cop, and Scum would have no interest in saving a real cop.

The remaining Scum are Fate, Myko and Bunny, in my opinion.

Anyone else wants to claim a powerrole? Because DX wants to lynch you. (the governer was scum too, remember?).

This is a joke.

[mykonian]

I second both posts from Fate.

A day has been taken off the deadline due to lack of posting.

This isn't fair oman. We had two pages yesterday, which isn't exceptionally low for day four. There was nobody who needed to be prodded and even someone who has been going through this game proddodging (DX), became miraculously active. CSL, the worst offender, is an ass, but don't blame the rest of the game.

That apart from the fact that you are having an influence on the game, which you shouldn't. But that's theory.

[mykonian]

It's insane. The only reason this is on discussion is paranoid panic. There is no reason to suspect fate, but the fact that this is so much in the spotlight means that everybody wants to have an opinion about it. And too many players are too clueless to see that Fate lead the lynch on Xvart, has been the most scumhunting player in this game.

Seriously, is there anyone having a serious reason to suspect Fate? Apart from being totally paranoid about a huge scum gambit.

[mykonian]

VOTE: TheJakalope

Just stop.

Mind giving any explanation to this?

PANIC.

By absence of a vig, a jakalope lynch is certainly not a bad one. Or it's just an escape from a terribad vote to a vote that can't be argued against.

Lets see how this plays out.

[mykonian]

yes fate, you were right, we are keeping this one.

unvote banshee, vote DX

[mykonian]

Oh, I'm probably one of the people who called you a he. I don't know, banshee apparently sounds male to me.

And Fate shouldn't have claimed, it's a wonder we are still alive. Nobody would have hammered that damned quick wagon with no basis.

And DX is scum. You want overconfident? I'd say calling in consecutive order the governer, the cop, and the two masons scum counts. And DX isn't the clueless person he acts like here.

[mykonian]

Myko a number of fucks made it VERY CLEAR that they were gonna sit on your wagon until a claim happened. I was moving the day FORWARD.
Plus I made it completely obvious I had role related info you were town

Sorry, I should have kept this between us. But a lot of bleeps were on my wagon, and not so many beyond that.

About games moving forward, bye DX. I sure hope nobody is going to fall for that claim.

[mykonian]

About games moving forward, bye DX. I sure hope nobody is going to fall for that claim.

Since he's been hammered already and the "bye DX" indicates that you know this, I don't know who this last comment is intended for. I don't think Porochaz will be influenced by DavidX's post-lynch claim

You know my thoughts about governers now (see my first post today), and I don't doubt that mods could use a full town governer because he screws the town over anyway.

And yeah, post lynch claims etc. Trauma from the bunny lynch, I'm sure.

[mykonian]

What are the basics of this game?

This game is one with no unusual mechanics, but has lots of flavour that you don't need to watch a TV show or read a comic for.
The roles aren't new and aren't made up off the top of my head, everything here has been found in the wiki and has been played before.
The game is more than likely to be swingy, but not bastard mod, I have done my upmost to keep the game as balanced as possible.

Doubt it. Lynchproof is hardly standard. I wouldn't expect prozac to put a lynchproof scum into the game.

Hardly makes bunny town though. The easiest explanation is that there was a rolehappy governer.

[mykonian]

COnsidering you`re now all about bunnytown, I dont see what you`re complaining about.

Fate

Myko

Four letters, different names.

(no seriously, are people expecting me to agree with fate all the time? I support him because I know his allignment, but that's it.)

[mykonian]

Hi all. I replaced in during the night.

Either you are a hero or you just like reading 50 pages. Good luck anyway, dear master of the game.

Fate - Joseph Rayne - Doorman - Governor - Beheaded Night 4

Well, it's out now: this is Fate his gimmick. I've seen him do it in the last three games I modded with him in it. He picks his top town read, and claims mason with that person as soon as they come close to a lynch to keep it from happening. It works better then "he's my top town read" because people then just go on. So yeah, we weren't masons. I hadn't seen Fate do it as scum, but apparently he abused this meta once, and I could have been a very good target for that, since I saw the mason claim as a continuation of his earlier town play.

