Mafia 119: MURDER AT HOTEL DEATH(GAME OVER)

[curiouskarmadog]

vote vollkan

, more respect....of course, last time you were scum.....and I was wrong about you

[curiouskarmadog]

also here is something everyone can mull over during the random vote stage, I will be partially claiming today (no not a miller)..not anytime soon, it is not information for today, but information that town will need in the future. But I think it should be out there before we go into Night 1. Once you here the claim, you will understand why.

[curiouskarmadog]

here=hear.

[curiouskarmadog]

No post restriction though?

no

[curiouskarmadog]

yeah, we should not lynch until my claim...that being said, my claim will have no bearing on today's lynch....my claim mostly revolves around "if I should die, then you need to know this"..I will claim it later in the "day". I am not being cryptic or anything, just that I feel this information (partial) needs to be out there just in case I die. Blah blah blah, it will make sense once I claim.

[curiouskarmadog]

CKD deserves an

FOS

until he explains himself berrter.

curious as to what anything I have said is scummy.

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote, vote Espeonage

sketchy play.

if this gets to -1 (-3) do not hammer, it is in the town best interest that I get this info out today.


.........

actually, -1, doesnt really matter....going to claim (again just partial) next time I jump on (later today/tomorrow)...just dont have the time at the moment.

[curiouskarmadog]

here is the partial claim and why I think it is important that I tell you.

I am one part of a neighbor. My neighbor is totallynotmafia. I am not sure why he is not talking now, we talked before the game started....(we cant talk during the day). I do not know his alignment.

together we have a "vig-like" ability. Dont want to get into the mechanic(and there is more to it), but we both have to decide who to kill. If we cant decide, it doesnt happen. Now, why am I telling you this? Well, if one of us dies, then the other can use the vig like ability alone. Now I cant imagine the mod would give scum an extra kill like that, but again, i dont know my neighbor's alignment.

My fear is that I will be offed tonight, without telling you this. then if my neighbor IS indeed scum, there will be an additional kill and no one will know where it was coming from.

[curiouskarmadog]

thoughts?...should I have claimed, why or why not?

[curiouskarmadog]

well I can question the mod all day...but here are the facts.

I have a neighbor i must work with.
I dont know his alignment
together we can kill.
if one of us dies, the other can kill alone.
did I mention I dont know his alignment?

EXACTLY..if he is did "off me to start"..then there would be an additional kill (if scum or even an SK)..

if i didnt claim, and scum started getting additional kills, no one would know who they were coming from..

now you know.

[curiouskarmadog]

well if I assumed the mod wouldnt have made the game that swingy, then I would have been outguessing him, right? Again, all i know is I have a neighbor whose alignment is unknown (could be an SK or mafia) and if I die, he can kill alone...(again, there is more to the claim/mechanic, but the gist is there)

I went back and forth on it...anyway, it is out there.

(side note: Mod, I would like to discuss this situation end game)

[curiouskarmadog]

CKD you shouldn't have claimed.

given the facts, why?

[curiouskarmadog]

Why do none of these claimed neighbors want to actually list their exact role name? Got something to hide?

unvote, vote Pranadevil

I got a feeling...with sweeping statements like that...

and yeah, I do have something about my role I am hiding...you want to fight about it?

[curiouskarmadog]

question zwet, are you guys a vig or "vig like"?

[curiouskarmadog]

take two

unvote, vote Pranadevil

[curiouskarmadog]

is that what I am saying? or did I say it was a partial claim?

[curiouskarmadog]

well kids, you are not getting it...you got a problem with that vote me....

[curiouskarmadog]

does that make me scummy? why or why not. I have told you what I thought you needed to know and why you needed to know it. Anything else would be anti-town.

[curiouskarmadog]

if you knew you would understand....my neighbor and I are vig-like..not vigs....I dont need to tell you if we are two shot, unlimited shot, etc...i dont need to tell you any other part of the mechanic, which is in the name...so no, it is not pro-town...so back the fuck off....if you think i am scummy for not telling you..vote me or move on.

at this point, you are looking scummy for role fishing...keep in mind, i didnt have to tell you jack.

[curiouskarmadog]

Well, let me put it to you this way...if my partner is scum, scum know exactly what I am hiding and WHY I AM HIDING IT.

they will try to put together any bullshit case to kill me, so they wont have to tonight. An example?....both looker and Vezo vote me, yet there are "4 neighbors total"..why is that? becuase I am the only one getting heat. Also, I brought this to everyone's attention and didnt sit on it, yet I am getting called scummy?

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote vote looker....

i have yet to see a game where vezo is anything other than a VI...his unthought out vote is a null tell...i would be surprised if he has even read the game

still think pdevil is scummy, but on afterthought, scum would not be fishing....they would already know my/our role if they are scum in my neighborhood...so he could be scum hunting or he might be scum not in my neighborhood.

but looker, just voted for no reason (after calling down pdevil for his post) has really stood out.

and to answer your question looker....i dont know what pom/zwet have, thus why i asked zwet a question about it....but imagine they share some of our mechanics/role.

I also wouldnt be surprised if there were MORE sets of neighbors out there....our neighborhood is named....

which reminds me, Jack, is the "PR" you are looking for have anything to do with language (not english)?

[curiouskarmadog]

3 points.

1, I am not a neighbor vig....we have a vig like ability, not going to say it again.

2, Unfornately, I would be willing to be that there are scum amoung the neighbors.

3, I also would be willing to bet there are more neighbor pairs.


lol, oh now my neighbor partner show sup..can we please not lynch anyone until we get some proper stances/content/thoughts from him.

[curiouskarmadog]

Wait, what the fuck, CKD? So you aren't a neighbor?

where the fuck did I say that??????

3 points.

1, I am not a neighbor vig....we have a vig like ability, not going to say it again.

2, Unfornately, I would be willing to be that there are scum amoung the neighbors.

3, I also would be willing to bet there are more neighbor pairs.


lol, oh now my neighbor partner show sup..can we please not lynch anyone until we get some proper stances/content/thoughts from him.

WE ARE NOT A VIG!!!!!!...We are still neighbors with a vig like ability....

I was correcting people...people keep saying neighbor vigs...we are not neighbor vigs...we are neighbors with a vig like ability...there is a HUGE FUCKING DIFFERENCE HERE!?!?!

[curiouskarmadog]

EBWOP: I think I misunderstood: You ARE a neighbor, but you're not a VIG; you just have a vig-like -ability-.

ok...ignore the above post I guess.