Yes, all you "fate fakeclaimed" mason people were totally right. A quick look at Fate's previous games would have told you it was very likely. However, he was town and I apparently his best town read.

[mykonian]

myko, who's scum here?

Dram, Thejakalope, MoS, Bunnylover, strangercoug. Banshee town.

Rest null lurking scumtown. Make me happy.

[mykonian]

Some people are way too happy that they won't get investigated.

Bunny, don't claim beforehand who you are going to investigate. If that person gets killed, you've got nothing.

[mykonian]

vote Dram

. The guy is lurking scummily. Compared to others which are just lurking.

[mykonian]

Sooooo myk, want to explain why Fate isn't a mason?

Oh, sure.

[mykonian]

vote Dram

. The guy is lurking scummily. Compared to others which are just lurking.

How is Dramonic's lurking different from that of others? Is that the main reason to vote for him?

No actually the fact that he tunneled hardcore day one, didn't have a clue what was going on, then at the moment his target was no longer available picked a fight with scooby, posted lots of fluff, but added little of interest, further was usually active when he was suspected and the fact that he left his vote on bunny yesterday while Fate got us through several wagons at a bit of speed, which reads to me as cautious scum.

Which in the end just amounts to Dramonic taking as little risk as he possibly can.

[mykonian]

Bunnylover has an innocent on Dramonic

Sorry Myko, but your princess is in another castle!

Reads > roles.

[mykonian]

There are 2 scum left

, so Bunny lying is a possibility.
You having picked Fate and Myko to kill as SK is WIFOM.
Fate was a townread in addition to having an innocent on him. You are a scumread and have an innocent. The innocent does not make you conftown.

Ok, I'm living on 2.5 hours of sleep which are already too long gone, but eh, where did we get that setup information?

vote thejakalope

. You should have stuck with lurking.

[mykonian]

That's pretty shit logic for a Jak vote. I'd go so far as to assume there are two, maybe three scum left if an SK is present. Haven't looked at the dead pile to see who did what when specifically, but I got that number simply by counting the total of the playerlist. Pretty easy to deduce that.

Skim thejak's iso. Check the amount of posts in the whole game. Check thejak's. See if there is a lot of content in thejak's posts. And take from me that most if not all of his votes were blatant bandwagon votes.

He said finally added something to the discussion, and it was the certainty that there were 2 scum left. I mean, as far as slips about the setup go, that's pretty much as good as it is going to get. So, can we please have a thejak lynch now?

[mykonian]

I still believe that either Reck or David is scum. But I'll support an xvart lynch as well.

VOTE: xvart

Doesn't read like bussing to me.

Sorry.

Reads to me as the classic: "meh, if you like to. I'd rather hop off though" sheeping of Fate. The fact that the wagon then took off had little to do with thejak's intentions.

[mykonian]

ask bunny again if he is really sure there isn't a godfather in the game, since his result is everything that is keeping Dram alive. When that fails again, probably, I'll tell the town that MoS's play is just as scummy as scooby who he replaced and that 2 times scummy is quite lynchworthy.

But they aren't on this wagon, which means they are probably now lurking again hoping this wagon will go away. And the moment to bus is already past us, so I guess we are waiting for some townie to wake up and hammer this wagon.

[mykonian]

Wait, so it's scummy to have distrusted a fake mason claim? Lawl...

OMG you were so right!

Now, how often have you seen a town fakeclaiming mason? You just inserted paranoia... and did nothing else. Fate isn't scum, I am not scum and now you are just lurking and popping in as soon as you are named.

[mykonian]

VOTE: mykonian

A weak vote like that last one this late in the game? Because he was certain about the number of scum and just came off an active lurking stint? You're killing me, smalls. That's not a D5 worthy vote and you know it, myscum. You're floating an easy mislynch here.

the guy, has never, in this whole game, done anything but making bandwagon votes. "Just came off an active lurking stint" doesn't really cover what is going on here. But sure, be paranoid and be thejak's white knight. I don't mind as long as it's temporary.