[curiouskarmadog]

CKD’s 122…*sigh* something like that, yeah. But you failed to mention (several times I might add) that it’s one-shot, so no, scum doesn’t get “extra” help if I die and you are, in fact, part of the scum faction. Dumb ass.

Horrordude’s 131 is a little unsettling when he agrees that CKD should’ve claimed today. I disagree, and almost think that CKD is part of the mafia faction because he decided to make that decision on his own. And not reading the Role PM very carefully apparently, since we can only use it ONCE. I think Horror is buddying with CKD on this one…

CKD’s 208=WIFOM.

Prana’s 213 doesn’t sit well with me. I don’t agree that we should hide how many times we can use the ability.

217: CC’s are always necessary.

I want TNM's replacement's thoughts on this whole situation when he/she comes in.

I hope this is sufficient.

I don't trust him anymore...VOTE: curioskarmadog

OMG FUCKING GOD
THERE IS A REASON I DIDN’T MENTION WE WERE A ONE SHOT YOU ASSHOLE, just in case you weren’t scum, I didn’t want to let scum know that…why the fuck did you think it was a good idea to tell everyone that?….as town, you should have understood why I WENT OUT OF MY WAY REPEATEDLY NOT TO TELL EVERYONE THAT...the fact you dont see why, is telling. and yes, if you (as scum) kill me tonight, and we don’t agree on the shot, you get to kill alone…the fact you are trying to paint that as anything else is bullshit or an out and out lie!!! so yeah, if I die tonight and we dont use the shot together, scum get "extra help".

I am going to go ahead and claim fully…because SS, is painting the picture that is untrue…and he obviously wants the kill…

So for you guys who wanted the full god damn name.

Town Neighbor one-shot CPR Doctor, now it should be quite obvious why a.) I didn’t want to claim fully b.) why I didn’t want to give you my full name, and c.) why I said "vig like".

The reason I decided to claim, is because right out of the gate, my neighbor partner in the thread last night, said.

“About the game, I'm thinking that there may be a lot of neighbourhoods like ours seeing as ours has a name, and maybe each one has a different PR and scum are in some of the neighbourhoods (if you're scum you should totally tell me, I promise I wont tell anyone!), which would be a pretty interesting setup as scum could try and influence the PRs.

I think that CPR doc is better used as a vig, especially in this case, because if you're scum you can just change where the NK goes...but then again you could do that with the vig target as well...I guess if you were scum you could just NK me though and get control of an extra kill, so because that seems a little bit too easy for scum I'm thinking you're more likely to be town at this stage anyway....”

My reply was this.


“ok, I think you are probably correct that the game is divided up in a bunch of neighborhoods..or at least several neighbors. I havent quite decided what I think we should do with vig/doc protect...you are correct that if one of us is scum (of course I am not) we could change the NK...HOWEVER, if we get a cop claim, and we both decide use it on the claimer, and he doesnt die, it buys us town creds does it not, plus, we might get another investigation that way....if he dies and someone else is killed, that means scum was tipped off...

I also think we should be open (mostly) with the town about our ability. Meaning, I think we should tell them we have a one shot vig ability. this way, if one of us dies, and a mysterious "vigging" occurs, they know where it came from. I dont think we should mention (AT ALL) about the doc ability.

if you are scum, I wonder about balance issues....it doesnt seem fair to give scum an additional kill....if you pop me off in the night...you can use the vig?...see why I want to claim that part?”

That was it for the communication.

I didn’t like the fact he wanted to use a potentional doc protect as a vig.

I didn’t trust my first neighbor…and I think this guy is scum. I wanted to be open and honest with the town, so if something happened, someone was accountable…I upset your plans…..you want people to believe as scum, I would come out with this information page 1, and not try to use it to my advantage?...bullshit, scum bag.

Unvote vote singersigner

[curiouskarmadog]

@ Demon, and who ever else feels so inclined to answer (the more the merrier, would like opinions and stances on this question)..also interested in seeing who blatantly ignores this post.

CKD’s 122…*sigh* something like that, yeah. But you failed to mention (several times I might add) that it’s one-shot, so no, scum doesn’t get “extra” help if I die and you are, in fact, part of the scum faction. Dumb ass.

I disagree, and almost think that CKD is part of the mafia faction because he decided to make that decision on his own. And not reading the Role PM very carefully apparently, since we can only use it ONCE. I think Horror is buddying with CKD on this one…

I would like to hear your thoughts on these two points SS made here.

The first paragraph, given that we are indeed a one shot CPR Doc, if one of us dies (the other can use the ability without having to come to a consensus), and the other is scum, do you think that scum will get "extra" help? Why do you think here that SS is saying they dont? (BTW: I just doubled checked the PM again, and yes, the other can make the decision alone.) Do you feel that a.) that is scummy to misrepresent that and b.) do you feel it was a good move as town to mention the one shot part? Also do you understand/agree with SS's vote on me?

2nd paragraph, first of all, this is a completely untrue statement. I DID discuss it in the QT thread, my neighbor, decided to quit posting in there. I did not go behind ANYONE's back and I stated my intentions clearly. But for WIFOM sake, what possible motivation could I have as scum to coming forward? IF I was scum, wouldnt it have been easier (and a much better play) to shut my mouth today, kill off my neighbor tonight, and simply use the CPR doc on someone I knew wasnt going to be killed? I am interested in hearing theories here..

I am also interested in how SS's is going to explain his two lies/misrepresentations in his vote post.

[curiouskarmadog]

first of all, I never implied the amount of shots in any way...matter of fact when pushed to claim further..I didnt.

explain to me HOW EXACTLY I FORCED ZWET AND POM TO CLAIM..another god damn misrepresentation..

I didnt include myself as scum, I am asking if I was scum, what is my motivation?

lets play this game real fast..

you are scum, I am town.

I dont say SHIT about the CPR doc.

you kill me.

next night, you have the ability to kill anyone you want...no one will have a clue why, how, or who.

now that I came out..and I die....you will be held accountable for that random kill....I think it was a very good play.

I held back the kicker about the doc, so on the off chance we do get a cop claim...or on the off chance you are not scum.

[curiouskarmadog]

CKD’s 122…*sigh* something like that, yeah. But you failed to mention (several times I might add) that it’s one-shot,

so no, scum doesn’t get “extra” help if I die and you are

, in fact, part of the scum faction. Dumb ass.

when you said this...What exactly did you mean that scum doesnt get "extra" help?

If I die and you are scum..who gets the cpr doc/vig ability?

[curiouskarmadog]

if someone is misrepresenting (this is different than misunderstanding) something..that is scummy and should be addressed.

DH, please point out where I misrepresented ANYTHING!

held back info yes, but I have only said the truth.

[curiouskarmadog]

@CKD: this may have already been asked but... Why the claim so early?

I dont think you are reading the thread...I have touched on this topic at least twice..let me ask you this....what was my claim (partial and then full)?

[curiouskarmadog]

I am at an impasse right now. I don't know if I should support Singer, or if I should support CKD.

when I see this statement, it makes me think you have read both SS and I thoroughly and you see valid points on both side.

but when you ask me, why did I claim...it makes me feel like the above quote is fence sitting and not really reading, but trying to look like you are reading.

[curiouskarmadog]

hoping to update in the next 48

[curiouskarmadog]

posting in all (3) games...tonight or tomorrow morning for updates (so it wasnt 48 hours, it was 72).

[curiouskarmadog]

Ok, updating, and typing as I go, I am sorry if this turns into a wall of text, if it starts to look like I giant post, I will break them up.
Starting at the top of page 13.

@ Demon, and who ever else feels so inclined to answer (the more the merrier, would like opinions and stances on this question)..also interested in seeing who blatantly ignores this post.

I already asked you the question earlier which one of you do you prefer we lynch, to which you replied with an OMGUS.

What's the rationale behind this post? I don't see the scum motivation for stifling your claim. Also, I didn't vote for no reason; one of you neighbors has to die. We can hash out the night action for the survivor once we decide.

Is singersigner the neighbor you want to lynch?

I am not sure what post you are talking (“this post”)about 208 or 209. I assume you are talking about my vote on you. Yes you did vote for no reason. In your view, why does one of the neighbors “have to die” and why does it have to be the any particular pair?

if you knew you would understand....my neighbor and I are vig-like..not vigs....I dont need to tell you if we are two shot, unlimited shot, etc...i dont need to tell you any other part of the mechanic, which is in the name...so no, it is not pro-town...so back the fuck off....if you think i am scummy for not telling you..vote me or move on.

at this point, you are looking scummy for role fishing...keep in mind, i didnt have to tell you jack.

UNVOTE: VOTE: curiouskarmadog
Do you propose we lynch you or totallynotmafia?

Where is the reason in that post/vote….there isn’t…so don’t act there was with this post.

And you are asking me if SS is the neighbor I want to lynch…at the time of this post, where the fuck was my vote?

How can vollkan and curiouskarmadog both have "Best Mafia Performance"?

how many people are in your mafia?

unvote P
vote singersinger

You tried to force a lynch on CKD. By using false information.

what were those reasons again? (edit: vollkan asks the same question later)

@CKD: I know you have already said it many times... I just want you to answer it once more. Why the claim so early?

I had to claim Day 1, you disagree, why or why not?

Spam.
Espy is scum. DIE.

unvote vote espy

why is he scum? I thought SS was scum, and vollkan asked you a question, why did you ignore it?

hoping to update in the next 48

I don't really have much for you right now other than this post.
UNVOTE: VOTE: curiouskarmadog

why the vote? I assume because you thought I was lurking?..did you check any of my other current games to see if that was true?

Vezok, replace out. You are seriously incapable of playing this game. I can tolerate inexperience, because people can improve, but you are going nowhere in terms of your play. This game requiers reasoning and analysis; you have neither. Leave.

QFT, I did a quick meta of him and in a current game...he just plays like this...it is a waste..the only scum game I found for him however, he was much more involved. I have a feeling he has some vanilla role and he is just bored.

[*]I'm voting CKD for the reasons I previously voted him; I only voted Stef for pressure.
[*]

I didnt see the reasons the first time, please give me some bullets points.

Pretty much Vollkan, I've never found Vezo to be the strongest player, but I don't ever recall seeing him move his vote with such piss poor reasoning as that before.

what game have you guys played together?..link please. because I looked over his games, curious which one you were in with him.

[curiouskarmadog]

@ Looker, I ask for your case against me and all i get is this?...please explain your vote.

[*]I didn't vote you for lurking; if I wanted to vote a lurker I'd have voted Pomegranate, NicolBolas, Nero Cain, etc.
[*]"Bullets points" won't help you.[/list]

Also you didnt really answer my question, why did you vote me between your posts...the only thing I did in the stretch of time, was post that I would post in 48 hours or so...so what changed? you also didnt answer my question why does a neighbor "have to die"? And if a neighbor does have to die, why did you not consider the other pair of neighbors?

Looker is obv. town, he's pushing people, and pointing out things that need pointing out.

what in particular do you think looker is pointing out that "needs pointing out"...I dont see anything obv town about his play.

@CKD, A little more on the claim explenation plz plz lz...

Cooldog, can you please tell me what my claim is.....once you do that, please tell me what the mechanic is behind the claim (consider this a lesson in critical thinking, if you

really

want to know the answer,but are too fucking lazy to go back and actually read the post where I explain in detail why and when I claimed you have to play along).

[curiouskarmadog]

@Looker: Yes

Someone ask me something simple about the game please.

are you scum?

if not, do you have scum on your wagon, who?

[curiouskarmadog]

You also asked leading questions of him (how many scum are in his mafia) that could only ever be answered with what amounts to no more than "How the hell do I know how many scum we have?" Because either he honestly doesn't know, or he would have to pretend he did anyway, it's a pointless question.

it was actually an answer to his question, and sort of a joke...sort of not.

he wanted to know why both vollkan and I have a mafia(scum) award....quick answer, because there are usually more than one scum in a mafia group, vollkan and I were scum together...long answer, my retort to him.

that being said,

I have no problem also voting looker.

I disagree, i dont feel like he is townish at all.

he votes me, when I ask for a case (some bullets points) he avoid answering like the plague...he knows his vote is bad and he is trying to backtrack...

you asked me looker, i think you should vote SS....ball in your court, good wagon, why or why not?

[curiouskarmadog]

@CKD, I know you have answered before, but answer the simple question. Why the claim? Thank you, quit avoiding it. I could look back and tread through that long discussion on it, but I want to hear it here and now from you.