[mykonian]

If there would actually be any reason to lynch me, that question would still make no sense.

Anything constructive to add?

[mykonian]

If there would actually be any reason to lynch me, that question would still make no sense.

Anything constructive to add?

Besides the fact the sole reason I've let you off is Fate claiming mason, I think I still am trapped in my belief that you are scum.

Poor thing.

Find the damned key and do something.

[mykonian]

So, are we really going to wait for flippo to complete his reread or is there any chance we can set up a wagon for a scumlynch here?

[mykonian]

Day 5 Votecount 1

Katsuki - 1 - Bunnylover
TheJackalope - 4 - Nocmen, Banshee, mykonian, StrangerCoug

dramonic - 1 - TheJackalope

mykonian - 1 - chkflip

Not Voting - 3 - dram, katsuki, MoS

Deadline is in 16.5 days.

Distancing? Who cares, we have a new wagon!

vote dram

[mykonian]

I've been thinking about it more.

I still don't trust myko, especially with the Fate flip.

It just makes that much more sense for scum to agree with a fake mason claim than town.

And then you add it to new vote jumps like that right above, and now I feel even more suspicion.

Guy, I had seen it three times as a mod that Fate did it as town. And I was at L-2.

[mykonian]

Logic, logic. Read my posts, see what I've done, and tell me what role I have. There is no case on me, there never has been one. But people keep saying I'm scum and putting me halfway on the list. It's keeping someone as a possible lynch, nothing more. Apart from that wagon that made Fate claim, town hasn't been so damn bandwagonny to lynch a person with no case at all.

[mykonian]

Logic, logic. Read my posts, see what I've done, and tell me what role I have. There is no case on me, there never has been one. But people keep saying I'm scum and putting me halfway on the list. It's keeping someone as a possible lynch, nothing more. Apart from that wagon that made Fate claim, town hasn't been so damn bandwagonny to lynch a person with no case at all.

[mykonian]

vote MoS

I mean, what did he add in those last posts? "kat would you trust fate after that and that?" and three theory posts. He's avoiding to post reads. And with scooby's history, MoS is just scum.

[mykonian]

Banshee, the case at where I voted for is that MoS hasn't given any reads and fill his posts with theory in stead of scumhunting. It's a way to look active and do little.

[mykonian]

I single him out for doing stuff which scum does, avoiding having to do what town does. There are enough people not doing what town does, so MS gets a step higher then them on the scumlist.

Top side of neutral. Fate must have protected him for a reason I cannot understand, but I have enough fate in Fate to leave him alive.

[mykonian]

godfather/sk, thejak?

Townies don't want to be investigated

[mykonian]

I'm going to float a theory, and those with more experience with Fate can tell me how likely they think it is.

We know now that Fate was a governor. That means he did not have to claim mason buddies with Mykonian in order to save Myko's life. He could have simply overruled the lynch if he felt it was a bad lynch, which in fact he did for Bunnylover. He had two options (three, if you count ignoring the lynch and just letting it happen). In one case, he chose claiming mason buddies; in the other, he chose governor.

Well, obviously he couldn't claim mason buddies with Bunnylover, so that's one explanation of sorts. But I'm wondering if Fate had another plan in mind.

If Fate thought Mykonian was scum, then he might have claimed mason with Mykonian knowing that Mykonian knew his meta and, even as town, would not reject this claim. It would be a safe move for Fate and might keep him alive longer, since scum would be reluctant to kill him and thus open up Mykonian to question about the mason claim.

SO, if Fate tried to claim mason with Myko because he thought Myko was scum in lieu of using the governor pardon on him, then I don't think Myko would have allowed him to be killed and to confirm that. Fate had shown no signs of backing down from his mason claim or of attacking Myko. So why would Myko-scum allow his security to be killed?

My answer is, he wouldn't. So, if Mykonian is scum, you have to believe that Fate was more dangerous to him alive than dead. That means that Fate was zeroing in on something. If this is the theory being floated by those on the Myko-is-scum lynching committee, I want some evidence of what Fate was on to that made Mykonian so nervous he was willing to kill his alibi. Without that, there's no smoking gun to lynch Myko.