I am not avoiding shit, your question has been answered...in several posts...what I am trying to do now is seeing if you are scum hunting or asking questions to look like you are scum hunting...seems to me if you really wanted to know (or scum hunt) the answer you would a.) go back and look or b.) answer my question.

sooo

Cooldog, can you please tell me what my claim is.....once you do that, please tell me what the mechanic is behind the claim (consider this a lesson in critical thinking, if you

really

want to know the answer,but are too fucking lazy to go back and actually read the post where I explain in detail why and when I claimed you have to play along).

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote, vote cooldog

thats what I thought

[curiouskarmadog]

@CKD, why the vote, I know what you claimed if that is what you are asking. You claimed that you are a neighbored to some one. And one of the two is scum. Together you two are a 1-shot vig, am I correct? Would you stop refusing to answer my question, I know you have already given the answer and I have looked it up, I want you to say it again.

if you read it, then you should understand it..if you dont understand it,here is more critical thinking excerises for you....just keep at it..you will get it, if you really want us to believe you want the answer.

so I am a neighbor with someone, good, you are correct.

I never said that one of the two is scum (though I do suspect SS, so I guess I can understand your confusion).

Ok, you almost got all of the claim, and I am down right proud of you....but..you did leave out something.

What happens if I die (hint: part of that claim mechanic) with my role?....

EDIT: I am being an asshole, because your question has been answered (at least twice)...I thought about going back and requoting it, but...you see I am not totally sure you are actually scum hunting....so you are either a.) slow and actually need these critical thinking exercises or b.) scum who tried to look like they were scum hunting, but have been backed into a corner after being called out for it...

so, if want everyone to believe you are scum hunting..you have to play along...unless of course, you want to admit you actually know the reason i claimed.

[curiouskarmadog]

also, I am not refusing you answer your question....keep playing along, and your "question" will be answered.

[curiouskarmadog]

If CKD were to be NKd the way he claimed, wouldn't his role be shown upon death?

This is why I was asking about the specific role name earlier, if it does, in fact, state in the role name that they are joint together, then claiming was a pointless task as the name should inform people what's going on.

but the claim wont have my partner will it?...and then you wouldnt know...come on, this isnt rocket science.

[curiouskarmadog]

@looker, right now, you, SS, and cooldog are on top of my scum list...SS is leading the pack.

that being said, what makes you think I am voting CD for being lazy? He has stated he has read my claim (after some prodding)...I think I have caught him in some bullshit act to look like he is scum hunting (stated this in my vote). I am going to keep backing him in the corner...(ie to see where he really wants to take this). I have a point at the end of it, but good money says he isnt going to let it get that far and will bail on the question.

still waiting on you CD.

[curiouskarmadog]

what I was commenting on was "claiming was a pointless task"..it wasnt...it was only pointless if I didnt expose you. And I know, I know, you keep bringing up that you are town-aligned....if you are scum, you know I am town and I wouldnt lie, so it is safe to say "our claims look alike"....you are not buying creds with me.

[curiouskarmadog]

above post was referencing this.

If CKD were to be NKd the way he claimed, wouldn't his role be shown upon death?

This is why I was asking about the specific role name earlier, if it does, in fact, state in the role name that they are joint together, then claiming was a pointless task as the name should inform people what's going on.

but the claim wont have my partner will it?...and then you wouldnt know...come on, this isnt rocket science.

The claim will give a clue as to what

your

alignment is, though (regardless of me). They can at least figure out whether or not they trust the first claim, and then from there, whatever the second claim is. This is why I'm inclined to believe your claim, because it's exactly the same as mine, and I know I'm town-aligned because of it...so you must be, too, right?

[curiouskarmadog]

@ vollkan, bold should answer your question....the particular quote you indicated came after I asked him some questions and he posted without acknowledge my post. I had to vote him to get him to answer...

that being said, what makes you think I am voting CD for being lazy? He has stated he has read my claim (after some prodding)...

I think I have caught him in some bullshit act to look like he is scum hunting (stated this in my vote). I am going to keep backing him in the corner...(ie to see where he really wants to take this). I have a point at the end of it, but good money says he isnt going to let it get that far and will bail on the question

.

still waiting on you CD.

[curiouskarmadog]

so I am a neighbor with someone, good, you are correct.

I never said that one of the two is scum (though I do suspect SS, so I guess I can understand your confusion).

Ok, you almost got all of the claim, and I am down right proud of you....but..you did leave out something.

What happens if I die (hint: part of that claim mechanic) with my role?....

@ckd, the other guy gets the 1-shot kill correct?
..

right!!..yes, we are getting there slowly up surely...

next critical thinking question..

now, if the other guy is scum and if I die he will get the 1-shot kill...when would be the absolute best time for scum to kill me? Hurry now, it looks like we are getting closer to this day ending.

---

I understand the Nero lynch, but feel there are scummier people today.

for example.

unvote, vote Looker.

He really wants everyone to know that his vote isnt changing today...which makes me feel like he knows Nero will flip town...that added to my other scum reads off him...

[curiouskarmadog]

lol, mother fucker...I note that CD quickly jumped on that wagon without "wanting to know my answer"..dude is scum. he is not scum hunting, and I caught him in some bullshit questioning.

if I do get offed tonight, please hold CD accountable

my money also says looker and SS is scum....

if for some reason nero flips scum (very doubtful) I might rethink some of this...but, another good bet is that Nero is quite town.

[curiouskarmadog]

Wasn’t aware that the game opened yesterday..
SS was town huh?....yeah he kept making comments last night like “aren’t you going to feel stupid” last night. We basically argued last night, neither of us trusted each other to even think about using there ability...though, I did ask him what he thought of CD and said he would be the only person I would consider using the power on.

I see that zwet and Pom used their ability last night on Esp?...curious, who came up with the suggestion first?

I'm not happy with CKD personally,

purely because he came out day 1 and revealed his role because he didn't trust his partner

, and it's his partner who gets nobbled? Could easily have been a big ball of WIFOM from CKD to throw us off the scent. But as there's going to be more than one scum out there I'll look elsewhere for now.

in reference to bolded...did I come out because i didnt trust my partner? or did I come out because I wanted everyone to have as much info as possible, especially IF my partner was scum. someone needed to be accountable for the kill...are you misrepresenting here, or simply misunderstanding my claim again? But lets play your game, so I am throwing a big ball of WIFOM to get your off my scent on page fucking 1?...you really are putting that forward? What scent were people tracking at that point?

I agree CD looks super scummy, but this wagon is really rocking and rolling pretty quick….

What is the rush?

Also CD, you had a question for me yesterday, but a.) completely ignored my post/questions and b.) didn’t get your answer….I thought it was important..why did you hammer if you still had a question outstanding?

[curiouskarmadog]

@CD come on pal....you really going to ignore this?

Also CD, you had a question for me yesterday, but a.) completely ignored my post/questions and b.) didn’t get your answer….I thought it was important..why did you hammer if you still had a question outstanding?

[curiouskarmadog]

@CD come on pal....you really going to ignore this?

Also CD, you had a question for me yesterday, but a.) completely ignored my post/questions and b.) didn’t get your answer….I thought it was important..why did you hammer if you still had a question outstanding?

in other news,

vote looker

[curiouskarmadog]

I have been reading all the accusations being levelled at CD and I have to say that LMP last posts have now convinced me to

Vote Cooldog

Cooldogs erratic and at times nonsense answer soundnlike someone who is trying to sound over carefully town which belies a scum? Underneath.

curious sp...how many vote to include yours is on CD right now.

[curiouskarmadog]

This is going to sound very scummy, but I can't post for the rest of today. I'll have to get back to answer vollkan tomorrow morning if I can get on at all.

HEY!..do not ignore me

[curiouskarmadog]

I thought I already answered your question at least twice CKD, try reading the game. I'm going throught the mass of vollk's posts right now so, I can't respond more then that.

post number please

[curiouskarmadog]

and you let that go...why?

[curiouskarmadog]

@CKD, because you were an ass and didn't answer after multipul tries, WHY AM I SCUM?
.

since you had an issue with reading the 2-3 posts that I explain in detail why I claimed yesterday, I was going to answer in a different way that maybe you could remember....and you were so close too, you dont want to know the answer anymore? why?

I thought/think you could be scum, because the fact you asked the question...sometimes scum want to look like they are scum hunting by asking questions...this question falls into the catagory of "whats the point"? you looked scummier when you avoided my questions and started avoiding my post once I backed you into the corner.....then, instead of getting your answer, you hammered a townie out of no where....THAT is why you look scummy.

the only reason I am not voting you currently, is the speed at which your wagon took off today....I am a little wary of it, but have no problem hammering you today if needed.

[curiouskarmadog]

@ looker, who is scum, you were pretty hot to trot to lynch a neighbor yesterday....well one pair killed scum, and one part of another (mine to be exact) is dead and flipped town....sooooo, I am a little surprised you are not barking up my tree today...

some content would be great from you.

[curiouskarmadog]

@ looker, who is scum, you were pretty hot to trot to lynch a neighbor yesterday....well one pair killed scum, and one part of another (mine to be exact) is dead and flipped town....sooooo, I am a little surprised you are not barking up my tree today...

some content would be great from you.

Votecount

that is not content...that is you asking for a vote count....and that post has nothing to do with what you were doing yesterday...so please comment.

[curiouskarmadog]

the game does need mod love.

[curiouskarmadog]

Yeah,

V/LA until further notice

Outtie.

can looker please be replaced.

[curiouskarmadog]

can someone contact a back up mod?

[curiouskarmadog]

if it isnt obvious, demonhybrid was my kill....thought his play was scummy.

I have got to reread the game.....thanks mod for helping out.

[curiouskarmadog]

Vote Curiouskarmadog

Why you ask? Well I watched him last night and he visited Demon who is now dead. Something says to me that he's up to no good. wouldn't you?

curious, how did you know that demon was killed?

[curiouskarmadog]

Vote Curiouskarmadog

Why you ask? Well I watched him last night and he visited Demon who is now dead. Something says to me that he's up to no good. wouldn't you?

also, why did you pick me to "watch"? given my role, why was it a good idea to watch me?

[curiouskarmadog]

Vote Curiouskarmadog

Why you ask? Well I watched him last night and he visited Demon who is now dead. Something says to me that he's up to no good. wouldn't you?

Only one problem, watchers see who TARGETS the person they watch, not who the person they watch targets.

Vote: SnakePlissken

oh hell, i didnt even realize he said that? I read track......umm, yeah, think you meant "track" scum

vote snakeplissken.

[curiouskarmadog]

Damnit. What an absolute disaster. Not even a page into the game and I've already made a terrible mistake. I need to nip this in the bud right now. This was not Snake's fault or anyone else's. This was all me. I gave Snake incorrect results. This wasn't a rushed error or anything, just a flat out mistake. There's no way to alter this without making an announcement to the thread, given the role claim. I apologize for that.

fuck, just going to read the fucking thread before posting.

unvote.

soooo, what was he suppose to get...did he actually "watch" me and you gave him "track"?

All that needs to be said from me is that Snake received incorrect results due to a modding error. I take full responsibility for that and apologize.

EDIT: And that I have since given him the correct results. This needs to be said as well.

[curiouskarmadog]

Snake, did you get a new result?....did you actually watch me or track me?

if you did track me, the question still stands...why did you bother tracking me what did you hope to find?

[curiouskarmadog]

fos:ckd

for what jack?

[curiouskarmadog]

also, my question is valid..if he is indeed a tracker, why waste the tracking on me?...

[curiouskarmadog]

Do you usually not finish reading the thread before replying?

jack has a point...

you mean EXACTLY like snake just did?

sometimes...

i read it, thought it was scummy voted...once I read what happened, i immediately unvoted.

[curiouskarmadog]

Snake, did you get a new result?....did you actually watch me or track me?

if you did track me, the question still stands...why did you bother tracking me what did you hope to find?

Right my now correct result is that no one visited you last night. I'm a watcher.

Also, why are being so jittery over being tracked? You outed your kill yourself? Why you so worried I watched you? Something to hide? I am watching everyone in turn until I die to try and find scum. That's the idea isn't it?

I am not "jittery"..I am trying to figure out if you have been reading the game or if you were scum....if you had been a "tracker" targetting me would have been very foolish...I am a one shot doc/vig....if I killed someone (as scum or town) it would have been obvious who I targetted....if I was a doc, not so obvious, but pointless to track...it was a waste of a track and not very towny.

it is all moot now though...you were a watcher...soooo, it wasnt that bad of a choice.

and given the mod's reaction, think you are probably town.