Mykonian is not confirmed town. There are no confirmed townies, not me, not Bunnylover, not Myko, no one. But Myko is not the most likely scum and he's surely not the lynch for today.

Corrections on my logic are requested and welcome.

This makes absolutely no sense. If Fate thought Mykonian was scum, why put out a random mason claim gambit that saved Myk from being lynched? If Fate thought Myk was scum, the best option was to let the lynch go through. It is obvious that Fate thought Myk was town, that's not even something that should be under debate.

Fate wouldn't want to waste his governor ability when he felt he could gambit to keep Myk alive.

Uhh...have you ever played with a governor before, Banshee? The ability to stop a lynch EVERY day is ridiculously broken and puts the entire game in the hands of a single player. This isn't Kingmaker or Consulmaker, this is a basic theme game. At best he might have had two shots, but I'm guessing the ability could only be used once.

Tell me, between which lines did I have to read or is this just filler?

[mykonian]

If Fate thought Myko was 100% town, MoS, why wouldn't he have just used his governor power on him?

Why go through the mason claim if he didn't have to? I think it's about 50/50 that Fate was trying to avoid being killed right away (does that happen a lot?) or that he thought Myko was town. I don't think it's beyond the pale that Fate would try to link himself to a scum in order to stay in the game longer. He's willing to gambit claim mason with people who may not even be town; why is my theory so much stranger than that anyway?

I'm not saying I'm right. I'm just saying that I thought about it as a possibility but then had to discard it as irrelevant when I realised that scum-Myko would never have killed town-Fate this early given the circumstances. So it honestly doesn't matter what Fate thought in any case and I'm sure he'll tell us after the game. It only matters that Myko is probably not scum because scum-Myko would have kept town-Fate alive longer imo.

This gives opinions. A train of thought. Then MoS tells you how strong the governer is. That's theory, this is scumhunting.

If the above isn't understandable, I'm sorry. It's early, or late, depending on how you look at the clock.

[mykonian]

I hate that chkflip is agreeing with me, if only because his vote on myk is so terrible right now.

Check the post stamps. If we take 48-72 hours from the post as the maximum 72 hours, Chkflip was two hours from prod range. That was a proddodge telling us it's all very difficult to read and "oh yeah myko is still scum".

Lets not do that again chk, otherwise you earn my vote. The fact that you haven't passed D2 yet and have no conclusions from those days is not a sign that you are actually trying to reread.


And to throw another tell into this: it's page 53. There is lots of information and lots of possible wagons. And there are three people voting no-one: dram, katsuki, MoS.

I wouldn't mind a kat lynch either.

vote Kat

. Bunny, we have a wagon.

[mykonian]

chkflp has been prodded.

Wanna try that again, myko?

Only makes you a little less clever. You didn't dodge the prod, but just made a post to satisfy the mod.

I'd like you to satisfy me, and don't post that stuff in d2 is so terribly hard to read and that you have no conclusions from d1 either.

[mykonian]

Dude, it's D5. Absolutely nothing that I could say hasn't been said. I'm not going to "satisfy" you by any means, only solidify my reads in one direction or the other.

Say stuff of your own. And you need reads to solidify one way or another. Please share them when you get them.

[mykonian]

Dude, it's D5. Absolutely nothing that I could say hasn't been said. I'm not going to "satisfy" you by any means, only solidify my reads in one direction or the other.

Reiterating your case is sometimes necessary. The answer may be "look at post X", but the answer is never "screw you" or anything to that effect.

FoS: chkflip

reiterating what case

There are 5 playernames in those posts. He states he wants to lynch dram, god knows why. He says he hopes ludi is alright, the guy who he replaced, and he calls two votes of me terrible, being on thejak and MoS, both people he says nothing else about. Which leaves me, who got pretty much all chkflips attention.

Now who believes flippo has actually reread?

(SC, you were aware that he has just been here for today, right?)

[mykonian]

Come on guys. There are no wagons, votes are all over the place and everybody needs prods or is posting little to no content. I mean, how clear do you want the signs to be that this town is losing? We need to step it up now.