[curiouskarmadog]

Do you usually not finish reading the thread before replying?

jack has a point...

you mean EXACTLY like snake just did?

sometimes...

i read it, thought it was scummy voted...once I read what happened, i immediately unvoted.

hey jack, you fos-ed me..so please address this

[curiouskarmadog]

ckd's not reading the thread stuff sounded fake to me

which part sounded fake and why? and if I was scum, what were the motives do you think...I mean, if you really believe this deserved an FOS..back that shit up. You think it was scummy, explain why!

[curiouskarmadog]

I did a pbpa on you last page. Skipped that one hmmmmm????

umm, what?

here are your posts for the last page.

fos:ckd

Do you usually not finish reading the thread before replying?

that's vollkans playstyle

maybe you meant 2 pages back...

nope.

vote:snakeplissken

this is it..

vote Jack

...maybe this will help you...I dont believe for a second that you think anything I did is scummy. now you are backtracking.

[curiouskarmadog]

wtf?

[curiouskarmadog]

I DONT BELIEVE YOU THINK ANYTHING I DID TODAY IS SCUMMY....you cant seem to explain why my actions (not reading before posting) is scummy....now you are...well, I dont know what the fuck you are doing, but you are not answering questions and backtracking..

explain why my posts today deserved an FOS...

[curiouskarmadog]

YOU FIRST SCUMBAG..
.
YOUHAVEN'T ANSWERED MY QUESTION

what question might that be???...

also why did you lie and say you did a pbp?

[curiouskarmadog]

do you understand anything he is fucking saying or doing?

[curiouskarmadog]

WTF!

[curiouskarmadog]

give me that post number for the pbp...

[curiouskarmadog]

This game's activity is excruciating.

explain

[curiouskarmadog]

so is what I am hearing is jack is just a poor player?

I found the FoS curious, when he backtracked, couldnt explain why, and lied...that is what made him scummy in my eyes....so he does all of that in other games?

[curiouskarmadog]

so is what I am hearing is jack is just a poor player?

I wouldn't say "poor" so much as chaotic/idiosyncratic.

you feel like his actions in this games are good?....is chaotic antitown?

[curiouskarmadog]

We've played together like 4 times ckd : (

exactly why I am voting you....never seen this before...also, I have posted like that (reason you FOSed) before, so you should know that.

[curiouskarmadog]

so we should just ignore him and hope he goes away? need to change my playstyle then.

[curiouskarmadog]

omg, walls of text...hope to get to this tomorrow

[curiouskarmadog]

3rd in line to update.

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote

, I am behind..dont know what is going on...dont want vote unintended when I dont have the time to catch up....trying.

[curiouskarmadog]

ok, putting down this self challenge...if I dont post an update post in this game tomorrow, feel free to lynch me...(posting in the games I have left to update)..I MUST UPDATE TOMORROW...I MUST UPDATE TOMORROW...

[curiouskarmadog]

Updating from about page 34 (wow, thought more time has passed)…typing as I go.

At this stage, I want Jack or Pacman lynched, not only has Jack been acting worthless all game, but he and Esp were buddy buddy at the start of the game, and he's just being allowed to slide by being useless and scummy.

what I think is interesting is that jack soft claimed something earlier in the game..I havent brought it up, because I was hoping for results....so far, nothing from jack....jack care to comment on this?

you know jack... this isn't how I last remembered you.

how do you remember him?..(edit: you answer it later)

We really need some direction in this game, I feel completely disinterested. I'll be perfectly honest, I have very little motivation for this game.

yeah you keep saying that, but you are not doing anything about it...also, i hate the saying "perfectly honest"..have you not honest in this game...how about you get something started by asking question instead of bitching about the boring game (not scum hunting). To “be quite honest”, I was debating between killing you and Demon last night..thoughts? I changed to Demon at the last second.

But meh, I'm officially giving up on this game, half of the players aren't even attempting to play mafia, while the majority of the rest have done a vanishing act.

more of the same.

UNVOTE: vollkan
I'll come back to this when people are more willing to listen.
VOTE: Jack
just iso'd him. 74 posts and next to no content. Most of his posts are useless one liners. Definitely not pro-town play.

interesting time for a vote…I say if Prana is scum, this might be a partner.

...

Prana, who do you think is scum in this game and why?

[curiouskarmadog]

Oh, and the Demon shot was awful, he was obv town.

really?...what about his play said town?

[curiouskarmadog]

checking in to avoid the prod....will attempt to update again shortly.

[curiouskarmadog]

jack, please quick talking about a pbp that doesnt exist...I asked you several time to provide a post number of the pbp, and insted of doing that you just said I was town..

[curiouskarmadog]

edit quit=quick

[curiouskarmadog]

so am I town or am I scum?

[curiouskarmadog]

until you tell me otherwise (ie provide a fucking post number)..I am going to assume this is your pbp.

I don't suspect ckd...he's almost confirmed town

[curiouskarmadog]

hey jack, why were you looking for post restrictions first thing on Day 1?

and yeah, I am role fishing...you soft claimed something then...I think it is important to have the info now...

[curiouskarmadog]

jack you are an (insert troll and reason for future policy lynch here)

PD, you claim vollkan and LMP are buddying, but you did not address their posts.

[curiouskarmadog]

lewarcher, why did you chose rude over PD?

[curiouskarmadog]

also given that the town tracker tracked pacman and got (nil) why do you think this is the BEST lynch today. I understand he could be scum that didnt make a kill that night, but neither did snake who watched/tracked me? But given that result, why is he the BEST lynch over your other "scum suspects"?

But I still want evilpacman gone.

vote: evilpacman

[curiouskarmadog]

also PD, you never explained to me why my coming out Day 1 was scummy...are you saying you see no town motivation behind my claim?

[curiouskarmadog]

vote Pranadevil.

given the tracker's claim, pac is not the best lynch...I refuse to believe you think so

[curiouskarmadog]

still good with my vote.

[curiouskarmadog]

2c) or you are lying.

going back to reread

[curiouskarmadog]

something about lew is bothering me, today, you (vollkan) summed up what rubbed me wrong, but yesterday ("I targetted X who was second on my scum list because I figured PD would be lynched today" bullshit) rubbed me wrong, especially after avoiding the wagon at that...I am not sure why he didnt vote for the top person on his scum list.

[curiouskarmadog]

I am fine with a massclaim, though my shit is already out there.

[curiouskarmadog]

Someone will be so nice to answer me about the weird "insider info" Jack claimed to have about post-restrictions?

I think his claim is the reason he was killed...are you saying you havent looked for it?