[mykonian]

You know I'm with you there Banshee. But it seems pretty much impossible to get any kind of life into this game. People wagon or sit at a wagon, but there are no reads from most of the players.

[mykonian]

any last words thejak?

[mykonian]

OH YES, FATE DEFINATELY PULLED OFF ON LYNCHING KATSCUM

Fate shifting the wagon off of me after my claim alone should have confirmed me as town, come to think of it.


=============[ ]

you totally did that on purpose.

vote thejak

[mykonian]

Myko you do realize that the only reason WHY you're still alive is because Fate chose to fake a mason claim on you, right?

Fate has just proven to read you very badly after a claim in a game with you and me in it. (just finished @mod). Such a fun way to confirm your way town via Fate right at this moment.

Don't mistake me, I do enjoy the irony of that post.

[mykonian]

Day 1

Nocmen - 8 -

Blackberry

,

Reck

, chkflip, myko,

Fate

,

TheJackalope

, Katsuki,

Banshee

Bogre

- 10 -

Flameaxe

,

Fate

,

TheJackalope

,

David

,

Blackberry

,

Elli

, myko,

Trekkers

,

xvart

, Bunnylover

Day 2

myko - 3 - nocmen, katsuki, MoS
Katsuki - 8 -

Fate

,

David

, chkflip, Stranger,

Reck

,

Oman

, Nocmen,

xvart

xvart

- 9 -

Fate

,

Reck

, Bunnylover,

TheJackalope

, katsuki,

Ellibereth

, MoS, dramonic, chkflip

Day 3

dramonic - 5 - MoS, Nocmen, mykonian,

TheJackalope

, StrangerCoug
Bunny - 7 -

Fate

, Katsuki, chkflip,

Oman

,

Elli

,

TheJackalope

,

David

Day 4

Bunny - 4 - Stranger, dram, nocmen, mos

Banshee

- 4 -

Fate

, myko, bunny,

TheJackalope

David

- 6 -

Fate

, Nocmen,

TheJackalope

, StrangerCoug, Bunnylover, mykonian

Day 5

Katsuki - 3 - Bunnylover, mykonian,

TheJackalope

TheJackalope

- 6 - Nocmen, StrangerCoug, Katsuki,

Banshee

, chkflp, mykonian

Lets not forget you. There was only one wagon scooby ended up with, and, hey, I'm missing my rocketwagon? He was on there too. Otherwise, apart from being at the end of the Elli wagon, scooby did very little other then filling the thread with useless rage.

1) Stranger, Nocmen, and myko: Why weren't you on the xvart wagon?

IIRC, I didn't see the reason why Fate led that wagon, and I didn't like at all how it formed, seen that some people I distrusted hopped on too easily. Might be that there was a counterwagon which I liked better.

vote MoS

Yes, exactly for that post.

[mykonian]

Guys, I need a few more on the MoS wagon to make him sweat. You aren't going to tell me you liked that bandwagon analysis post by him, are you? So do the logical thing and vote some scum.

[mykonian]

I wish I was as certain of my cases here as I was there. This game is really going nowhere.

As for people thinking I'm scummy, that seems to happen every single game. As long as they don't lynch me for it, I'm fine. It's really amazing to see that I get lynched in games where no cases are made, and I'm not lynched in games where cases form the basis. Cases catch myko scum, using gut gets myko lynched pretty much every single game. Hoopla says I'm stretching to conclusions, she's probably the best one to tell me what I'm doing wrong.

Stretching to conclusions I might be, but I do catch scum with it now and then and it always makes sense. To me at least, and to a good reader too.

Just take that big post by MoS. I really dislike it, even forgetting about scooby's and MoS's play beforehand. And I'll tell you why:

In a long game, scum have a problem compared to a short game: at some point they ran out of their targets, either because the town finds your target to by townie, or they got lynched already. In short, you need some new goals. For town, this means getting reads from posts. For scum this is harder to fake, so what is the ideal solution? A reread. A cold hard analysis which gives a set of lynch targets automatically. So, straight at the start of the day, after MoS nightkilled banshee and he had thought about the goals next day and realised he didn't know exactly where to go, he posted a bandwagon analysis. And I don't have to tell you how they can be manipulated by scum, because bandwagon analysis is such a crude way of scumhunting, as long as you are only looking at placement on the wagon. Scum are countering to that already for a long time. So MoS is looking very brilliantly scumhunting with his analysis and subsequent questions, but in fact he has just given himself a set of targets, and further bases on that post a few other posts asking questions to look active.

want to know why he just asks them to look active? Just check what his reactions on the answers are: they aren't there.

MoS states that he could have gone for an easy mislynch like SC or chkflip. I ask you, who wants to lynch SC after fate called him town based on meta? Who thinks chkflip is a good choice after he so bluntly disagreed with the direction I was taking, showing pure paranoia while the town considered me townie? Those aren't easy mislynches at all, and I honestly don't see any reason to pursue either.

TL;DR you really need to be on the MoS wagon.

[mykonian]

I wish I was as certain of my cases here as I was there. This game is really going nowhere.

As for people thinking I'm scummy, that seems to happen every single game. As long as they don't lynch me for it, I'm fine. It's really amazing to see that I get lynched in games where no cases are made, and I'm not lynched in games where cases form the basis. Cases catch myko scum, using gut gets myko lynched pretty much every single game. Hoopla says I'm stretching to conclusions, she's probably the best one to tell me what I'm doing wrong.

Stretching to conclusions I might be, but I do catch scum with it now and then and it always makes sense. To me at least, and to a good reader too.

Just take that big post by MoS. I really dislike it, even forgetting about scooby's and MoS's play beforehand. And I'll tell you why:

In a long game, scum have a problem compared to a short game: at some point they ran out of their targets, either because the town finds your target to by townie, or they got lynched already. In short, you need some new goals. For town, this means getting reads from posts. For scum this is harder to fake, so what is the ideal solution? A reread. A cold hard analysis which gives a set of lynch targets automatically. So, straight at the start of the day, after MoS nightkilled banshee and he had thought about the goals next day and realised he didn't know exactly where to go, he posted a bandwagon analysis. And I don't have to tell you how they can be manipulated by scum, because bandwagon analysis is such a crude way of scumhunting, as long as you are only looking at placement on the wagon. Scum are countering to that already for a long time. So MoS is looking very brilliantly scumhunting with his analysis and subsequent questions, but in fact he has just given himself a set of targets, and further bases on that post a few other posts asking questions to look active.

want to know why he just asks them to look active? Just check what his reactions on the answers are: they aren't there.

MoS states that he could have gone for an easy mislynch like SC or chkflip. I ask you, who wants to lynch SC after fate called him town based on meta? Who thinks chkflip is a good choice after he so bluntly disagreed with the direction I was taking, showing pure paranoia while the town considered me townie? Those aren't easy mislynches at all, and I honestly don't see any reason to pursue either.

TL;DR you really need to be on the MoS wagon.

Still on V/LA right now, but my first reaction to this is the absurdity of not taking into account the fact that I'm a replacement into this game that has not read this game through all the way, so the #1 best way for me to scumhunt at this point is to go back and look at trends in this game, since I'm not familiar with everything that has happened.

Additionally, there's no way in hell I would have killed Banshee, he was actually a decent lynch target. If I was scum I would have killed Bunnylover or myko. I see what you did there, though, trying to attribute the nightkill to me as if it was already a given. Sneaky.

Interesting shift here by myko/chkflip, though. I need to go back and look at their connections, I'm kinda surprised to see myko defending chkflip all of a sudden.

On a somewhat out-of-game note, if you are scum myko, I commend you for trying to take me on head to head. Sure, the scooby VI thing gives you an easy way to base your case, but it's still commendable that you aren't taking the easy way out by going after someone who has actually done something verifiable as scummy during the course of this game.

You seem to miss that the key point is that you do such a large analysis right at the start of the day. Town can do it at any point. Scum do it at the start of the day to get targets for a mislynch.