[curiouskarmadog]

i figured there were more pairs of neighbors.

so vollkan, you guys did you jail keeping every night...and every night there was a kill...poor luck?

who made the decisions between the two of you?

[curiouskarmadog]

edit:....."so vollkan...you guys did jail keeping every night..."

also, the claim gives some credit to Lew's claim.

[curiouskarmadog]

sorry for many little posts back to back, but the thoughts come after I have posted..

so, i doubt that Lewscum would have tried to kill rude, if he knew he was going to be blocked (ie knowledge from the vollkan/lmp pair)...that is assuming some timing of actions though. but it makes sense him coming out with the information the following day. I dont understand why lew did try to kill someone last night though.

have another line of thinking too, but want to wait to see who wears the pants in that neighborhood first (ie who made what decision what night)

[curiouskarmadog]

LMP do you agree with vollkan about the above post?

[curiouskarmadog]

also need a claim from rude.

LMP and vollkan...not only does your role stop someone from killing, but it also protects someone from a kill....after 4 nights, you have yet to stop a kill..one would think that you have done something by now...thoughts on suspicion of the other? What happens to your power if the other dies?

also, pac should not be the lynch today, given your claim.

Mod can you update the first page please.

Done

[curiouskarmadog]

well unless vollkan and LMp are both scum and lying, he was jailed last night...there was not a kill last night...so pac is not the best lynch today...you disagree? also LMP is answering my quesiton (about vollkan)

[curiouskarmadog]

vote a2rudeboy

quit lurking

[curiouskarmadog]

and who here is played with vollkan before?

lew, why would jack's death be an attempt to frame rude?...didnt jack say numerous times yesterday he thought I was scum?

[curiouskarmadog]

edit...who here HAS played with...

[curiouskarmadog]

actually

unvote

, until everyone has claimed

[curiouskarmadog]

the tracker tracked pac and got a nil.

according to the jailkeeping twins, he was blocked a different night, and there was still a kill.

Pac is a poor choice for a lynch today...the above does not clear him, but he is just not a good lynch.

vote a2rudeboy

also, your reasoning behind your vote is poor.

[curiouskarmadog]

so who is a better vote?.....why arent you scum hunting?

[curiouskarmadog]

add answering "hard" questions with a deflect to why you are scummy list.

[curiouskarmadog]

answer the questions, if you are really town and want us to believe you are trying to find scum..answer the questions.

[curiouskarmadog]

interesting....so..if you are "worried" of a vollkan/CKD scum team, why arent you pressing it further? Why does that worry stop you from voting a2?...does that mean you wont vote him at all today because of said worry? the above statement rubs me completely wrong. maybe it is the phrase "you are not helping yourself"....not sure what exactly about it rubs me wrong. why do you care if he is "helping himself"? this feels coachy to me...or...or something....need to think on it.

[curiouskarmadog]

my post is referencing this.

You're not helping yourself a2. That is a massive ball of indecision and bad logic (I don't think the neighbors have scum, and I believe LMP/Vollkan claim, I guess I'll vote LMP), followed by placing a vote only to appease the people pressuring you. I'd vote you if I wasn't worried about a Vollkan/CKD team.

[curiouskarmadog]

lol, you can vote and unvote me all you want to...but like A2..you are just ignoring the questions.

interesting....so..if you are "worried" of a vollkan/CKD scum team, why arent you pressing it further? Why does that worry stop you from voting a2?...does that mean you wont vote him at all today because of said worry? the above statement rubs me completely wrong. maybe it is the phrase "you are not helping yourself"....not sure what exactly about it rubs me wrong. why do you care if he is "helping himself"? this feels coachy to me...or...or something....need to think on it.

[curiouskarmadog]

Anyone who thinks I'm scum after how hard I pushed PD to the front of the lynch line is stupid.

dont give me this WIFOM bullshit.

besides, is my fucking vote on you?...am I not allowed to say something bothers me, without you bullying me?

[curiouskarmadog]

also I have a WIFOM card too.

remember snakescum coming out of no where a couple days back trying to push a bullshit case on me when he got information he shouldnt have from the mod?

yeah, I thought you forgot that.

[curiouskarmadog]

waiting for LMP to address my post.

[curiouskarmadog]

why is vollkan NOW making you jumpy? you guys have had 4 NIGHTS and not once have you stopped a kill....what really are the chances?

[curiouskarmadog]

not sure why pac is tied with vollkan.....again there were two nights that he was either blocked or tracked..and he isnt making the kill..I get it doesnt clear him, but it gives him town points...on the other hand vollkan is part of a couple that can either protect a townie OR stop a kill and somehow the mafia is assigning a killer and killing someone that these two arent getting...FOR 4 nights....like pac, it doesnt damn them, but it gives them some suspicion.

if we werent in the position we might be in, I would push for both vollkan and LMP going....that being said, both are not scum.

one last bit...vollkan is an awesome player...as scum, he has bested me 2-3 times...I just cant read him....if I were mafia (and I have seen this occured 1 maybe two times) I would have offed vollkan a long time ago....however he is still around...(thus the has anyone played with vollkan before" question.)..again doesnt mean jack in this game because no one is admitting to it.

again, has anyone played with vollkan before?

[curiouskarmadog]

sidenote: it is stupid and anti-town to jail a town vig to protect him. It is not pro-town for a vig to shoot, but it is pro-town to prevent him from shooting?

who said they jailed you to protect you?

[curiouskarmadog]

lew can you do we a favor, what post number did you enter the game?

[curiouskarmadog]

nm, there are links.

[curiouskarmadog]

another reason I dont think pac is scum, vollkan and LMP came out Day (whatever) and both voted PD...PD started pushing pac.

another reason I think rude is scum, jack was pushing him as his number one suspect yesterday (now he is dead)..though I guess it should be noted, that he also said I was scum....

[curiouskarmadog]

easier and better canididates?..like who?....and maybe you (and your partner?) kill jacked because he was soft claiming something you felt might threaten you..

the above post makes we secure in the vote.

@ ALL, where do you stand on the A2 lynch.....I want firm stances and reasons!

[curiouskarmadog]

lol, fuck!!!

"killed jack"

This made me lol for some reason.

[curiouskarmadog]

also A2, I would like a scum/town ranking from you now....why is your top two scummy, why is your bottom two townish.

[curiouskarmadog]

vollkan is a good player as town or mafia...