The fact that you have problems with me thinking chkflip is odd to me. There wouldn't be any sane scum who would try to lynch me yesterday. It's just going to make you look bad. However, I did my share of leading and poking, and I can totally see a town be paranoid about that, since it's quite out of his control. Chkflip voting me doesn't at all make that I have to think chkflip scum.

[mykonian]

but lets be honest, you aren't sure you get anything in this game, since you are lurking scum who doesn't bother to follow the thread. Just bus your buddy while it doesn't look too bad.

[mykonian]

You seem to miss that the key point is that you do such a large analysis right at the start of the day. Town can do it at any point. Scum do it at the start of the day to get targets for a mislynch.

When else was I supposed to do it? Why the hell would I delay it to post it in the middle of the day? That doesn't even make sense.

The fact that you have problems with me thinking chkflip is odd to me. There wouldn't be any sane scum who would try to lynch me yesterday. It's just going to make you look bad. However, I did my share of leading and poking, and I can totally see a town be paranoid about that, since it's quite out of his control. Chkflip voting me doesn't at all make that I have to think chkflip scum.

Wait, so you think chkflip is town because he was paranoid about you, but you completely ignore the fact that he just parked his vote on you until he could hop onto the Jakobvtownwagon without any reasoning? He even TOLD us that he thought Jak was town and voted to lynch him ANYWAY! And you don't find that suspicious AT ALL!?

Why would scum ever do something that blatantly logically wrong? Scum do like to point out inconsistencies, town happen to care less about them. They argue easily, and they don't catch scum.

So no, not getting scumvibes for chkflip.

[mykonian]

Scum do that because they like to push mislynches through. Letting them get away with it is how towns lose.

Town never has a reason to lynch people they think are town.

Nor do scum have a reason to vote a top town player. It's just going to look bad.

And I can totally see why while rereading he decided to change his read. Town are allowed to change their read.

Why no vote on chkflip if you are so eager to make sure I don't have a townread on him? You aren't pushing for his lynch, and you react on the fact that I call chkflip town.

[mykonian]

Scum do that because they like to push mislynches through. Letting them get away with it is how towns lose.

Town never has a reason to lynch people they think are town.

Nor do scum have a reason to vote a top town player. It's just going to look bad.

You're not a top town player. You haven't been since Fate died. Stop fooling yourself.

See the reaction chkflip got when he voted me. I think there were two or three posts saying "don't be so silly". That's plenty for me to say that it would be an idiotic scummove.

And I can totally see why while rereading he decided to change his read. Town are allowed to change their read.

Why no vote on chkflip if you are so eager to make sure I don't have a townread on him? You aren't pushing for his lynch, and you react on the fact that I call chkflip town.

Because I'm not sure if chkflip is the best lynch yet, but your town read on him came out of left field. Unlike you, I'm not going to go guns blazing with my vote until I have more evidence to back it up. Unlike you, I'm not just hoping to push a lynch through before people realize that I don't have shit to show for it.

Uhm, no. You don't feel like moving your vote because you hardly have a decent case on him, and you are just going to argue against a townread that doesn't suit you since chkflip was apparently on your "going to mislynch" list for that thejak vote.

And unlike you, I didn't suddenly start calling someone town after this:

Check the post stamps. If we take 48-72 hours from the post as the maximum 72 hours, Chkflip was two hours from prod range. That was a proddodge telling us it's all very difficult to read and "oh yeah myko is still scum".Lets not do that again chk, otherwise you earn my vote. The fact that you haven't passed D2 yet and have no conclusions from those days is not a sign that you are actually trying to reread.

When chkflip was voting you, you were all about how scummy he was for doing so and how he wasn't reading the game. Now that he's changed his mind, you suddenly think he's town

because he had been voting you

? Bullshit. You've tried to justify two completely opposite reads on chkflip using the EXACT same reasoning.

Exactly. The vote on me was silly. Then chkflip stopped being silly and made the right vote. I then thought he was town. You are getting quite determined at arguing against this townread MoS. Are you sure you want to park your vote at SC, who isn't going to be lynched ever if you aren't going to try to get a bandwagon?