[curiouskarmadog]

LMP, couple questions.

why do you keep saying you were uncomfortable about my day one claim? (I have only said 5 times)...look at it from my point of view...you and someone else have a power to kill someone...if you die, the power goes to that other person alone. if you dont tell anyone about it, then that person gets the kill and NO ONE WOULD KNOW ABOUT IT. Now, I came out and told you about it..so that way if there was another kill (ie my neighbor partner who might be scum) unaccounted for..someone would be accountable for it. ..

wouldnt it have been easy (as scum) to not say a fucking word...pop off my partner THEN use the kill?...no one being the wiser? also, LMP, do you remember who attacked me after the claim?...do you remember you tried to role fish, then denied they were doing it?

EXPLAIN TO ME EXACTLY HOW MY ACTION WAS SCUMMY.

also, when you told vollkan that you thought I was scummy because of your "gut" what was his reaction?..

[curiouskarmadog]

well, was hoping LMP would answer...., but I guess he can confirm that.

vollkan and I differ on gut case..I know his (vollkan) disdain for the word "gut"....but my gut is usually pretty on....I also think our definition of what a gut case is is different...what I was looking for was to see if you let that "gut" statement go in the QT or if you gave him crap for it....was looking for a difference in your play when only one person could see you.

[curiouskarmadog]

also if we end today without a A2 lynch...I am going to be pissed.

a2rude, (in attempt to get some content)...you say we are tunneling on you...you have me at 2 on your scum list...explain why.

if you really felt LMP or myself was scum, why arent you pushing a case?..dont you want to catch scum?

[curiouskarmadog]

why is pacman (someone who has gotten to nil investigations of sorts) more likely scum than lets say lew, or vollkan.....or even me?

in reference to lew, I dont know....I question his decision not to kill, but again, if he killed and popped off town, I would question that too....if lew was scum with one of you (lmp and vollkan) I imagine he would not have been blocked...or come out the way he did (gambit aside) with his info....I am leaning town on him....

I think Pac is town....he is certianly not clear...but I think he is town..unless of course he is scum with one of the jailing twins...but he still has the track on his side.

I think A2 is probably scum.

if there is a second scum, I think it falls between you and vollkan....though I am not sure why the other partner would not have been offed yet.

I would be extremely pissed if you were scum together, but I really doubt that.

[curiouskarmadog]

so as a day killing vig you would off A2rude...but you cant vote to lynch him?..words are meaningless.

[curiouskarmadog]

LMP, I looked at the vote counts...to me, it confirms that A2 is scum....

also, let me put it to you this way...the only other person i would consider voting right now is you or vollkan....and A2 is a much better vote than either of you two right now....

even now, he is not scum hunting...he knows we got him...if he was town, he would at least answer questions, provide content..something...you can stall out the day as long as you feel you got too, but if we dont lynch today, i am holding you responsible.

[curiouskarmadog]

pac get your vote off vollkan and put it on rude.

[curiouskarmadog]

pac, that was just the last reason I think he is scum..there are others.

[curiouskarmadog]

then why fucking sign up for so many fucking games???..if you are town you are being an ass.

[curiouskarmadog]

and who gives a shit about a wiki page, when you dont do anything but lurk?

[curiouskarmadog]

then why fucking sign up for so many fucking games???..if you are town you are being an ass.

[curiouskarmadog]

CKD- Was that post really necessary? I've already explained there are only two ongoing games I am in where I am still alive. And I don't think you really needed to repeat the 'ass' portion.

well you are being an ass..I have asked you questions you are avoiding...you are using X amount of games to prove that you are lazy....so, why not just play a few games well..instead of a bunch of games shitty?

[curiouskarmadog]

no, pacman said he wasnt going to hammer...(of course you would know that if you read the damn game)

if you really are town, i will avoid playing with you in the future and policy lynch you if I end up in a game with you. I hate people that sign up for a bunch of games looking for that awesome role the abandon the games that they get vanilla or whatever....."I am lazy" is bullshit....and if you really are town, you just helped fucking scum because you are (indeed) an ass.

[curiouskarmadog]

Well, I'm not.

Pacman already said he wouldnt hammer.

correction, i read this as "would", but the point still remains.

if you are town...it was fucking better to get a "no lynch" then to lynch a town...so voting yourself is fucking bullshit....you are voting yourself because you just dont care to actually read the game, not because your lynch was going to happen.

god dammit...this pisses me off.

[curiouskarmadog]

well this is obvious...lew..I assume you killed vollkan?

so, if the above is true and pac did not submit the kill "he claimed to be a VT"....then he is scum.

vote pac.

[curiouskarmadog]

also, going to be gone between 11/25 until 11/29....might be light posting, but doubt it.

[curiouskarmadog]

I am not scum...seriously pac?...you werent scum?

either lew was scum and killed vollkan to get town cred, which was an awesome play..

or lew is some sort of SK...

lew?

[curiouskarmadog]

Scum win. Ridiculous. Lew, please justify that vote to me, I don't understand.

why are you asking lew to justify a note when you didnt justify the one on me?

if lew was mafia that killed vollkan to get town cred..that was a great play, but I think too risky...I dont know.

[curiouskarmadog]

i dont....good game I guess...

i hope I am not given a bunch of shit for the quick vote....i figured I looked scummy and pac was going to drop a vote on me anyway....wanted to be first to the gun...so what was your role...were you a killing SK, or could only kill with the neighbor role?

really, there was hardly anyway, I could vote anyone BUT pac...ugh.

[curiouskarmadog]

sorry for the kill demon, when you said "CKD is obv town"...I thought you were trying to buddy because you knew I had a kill

[curiouskarmadog]

funny thing was, it really was between you and PD...I initally said I wanted to kill PD...but changed my mind and re PMed the mod (at that time sera)...I didnt like PD's role fishing day 1.

[curiouskarmadog]

now given that we now know there were two scums in the neighbor pairs...was it a good idea that I claim....if there HAD been a scum in my pair....would it had helped or hurt?

[curiouskarmadog]

vollkan town = dead in the first couple of days...got it, thats how I am reading you now buddy.

[curiouskarmadog]

like I said in the game, vollkan is so hard to read...I was trying to find something, which is why i asked so many questions about want went on in the QT thread. if a gun was placed to head and I had to pick between LMP and vollkan, I would have picked LMP as scum....curious, was mafia worried about an SK at all?

[curiouskarmadog]

whoa whoa what?...how is the whole game on my shoulders?