[mykonian]

Massclaim is not a bad idea. I wouldn't mind if MoS and Dramonic were early in the list of people to claim.

[mykonian]

chkflip or MS, first here, first to claim. We need stuff to get going here. I have to bump this thread up from way too low.

[mykonian]

I thought the same dram, though I doubt flavor would help us.

Vanilla.

MoS please.

[mykonian]

My name is Lindsay Milward, I'm a gambler. I'm here because I think gambling is exciting, and the people around think I'm a bit addicted.

[mykonian]

N1 Dram innocent, N3 Fate innocent, N5 RB'ed.

It's all there Kat.

[mykonian]

I'm just trying to determine whether that's possible.

With Bunny not getting a result last night, these are the options that make him town

1. Town RB - Unlikely, given that Reck was a RB
2. Town Jailkeeper - Again, unlikely now with the mass claim.
3. Scum RB - Possible, but doesn't explain the kill missing, unless its a SK/RB ?
4. Untargettable Scum

I really don't buy any of those.

Unvote, Vote: Bunnylover

And I forgot about Oman's role. Who was a full cop.

vote Bunnylover

That was the original case.

[mykonian]

Congrats town.

This game made me sad. I've probably never played better as scum, I told various people very clearly I was scum, didn't even bother to follow my town meta from time to time, and apart from that rocketwagon (stopped by fates claim, thank you again), you simply refused to lynch me. And well, endgame... Lets say that I would have wanted a lot of small and big things to have been different.

[mykonian]

Got mykonian-scum from the start? Yup.

oh, how I was waiting for this post. You were the person, apart from scooby, who I practically told I was mafia. And I even know you listened. After the first point made against you, where I had the idea that Fate would back it up, I was trolling you. And from the later posts that day I can even see you

knew

. You were laughing it off, or even trying to beat me at trolling.

So you managed to fill the thread with a lot of useless banter, you even knew I was trying to encite reactions from you with no further use, and you never went into lynch-mode. At the time of your death, you had had your use. With all those filler in thread, you made it already hard for several people to keep up with the game.

Congrats Reck, you knew I was scum, I mean, you must have known. And you didn't lynch me, and did get the town in a situation where apathy ruled.

[mykonian]

Also, what the hell did I do that warranted that first D1 wagon? Still confused on that, though it didn't really hurt my team.

I think my best play was the reasoning on why I wanted to kill Reck/SC. Definitely ended well?

Now, Fate, why should I consider this Katsuki wagon as anything but mindless banter/personal feud/jokes?

Nocmen, this post is going to get you attention. And it's rather typical for your later game. You are rather passive. Here you are asking the obvious (it's a rethorical question, right)... and doing absolutely nothing. I coached in the post where I voted. I gave exactly the reasons why that was scummy. It wasn't a wagon that a buddy could avoid. I was just hoping that even with Fate in the game the first wagon wouldn't make it (because it never does). It didn't hurt, because you got some mysterious towncred from it. But in the endgame, you show you haven't learned a thing from it. For a lot of the game people didn't care about you, but at the point where they are actually searching again, you pop up because of your unnatural passivity. Town does things. That means you have to do so too.

[mykonian]

Pardon if this is in the blue team's QT (busy checking other stuff right now), but who killed me?

I pulled the trigger. Nocmen made the call. I had no clue who was the last scum, nocmen had.

[mykonian]

On a somewhat out-of-game note, if you are scum myko, I commend you for trying to take me on head to head. Sure, the scooby VI thing gives you an easy way to base your case, but it's still commendable that you aren't taking the easy way out by going after someone who has actually done something verifiable as scummy during the course of this game.

I just wanted to go back and say that I actually did mean this. Myko played with a lot of balls this game after Fate's mason claim, and it definitely took balls to try and run me up while I was on to you guys.

Thanks, it was, and is appreciated. Such a shame that massclaim ruined every chance at that wagon. If bunny and nocmen had just voted you, nobody would have bothered about it and I think this town would have been on it's knees with just SC being able to evade us and maybe win it. One of the things that in hindsight made me so sad. We were so close